My thoughts on playable friends m2k

[Regen]

I think another reason why Sonic fans are weary about Solo Sonic is that Sonic Team absolutely refuse to make the other characters playable when they logically should be in some ridiculous fear that having 'Sonic's shitty friends' will outright ruin the game's chance of success. It's totally transparent. Case in point, Sonic Colours and Lost World gave Player 2 a different coloured Sonic for the muliplayer. This is totally stupid, seeing how Tails is the secondary protagonist, and it would make way more sense for him to be playable in literally in any other game series. Yet with the Sonic franchise, the devs are so terrified of making Sonic's friends playable they give us a red Sonic. Lol, what? One of the best parts of Adventure 2's Multiplayer, arguably the most popular Sonic muliplayer experience, was the multitude of characters. They even marketed SA2 Battle around this. The whole reason Tails was even created in Sonic 2 was for Player 2. Could you imagine the adventures of Sonic and his best friend, Red Sonic, in Sonic 2. It's a joke.

This feeds into other questionable decisions, such as the weird compromise of making Sonic's friends powerups in Generations rather than just making them playable, even if only for the temporary side missions they are featured in. Like Sonic Team want to give fanservice but instead of making the characters playable they just stand around in the Hub World and act as gimmicky powerups. It's a pathetic compromise and Sonic Team just need to stop fucking about and let the characters be playable when they should be.

[Wraith]

Honestly, a narrative without Sonic is something I would definitely welcome. I have nothing against the guy, he's my favorite character and I love him to death, but I really get the feeling literally every single supporting character just revolves around him. Sonic befriends, he moves on to his next big adventure and that's the end of any reason we should give a damn about them because they're lives outside of Sonic apparently don't matter? What kind of bullshit is that, that's not how world building works. And I get he's the main character, and therefore the one who should have some of the stronger dynamics but its pretty telling when this series has such a large supporting cast and yet most of them can just be summed as "Sonic's friends" :\

 

And hell, Sonic not being as prominent only makes his eventual appearances that much more special, because since he's the main character, you know he's going to be the one who stirs things up the most. I would gladly welcome a side series like Archie's Sonic Universe; just a series of games focusing on the extended cast for once without Sonic's presence. How does Blaze govern her kingdom? What's a day like for Knuckles on Angel Island all day? What kind of cases do the Chaotix solve in their spare time? I shouldn't have to just see these characters when they're just supporting Sonic.

 

But this is all wishful thinking at this point because I know Sega are just content with making everything about Sonic, Tails, and Eggman and to hell with everyone else. Even if they did bring in additional characters, they'd probably just play inconsequential roles like Generations and Lost World. And people will play it anyway and call it good because "Fuck you, nobody but Sonic matters and you're wrong for thinking otherwise". I'm really kind of thankful for the comics right now because I'd probably just drop the series altogether and just read fanfiction if I had to deal with the game's shit anymore.

That's kind of missing the point of Sonic though, isn't it? It's what he does. He wanders into bigger problems and issues, helps whoever's there solve what's going on and goes on his way. Maybe he'll see them on the flipside again (Knuckles, Shadow, Blaze etc), or maybe he won't (Tikal, Chaos, Chip etc). All this expanded universe stuff people are asking for is pretty much meant for some side thing like the comics. I can't actually see making an entire spinoff about Knuckles or Blaze(as much as it pains me to say) or whoever being feasible for a lot of reasons, and that's not really Sonic Team's fault. It's pretty rare that side characters in general get whole games dedicated to them like that. 

 

 

[Kuzu]

 

That's kind of missing the point of Sonic though, isn't it? It's what he does. He wanders into bigger problems and issues, helps whoever's there solve what's going on and goes on his way. Maybe he'll see them on the flipside again (Knuckles, Shadow, Blaze etc), or maybe he won't (Tikal, Chaos, Chip etc). All this expanded universe stuff people are asking for is pretty much meant for some side thing like the comics. I can't actually see making an entire spinoff about Knuckles or Blaze(as much as it pains me to say) or whoever being feasible for a lot of reasons, and that's not really Sonic Team's fault. It's pretty rare that side characters in general get whole games dedicated to them like that. 

