Sega of America's chief operating officer says 'words'

[NoirSuede]

Sega's PR is notorious for claiming that they will be taking Sonic "back to his roots" in the previous games (going back as far as Sonic 2006 and most infamously used during the Sonic 4 saga) and then not delivering on their promises / meeting expectations, which is why many people are so skeptical of this new slew of comments from Sega's branches in the first place.

But has all three branches said it in unison ? Usually it's an isolated statement made by one of the branches.

[Milo]

But has all three branches said it in unison ? Usually it's an isolated statement made by one of the branches.

That of which is true and is an understandable reason why people are giving them the benefit of the doubt this time around. For others though, it's too little too late, they've been burned so many times before to the point that they're taking these comments with a handful of salt unless Sega actually delivers on their latest crop of promises with the next title.

Edited October 31, 2015 by Gabe

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

Maybe the fans they're referring to losing are those who loved 2ds levels and sections? 

Possibly a consistent amalgamation of the 3 Sonic eras of gameplay, momentum,  spindash, modified boost system, proper parkour with a completely 3d-orientated game anyone? 

Edited October 31, 2015 by Jovahexeon Ace Joranvexeon

[Dizcrybe]

The only thing I'm taking from "we might lose some fans" is "We're going to try to appeal to everyone for our next title like we have been, and in doing that we might end up losing some fans, like we have been for some strange reason." I just don't think they get it yet.

[Jango]

I really think he shouldn't have said "we'll loose fans". This is not a good statement in a creative industry like video games, much less considering the Sonic franchise, which was and still is SEGA's IP that should appeal to everyone, for over 24 years. At least is how I see it.

Edited October 31, 2015 by Jango

[Char]

I find it rather concerning that they're now focusing on Sonic in particular with their statements. Back when Haruki's article came out he spoke of letting down fans but didn't name any franchise, and now it appears they really have they eyes on Sonic and it makes me uncomfortable. Under normal circumstances it would be a good thing for someone to say that they'll focus on improving something, but the trust is just not there for SEGA. The fact that they say "we might lose some fans over this!" out of the blue doesn't help a single bit. I have no idea why he would even make that remark, it only serves to grow more concern and uncertainty.

[Dizcrybe]

The fact that they say "we might lose some fans over this!" out of the blue doesn't help a single bit. I have no idea why he would even make that remark,

Because honestly, whatever ends up happening, he's right.

[FantasticMrRobb]

The part I'm really focused on is...

"Maybe that might lose some fans along the road, but we're picking up new fans that will hopefully grow with us as Sonic grows."

Lose some fans? This part kind of worries me. What could it mean? I think maybe since with every game as of recently has been an attempt with trying to please everyone at once, they're going to stick with one side. Hmm...

[Blacklightning]

In a perfect world I'd make some kind of attempt to devise a reasonable compromise between the most major splits in the community, but honestly I can't blame Sega if they just want to focus on one from now on - especially when it's the side of Sonic most people already know him best for.

Besides, once you get classic physics working in full 3D, the ground work's basically already there anyway - all they'd really have to do from then on is add some variation of the Homing Attack and Boost and balance it accordingly. The other styles would lose absolutely nothing from having a set of physics as responsive and intuitive as the Genesis games set out, and could really benefit from having a shared identity in this vein rather than a needless cornucopia of competing gameplay styles.

[Bolt]

If anything from the last 3 games is given full focus and attention, I'd not be happy and I'd leave forever!

Kidding, obviously, as I wouldn't quit the series even if that happened, I'd just be disappointed, but shrug it off and continue playing and enjoying what I already do like, even if that makes me sound like a grumpy old person.

[Jango]

In a perfect world I'd make some kind of attempt to devise a reasonable compromise between the most major splits in the community, but honestly I can't blame Sega if they just want to focus on one from now on - especially when it's the side of Sonic most people already know him best for.

Besides, once you get classic physics working in full 3D, the ground work's basically already there anyway - all they'd really have to do from then on is add some variation of the Homing Attack and Boost and balance it accordingly. The other styles would lose absolutely nothing from having a set of physics as responsive and intuitive as the Genesis games set out, and could really benefit from having a shared identity in this vein rather than a needless cornucopia of competing gameplay styles.

But that's now a distant dream, pal. Sega saying they will focus on one "fandom" only (if our speculation is almost right) doesn't seems right to me. That means they will gather both teams to develop a 2D game instead of half of it plus Dimps? One can say it might work and we will finally get a great 2D game... But.. Yeah, I already said that tatic is not the ideal in my vision. I'll much rather have most of both teams working on a 3D game, and TaxStealth on a retro 2D, alongside members of ST that are closer to that genre, including musicians (Hataya) and even Iizuka (he was in charge of level design in Gens, correct me if I'm wrong). Isn't that better than bet all your chips on something we still haven't seem been done right by ST?

