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The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

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Why would Sonic even need to provoke Evil Sonic into a fight. Not only is Evil Sonic (Penders era at least) a petty little shit who takes any chance to try attack Sonic, but are we reaaaally forgetting the fact that just 15 issues prior, he kidnapped Sonic and impersonated him for an undisclosed amount of time? He is a known villain, why would Sonic need to wait for Evil Sonic to initiate the fight instead of just immediately going after him? Hell, why the fuck would Evil Sonic care if Rouge hooks up with Sonic or not? Rouge to him is meant to just be a patsy so he can get the Master Emerald, but suddenly he now cares about her so much to get into a fight with Sonic?

Like, I'd get it if it was Flynn!Era Scourge, because Scourge admits than he likes Fiona because unlike everyone else he knows/has been with, she makes an active decision to be bad, and be with him, rather than just be conditioned to be that way like the girls on Moebius, so if Fiona was the one Sonic pulled this with, then maybe, but Rouge makes no sense.

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On 11/30/2019 at 3:03 PM, Monkey Destruction Switch said:

Penders' idea to redeem Snively and kill him off and have it be a really emotional moment that has Sonic wracked with grief has always felt super weird to me. Snively has been evil and a sworn enemy of the Freedom Fighters for many, many years. Sure, if he finally sacrificed himself, it would be emotional, but grief seems like it'd be an odd response. I would more expect them to be stunned that he had good in him after all, thankful for his sacrifice, and be more serious and somber for a while in light of it. But would they MISS Snively? Of course not! He's been sidekick to one of the worst villains in Mobius' history since the Freedom Fighters were kids! So why would Sonic be "wracked with grief" as though Snively was one of his friends?? And that's not even getting to the weirdness of why Penders felt the need to redeem him or kill him off in the first place.

Some of the other ideas sound OK, but that doesn't necessarily mean they would be any good in Penders' hands...

Penders tends to have some really weird storytelling priorities in general. Just look at Chaos Knuckles and the entirety of 25YL. Beyond that though, when he wasn't trying to make these books into an "Epic" Sci-Fi Drama/Soap Opera? He pretty tried to write it as being your typical Superhero comic, in particular one from the times he was growing up. One of the things prevalent in 'his' era of comics was this idea that Archnemesises hold this weird place in the hearts of the various Superheroes, almost like a 'frenemy' sort of deal- and that if they were gone, the absence would in fact sadden said superheroes. Penders tends to copy tropes from stuff he likes without really giving much thought to the context, so in all likelihood he figured it was a similar deal- Snively is one of the constants in Sonic's life, so clearly, him being gone means it'd have an emotional impact on Sonic. 

Obviously this all falls apart pretty much for all the reasons mentioned by everyone else in this thread. This isn't a Superhero book, and Snively isn't a supervillain- he's the right hand of a genocidal dictator and an active participant in the events that destroyed Sonic's life along with the lives of his friends. While I doubt Sonic actively wishes anyone dead, it'd be REALLY difficult to justify him feeling all that torn up over Snively going bye-bye. 

But Penders has never allowed a little thing like characterization and context get in the way of Drama, nor has he ever really been able to process the book or its characters on their own terms when it was always so much more convenient to box them into genres he personally found 'acceptable'.  

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4 hours ago, Ryannumber1Santa said:

Why would Sonic even need to provoke Evil Sonic into a fight. Not only is Evil Sonic (Penders era at least) a petty little shit who takes any chance to try attack Sonic, but are we reaaaally forgetting the fact that just 15 issues prior, he kidnapped Sonic and impersonated him for an undisclosed amount of time? He is a known villain, why would Sonic need to wait for Evil Sonic to initiate the fight instead of just immediately going after him? Hell, why the fuck would Evil Sonic care if Rouge hooks up with Sonic or not? Rouge to him is meant to just be a patsy so he can get the Master Emerald, but suddenly he now cares about her so much to get into a fight with Sonic?

Like, I'd get it if it was Flynn!Era Scourge, because Scourge admits than he likes Fiona because unlike everyone else he knows/has been with, she makes an active decision to be bad, and be with him, rather than just be conditioned to be that way like the girls on Moebius, so if Fiona was the one Sonic pulled this with, then maybe, but Rouge makes no sense.

