Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[Razule]

Unless he's redrawing it, he'd still be reprinting assets of a comic owned by Archie and licensed by SEGA, so I have no idea how this would work. Unless it somehow goes under fair-use?

[horridus]

1 hour ago, DabigRG said:

Remastered in the sense that he removes what characters and elements won't be in the Lara-SU Chronicles, one hopes.

But hey, at least he's working to get something else released.

Yeeeah, if that's the case he'd have to redraw it from scratch- not only are the characters he DOESN'T own very prominently featured, but he also doesn't own the artwork that was used in the story. It belongs to Steve Butler. 

And frankly, he's been 'working' towards getting multiple things released for years now, and every one of those endeavors has turned up zilch. Him announcing this is just another in the long list of frankly pathetic attempts to appear as though he's hard at work on something or the other, when come Comic-Con he's still not going to have anything of substance to show for his efforts. This isn't even the first time he's mentioned something like this- he's mentioned including a version of 'The Die Is Cast' with a revised ending for a few years now.

So yeah, until we see something? It's all empty words. 

[SBR2]

1 hour ago, Razule said:

Unless he's redrawing it, he'd still be reprinting assets of a comic owned by Archie and licensed by SEGA, so I have no idea how this would work. Unless it somehow goes under fair-use?

Except according to him Archie doesn't own the material they printed. I mean even if he's right Sega probably still has ownership over it.

[Zaysho]

It seems pretty murky. It's possible he may have ownership of the stories--the scripts and the art. Depends on what stories he managed to actually secure the copyrights for when this all started (iirc, Sega either secured or at least attempted to file for the copyrights of the Knuckles series when this all broke years ago), and it's entirely possible Butler may have signed over his rights to the artwork anyway. I believe Butler was still a regular with Archie in one way or the other during and after this, so he may not have gotten involved in this mess. That's just a guess on my part though.

I'm not sure how he's legally covered if the stories involved Sonic, Knuckles, Sally, et al., but I've long since given up trying to make sense of this.

[Salamander]

Even assuming that Ken owned everything else - story, characters, art - then I would imagine he'd have to redraw the SEGA characters with his own distinct designs and different names à la K'Nox (or just scrub out any text that actually gives their names, black out the characters into shadows, etc.).  Alternatively, if he put the whole thing out for free, there might be an argument that it wasn't a commercial use of the property and thus falls under fair use, like fanart.  It would depend, basically.

With that said, given Ken's estimated publication date for his "remaster":

Then the answer is that we'll never find out.

[OnyxCrimsonBlur]

On 6/18/2019 at 12:55 AM, SBR2 said:

Except according to him Archie doesn't own the material they printed. I mean even if he's right Sega probably still has ownership over it.

My thoughts would be that the 25YL arc would only have to do with the characters that he created as his fan works. Honestly, that's all they really are now are 'original characters, do not steal.' He wouldn't be able to use any Sonic official characters and to be honest, I'm surprised he's getting away with the clearly Knuckles rip off with the cyber eye.

[DabigRG]

2 hours ago, OnyxCrimsonBlur said:

My thoughts would be that the 25YL arc would only have to do with the characters that he created as his fan works. Honestly, that's all they really are now are 'original characters, do not steal.' He wouldn't be able to use any Sonic official characters and to be honest, I'm surprised he's getting away with the clearly Knuckles rip off with the cyber eye.

I'm guessing it's either because he decked him out enough that K'nox" is legally distinct from what SEGA would say represents Knuckles and/or it's the same way he allowed Archie to reprint his stories for a while: he won't be on covers.    

[Rabid-Coot]

With all his talk of reprints would a writer typically get the finished page assets that are used for printing?

[Big Panda]

5 hours ago, Rabid-Coot said:

With all his talk of reprints would a writer typically get the finished page assets that are used for printing?

Considering the pages he used to showcase foreign translations of “The Die is Cast” were clearly direct scans from the comic itself, I’m guessing no.

[RobotnikHolmes]

Hmm, if he was to reprint those 25YL stories, wouldn't he have to get the permission of the artist Dawn Best? And the colourist and whatnot? I'm no expert on ownership or anything, but it can't be that just because this dude wrote the stories, it shouldn't mean he gets to re-publish it without crediting the other guys who drew and lettered it, right?

[King Scoopa Koopa]

2 hours ago, RobotnikHolmes said:

Hmm, if he was to reprint those 25YL stories, wouldn't he have to get the permission of the artist Dawn Best? And the colourist and whatnot? I'm no expert on ownership or anything, but it can't be that just because this dude wrote the stories, it shouldn't mean he gets to re-publish it without crediting the other guys who drew and lettered it, right?

It shouldn't, but he's Ken Penders; concepts of "should" and "should not" don't apply to him, because he's a smart businessman!

[SBR2]

5 hours ago, RobotnikHolmes said:

Hmm, if he was to reprint those 25YL stories, wouldn't he have to get the permission of the artist Dawn Best? And the colourist and whatnot? I'm no expert on ownership or anything, but it can't be that just because this dude wrote the stories, it shouldn't mean he gets to re-publish it without crediting the other guys who drew and lettered it, right?

