Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[Tenko]

I think he is highly exagerating what he's currently peddling about his proposed Sonic film on Twitter. He's trying to say Sega was interested in the proposed cross promotion he was offering them by suggesting they could use the 3D models from the film for the games going forward saving them time and money etc. Which is kind of odd in itself since the art and animatics that ended up online seem to imply a 2D animated project akin to SatAM not a 3D one.

That his ideas about making the film, and by proxy the Archie universe it would be based on, the international cannon for Sonic went down well with Sega at the time.

I mean seriously, it's like he completely ignores Sega Japan, and the fact that it's what they say goes as far as Sonic is concerned. They would never let Archie Sonic, or some American made movie based on it, become Sonic's main game cannon internationally, even back then when they had a much looser grip on the international portrayal of the brand.

Just because the one guy he was corresponding with inside Sega (which he has mentioned before when talking about the project, citing this guy's departure as one reason the project never went forward) liked the idea doesn't mean Sega as a whole was super receptive of it. I mean if that was the case and Sega as an entity liked his idea then one guy inside leaving wouldn't have halted his project surely.

I would love to point out his errors in logic on this one, but I'm thinking this is one of those times I should just leave it be. I can just see him reply with the whole tired argument of 'your opinions don't equal my first hand experience etc etc' which basically hinges on the fact we know he did submit an atrocious power point to Sega. Without anything else beyond common sense, and what little of his presentation ended up on the web to back us up its his word against ours, and he can make up whatever he wants using his ever favoured 'I have a lot more material that no one has seen that i'm not going to show you that proves you wrong' that he likes flopping out when people know he has worked on something but try to point out his flaws in logic.

Unless anyone else has some solid points to bring up, regardless of the fact that Sega Japan wouldn't have let that happen, we should probably leave this one huh.

[horridus]

All you really have is Penders word, and that's not worth time or effort that was spent typing them out. He's got a history of misrepresenting actual past events... he's tried repeatedly to sweep his rather bitter feud with Bollers under the rug, and tried to convince people that he somehow had Ben Hurst's 'blessing' when it came to his stories despite the fact the guy never read any of them and actively disliked him after the FIRST film fiasco, to say nothing of his repeated attempts to paint himself as someone who 'cared' about Sonic as a character and a franchise despite trying his damndest to phase out a lot of what came before in favor of his own creations (recall that the things that happened in Knuckles were originally meant for SOnic; let that sink in). To say nothing of the fact that he stole the name of his project from a fan of his and then refused to talk about it with him. Or the fact that he claimed that 'retailers were impressed' by the quality of that horrid Lien-Da image of his. Or that he claims he has a super spcial smash hit of a phone App that no one can see because it's just two awesome for a mere screen shot. 

All I can really say is that a lot about his story is incredibly suspect given the time that it happened, ESPECIALLY the part about SEGA being totally on board with making his movie and, lets face it, HIS continuity the continuity for the entire franchise. That film proposal was done AFTER he had quit Archie due to them desiring to be more in-line with the games, starting with refusing to do any more 25YL until he could figure out how to better incorporate game characters into it. This was the precise time when SEGA was starting to look for a more unified take on their franchise, and that meant the games and only the games. And that's without getting into how shoddy that presentation was, along with the concept art he's provided... I sincerely doubt that those 'models' he mentioned would be much better, and I have a really hard time that anybody would be wowed by what he had to offer, let alone to such an extent that he's suggesting.

I wouldn't bother with trying to point out the holes in his logic with this one; this isn't the first time he's painted a rosey picture of his Film-That-Never-Was, and given his response to the idea that the pre-reboot continuity would be gone forever if the Sonic lisence changed hands, he's not going to even entertain the idea that his proposal was anything short of a smashing success. Just leave it be. 

[SenEDDtor Missile]

Tenko, I have no idea how on earth you can continue to try to do the impossible of convincing Penders that he is ever wrong on anything, let alone do so this many times. That's frankly the definition of insanity.

[Tenko]

2 hours ago, SenEDtor Missile said:

Tenko, I have no idea how on earth you can continue to try to do the impossible of convincing Penders that he is ever wrong on anything, let alone do so this many times. That's frankly the definition of insanity.

What can I say, I've grown up reading his stories, own every comic, some of the guys insanity might have rubbed off on me haha.

