Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[horridus]

1 hour ago, DabigRG said:

Actually, Geoffrey had a fair bit of character development before that. In fact, some might even argue he actually saw less development after the marriage until the King Naugus Arc--which coincided with everyone thinking Hershey was dead. 

Oops.(Not that it didn't add/provide something to his character during that arc.)

You are indeed correct- and just like the marriage, all of that development sprung not from Penders, but from Karl Bollers, much like how most of Elias' developments before Flynn came on board came from Bollers rather than the guy who actually made him. At the end though its not the relationship itself that is the issue, but the fact that it is simply another example of his disrespect towards the work others on the book did, despite his claims otherwise. Which, as I said multiple times, is not surprising... but it IS aggravating. 

1 hour ago, DabigRG said:

Uh, not to scar any ignorant brains or anything, but you do realize that 16 was an age of matrimony/consent in similar locations for years and is still one even in some states?

Don't get me wrong, it's still pretty eye scrunchy, but it has precedent.

Oh, I am well aware. Thing is though, regardless of the legal reality, 18 is treated as the age of adulthood overwhelmingly so in the US, and 20 year olds going after 15-16 year olds is definitely not regarded as a good thing, ESPECIALLY not in a comic book intended for 8-12 year olds. That it has precendent in history and within the nation is not a sufficient excuse, nor does the excuse of this being another world and culture really work given that contrary to what Penders wanted the world to think, this was never the kind of book meant to handle such subjects, which would be touchy to handle even in a more mature work. 

1 hour ago, DabigRG said:

WTF?! Really?!

What bio is this exactly?

The one that he wrote for Geoff in LSC.

Right here.

Look to the where it says "Dynamac-3000", the text following it. It reads as such-

Quote

It was during that mission he discovered a rival for the Princess' affections. Whereas the princess would be one of a line of conquests where St. John was concerned, the blue-spined Erinaceinae who protested doth too much regarding his affections for the Princess for St. John's taste would prove to be a source of great sport and amusement.

That one is going to burned into my brain for a while now. Do take note that according to Penders, this is all his 'TRUE' vision at work- it even uses the word 'conquest' to describe how Geoff viewed Sally. This is the hill he's chosen to die on. 

[Big Panda]

I teeny, tiny, miniscule part of me likes to hope that Ken simply chose those words without stopping to think of their implications...

[RedFox99]

Has anyone here ever met Penders in person before?

[Flyinpenguin117]

9 hours ago, horridus said:

Now now- she actually wasn't dead, recall, just deep undercover. The only 'death' she got was thanks to the lawsuit forcing the entire universe being rebooted.

I've always wondered.... while I know it'd never be addressed in the comic, did the banned characters still exist, just in a different form/backstory that means they never cross paths with the main storyline, or were they specifically removed from reality as if they never existed in the first place?

[Multikaris]

And if Sega ditches the Archie characters completely, will Penders try to grab them from their clutches?

[RedFox99]

1 minute ago, Miragnarok said:

And if Sega ditches the Archie characters completely, will Penders try to grab them from their clutches?

Well given his perception of legal use, he might end up doing so. I don't mean to be cruel, but he has a self-entitlement issue.

[Big Panda]

32 minutes ago, Flyinpenguin117 said:

I've always wondered.... while I know it'd never be addressed in the comic, did the banned characters still exist, just in a different form/backstory that means they never cross paths with the main storyline, or were they specifically removed from reality as if they never existed in the first place?

It can be whatever you want it to be.

Maybe they existed but lived completely different lives at different times and places, maybe even in different bodies.

Maybe Geoffrey was alive before Sonic was even born. Maybe Mina lives in Silver's time. Maybe Fiona is an 80-year-old lady in Sonic's time. Hell, maybe Elias was reincarnated into Relic. The possibilities, however crazy, are infinite.

[horridus]

33 minutes ago, Flyinpenguin117 said:

I've always wondered.... while I know it'd never be addressed in the comic, did the banned characters still exist, just in a different form/backstory that means they never cross paths with the main storyline, or were they specifically removed from reality as if they never existed in the first place?

Hypothetically they COULD exist, but given the legalities involved we would never ever see them or see them acknowledged, since they cannot under any circumstance be used. So in effect, Hershey really DID 'die' since she legally could not show up in the comic. Beyond that though it would largely fall to you to decide what's what. 

6 minutes ago, Miragnarok said:

And if Sega ditches the Archie characters completely, will Penders try to grab them from their clutches?