Ken penders has on numerous occasions have written stories who's only explanation is " he doesn't think of women characters besides objects and things to have" it also explains the funky acephobic shit he said on twitter

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16 hours ago, Dr. Christmas Mike said:

Stop using TOMORROWS in your titles for things Ken. TOMORROWS is not a good word. I know all words are made up but some words are better than others. That word is a not a good word.

He needs to quit using it because tomorrow never comes, since his stories never go anywhere.

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19 hours ago, Panda Claus said:

For the record, the gentleman-at-arms thing is canon. It was mentioned in the Sonic Comic Encyclopedia.

Just in case people weren’t aware.

Well yeah. Sonic gets that rank in #159 but it changes so little that it's never really mentioned again. He's like just as much a field commander as Sally is I think is really all the power the title actually brings.

I'm just bummed it didn't give him a silly orange armor and a helmet.

Quote

Rouge to him is meant to just be a patsy so he can get the Master Emerald, but suddenly he now cares about her so much to get into a fight with Sonic?

Eh, TBF the entirety of #151 is Evil Sonic trying to steal the Master Emerald so Rouge will fuck him...which is really kinda pathetic when you think about it. Even more so that she takes him "Somewhere they can discuss things more privately" over a smaller stone. It's almost like Penders isn't a very good writer.

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Sonic plowing Rouge to enrage Evil Sonic sounds like the plot of a porn comic, not an actual comic. And to agree with Ryannumber1Santa, why on earth would Evil Sonic care? What, is he actually dating Rouge now? Wouldn't he be off running around plowing other women like he did with Bunnie, and would of ditched Rouge at some point?

The Penders saga truly is something, although it is interesting how it does sound like the other writers at the time wern't exactly perfect either. You could right a book about this sortof thing, the behind the scenes of Archie Sonic, it just is that fascinating. I kindof wish there was somewhere that collected all the behind the scenes info as I am just learning so much of this second hand from users on this site.

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We haven't even talked about how rouge seems to have no agency. She is just a sexual plot device.

The penders era is so bad that I even feel like Ian Flynn wrote some bad stuff trying to fix his problems after the fact. I stand firmly by the comic got a great deal better once it rebooted. I see shit like this and while I wince at the handling at some of the things in the IDW comic, I understand their firmness on a bunch of issues. Every new detail is like "No yeah I understand most of the rules and restrictions , yep yeah. "

I honestly have to wonder, I feel as though through internet dissections, breakdowns on youtube and ken penders big mouth more people are aware of the fuckery that was the ken penders era. I wonder if ken is actually making it worse behind the scenes, like every time he opens his big mouth about some older characters there is someone in charge who doesn't want to use them because that association. Like ken penders cursing people from beyond the grave, or at least a literary and canonical one.

 

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Well, there's your movie comparison. Sonic Live is totally a better story than the movie. It's not like - one of the most despised issues of the whole Archie run or anything. Nope, not at all.

Y'know, there's not a lot of things you can place the Sonic movie above in terms of quality...but if the trailer with the new design was any indication, even that is a higher bar than Sonic Live. 

Also, he gave out this gem:

 

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Hold up. Something's not adding up. So looking further into the tweets, Ken elaborates on the making of the Sonic Live comic...

Apparently the reason why his son wound up holding a tv remote pretending to play Sonic games instead of actually playing it with a genesis controller was because his family had just moved in the new house they took those shots in, and he had to hastily make a new cover photo since the original photo for the comic cover had a tv deemed "too old" for it to be used according to "the suits", so they didn't have time to pull out the Genesis for the comic...

...But I had just read up that giant blog post about Ken and his "legacy" at Archie and it said that he never even owned a Sega Genesis and didn't even like the damn games lol. Also, looking up the actual comic, the cover art showing all those games is clearly different from the actual photos within the comics where it looks like the "old tv" was still being used in the comics... yet there's still no Genesis to be found and his son is still using a tv remote...?

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I asked that before, but didn't got an answer, so I'll ask again: Why in hell are you people listening to him?
 

I think we agree that Pender's opinions are stupid and that he WANTS attention people are giving him. Because there is no such thing as bad publicity and he doesn't have anything else.

He's got no power over this franchise, expect the one we give him by spreading his post. Ignore him and he'll disappear in thin air.

Why waste precious time on Earth by listening to him? If you need moronic opinions so badly, I can just make up some for you.

