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Nintendoga

General Halo Thread & Discussion

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Well I never saw Halo Legends, but I don't see why it's such a stress to assume she's turned off functionalities that would lead to her rampancy, seeing as they're irrelevant given the situation. On top of that, neither she nor the chief seemed particularly concerned that she's more likely to go rampant before they're found.

In addition to what Goku said, there's the fact that she has to maintain that distress beacon and monitor the Chief so that she could wake him up. If she was in sleep mode, she wouldn't be able to maintain all that.

Kind of the same reason why your computer doesn't go into sleep mode while you're making a download, it's in the middle of doing something before it can do that.

That analogy only extends to the event queue BEFORE the system enters sleep mode. It's closer to the need for an overhead update loop to check when a key is pressed or mouse is clicked to turn back on. The whole idea of rampancy is that the AI is inevitably overwhelmed by all the information its acquired by a certain point in its life, but when you're simply monitoring the empty void of space for changes in patterns, there isn't a whole lot of information you need to acquire or process. Hell, if she retained only a finite amount of readings during sleep mode, she'd probably run out of power sooner than go rampant.

If they could turn her off, they don't have to worry about the threat of rampancy. They could keep AIs inactive for an extended period of time that way, and it would make a lot of sense to do so to keep them as far away from rampancy with that ability.

And if turning them off made little difference to the time they're active, that that only makes it further moot that they can't have it for around 100 years or so because she'd already be rampant before she hits the double digits of her life regardless.

But how often could these AIs have the opportunity to BE turned off for an extended period of time? The whole point of these AIs is to be a perpetually available assistant for use in a large-scale war; if she's not analyzing each situation or threat, calculating strategies or assisting someone in some way, she's probably maintaining a ship. On the other hand, the end of Halo 3 is an abnormal scenario where she can guaranteeably have no necessity beyond the one very simple simple task of waiting to be needed again.

Edited by SuperStingray

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Well I never saw Halo Legends, but I don't see why it's such a stress to assume she's turned off functionalities that would lead to her rampancy, seeing as they're irrelevant given the situation. On top of that, neither she nor the chief seemed particularly concerned that she's more likely to go rampant before they're found.

As far as know, there is no such ability to turn off functionalities leading to rampancy, otherwise why worry about rampancy in the first place?

And they were worried about her going rampant long before they got stuck into outer space; it was during the period in which she was stuck with the Gravemind and they were skeptical about following her advice in destroying the flood and then later on you had to rescue her from the monster to go through with the plan.

That analogy only extends to the event queue BEFORE the system enters sleep mode. It's closer to the need for an overhead update loop to check when a key is pressed or mouse is clicked to turn back on. The whole idea of rampancy is that the AI is inevitably overwhelmed by all the information its acquired by a certain point in its life, but when you're simply monitoring the empty void of space for changes in patterns, there isn't a whole lot of information you need to acquire or process. Hell, if she retained only a finite amount of readings during sleep mode, she'd probably run out of power sooner than go rampant.

Well seeing how from what I've read (and I'm trying to recall where) 7 seconds of doing nothing is excruciatingly boring to an AI, I don't think she's going to be doing a lot of nothing.

Not to mention that with rampancy being caused by an overwhelming of information, you do realize that Cortana absorbed A LOT of Forerunner data during her time right?

But how often could these AIs have the opportunity to BE turned off for an extended period of time? The whole point of these AIs is to be a perpetually available assistant for use in a large-scale war; if she's not analyzing each situation or threat, calculating strategies or assisting someone in some way, she's probably maintaining a ship. On the other hand, the end of Halo 3 is an abnormal scenario where she can guaranteeably have no necessity beyond the one very simple simple task of waiting to be needed again.

Considering that there is more than one and that desperate times could call on the creation of more than one? They could turn them off anytime they could perform actions without an AIs help, only using them in dire situations or use "dumb" AIs with combat as their sole parameters.

Point being, that it can't be 100 years or so into the future without her already going rampant by the time she turns 8.