SEGA no longer using the Archie character doesn't magically free up the copyrights. Pre-Reboot the copyrights are a clusterfuck, and SEGA doesn't actually acknowledge the ownership of any of the creators who contributed anything to the book from that time, nor does Penders have any kind of claim beyond anything he personally did not create, having already created a stand-in for Athair called 'Auri-on' due to not having the copyright for that character. Similarly, anything made by Flynn or Stanley or Baker is VERY explicitly owned SEGA, ESPECIALLY the post-reboot stuff. 

[RedFox99]

I wonder though: does Ian know that Penders wants to use his stuff, because I'm assuming he'll use stuff from the reboot comics. 

[horridus]

1 minute ago, RedFox99 said:

I wonder though: does Ian know that Penders wants to use his stuff, because I'm assuming he'll use stuff from the reboot comics. 

I sincerely doubt that Penders would want to. The reboot comics are a completely non-entity to Penders- he couldn't even be bothered to keep up with Flynn's run after leaving the book, not that he let a little fact like that keep him from criticizing the guy all the same. Words really cannot begin to convey just how little Penders actually cares about anything Sonic related that didn't stem from him- he only invoked Scourge because Scourge was popular and started out as Anti-Sonic. 

[Harkofthewaa]

2 hours ago, horridus said:

4 hours ago, DabigRG said:

WTF?! Really?!

What bio is this exactly?

The one that he wrote for Geoff in LSC.

Right here.

Look to the where it says "Dynamac-3000", the text following it. It reads as such-

Quote

It was during that mission he discovered a rival for the Princess' affections. Whereas the princess would be one of a line of conquests where St. John was concerned, the blue-spined Erinaceinae who protested doth too much regarding his affections for the Princess for St. John's taste would prove to be a source of great sport and amusement.

That one is going to burned into my brain for a while now. Do take note that according to Penders, this is all his 'TRUE' vision at work- it even uses the word 'conquest' to describe how Geoff viewed Sally. This is the hill he's chosen to die on. 

Hold the phone, any more evidence of this and Geoffery is gonna get paid a visit from Chris Hansen...

[DabigRG]

3 hours ago, horridus said:

You are indeed correct- and just like the marriage, all of that development sprung not from Penders, but from Karl Bollers, much like how most of Elias' developments before Flynn came on board came from Bollers rather than the guy who actually made him.

What's interesting about that is that I recall Mr. Penders stating that he created/introduced Elias in his Knuckles comic for Karl Bollers to use in the main book. Almost makes me wonder if he would've bothered if not for that alleged fact.

Has there been any sign of Elias in this, btw?

3 hours ago, horridus said:

Oh, I am well aware. Thing is though, regardless of the legal reality, 18 is treated as the age of adulthood overwhelmingly so in the US, and 20 year olds going after 15-16 year olds is definitely not regarded as a good thing, ESPECIALLY not in a comic book intended for 8-12 year olds. That it has precendent in history and within the nation is not a sufficient excuse, nor does the excuse of this being another world and culture really work given that contrary to what Penders wanted the world to think, this was never the kind of book meant to handle such subjects, which would be touchy to handle even in a more mature work. 

 

True.

Ah well, it's in/out there now.

3 hours ago, horridus said:

The one that he wrote for Geoff in LSC.

Right here.

Look to the where it says "Dynamac-3000", the text following it. It reads as such-

Quote

It was during that mission he discovered a rival for the Princess' affections. Whereas the princess would be one of a line of conquests where St. John was concerned, the blue-spined Erinaceinae who protested doth too much regarding his affections for the Princess for St. John's taste would prove to be a source of great sport and amusement.

That one is going to burned into my brain for a while now. Do take note that according to Penders, this is all his 'TRUE' vision at work- it even uses the word 'conquest' to describe how Geoff viewed Sally. This is the hill he's chosen to die on. 

Oh my goodness...he actually used that turn of phrase. I know he's openly aiming for an older audience now, but still.

With that said, I know I asked for that bio specifically for that line, but I'm honestly more interested in pointing out the list of Abilities this time-warped Geoffrey possessing.

Also, is it me or there a few serious incomplete sentences in the History?

1 hour ago, Flyinpenguin117 said:

I've always wondered.... while I know it'd never be addressed in the comic, did the banned characters still exist, just in a different form/backstory that means they never cross paths with the main storyline, or were they specifically removed from reality as if they never existed in the first place?

