CONFIRMED - Yoshihisa Hashimoto has left Sonic Team for Square-Enix

[JezMM]

I'll never quite understand all the praise for the Wii version. The only reason it was easy is because you did nothing but run forward, drift and homing attack enemies. That was literally pretty much it.

The reason the 360 version is hard is because Sonic goes as fast as he's meant to, and you actually have to do stuff at the same time.

I will agree to the medals though. I had no problem with it, but Adabat shouldn't have needed 120. 80-100 at the most maybe.

[Dreadknux]

To illustrate my point, let's talk about QTEs. In my view Sonic Unleashed is one of the few games to implement this sort of gameplay mechanic successfully. This is because Sonic Team has been very fair on the players when implementing their placement. Most importantly, as a general rule QTEs don't kill you, they merely redirect you to an alternative path; this is a very good use the game mechanics. Besides, most QTEs are very easy to complete, usually you are faced with only three buttons to press, this is not a hard task. Certainly, the QTEs do get more complex as the game progress but that is all part of the learning curve. Sonic games are designed to be played by a wide audience, as such the game is relatively easy to control or play; presumably this is for the benefit of younger players. I don't expect anybody to beat the Eggmanland on their first go; it is the last level after all. Yet at the same time, anybody with reasonable hand eye coordination and a little patience should be able to beat it eventually.

The point is moot - the QTE's shouldn't have been in there at all.

[Kintor]

The point is moot - the QTE's shouldn't have been in there at all.

I really don't understand all the hate for QTE events, in this or any game. As it stands, they only comprise a very small part of the game, usually acting as a trivial method to navigate the level. Often Unleashed gets criticises for this gameplay choice, often the whole game is condemned over this simply mechanic; that simply isn't fair. There is a lot more to Sonic Unleashed then QTE, it should be judged accordingly. I've never really had a problem with Sonic Team implementing QTEs; all things considered it worked out just fine.

Edited July 10, 2009 by Kintor

[nuckles87]

Not sure where this talk of Unleashed selling poorly is coming from. It was one of the two games that helped the Sonic brand be so profitable this year. Last I heard, the game sold pretty well over the long term, like most Sonic games over the last few years.

VGChartz, which has been cited by Capcom among other companies since it's inception due to being relatively on the money, has every version Sonic Unleashed selling faster then both Sonic 06 and Secret Rings on each respectible platform.

[Dreadknux]

I really don't understand all the hate for QTE events, in this or any game. As it stands, they only comprise a very small part of the game, usually acting as a trivial method to navigate the level. Often Unleashed gets criticises for this gameplay choice, often the whole game is condemned over this simply mechanic; that simply isn't fair. There is a lot more to Sonic Unleashed then QTE, it should be judged accordingly. I've never really had a problem with Sonic Team implementing QTEs; all things considered it worked out just fine.

I just feel it's the laziest thing a developer can do, to push off actually playing a stage by farming what are essentially interactive cutscenes. QTE's hold no substance, no immersion... it's like a game without the work on the developer's part, and without the play on the consumer's part.

[FeathersMcGraw]

I really don't understand all the hate for QTE events, in this or any game. As it stands, they only comprise a very small part of the game, usually acting as a trivial method to navigate the level. Often Unleashed gets criticises for this gameplay choice, often the whole game is condemned over this simply mechanic; that simply isn't fair. There is a lot more to Sonic Unleashed then QTE, it should be judged accordingly. I've never really had a problem with Sonic Team implementing QTEs; all things considered it worked out just fine.

Nobody likes QTE's because they're a cheap and lazy alternative to actually having to design level segments, why put the time and effort into creating a cool platforming section or an interesting level-specific gimmick when the designer could puss out and put in a random button combination? In moderation they're fine (see Shemnue, in which they actually had some specific context, which is missing Unleashed, except for some at the end during the bosses), but when they're used as an obvious "Get out of designing free card" it starts to grate a little.

Unleashed didn't start off too bad in regards to QTE's, but I draw the line at the Tornado sections and the fact that the final boss consisted mostly of them.