Edited by ChaosSupremeSonic

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Well first off AIs who feel that they have a great importance they need to accomplish can fight off rampantcy but still suffer with the symptoms. and second i thought it was gravemind that forced her into early rampantcy because of what it made her experence in Human Weakness? I don't even think she showed any signs of rampentcy before Halo 2 though in the books her mind was alittle strained after aqiring all of Installation 04's data.

Seriously guys who haven't seen or read these storys yet, go buy or rent them! Here i'll do you a favor and link the things were talking about here the rest you should go buy there great stories:

Origins Part 1

Origins Part 2

Human Weakness

Edited by goku262002

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Lol I came into the series from Halo 3, so I have a general idea of what you guys are talking about, since I haven't yet played Halo 1or 2 yet.

But with Cortana's AI dying or "changing" as confirmed by 343, wouldn't being in sleep mode pretty much drain her life battery, just not as much. If the time difference between going into statis and Halo 4 isn't that long (Weeks,4 or 5 Months) as opposed to years, then she probably will still have some life to go through at least 4. She'll probably be dead by Halo 5, but I expect her to make it to the very end of the game at least. They said she was already over-living her the normal life span of most AI's, so I dunno.

I'm just throwing this out of my ass btw.

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I don't think the AI's in Halo actually have batteries...unless you meant something else by that.

Nah, not batteries as in Double A batteries,

I meant more like the life span/energy they have left. Can't really word it right I suppose.

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As far as know, there is no such ability to turn off functionalities leading to rampancy, otherwise why worry about rampancy in the first place?

Because it's a side effect of the functionalities they DO need. Most PCs die after less than a decade of use, that doesn't mean we should stop using them. All I know is that anything that requires energy is capable of being turned off somehow, and that if modern computers are able to prolong isolated functionality by limiting energy and resources consumption, an operating system constructed over half a millennium from now is at least going to be capable of that much.

And they were worried about her going rampant long before they got stuck into outer space; it was during the period in which she was stuck with the Gravemind and they were skeptical about following her advice in destroying the flood and then later on you had to rescue her from the monster to go through with the plan.

My point is that if Cortana is on the verge of reaching the age rampancy and it's more likely than not they'll be drifting in an uninhabited wing of space perhaps decades at best before they're located, Chief wouldn't entrust his life to Cortana if he wasn't sure he could hold her to that task for that long. Beyond that, if we've reached a time where humans can keep their current state indefinitely by use of cryostasis, I can't see why an AI doesn't have a similar functionality.

Well seeing how from what I've read (and I'm trying to recall where) 7 seconds of doing nothing is excruciatingly boring to an AI, I don't think she's going to be doing a lot of nothing.

All the better reason to enter a lowered state of awareness. My attention span is incredibly short, yet you don't see me get bored of doing nothing for 9 hours every night after I fall asleep.

Not to mention that with rampancy being caused by an overwhelming of information, you do realize that Cortana absorbed A LOT of Forerunner data during her time right?

Not enough that she hasn't turned already.

Considering that there is more than one and that desperate times could call on the creation of more than one? They could turn them off anytime they could perform actions without an AIs help, only using them in dire situations or use "dumb" AIs with combat as their sole parameters.

That's like buying a new iPhone every time you want to download a new app. The whole point of these AIs is to simplify interface, not just control trivial functions. Modularizing them for individual tasks would be a quasi-bureaucratic nightmare; "No captain, for this issue you'll want to talk to the navigational AI, not the targeting AI" etc. That could potentially prolong if not remove the threat of rampancy, but I think it's worth the sacrifice of a long lifespan to circumvent that, especially in war where you often need actions carried out immediately without any overcomplicated bullshit.

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Lol I came into the series from Halo 3, so I have a general idea of what you guys are talking about, since I haven't yet played Halo 1 or 2 yet.

Well combat evolved anniversary is out theres no excuse to not play Halo CE now. As for Halo 2, check Ebay for a cheap copy.