Yes.

1 hour ago, Miragnarok said:

And if Sega ditches the Archie characters completely, will Penders try to grab them from their clutches?

 

1 hour ago, RedFox99 said:

Well given his perception of legal use, he might end up doing so. I don't mean to be cruel, but he has a self-entitlement issue.

Not to jump on the bandwagon of insulting Mr. Penders after all this time, but he'd be really friggin stupid to do that considering the other Archie Characters(with the exception of those who joined/worked around the time Ian Flynn did) belong to their respective creators--by his own efforts, no less!

1 hour ago, Ernest the Snowpanda said:

IMaybe Geoffrey was alive before Sonic was even born. 

Well, he was/is.

45 minutes ago, horridus said:

 So in effect, Hershey really DID 'die' since she legally could not show up in the comic. Beyond that though it would largely fall to you to decide what's what. 

That's not the reason she didn't turn up when she was intended to: despite initially covering his tracks by claiming the mysterious figure(s) were the Wolf Twins Leeta and Lyco, Mr. Flynn later admitted that the mysterious figure mentioned in the solicits was indeed originally supposed be Hershey as part of his plans involving the Secret Freedom Fighters, but he realized he didn't have enough space/pages to work her in effectively and so cut her intended appearance there to keep the issue focused.

[horridus]

15 hours ago, DabigRG said:

What's interesting about that is that I recall Mr. Penders stating that he created/introduced Elias in his Knuckles comic for Karl Bollers to use in the main book. Almost makes me wonder if he would've bothered if not for that alleged fact.

Has there been any sign of Elias in this, btw?

That MIGHT explain why he never seemed to do anything with the guy after introducing him, though frankly I've learned to take what Penders says with a grain of a salt. An odd decision either way, given the fact his existence was something of a can of worms itself considering the questions his existence raised. 

And so far, nah, no signs of Elias as of yet. Given Elias wasn't present or mentioned in 25YL, I'm not all that confident about him being alive or present for whatever is intended to happen in LSC. 

15 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Oh my goodness...he actually used that turn of phrase. I know he's openly aiming for an older audience now, but still.

With that said, I know I asked for that bio specifically for that line, but I'm honestly more interested in pointing out the list of Abilities this time-warped Geoffrey possessing.

Also, is it me or there a few serious incomplete sentences in the History?

Yeah, its uh... something, alright. 

And oh boy, tell me about it. This is precisely how you DON'T go about summarizing a characters skills and powers- it just goes on and on and borders on to wankery. 

Oh, its not just you, not even remotely. Penders needs himself a proofreader. Among other things. 

15 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Not to jump on the bandwagon of insulting Mr. Penders after all this time, but he'd be really friggin stupid to do that considering the other Archie Characters(with the exception of those who joined/worked around the time Ian Flynn did) belong to their respective creators--by his own efforts, no less!

Recall, this IS a man who tried to copyright the idea of multiverse theory and continues to take credit for things like time travel and alternate universes despite these things having been in the franchise before he came on board, to say nothing of his continued denial that the idea of surviving echidna existed before him as well. Having been said, he is at least aware of the fact he cannot use the other creators characters- he's replaced Athair with someone called 'Auri-On', and then of course we have the rhino that used to be Rotor. His invokation of Scourge is due to the fact that he began as Anti-Sonic, but Anti's status itself is something of a weird legal clusterfuck as well. 

[Multikaris]

1 hour ago, Ernest the Snowpanda said:

It can be whatever you want it to be.

Maybe they existed but lived completely different lives at different times and places, maybe even in different bodies.

Maybe Geoffrey was alive before Sonic was even born. Maybe Mina lives in Silver's time. Maybe Fiona is an 80-year-old lady in Sonic's time. Hell, maybe Elias was reincarnated into Relic. The possibilities, however crazy, are infinite.

And I also propose that true of Boom, and maybe IDW. 

[RedFox99]

So I asked Ian what he thought about this and he says that he's not familiar with the nitty gritty of the copyright. 

[BlueSky]

10 hours ago, DabigRG said:

What's interesting about that is that I recall Mr. Penders stating that he created/introduced Elias in his Knuckles comic for Karl Bollers to use in the main book. Almost makes me wonder if he would've bothered if not for that alleged fact.