[Apollo Chungus]

Just had a thought about this whole thing last night, mainly with the whole 'stop talking, start doing' sentiment a good number of y'all have been saying with this press release and the last one.

Why are we asking this in response to PR men? That's what these people we keep hearing from; chief officers, and the like; are. They're people who publicly represent the studio/company and tell us what is expected to happen (whether that becomes true or not can only be revealed after the fact). They have nowhere near the same level of involvement or understanding as to what's going on, especially compared to a level designer working on an unannounced Sonic game, but that's the whole point.

It's not the job of PR men to start developing games, but the people working on said games. Would you rather have one of developers come out and tell us about a subject they might not be very tactful at addressing, instead of putting more time and effort into finishing the game that might very well prove these PR men right? I know what I'd rather have.

Look, I completely understand the speculation (as someone who acknowledges how many idiotic things SEGA have done over the years), and I urge you to take it with a grain of salt until something comes along to prove them right/wrong, but I don't like the extremism of either praising the company as being back in action or being thick-brained Chunguses as usual, when they haven't done anything yet. Especially when it's about the PR men talk; it's just their job to say words that give some slight reassurance (some communication is far better than saying nothing, in my opinion).

Wait for proof, which will certainly come in one form or another over the next year or two, and then decide whether they should be praised or dismissed. Just wait, love, alright?

(P.S. I've tried to draft this thing so many times since last night, due to having a bit of writer's block. If this comes off an unclear in some parts, that's probably why. Sorry.)

[Myst]

I feel kind of bad for Sega. It seems like they've been listening to fans for years, but no matter how hard they try, people just aren't satisfied. People complained about treasure hunting and fishing during the adventure era, so Sonic Team fixed that with Heroes. People then complained about how there's too many characters, so for many years, Sonic was the only playable character. People complained about the series being too serious, so we got Pontac and Graff making it silly, then the fans bitched about that. People thought modern games focused too much on boosting, so we got a new gameplay style with Lost World. People hated that game. Fans have been vocal for the past few years about wanting to play as the supporting characters again, Rise of Lyric answered those demands. Sigh. Just get the original team back, Sega. Naka, Oshima, Yasuhara. Even just for one game, so they can lay the groundwork other Sega employees can follow for future games. Pay no attention to fans, or what's currently 'hip' with kids. Just do your own thing.

[NoirSuede]

I feel kind of bad for Sega. It seems like they've been listening to fans for years, but no matter how hard they try, people just aren't satisfied. People complained about treasure hunting and fishing during the adventure era, so Sonic Team fixed that with Heroes. People then complained about how there's too many characters, so for many years, Sonic was the only playable character. People complained about the series being too serious, so we got Pontac and Graff making it silly, then the fans bitched about that. People thought modern games focused too much on boosting, so we got a new gameplay style with Lost World. People hated that game. Fans have been vocal for the past few years about wanting to play as the supporting characters again, Rise of Lyric answered those demands. Sigh. Just get the original team back, Sega. Naka, Oshima, Yasuhara. Even just for one game, so they can lay the groundwork other Sega employees can follow for future games. Pay no attention to fans, or what's currently 'hip' with kids. Just do your own thing.

Yuji Naka and Naoto Ohisima now own their own companies while Yasuhara now works for Nintendo so it can't happen.

[Milo]

I feel kind of bad for Sega. It seems like they've been listening to fans for years, but no matter how hard they try, people just aren't satisfied. People complained about treasure hunting and fishing during the adventure era, so Sonic Team fixed that with Heroes. People then complained about how there's too many characters, so for many years, Sonic was the only playable character. People complained about the series being too serious, so we got Pontac and Graff making it silly, then the fans bitched about that. People thought modern games focused too much on boosting, so we got a new gameplay style with Lost World. People hated that game. Fans have been vocal for the past few years about wanting to play as the supporting characters again, Rise of Lyric answered those demands. Sigh. Just get the original team back, Sega. Naka, Oshima, Yasuhara. Even just for one game, so they can lay the groundwork other Sega employees can follow for future games. Pay no attention to fans, or what's currently 'hip' with kids. Just do your own thing.

Myst, gameplay elements such as narrative tone, gameplay structure, and presence of characters are not inherently bound to each other. Sonic Team making sure to fix one thing in one area of their game design doesn't (and shouldn't, really) mean everything else is fixed, nor result in everyone else being satisfied. It's also worth pointing out that the complaints people have about characters and the tone of the narrative isn't as broad, or as black and white as you're making it out to be. Have you tried considering or figuring out why people are complaining about those things? Sonic Team axing every playable character not named Sonic for Sonic Unleashed did not address complaints that the game featured gameplay that wasn't like Sonic. Nor did the complete spectrum shifts in narrative between a dark, serious tone to a lighthearted, comical tone that has happened to the series since the first Adventure game alleviate criticisms aimed at the quality of the writing in Sonic games.