Edited July 10, 2009 by FeathersMcGraw

[nuckles87]

Way I see it, QTEs ARE a way to keep the gamer engrossed. Do I want to simply sit back and see a cinematic play out, or have interaction with it to make the cinematic more exciting? I'd prefer the interaction. It was one of the great things about Shenmue. That game would have lost a lot of it's spart if I sat back and watched Ryo beat people until we finally get to an actual fight.

It's a way to keep things cinematic. It's a fine method so long as it's used correctly.

Frankly, a lot of the so called "QTEs" in Unleashed aren't really QTEs. It's just a set of button combinations that determine which path you get (or whether you die, in Adabat and Eggmanlnd). Those, I do have a problem with, and I think Unleashed could have done without.

[Badnik Zero]

About the QTEs in Unleashed. What exactly people don't like about it is that it turns an action sequence into Guitar Hero.

That's not cool. Instead of including interactive cutscenes as part of play, include more play. My first encounter with QTEs was in Resident Evil 4, where you had to dodge axes and stuff at a second's notice or die. That was alright because it was a suspense thing, it was more like a reflex move. But then there was an entire fight that was QTE and that was lame, because a boss fight really should play like the rest of the game. A very good example of interactive cutscenes are the ones in MGS, where you have camera angles and POVs to spice it up, or just being able to mess around with the codec sequences. I used to make Raiden dance during long codecs, it was a distraction, but it's not something that replaces gameplay.

An artificial solution to automated gameplay is still artificial. Instead of PaRappa the Rapper (nothing against him) give me gameplay.

[Chaos Skies]

Yeah, honestly, I have to go with nuckles and kintor on this one, the QTEs seem fine. A good deal of games include them now and I do feel they are just another layer of immersion. The argument seems to be that they distract from the game or appear randomly "thrown in". I disagree with this. A large complaint with past 3D Sonic games is the automated parts of the games, for example, going off a ramp. Go off a ramp and spend your time watching Sonic spin and twist through the air...wooo fun lol. The QTEs kept you on your toes and made you pay attention during those sections. Do the QTEs get ridiculous towards the end? Yeah, this I will agree with. They should have been kept purely for picking your path and never include death, but minus the few which result in death in adabat and eggmanland, they're really not a problem and honestly I don't even find the QTEs in those levels a problem, though I do understand how they may be difficult. Lets face it the QTEs last for literally a second, are they really that big of a deal?

Also, to stay on topic, I don't really see it being too big of a deal for Hashimoto to leave Sonic Team; it's part of any career. Kintor nailed in in my mind; it's not as if everybody else at Sonic Team has no idea how Sonic Unleashed was made. They all understand the mechanics, the game engine, art direction, etc. If SEGA's plan is to take the unleashed formula and tweak it/modify it, then Hashimoto leaving will do little to deter that.

just though I would interject my thoughts. Good discussion

-CS

[Slingerland]

So, this guy has officially left.

Party at my place. BYOB.

[Solid SOAP]

Ah well. If this means a game with the amount of polish of Unleashed, but without all the stupid shit like Werehog and medal collecting then I'll be happy.

[Gatestormer]

Ah fuck :/ Oh well. Wish him the best of luck in the future of course and hopefully someone else who's just as good or better will give the series the help it needs.

[Tombi]

So, this guy has officially left.

Party at my place. BYOB.

How in the hell did the comments section go from discussing a very important change of director to complaining about a four year old voice actor change? Yeesh, Sonic fans.

It's kind of a shame it's been confirmed now, but it's nice to see some optimism from the =SSMB=. I figure the rest of the team for Unleashed will stay onboard and use what good came out of the game to build up something even better. Like I said before, with a new person running things I'm a bit concerned about consistency and a "change of vision" possibly for the worst; but we won't actually know until we see or at least hear about what the next main game will entail.

Edited July 10, 2009 by Tombi

[Badnik Zero]

Like I said before, with a new person running things I'm a bit concerned about consistency and a "change of vision" possibly for the worst; but we won't actually know until we see or at least hear about what the next main game will entail.

That's basically what I don't want. Unleashed was a solid package, much more than other recent games. I fear Sonic Team will lose direction, and that will get us another experimental Sonic game. I just wanted a series like before. I guess I'm whining though.