If that's the case, I just wonder why... what kind of hidden intentions he had, if he had any..? He just doesn't hit me like a creator who would create something for others to use just like that, considering his stand towards others usage of his own-made creations. Then again, maybe it was another time and all that jazz... Like I'd know any of it, it just raises a huge question mark inside my head...

53 minutes ago, RedFox99 said:

So I asked Ian what he thought about this and he says that he's not familiar with the nitty gritty of the copyright. 

Sounds Mr. Flynn alright. And even if he'd know anything, he strikes me as a kind of guy who wouldn't put his spoon in a soup like this, what I've seen is he tries not to stir any drama in the Internet which is pretty nice thing I'd say. Pretty role-model like even, something I appreciate.

[Sidronas]

On 30/12/2017 at 7:16 AM, Zaysho said:

Keep in mind this is the guy who said he picked up "Mobius" at the Goodwill SEGA and Archie left it. It doesn't surprise me he thinks he can try to do that with something less generic or that people just need to be paid and he can do whatever he wants.

i was there on the forum when he said that

[CleverSonicUsername]

On ‎1‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 5:49 PM, horridus said:

It was during that mission he discovered a rival for the Princess' affections. Whereas the princess would be one of a line of conquests where St. John was concerned, the blue-spined Erinaceinae who protested doth too much regarding his affections for the Princess for St. John's taste would prove to be a source of great sport and amusement.

Look, I'm not much of a writer myself, but everything about this reads like someone is having a stroke.

[Razule]

12 minutes ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

the blue-spined Erinaceinae

Oh I remember that guy, S'awn-ik, Penders' completely original character.

[CleverSonicUsername]

1 hour ago, Razule said:

Oh I remember that guy, S'awn-ik, Penders' completely original character.

I just really like how he can't even seem to use stuff like "echidna" or "blue hedgehog" as descriptors because they're probably a bit too specific.

[SenEDDtor Missile]

9 minutes ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

I just really like how he can't even seem to use stuff like "echidna" or "blue hedgehog" as descriptors because they're probably a bit too specific.

That or he thinks he's being real clever and using the ridiculously long words to hopefully obfuscate his intention of appropriating the blue spined Erinaceinae for his work even as he attempts to promote his "masterpiece".

[CleverSonicUsername]

Just now, SenEDDtor Missile said:

That or he thinks he's being real clever and using the ridiculously long words to hopefully obfuscate his intention of appropriating the blue spined Erinaceinae for his work even as he attempts to promote his "masterpiece".

I mean that's pretty much what I'm getting at. He can't directly say it's Sonic or Knuckles and using descriptors like "blue hedgehog" would be far too specific, so he thinks he's being more clever than he is by skirting around that in an attempt to appropriate those characters.

[horridus]

9 hours ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

Look, I'm not much of a writer myself, but everything about this reads like someone is having a stroke.

Yeah, its kind of amazing that the word check didn't pick up on something being off about that one, or any of the others for that matter. I still debate whether 'Erinaceinae' is an intended or unintended misspelling of 'Erinaceidae'. And since I'm on the subject, even getting away from how pathetically transparent it is for him to resort to the scientific name of the species as a way to very poorly wriggle around the fact that its still a blue-spined hedgehog (and somehow still less blatant than 'Echyd'nya'), the decision to re-classify Mobians in this way is pretty questionable give that A) Penders insists this is a 'hard science fiction' story, and yet is using human words to designate a supposedly alien species, and B ) Why do the Echidna get remade into 'Echyd'nya' while the other species of Mobius go by latin names? Would it not be more 'alien' for all of them to get the Klingon treatment? 

I know, it's redundant to point out given that Penders is creatively bankrupt and fond of throwing terms around he doesn't actually understand, but its irritating all the same, especially since its such a simple thing to work with and yet even THAT is beyond him.

[Tylinos]

And now for another edition of Ken's Arbitrary Deadlines:

The TL-SC app is now slated for a March release.  Because having just missed yet another arbitrary deadline for it last month apparently still wasn't enough for him to realize he should just stop publicizing release windows.

[horridus]

7 minutes ago, Tylinos said:

And now for another edition of Ken's Arbitrary Deadlines:

The TL-SC app is now slated for a March release.  Because having just missed yet another arbitrary deadline for it last month apparently still wasn't enough for him to realize he should just stop publicizing release windows.

Didn't he say it was for April the last time?? Well, whatever, something to keep looking out for until March rolls on by. I'm sure he'll have an entertaining excuse for why this still hasn't gotten anywhere by then.