You also seem to believe that Sega aren't comprised of adults capable of making their own decisions and taking responsibility for them. A car manufacturing company doesn't sell a critically acclaimed line of sports cars, and then completely lose their plot the very moment their large audience start to express a variety of tastes. That's because they're people with jobs, mortgages, and brains. They have the thought process of adults, and not the weakness of bending over backwards to peer pressure you find in adolescents. Meanwhile, until they start calling their line of sports cars station wagons, having such a vast audience doesn't create less success.

The fanbase can be notorious for several things, and maybe it is crazy, I'm not going to be the judge of that. But the way you're painting them as scapegoats as to why Sega can't catch a break, especially with the arguments you're pushing...sounds nothing more than a quick attempt to build an explanation to fit your dissatisfaction with all the complaints.

Also, Sonic the Werehog, Shadow packing guns and swearing, Sonic having a romantic subplot with a human princess. Those are but a few examples of Sega "doing their own thing" without any influence from the fans whatsoever. (The closest thing you could blame the fans for concerning Shadow's game is that he was the highest voted Sonic character to have his own spinoff in a poll conducted by Sega themselves. Yet that doesn't mean people specifically wanted the darker and edgier backstory that resulted from Sega's interpretation of that poll.)

Edited November 1, 2015 by Gabe

[Myst]

I understand there were other factors involved for the failure of those games, but when you look back at the complaints fans made, and what future games brought to the table, I think it was clear Sega was trying to listen to their fans. Personally, I would like two franchises coexisting: A Genesis-styled series that plays exactly like the classic stages of Generations, and a return of the Adventure games.

[Milo]

I understand there were other factors involved for the failure of those games, but when you look back at the complaints fans made, and what future games brought to the table, I think it was clear Sega was trying to listen to their fans.

I think we've both acknowledged at this point that yes, Sega was listening (or trying to listen) to the fans in the past; we've also acknowledged that fans, in spite of Sega listening, are still dissatisfied with the games in spite of them listening. Why this is the case is generally what we are both addressing, right?

You've saying this has happened because the fans just aren't satisfied no matter how hard Sega tries to please them. Meanwhile I'm here pointing out "Or maybe fans aren't satisfied with how Sega has responded to complaints, rather than fans aren't satisfied no matter what Sega does." Consider that, Myst.

What you've described as "other factors involved in the failure of those games" actually holds a rather strong connection as to why fans are complaining, what Sega has done in response, and why fan complaints haven't ceased in spite of that.

Again, the situation as to why people are still critical about the games, in spite of all Sega has done to try and fix their complaints, isn't as simple as you seem to be making it out to be.

[Dizcrybe]

Just had a thought about this whole thing last night, mainly with the whole 'stop talking, start doing' sentiment a good number of y'all have been saying with this press release and the last one.

Why are we asking this in response to PR men? That's what these people we keep hearing from; chief officers, and the like; are. They're people who publicly represent the studio/company and tell us what is expected to happen (whether that becomes true or not can only be revealed after the fact). They have nowhere near the same level of involvement or understanding as to what's going on, especially compared to a level designer working on an unannounced Sonic game, but that's the whole point.

It's not the job of PR men to start developing games, but the people working on said games. Would you rather have one of developers come out and tell us about a subject they might not be very tactful at addressing, instead of putting more time and effort into finishing the game that might very well prove these PR men right? I know what I'd rather have.

You don't honestly think we're asking PR reps to go in and start making good games, do you? Like you said, these guys represent SEGA,  so what they're saying are words from SEGA, And in response, we've been asking SEGA - not the people speaking for them - to put their money where their mouth is.

[Regen]

I hope they actually announce Sonic Adventure 3 and then everyone loses their minds.

[Badnik Mechanic]

I hope they actually announce Sonic Adventure 3

Christ no.

[Regen]

Christ no.

Well I don't want it to literally happen, it was a joke because of the reactions it would cause. Jeezie.

[Myst]

I would love to see a third adventure game. The Adventure series (And Generations) were the best 3D games in the series, and had great storylines to boot.

I would love to see a third adventure game. The Adventure series (And Generations) were the best 3D games in the series, and had great storylines to boot.

[SuperAj3]

I don't like how they think they need to cater to the "old-school" or genesis all the time. A lot recently are talking about revival of the Dreamcast era. I think with Sonic 4 eps 1 and 2, Generations and the 3D classics, the Classic Era's come and gone, time to move on.

[Myst]

Actually, I agree. Don't get me wrong, The classic games were some of the best videogames ever made, and they were my introduction to the franchise, but I really like what Sonic Team did with the Adventure series. I think I'm in the minority, as someone who got into Sonic during the classic era, but prefers the Adventure Era designs and atmosphere.

[Hedgehugs]

Well I don't want it to literally happen, it was a joke because of the reactions it would cause. Jeezie.

Call me a sadist if you want but I would love for them to announce it on April 1st, as an april fools joke or not.

Imagine the chaos.