Steven Butler was the penciler on it but I brought it up to him and he respondedthat it's none of my business. Which TBF his legal dealings aren't anyone's business but his but also I think asking "Do you have a plan for how you don't own these characters and also have a way to pay royalties which you claim to care about?" is fair.

[Kellodrawsalot]

12 minutes ago, SBR2 said:

Steven Butler was the penciler on it but I brought it up to him and he respondedthat it's none of my business. Which TBF his legal dealings aren't anyone's business but his but also I think asking "Do you have a plan for how you don't own these characters and also have a way to pay royalties which you claim to care about?" is fair.

it just sounds Penders is betting all of his luck on Sega and the other people who worked on thise issue not to care enough  to make a hassle about it, Which is fair Sonic Team has no issues turning a blind eye on Sonc Zines but I wonder if he secertly settled with Butler over a price or hoping Butler wont care.

 

 

[DabigRG]

47 minutes ago, SBR2 said:

Steven Butler was the penciler on it but I brought it up to him and he respondedthat it's none of my business. Which TBF his legal dealings aren't anyone's business but his but also I think asking "Do you have a plan for how you don't own these characters and also have a way to pay royalties which you claim to care about?" is fair.

Mr. Penders or Mr. Butler? 

[SBR2]

2 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Mr. Penders or Mr. Butler? 

Penders. Butler isn't on Twitter. 

[SBR2]

https://mobile.twitter.com/KenPenders/status/1150992741578371072

Ken gave the pronunciation of Ecyd'na and says "It sounds better said by someone who speaks fluent Klingon" and Hoo boy if that doesn't say the world right there. 

[Big Panda]

“A kidney, yeah?”

[DabigRG]

8 minutes ago, SBR2 said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/KenPenders/status/1150992741578371072

Ken gave the pronunciation of Ecyd'na and says "It sounds better said by someone who speaks fluent Klingon" and Hoo boy if that doesn't say the world right there. 

Almost sounds Canadian.

Also

Quote

★ Zapher ★@That_Zapher_Guy·: y'o'u s'u'r'e l'o'v'e a'p'o's't'r'o'p'h'e's

Ken Penders@KenPenders·: One lousy apostrophe and you have a problem with THAT?! Let's not get ridiculous here.

 

[horridus]

1 hour ago, SBR2 said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/KenPenders/status/1150992741578371072

Ken gave the pronunciation of Ecyd'na and says "It sounds better said by someone who speaks fluent Klingon" and Hoo boy if that doesn't say the world right there. 

It really does. Also, not the smartest move there to directly invoke the incredibly well known constructed language of another franchise to describe his own stuff. He already gets shit for ripping off of Sonic, he REALLY doesn't need to invite people to do the same thing with Star Trek. 

Likewise, had a bit of a small laugh at that 'THE LARA-SU CHRONICLES is straight up sci-fi and doesn’t treat the characters as human in animal form. Their beliefs, culture & so on differs from what humans do in many ways' bit. This guy repeatedly claimed he 'always' saw the characters of Sonic as aliens and wrote them with that in mind. Largely to justify the fact that he can't actually convincingly write believable humans, and as such, couldn't write convincingly believable characters in general. 

[Rabid-Coot]

Thats a fancy way of saying they have a lower age of consent.

[Dr. Detective]

On 6/18/2019 at 1:05 AM, Zaysho said:

It seems pretty murky. It's possible he may have ownership of the stories--the scripts and the art. Depends on what stories he managed to actually secure the copyrights for when this all started (iirc, Sega either secured or at least attempted to file for the copyrights of the Knuckles series when this all broke years ago), and it's entirely possible Butler may have signed over his rights to the artwork anyway. I believe Butler was still a regular with Archie in one way or the other during and after this, so he may not have gotten involved in this mess. That's just a guess on my part though.

I'm not sure how he's legally covered if the stories involved Sonic, Knuckles, Sally, et al., but I've long since given up trying to make sense of this.

I'm sure it'll be fine.

All he's gotta do is turn them all into aliens.

Sinik the Hedg'nya-hag and Tale the Faux. 

They already look like alien, bootleg versions of the characters when he draws them anyway. I can actually hear a lawyer going "Your honor... this CLEARLY isn't Sonic the Hedgehog. Look, he's got huge breasts and a white string bikini."

[Adamis]

 

That's funny, I didn't get anything to translate, new or "last minute rewrite"...

[DabigRG]

4 hours ago, Adamis said:

 

That's funny, I didn't get anything to translate, new or "last minute rewrite"...

Oh dear...you don't think he opted for another, do you? 

[Adamis]

Maybe. That wouldn't surprise me, as I contradicted him a few times on Twitter in the past months. But I think he'd have told me.

We'll see

[Shadowlax]

Every time this thread updates I feel a genuine since of dread about why it has updated and what ken may have done. Ken's antics in the last few months has set my expectations of him, lower than they ever have.