 

Then what's the point of these characters to begin with then :V Why go through such lengths of giving them such distinctive motivations and personalities and then treat them like side fodder afterwards? It makes no fucking sense. It'd be one thing if they were one-shot characters, never to be heard or seen from again, but nope they're all over promotional material and given profiles on other official sources. So its pretty obvious Sega insists on keeping them around, but has absolutely no interest in doing anything substantial with them other than just to fill out space and make gracious cameos. So if I want to be able to play as Knuckles or Shadow again, I'm just shit out of luck :\

And yes, that is SONIC'S character, that's not everyone else's character tho; just because Sonic likes to go from place to place and see new things shouldn't mean that everyone else suddenly shouldn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

Edited October 17, 2015 by Kuzu the Boloedge

[Wraith]

 

Then what's the point of these characters to begin with then :V Why go through such lengths of giving them such distinctive motivations and personalities and then treat them like side fodder afterwards? It makes no fucking sense. It'd be one thing if they were one-shot characters, never to be heard or seen from again, but nope they're all over promotional material and given profiles on other official sources. So its pretty obvious Sega insists on keeping them around, but has absolutely no interest in doing anything substantial with them other than just to fill out space and make gracious cameos. So if I want to be able to play as Knuckles or Shadow again, I'm just shit out of luck :\

And yes, that is SONIC'S character, that's not everyone else's character tho; just because Sonic likes to go from place to place and see new things shouldn't mean that everyone else suddenly shouldn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

I think there's a middle ground between treating them like side fodder and giving them a spinoff that Sega just needs to hit, is all. I'm not saying what Sega is doing is right. Just that entire spinoffs about the other characters is..a bit much, isn't it? 

[Kuzu]

 

I think there's a middle ground between treating them like side fodder and giving them a spinoff that Sega just needs to hit, is all. I'm not saying what Sega is doing is right. Just that entire spinoffs about the other characters is..a bit much, isn't it? 

There are about four to five Mario characters that have had their own successful spin offs, I see no reason why that should even be considered a risk. Its really all about how much effort goes into the product. And fuck, its not even like I'm asking for something major either, a freaking handheld platformer starring Team Dark would suffice. 

And this is ignoring the fact that this is all hypothetical to begin with, because I know for a fact this series is never going to risk giving a side character a spin off anymore given how they've been received in the past, but you know...is it wrong for me to dream?

[Nepenthe]

Every time Sega gets burned they throw a developmental idea off the table, so let's not even bother with the thought of character spin-offs. It will never happen again.

The best we can hope for are Adventure-like campaigns where a few other characters approach the story from their own unique point of view and thus are allowed the time to get some of their own development while Sonic does his Sonic thing. That's probably the best middle ground.

But that would require them being playable in the first place and we can't have even that anymore lol.

[Tara]

You know, with my initial suggestion, it was under the hope that we could have characters expanded upon in such a way where it wouldn't even be considered a spin-off just because Sonic isn't in it, but I admit that it's probably a lot harder to achieve with video games than, say, comic books or movies or TV shows.

But it's all a pipe dream at this point anyway.

[Muscles Maximum]

To me, it's always been like, the more the merrier. It always bothered me when people hate Heroes because there's "12 playable characters" or how the Adventure games are bad because "You'd just rather play as Sonic". I've never felt that way. I love the colorful cast of characters this series has, and I love learning about them and having their stories fleshed out. I love the Adventures for that reason. I love Heroes in general, and I know that's pretty unpopular of an opinion, but I've heard lots of people say how only Team Sonic was necessary. And maybe that's true. But the other Teams were so much fun. It's cool how they all had their own sort of difficulty. And how the Chaotix had their own missions which suits them really well considering their detectives for hire.

When it comes to the Adventures, sure the other characters could have played better, but so could have Sonic. It's not really the characters fault. They could definitely have fleshed out everyone just as much as Sonic himself. They just didn't. I still think it's criminal how Sonic goes through 10 levels, while everyone else is lucky if they even get to 5. At least I can get Tails, Knuckles and Amy into emerald coast for a little while and pretend it's how it was meant to be.