On a sadder note, poor Ian's thread on the closure of his forums and his final posts made were somehow lost during the closing process and he can't get them back. He's pretty upset about it too apparently. Hope one of our more archival minded forum members managed to get a screen cap or copy of the posts before they disappeared.

[Tylinos]

1 hour ago, Tenko said:

On a sadder note, poor Ian's thread on the closure of his forums and his final posts made were somehow lost during the closing process and he can't get them back. He's pretty upset about it too apparently. Hope one of our more archival minded forum members managed to get a screen cap or copy of the posts before they disappeared.

I actually do have a copy saved of the final page of the End of Forum Announcement thread (I had it open when the posts disappeared, so I saved it just in case), and I know someone posted up a full forum backup earlier that day...although the link was on one of the lost parts of the thread.  Anyone here happen to still have that backup link?

[Tenko]

1 hour ago, Tylinos said:

I actually do have a copy saved of the final page of the End of Forum Announcement thread (I had it open when the posts disappeared, so I saved it just in case), and I know someone posted up a full forum backup earlier that day...although the link was on one of the lost parts of the thread.  Anyone here happen to still have that backup link?

If anyone would Tylinos I would say it would be VEDJ-F. She's a bloody good historian and archivist when it comes to Sonic, she's also usually one of the first ones to report on Ian's posts and info, especially regarding the Archie comics. Failing that, Fatpanda (is that still his user name, haven't been in the Archie forum for a while since NZ no longer gets Sonic comics shipped here) he's also usually got his finger on the pulse on Bumbleking, you could try hitting one of those two up.

[goku262002]

Has dumbass released anything as of late? I'm going to bet and say no but I feel I should ask.

[Tylinos]

Come on, jerk or not, that's a bit uncalled for.  And no, Ken hasn't really been saying much the past few days, and certainly hasn't released anything new on TLSC.

Also, regarding the Bumbleking thing, thanks to Google cached pages of the End of Forum thread, I found the link to Sunwalker's complete Bumbleking archives, for those interested:
http://1drv.ms/1JCHbIL

[King Scoopa Koopa]

9 hours ago, Tenko said:

I think he is highly exagerating what he's currently peddling about his proposed Sonic film on Twitter. He's trying to say Sega was interested in the proposed cross promotion he was offering them by suggesting they could use the 3D models from the film for the games going forward saving them time and money etc. Which is kind of odd in itself since the art and animatics that ended up online seem to imply a 2D animated project akin to SatAM not a 3D one.

In fairness, 3D models are kind of hard to draw by hand. Especially if your skillset there is already, shall we say "limited." Even his current project has him outsourcing to someone else.

 

[Nepenthe]

31 minutes ago, goku262002 said:

Has dumbass released anything as of late? I'm going to bet and say no but I feel I should ask.

This is the stupid shit that I've threatened multiple times will get this topic locked if it gets out of control. Don't the one to ruin it for everyone else.

[goku262002]

Honestly, you might as well.

This topic has been a headache for nearing 2 years now and for what benefit? to discuss a creation that may never come to existance? I could understand the importance of this topic if regular content was released and sure Penders has shown us things over the year/s since his announcement but it hasn't been noteworthy, all I recall is ugly character designs and a page from some prequel along with a flood of moronic tweets. All the while for this wait we get into tangents about the same stuff over and over like a circle eventually devolving back into what you guys don't want which causes you to threat which starts the circle again. This "Lara-Su Chronicles" isn't even known outside the fanbase, its like our own secret joke, only letting people in on it when they think the main Sonic comic is still bullshit from 10 years ago (Yeah, its been 10 years now since Penders was ever on the main Sonic comic).

To me, The longer this topic goes on the more pointless it seems. maybe closing it is a viable option or at least this one until the impossible happens and Penders actually releases something that resembles a comic.

[Adamis]

If it's an headache for some people, surely these people can just not come to this topic ?

Also, he didn't release anything because there's been a death in his family recently (as he told me in an e-mail from a few days ago + there was a message on his Twitter account), so as bad as he can get, maybe drop the acid ?

[goku262002]

Just now, Adamis said:

If it's an headache for some people, surely these people can just not come to this topic ?

Also, he didn't release anything because there's been a death in his family recently (as he told me in an e-mail from a few days ago + there was a message on his Twitter account), so as bad as he can get, maybe drop the acid ?

Maybe, but I feel that it doesn't stop the cycle even if there was 2 people in this topic on a regular basis.