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3 hours ago, StriCNYN3 said:

 

...But I had just read up that giant blog post about Ken and his "legacy" at Archie and it said that he never even owned a Sega Genesis and didn't even like the damn games lol. Also, looking up the actual comic, the cover art showing all those games is clearly different from the actual photos within the comics where it looks like the "old tv" was still being used in the comics... yet there's still no Genesis to be found and his son is still using a tv remote...?

He "technically" didn't, but his son did. That's half the reason he even accepted the job in the first place, wasn't it?

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@DabigRG Hmm is that so? See, although I don't know too much about Ken and what he does, I was under the assumption that he just flat out never bought a Genesis. If not and he actually did get one, I'd say it's weird how he revolves his entire career around a franchise he could care less about yet buys the system and game for his children to play with. Idk though. It just seems off. It's still weird how there's blatantly two different tv sets going by the cover art and the actual comic pages. Why would the suits be concerned about only the front cover and not the whole comic?

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7 minutes ago, StriCNYN3 said:

@DabigRG Hmm is that so? See, although I don't know too much about Ken and what he does, I was under the assumption that he just flat out never bought a Genesis. If not and he actually did get one, I'd say it's weird how he revolves his entire career around a franchise he could care less about yet buys the system and game for his children to play with. Idk though. It just seems off. It's still weird how there's blatantly two different tv sets going by the cover art and the actual comic pages. Why would the suits be concerned about only the front cover and not the whole comic?

I don't know and honestly don't care.

Just going by what's been established for years--he was offered the job along with Mike Kanterovich, he knew little about the franchise beyond his son liking it, stuck with it up to the point that SEGA extended it, and he leaped at opportunities to do tell his own stories through Knuckles, which eventually led us to the infamy that persists to this day.

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6 hours ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

I asked that before, but didn't got an answer, so I'll ask again: Why in hell are you people listening to him?
 

I think we agree that Pender's opinions are stupid and that he WANTS attention people are giving him. Because there is no such thing as bad publicity and he doesn't have anything else.

He's got no power over this franchise, expect the one we give him by spreading his post. Ignore him and he'll disappear in thin air.

Why waste precious time on Earth by listening to him? If you need moronic opinions so badly, I can just make up some for you.

A good dumpster fire is hard to look away from tbh

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Small update.  Ken has revealed that he just now came up with a solution on how to deal with where Sally is in TLSC.  And the solution is...she's off-screen.

A brilliant and unique idea that no one else would have ever come up with.  Definitely not an obvious solution that everyone already knew was going to be the case.

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2 hours ago, Tylinos said:

Small update.  Ken has revealed that he just now came up with a solution on how to deal with where Sally is in TLSC.  And the solution is...she's off-screen.

A brilliant and unique idea that no one else would have ever come up with.  Definitely not an obvious solution that everyone already knew was going to be the case.

I'm not sure what's more eye-rolling. Him trying to convince us this was something that never occurred to him before, or the fact he feels a need to justify it as being 'inspired' by the lives of a pair of celebrities. 

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32 minutes ago, horridus said:

I'm not sure what's more eye-rolling. Him trying to convince us this was something that never occurred to him before, or the fact he feels a need to justify it as being 'inspired' by the lives of a pair of celebrities. 

Celebrities? Who in particular?

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1 minute ago, DabigRG said:

Celebrities? Who in particular?

Prince Harry and his wife Meghan Markle, whom are renouncing their royal titles and leaving the royal family of the UK. It's been on the news for a while now. 

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11 minutes ago, horridus said:

Prince Harry and his wife Meghan Markle, whom are renouncing their royal titles and leaving the royal family of the UK. It's been on the news for a while now. 

Oh, okay. How random.

I assumed he was just talking about somebody he sat next to for lunch in Hollywood.

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14 hours ago, Tylinos said:

Small update.  Ken has revealed that he just now came up with a solution on how to deal with where Sally is in TLSC.  And the solution is...she's off-screen.

A brilliant and unique idea that no one else would have ever come up with.  Definitely not an obvious solution that everyone already knew was going to be the case.

Holy fucking shit stop acting like it's coming out in the not too distant future if you're literally still coming up with plot points! Also I sincerely doubt he actually was thinking of such a plot because it would require writing Sally with literally any agency of her own. 

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