It's a shame that the "Sonic's Shitty Friends" mentality ever even became a thing. You can tell how afraid they are to use their characters because like some others have said previously, Oh you're going to play multiplayer, here's red Sonic. That's gross to me. I like to tell myself that maybe they're just too lazy to be mindful of Tails' ability to fly or something. But even then, he didn't fly in Sonic 2. Not saying they should regress to that but still, it's no excuse. Sonic Adventure 2 Battle has the best multiplayer in the series, and a friend of mine comes over and we still to this day play together. I always think how when the Boost games were new, not having multiplayer racing in that style was such a wasted opportunity. But even if there was SA2 style multiplayer in Generations or Unleashed, they'd probably just give us Red, Green, and Pink Sonic's to choose from.   

I'd be so happy seeing a Knuckles side series or a Chaotix side series. I know it will never happen. But it's cool to pretend I guess. I'm keeping my fingers crossed and hoping that maybe Tails or Knuckles or even Shadow or something will be playable in the next main game. It'd be nice to have them playable after you beat the game kind of like Luigi in the Galaxy games. I think that'd be more appealing to people who for some reason throw up at the thought of another character being thrown into the story as playable. Still Boom's reception doesn't leave me hopeful. I wouldn't be surprised that they throw away other characters playable for good since they were there in Boom, but the game was received horribly. Or worse, maybe Tails, Knuckles, and Amy are doomed to only be playable in the Boom verse while the main games stay Sonic Time.

Edited October 17, 2015 by monkokaio

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

To be honest except for 2 characters, no one else is strong enough to have a game to themselves without Sonic in it or helping. Only one character actually they have there own cast. 

[Lord-Dreamerz]

To be honest except for 2 characters, no one else is strong enough to have a game to themselves without Sonic in it or helping. Only one character actually they have there own cast. 

In my opinion at least 30% of the characters are cool enough that they could have their own game no problem. I mean where do people even get this idea that all these characters are so weak that they couldn't handle a story around them? Fear and bias? If the game is well made enough then many people will buy it even if most barely know the character, afterall how do you think games that are not Sonic whatsoever such as Spelunky sell at all?

 

And here is a short list of just a few of the more popular Sonic characters that I argue could easily support a game of their own.

Dr.Eggman.

Blaze.

Shadow.

Tails.

Amy.

 

I mean seriously. What about these characters having their own game gives you the idea that they would fall apart without Sonic?. what's the reasoning other then you like Sonic most? I'm telling you right now if they made a Blaze game and it was actually well made... I know a very good handful of people already who are dying to buy it... myself included... don't be so quick to underestimate the other characters and the possibility of a game where they have focus.

[Tara]

Besides that, a theoretical game based around any other character would accommodate for their own specific strengths and weaknesses, so how weak they are compared to Sonic is sort of irrelevant.  Even at that, if they are really so weak compared to Sonic, then Sonic being absent would make the conflict a lot more interesting, as we could experience their struggle as they grow and develop as a result of this... or how they don't.  Depending on what the story dictates.

Unless you mean "weak" in terms of the character's weight in the overall narrative, in which case, I'm obviously not saying we should give everyone like, I don't know, Professor Pickle or Mr. Know It All or Omochao his own game, but there are certainly plenty (if not too many) candidates that have enough narrative weight to carry a story without Sonic.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

I was talking about Blaze in my post for the own cast thingy. I was on my phone so I cannot type well. I also forgot the Chaotix to, actually they are the strongest to have there own game there own world etc. For Blaze she has her own world, her own Eggman her own emeralds and her own friends. Shadow is also a strong character to have his own universe.

I do have to disagree with Tails and Amy. Tails unless you trying to go from Tails Skypatrol and the Adventure then no. I mean they dont let Sonic have a game without Tails (Sonic Lost World would worked) they arent gonna let Tails have another game without Sonic. (I would like to see a game where Tails goes against a villian and Sonic guides him)

Amy.... if it is Sonic the Comic Amy,Archie Amy or Boom Amy then yes. That boom episode made me think to want a game where Amy and Eggman teamup. But modern... shes now uslally in the games randomly plus she is in love with Sonic. So whatever game they have for her he's gonna be in it.

Ill say Eggman yes. I want to see him in his own action game. Can he do without Sonic... yes and no. Yes he can find someone else to pick on. no because his goals to beat Sonic. 