Okay, credit for that but I was also inputting from the last year and a half of his delays. if he has been working, legitimately working, on this comic he should've been better presenting that first and foremost instead of his twitter tirades which I know him more for now. this comic or graphic novel or whatever it is now should be what hes presenting to people seeing as he wants to make a profit from it, but thanks to his rants on twitter we collectively have enough evidence to show anyone why we shouldn't support him in hindsight I feel that Twitter will be a major backfire on him then his forum ever was.

[Nepenthe]

Miss me with these excuses and take responsibility for your actions for once. Lack of content updates doesn't excuse bad posting. If you can't gather the maturity to just ask what is going on in the comic in a way that isn't against the in-thread rules or just in a generally derailing manner (nevermind actually Googling it yourself), then don't post. 

This thread hasn't been locked yet because I've been willing to give people chances to actually recover it from the shitty state that it was in beforehand and discuss the overall subject with some tact. If that's not how the thread has been going and people have been engaging in nonsense that goes against the stated rules under my radar, then I'll review it when I get time and make a decision on its overall fate.

[Ellipsis-Ultima]

Actually, there's Evan Stanley, Diana Skelly, Jennifer, Rafa Knight, and Aleah Baker who sometimes writes the stories/makes covers/draws.... Did I miss anyone else?

[RetroRy]

1 hour ago, Detective Zebra said:

Actually, there's Evan Stanley, Diana Skelly, Jennifer, Rafa Knight, and Aleah Baker who sometimes writes the stories/makes covers/draws.... Did I miss anyone else?

I actually just brought this list to his attention on how these women basically have become regulars on the book within the last few years.  Can't wait to see him justify his answer on why it's not the same.

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

Maybe he was talking about when he was working on the book? I doubt he really pays close attention to anything going on with the book currently.

[Celestia]

The way he phrased that statement makes it seem like he meant it in the present tense.

Quote

One of my biggest disappointments with the Sonic comic series is not seeing more female creators recruited to work on the books.

Since he said "more" I think it's fair to assume he's well aware of the women Detective Zebra mentioned, or at least some of them. Take that as you will. Personally I can't say I disagree exactly. I'd like to see more writers in general--I like Ian's work as well as the other more rare writers / artists who contribute here and there, mind you, but I'm always open to new blood, so to speak.

[Zaysho]

I tend to be a little... distrustful when Penders says anything about the comic at this point because I'm fairly doubtful he's really aware of who's working on the book besides the most well-known creatives (I'm pretty sure he's said Terry Austin was slumming on the book at one point). Granted, I know for a fact he does buy the book, because he throws those issues up on his eBay all the time (yes, issues he has nothing to do with) and does like bringing up the statements of ownership from time to time, I don't think he's all that aware because he doesn't seem to care for Sonic beyond what he did (he likes to inflate the importance of his contributions to the point of insisting that SEGA can't get along or make a movie without them), nor does he seem interested in the work of others who picked up the book after him.

I know I should give him the benefit of the doubt, but I've done this song and dance long enough that I think he'd just be looking to pat himself on the back because he recruited Dawn Best back in the day (though I will grant Archie Sonic did launch her career, so kudos to him for that).

That said, I wouldn't mind some new writers in the mix. Archie isn't hurting for artists, really (I say while wanting to get in with them one of these days), and they have been branching out while letting Flynn handle the basic outlines, so I can see them adding a few others such as those that have been doing the Worlds Unite Battle short stories and whatever else.

[Sunwalker]

23 hours ago, Tenko said:

What can I say, I've grown up reading his stories, own every comic, some of the guys insanity might have rubbed off on me haha.

On a sadder note, poor Ian's thread on the closure of his forums and his final posts made were somehow lost during the closing process and he can't get them back. He's pretty upset about it too apparently. Hope one of our more archival minded forum members managed to get a screen cap or copy of the posts before they disappeared.

 

22 hours ago, Tylinos said:

I actually do have a copy saved of the final page of the End of Forum Announcement thread (I had it open when the posts disappeared, so I saved it just in case), and I know someone posted up a full forum backup earlier that day...although the link was on one of the lost parts of the thread.  Anyone here happen to still have that backup link?

 

20 hours ago, Tenko said:

If anyone would Tylinos I would say it would be VEDJ-F. She's a bloody good historian and archivist when it comes to Sonic, she's also usually one of the first ones to report on Ian's posts and info, especially regarding the Archie comics. Failing that, Fatpanda (is that still his user name, haven't been in the Archie forum for a while since NZ no longer gets Sonic comics shipped here) he's also usually got his finger on the pulse on Bumbleking, you could try hitting one of those two up.