Everything else like books, comics, the dvd, and such, Go and rent or buy them there privital to the story as well. Oh but one thing in book order if your a chronological nutjob like me i would go Contact Harvest first then Core Protocol -> Fall of Reach -> The Flood -> First Strike -> Ghost of Onyx -> Glasslands. The forerunner saga is before all this but it won't be complete until after Halo 4 is out.

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Well combat evolved anniversary is out theres no excuse to not play Halo CE now. As for Halo 2, check Ebay for a cheap copy.

Everything else like books, comics, the dvd, and such, Go and rent or buy them there privital to the story as well. Oh but one thing in book order if your a chronological nutjob like me i would go Contact Harvest first then Core Protocol -> Fall of Reach -> The Flood -> First Strike -> Ghost of Onyx -> Glasslands. The forerunner saga is before all this but it won't be complete until after Halo 4 is out.

Eh...I didn't really like Combat Evolved Anniversary, wasn't my type of game, and Halo 2...I dunno.

And yeah, I do know the general idea/ some factual details of the Halo story (games, books, etc), just not as much as you guys that is tongue.png

Edited by Nintendoga

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Because it's a side effect of the functionalities they DO need. Most PCs die after less than a decade of use, that doesn't mean we should stop using them. All I know is that anything that requires energy is capable of being turned off somehow, and that if modern computers are able to prolong isolated functionality by limiting energy and resources consumption, an operating system constructed over half a millennium from now is at least going to be capable of that much.

If a PC dies, there's absolutely no way you can use it at all...depending on how I'm understanding you.

However, that isn't my point regarding Cortana going rampant. If they could turn Cortana off, or give her a sleep mode, that would be a point where she isn't particularly active, and if she isn't active then there's very little concern about her going rampant because she could completely delay it indefinitely; because of that, there's no need to worry about a 7 year life span for her. But that's not the case with any "smart" AI like her, because rampancy is a completely unavoidable flaw inherent in all "smart" AIs. Even if she could delay it, she'll be coming closer to it during the time she is active regardless.

My point is that if Cortana is on the verge of reaching the age rampancy and it's more likely than not they'll be drifting in an uninhabited wing of space perhaps decades at best before they're located, Chief wouldn't entrust his life to Cortana if he wasn't sure he could hold her to that task for that long. Beyond that, if we've reached a time where humans can keep their current state indefinitely by use of cryostasis, I can't see why an AI doesn't have a similar functionality.

Except that goes against the fact that smart AIs have a seven year life span because of rampancy. By the time she turns 8 she's already in the process of going through the first stages of ramancy and there is absolutely no way for her to avoid it. Any longer than that and she ends up going further and further into the stages until she hits the final "theoretical" one of metastability.

Whether or not Chief entrusts his life to Cortana does not negate the fact that she WILL be rampant should they be spending decades in outer space before they're located, and we can debate about this as long as you want, but I repeat that there is absolutely nothing stopping that process at all.

All the better reason to enter a lowered state of awareness. My attention span is incredibly short, yet you don't see me get bored of doing nothing for 9 hours every night after I fall asleep.

Are you a "smart" AI like Cortana? Because if not, then that's not a valid comparison.

Let me put it this way, after 7 seconds of doing nothing, they absolutely have to do something. They can't keep doing nothing after that long. Why? I honestly don't know or remember, but they can't keep their time free doing nothing.

Not enough that she hasn't turned already.

They were worried that she was by the time she sent a message to them on Earth about destroying the Flood. And even if she hasn't that doesn't negate the fact that shewill turn rampant.

That's like buying a new iPhone every time you want to download a new app.

Well if it keeps the iPhone from harming itself and others, it's a much better solution.

The whole point of these AIs is to simplify interface, not just control trivial functions. Modularizing them for individual tasks would be a quasi-bureaucratic nightmare; "No captain, for this issue you'll want to talk to the navigational AI, not the targeting AI" etc. That could potentially prolong if not remove the threat of rampancy, but I think it's worth the sacrifice of a long lifespan to circumvent that, especially in war where you often need actions carried out immediately without any overcomplicated bullshit.