[Chaos Skies]

That's basically what I don't want. Unleashed was a solid package, much more than other recent games. I fear Sonic Team will lose direction, and that will get us another experimental Sonic game. I just wanted a series like before. I guess I'm whining though.

Definitely a legitimate concern for those who felt Sonic Unleashed was a step in the right direction.

My question though is how much power does Sonic Team exactly have? I know that may seem like a dumb question (lol) but how much power does Sonic Team have in the creation of a Sonic game (possibly even sillier sounding)? Obviously they are in charge of implementing the ideas, but I mean if the higher-ups at SEGA assess Sonic Unleashed and feel that the next "mainstream" Sonic game is going to mimic that style and such, does it really matter who is director of the game? Obviously Sonic Team makes the game, but let's put it this way; if Hashimoto was the director for the next mainstream Sonic game, BUT SEGA wanted an entirely different game, nothing similar to Unleashed, I don't think having Hashimoto as director would make any difference., y'know?

I guess what I'm trying to say is we would have to know exactly how Sonic games are brainstormed and such before we can fully assess how much of an impact this move will make.

Did that make any sense? haha.

-CS

Edited July 10, 2009 by Chaos Skies

[Eternal EX]

^ Wow that was very confusing. But I get what your saying.

[Candescence]

That's basically what I don't want. Unleashed was a solid package, much more than other recent games. I fear Sonic Team will lose direction, and that will get us another experimental Sonic game. I just wanted a series like before. I guess I'm whining though.

Now you see why I'm hoping for Ogawa to take the reins? Secret Rings was also a step in the right direction, albiet a different one, and I very much enjoyed it myself.

[Dreadknux]

Way I see it, QTEs ARE a way to keep the gamer engrossed. Do I want to simply sit back and see a cinematic play out, or have interaction with it to make the cinematic more exciting? I'd prefer the interaction. It was one of the great things about Shenmue. That game would have lost a lot of it's spart if I sat back and watched Ryo beat people until we finally get to an actual fight.

The thing is though, Sonic the Hedgehog and Shenmue aren't comparable. One is meant to play out pretty much like an interactive movie, and the other is all about fast-paced action that involves the player by physics and gameplay elements. We talk about 'making cutscenes more alive' but the fact is there are far too many cutscenes already in Sonic games. That's the problem. Cut the fluff.

All I needed from Sonic Unleashed was the intro movie, outro movie, Werehog changing thing and Eggman eating his sammich. Everything else cutscene wise could have been tossed out for the better (although to be fair Unleashed -really- needed the cutscenes to tie everything together because its level progression is about the worst, most confusing I've ever seen in a video game. Simplify - Sonic Heroes had it right the third time round).

It's a shame that Hashimoto is gone, because although I feel that Sonic Unleashed is not the direction the franchise should take, at least he had a coherent vision and was able to follow through on that without making a broken game code-wise. For all intents and purposes, his heart was in the right place so I salute him for that.

And some things were done right for me in Unleashed as well - notably the cartoonier look and less dramatic feel (although still could have done without the final boss - you can have epic without silly Armageddon Monster XIII, look at Sonic & Knuckles - and the humans, and shouldn't have been so rooted in 'logical' level design ala exaggerated Planet Earth). Perhaps his true calling was just doing what he does best - technical directing.

Sonic Team does have a habit of 'revolving door' random people these days to see if at least one person can make a hit in their studio, and I think that tactic is ultimately killing them - nobody really wants that pressure to revive Sonic on a Director/Producer level unless it's well within their comfort zone. No wonder the poor sod left.

Also, Ogawa for President. Although I've yet to see what he would do with a canon Sonic game (hopefully something really creative/out of the box, Marble Zone stylee) but as far as I'm aware Secret Rings has been the only Sonic console game this generation, spinoff or otherwise, that has actually been really, really decent. Unleashed got close though.

[Cortez]

*post*

I agree 100% with what you just said. Although as much as it pains me to say it, at least 90% of this entire forum will disagree with you.

[Candescence]

Also, Ogawa for President. Although I've yet to see what he would do with a canon Sonic game (hopefully something really creative/out of the box, Marble Zone stylee) but as far as I'm aware Secret Rings has been the only Sonic console game this generation, spinoff or otherwise, that has actually been really, really decent. Unleashed got close though.