I am the one who did the forum backup. Here is the link to the backup: http://1drv.ms/1JCHbIL

Fortunately, I have managed to savage all the 14 pages of the End of the Forum thread, before they were somehow lost. I have put them in a separate file in the above backup, for the sake  of simplicity, so you do not have to download a 700 MB file just to see them.

By the way, I have also noticed that the images uploaded to the forum were also lost, but I can recover them from a previous backup of January 7th 2016, that I have on my computer. I will upload them to the backup linked above once I finish digging them up.

I am also getting in touch with Ian about what I could recover, and I will see where else I can post this link. Anyone with doubts or concerns about this backup, feel free to PM me on this forum 

On a related note, here goes some advice. Contrary to the popular belief, things do disappear from the Internet. So if you see some important page that you think you will need to refer later, then bookmark it and save it. Aside from saving on the computer, there are a couple of online places that allow you to archive pages: archive.is and web.archive.org (it has a save page form at the bottom). This way you decrease the chances of important material getting lost, especially when you need to refer to them in the future.

I have also made a script that submitted to Web Archive all the URLs I have found, so Web Archive has almost all of the forum archived in a browsable form, wxcept for the URLs that went down before it had the chance to crawl, but the archive is pretty extensive anyways .

[horridus]

Regarding Penders comments, I've learned to be extremely wary whenever he pulls the 'more progressive than thou', given the actual content of his works and his various actions and statements over the years. He might talk a good game, but his actual efforts when it comes to being progressive or engaging in such themes tend to be lackluster and token. In this particular case it's more about congratulating himself and once more sniping at his ex-employers. This is the same guy who claimed his invisible gay romance in the book 'paved the way' for the openly gay Kevin Keller, despite things being so vague that nobody at all figured things out until he revealed the truth on his forum. 

[King Scoopa Koopa]

10 hours ago, Zaysho said:

I tend to be a little... distrustful when Penders says anything about the comic at this point because I'm fairly doubtful he's really aware of who's working on the book besides the most well-known creatives (I'm pretty sure he's said Terry Austin was slumming on the book at one point). Granted, I know for a fact he does buy the book, because he throws those issues up on his eBay all the time (yes, issues he has nothing to do with) and does like bringing up the statements of ownership from time to time, I don't think he's all that aware because he doesn't seem to care for Sonic beyond what he did (he likes to inflate the importance of his contributions to the point of insisting that SEGA can't get along or make a movie without them), nor does he seem interested in the work of others who picked up the book after him.

Well, he did give birth to Sonic, plumbing the depths of his own womb with nothing more than a fountain pen, a bottle of moonshine, and lots of dodging and burning.

SEGA, of course, is the estranged father. Sure, they played a role in Sonic's conception, but it was Penders who gave Sonic life, and it's Penders who really cares about Sonic. SEGA isn't there for Sonic, they don't care about his wants or needs or development. But Penders? He'll make sure Sonic is grooviest hep cat on the playground, daddy-o. To the extreme! (Because that's how cool kids talk, right?)

[horridus]

14 minutes ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

Well, he did give birth to Sonic, plumbing the depths of his own womb with nothing more than a fountain pen, a bottle of moonshine, and lots of dodging and burning.

SEGA, of course, is the estranged father. Sure, they played a role in Sonic's conception, but it was Penders who gave Sonic life, and it's Penders who really cares about Sonic. SEGA isn't there for Sonic, they don't care about his wants or needs or development. But Penders? He'll make sure Sonic is grooviest hep cat on the playground, daddy-o. To the extreme! (Because that's how cool kids talk, right?)

What pathetic drivel is this?

Everyone knows that Penders is the father of KNUCKLES! Get your bastardizations right!  

Heh, seriously though, the really sad thing? Penders actually doesn't abuse the dodge and burn tool... somehow, he is able to make his art look that way all on his own. It's actually kind of amazing. 

[SBR2]

Apparently Writing complete arcs and getting pushes all the time isn't enough exposure for the female creators on the book in Ken's eyes.

[horridus]

Goalpost moving? From Penders? Shocking. Simply shocking. 

It's funny that he brings up Butler and Fry tho, given that they both had extensive careers before coming to Sonic. Seems a little cheap to make that comparison. Which is par the course for Penders, really, but still.