I'm starting to wonder how much you know about the Halo lore regarding AIs and Rampancy.

You do know that a "dumb" AI could potentially do more than one task right? "Smart" AI's have no limitations on what they can do, they can control a starship, then take control of a city infrastructure, then a spacestation, create war strategies, and then focus on decoding Alien Tech if they wanted to or felt in necessary to do. "Dumb" AIs on the other hand have limitations in that they can only be used for one purpose. In short, you can have a "Dumb" AI that has war as it's only purpose and perform both navigation, targeting, and war strategies all in one without the risk of rampancy, but as a result you can't have it decode Alien Tech or take control of a City because that's outside of the parameters it's given; a "Smart" AI on the other hand can do everything that several different "Dumb" AI's can do all in one, but all that is at the cost of the "smart" AI succumbing to rampancy.

EDIT: Let me just put this whole argument to rest by giving you the interview from the franchise director confirming that Cortana will be going through rampancy.

Edited by ChaosSupremeSonic

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The Halo Bulletin: 3.28.12

Topics Include:

~Warhouse - More infomation and Concept Art wallpapers

~April Matchmaking Playlist Update

~Custom Challenge of the Week

~Double Super Jackpot Weekend

~Final Transition for Halo Services

So, in the end I did get my recon after all! But it looks like there not making any sort of changes to Waypoint to have it mimic B.net's file share system.

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Here’s Your First Look At Cortana in Halo 4 (Kotaku)

cov_229_l.jpg

Holy tits batman! Seems cortana went through some "self" improvements while chief was in cyro.

SO, anyone has lolgameinformer this month? whats the new infomation?

The Halo Bulletin: 4.5.12

Topics Include:

~Inside details on 343's internal beta testing

~Custom Challenge of the Week

~Super Jackpot Weekend

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Ever since my 360 scratched and ruined my copy of Halo reach, I decided I would skip re-buying it again and just wait for this game.

Just out of curiosity, is this game supposed to be a reboot or anything? From what i've heard, it's taking the direction of the halo novels now, and the characters look slightly redesigned.

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Just out of curiosity, is this game supposed to be a reboot or anything? From what i've heard, it's taking the direction of the halo novels now, and the characters look slightly redesigned.

No. The game's story picks up where Halo 3 left off. The characters are redesigned just to make them look better (Natural art evolution and all that).

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First Halo 4 Infomation from Game Informer (NeoGAF)

Well this seems all well an-

Firefight is absent and it is stated that there are no plans for it to return.

Elites Not Returning to Multiplayer -Not much detail was given as to why elites will not see multiplayer combat, it was stated in a picture caption. The caption reads, "Competitive multiplayer focues on the Spartan IVs. Elites will not be playable.

Well that taints my experence abit. :(

Also:

Game is split between Campaign and Infinity - the new term of the entire multiplayer experience seperate from the Camapign.

What a stupid name.

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No Elite's in MP? Well that's a disappointment. Although if it's Halo, I usually don't care about MP for the most part and go straight to the Campaign, but whenever I do play MP, I usually play as an Elite. Aw...

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Frank O'Conner clairifies some stuff:

The magazine scans were always going to come out the day after the cover debuted, that almost always happens. We can't talk about the story in detail, because it is GI's exclusive. I will say that some of the things that "invested, emotional" players are "raising eyebrows slightly at" are being very misinterpreted ("random" weapon spawns for example) but we will be able to clarify some of those things in due time.

Some of the other features, abilities, are also being discussed with no context (not your guys' fault, obviously) and frankly, a video of TS would probably allay many of the especially hysterical reactions, but we're not there yet.

We haven't seen a single reaction we didn't expect (apart from the Dax love story) and we will clarify a lot of this stuff 100% in the coming weeks and months. SOME of the things in here won't be properly understood outside of a holistic experience (modes, progress, fictional setting, etc) but I am going to say one thing and leave it at that:

It feels like Halo, it does NOT feel or act like the other game(s) it's being compared to. Again, without playing it, you can't be blamed for jumping to certain conclusions.

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