Amen, brotha. I really don't need to repeat why I think he should direct again.

[Scarlet2106]

Wait, what? You think the Unleashed style isn't the way to go, but then you want Ogawa to do the rest of them because of Secret Rings? The game that essentially gave birth to the Unleashed style? Not that I have a problem with that or anything, it just strikes me as... strange. Of course, he won't necessarily go with the same forced-speed feel of (not so much) Secret Rings or (mostly) Unleashed, but...

Well, whatever. I don't particularly care who gets it as long as it's not just 'OMG SPEED LOOK HOW FAST SONIC CAN GO KIDS' all the way through. Well, okay, I'd prefer an Iizuka/Ogawa tagteam, actually, but that's unlikely to happen.

[Rusty Spy]

Wait, what? You think the Unleashed style isn't the way to go, but then you want Ogawa to do the rest of them because of Secret Rings? The game that essentially gave birth to the Unleashed style? Not that I have a problem with that or anything, it just strikes me as... strange. Of course, he won't necessarily go with the same forced-speed feel of (not so much) Secret Rings or (mostly) Unleashed, but...

No, I'd say the Rush series gave birth to Unleashed's style. Overly linear levels, and a big emphasis on boosting most of the way through. In fact, most people refer to those title when describing Unleashed.

Edited July 11, 2009 by VirgoTheCougar

[azoo]

Still doesn't make much of a difference. People complain enough about the lack of platforming as it is with Unleashed; so we definitely don't need a "HEY-WE'LL-MOVE-FOWARD-WHILE-YOU-STEER" game again. It must be said: it was way harder to do platforming in SatSR because of that issue, and not just that, but of course the whole "on-rails" feel of it chained down your freedom completely.

Not saying that's what Ogawa would do with the series, but if he really did consider SatSR his take on "re-inventing Sonic", then that's probably what we would get, except this time on the 360 or PS3. *shrug*

Edited July 11, 2009 by Azukara

[Dreadknux]

Still doesn't make much of a difference. People complain enough about the lack of platforming as it is with Unleashed; so we definitely don't need a "HEY-WE'LL-MOVE-FOWARD-WHILE-YOU-STEER" game again. It must be said: it was way harder to do platforming in SatSR because of that issue, and not just that, but of course the whole "on-rails" feel of it chained down your freedom completely.

Not saying that's what Ogawa would do with the series, but if he really did consider SatSR his take on "re-inventing Sonic", then that's probably what we would get, except this time on the 360 or PS3. *shrug*

Who said Ogawa, if given the chance, would work on another on-rails Sonic game?

[Hero of Legend]

Ogawa IS the big cheese of Sonic Team isn't he? XD

I wouldn't be surprised if it goes like this:

Iizuka becomes in charge of the mainline games.

Katano and better Ogawa continues the Storybook/Wii as a whole games.

Honestly, I have a few opinions:

Iizuka is outstanding in the art department.

Ogawa is excellent in overall direction. SR not being a cock up in concepts and ideas shows.

Katano... I say programming, he was the programmer in the Adventure series right? He directed BK, but who was it that make BK so outstanding in the visual department?

And also... get ready to laugh at this...

But perhaps the dudes at NOWPRO and the BK team can team up on a Wii engine that runs in 60 frames (like in Zero Gravity, worked on by NP), and the BK team can help push it further while keeping the framerate at 60?

Seriously, NOWPRO's the only team to make a silky smooth 60 framed Sonic game this gen. The graphics were also quite good, but nowhere near BK's.

I don't know how, but NOWPRO manged to do good in that department. And now they have tons of Wii-experience since:

Little League '08 and now '09, Super Sluggers (you read that right), Bakugan, Chaotic, and of course SR's Minigame mode.

I'd love to see for Wii, a Sonic game directed by Ogawa, art directed by Iizuka, programmed by the BK and NOWPRO for the main engine to make it run as silky smooth as possible and still be gorgeous on a technical level.

And preferably not another set path game, make it at least free to control like in Unleashed. Best case, make it Adventure-style.

Edited July 11, 2009 by Hero of Legend