Also now I am not scared of shit. I am allowed to have my own opinion on this. yes its umpopular opinion but I want to see more to Sonic. 

Edited October 18, 2015 by Sonikku/

[Tara]

The very point of Amy's character development in SA1 is about the establishment of her growth and independence, which means that modern Amy is just as easily viable, despite every game following SA1 sort of derailing that character development.  I also don't quite understand what her being in love with Sonic has to do with anything.  I've been in love before, too, but that doesn't mean that I never did anything else during that time.

I also don't find the reasoning that Tails can't have his own game because he's often seen with Sonic to... well, be very good, let alone make a lot of sense.  Honestly, I think that increases his potential even more, because this is someone that the general gaming public actually recognizes, whereas characters like the Chaotix are probably not super well-known outside the core fandom.

And Eggman's ultimate goal is world domination.  Defeating Sonic is merely the catalyst for that.

Edited October 18, 2015 by Spooky Scary Skeletaras

[Zaysho]

In my opinion at least 30% of the characters are cool enough that they could have their own game no problem. I mean where do people even get this idea that all these characters are so weak that they couldn't handle a story around them? Fear and bias? If the game is well made enough then many people will buy it even if most barely know the character, afterall how do you think games that are not Sonic whatsoever such as Spelunky sell at all?

 

And here is a short list of just a few of the more popular Sonic characters that I argue could easily support a game of their own.

Dr.Eggman.

Blaze.

Shadow.

Tails.

Amy.

 

I mean seriously. What about these characters having their own game gives you the idea that they would fall apart without Sonic?. what's the reasoning other then you like Sonic most? I'm telling you right now if they made a Blaze game and it was actually well made... I know a very good handful of people already who are dying to buy it... myself included... don't be so quick to underestimate the other characters and the possibility of a game where they have focus.

I'd add Knuckles to the list, as well. The classic characters are, by far, the most marketable of the entire cast, and Knuckles on a solo adventure would definitely have plenty of potential both in terms of gameplay and story.

Blaze is a bit debatable. She can definitely carry her own game (give me "Pirate Plunder Panic" the game, plz), but I don't think she's quite as popular/well-known that SEGA would be willing to take the risk, and that's considering she headlined two games with Sonic already. SEGA would probably sooner choose Amy due to her visibility as a classic character. I'd jump at a game about Blaze and her world, though.

Otherwise, I agree any character in this franchise has potential to carry their own game or support others not Sonic, but knowing Sonic Team, they'd never do it, or if they did, they wouldn't do it well and we'd be right back to them playing it safe and ignoring everyone but Sonic. Shame, really.

 

And I think Shadow deserves another shot.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

I think Shadow deserves a shot to ^^;

[E-van]

I actually think another Shadow game would be kind of cool. I think he deserves a second chance after his first game wasn't so good.

[Lord-Dreamerz]

And personally. Besides Blaze & Eggman which I'd love to see. I also would like to see a spin-off with focus on Metal-Sonic or Sticks... Yes I know that might sound crazy of me to say... as Sticks isn't the most popular yet. but I am just talking about what if here, not what absolutely SEGA realistically would be willing to risk or not. Regardless a origin story of where Sticks came from sounds interesting to me and her coming across the rest of the cast and slowly learning to trust them. Metal-Sonic's game could be a better more full game version of Episode Metal... or hell there's other ideas they could do with him too if they tried... and it doesn't even have to include him defeating Sonic... I know that may sound odd at first because that is all he tries to do normally... but I'm just saying. And in my opinion it would be finally a good chance to make his gameplay more then just a Sonic reskin for once.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

 I do want to see a game focus on Eggman. That would be cool. 

[Shadowlax]

here's the thing, I think story is important. Because I kind of thing its something sonic can actually get away with , much like Ratchet and clank, I enjoy those games because they actually have some sort of narrative and over arching business. Worlds, expansion ect, you don't have to make sonic 06, but you don't have to abandon the entire idea of a story being sort of in depth either.

 

All this said, my dream Shadow game is metal gear rising , but with shadow. So on the other hand I'm totally ok for the to warp story so they can make an enjoyable experience.To be honest anything is better than the safe nothing they have been trotting out.