What defines the post Unleashed era to you?

[Idon'tcare]

For me its simply been nothing but extremely linear gameplay, lack of both pre and post completion content, minimal replay value and a general feel of Sonic Team not really doing their best.

 

[azoo]

Critics in general weigh a lot more on the negatives than the positives when it comes to Video games, so if something is overtly bad in their eyes....you're going to hear a lot about it. Tis the way they work.

Of course. That comes to show that Sonic Team sort of took it too hard, though at the same time the critics' hatedom of the game was kind of overblown. A fault of both parties, really.

I hope a focus on more time and quality for this next title means something that feels special again. Another game on similar scale and effort to Unleashed (but without the weirder ideas) would be more than enough to win me back over.

[Kuzu]

Of course. That comes to show that Sonic Team sort of took it too hard, though at the same time the critics' hatedom of the game was kind of overblown. A fault of both parties, really.

I hope a focus on more time and quality for this next title means something that feels special again. Another game on similar scale and effort to Unleashed (but without the weirder ideas) would be more than enough to win me back over.

I'm starting to feel like whenever Sonic Team start to get ambitious about something, they mess something up in some way.

[Soniman]

I'm starting to feel like whenever Sonic Team start to get ambitious about something, they mess something up in some way.

so either they keep making decent to good minimalist game that critics will like but many fans will will claim they're stale, boring, souless, etc. Or they go big and (knowing Sonic Team's track record) turn in a game that excels in some areas but fais in other that all together makes a subpar product that might be enjoyed by fans but probably hated by critics. 

Sonic Team just cannot win :')

Edited December 16, 2015 by Soniman

[Wraith]

so either they keep making decent to good minimalist games, and people will claim they're stale, boring, souless, etc. Or they go big and (knowing Sonic Team's track record) turn in a game that excels in some areas but fais in other that all together makes a subpar product that might be enjoyed by fans but probably hated by critics. 

Sonic Team just cannot win :')

I think the next one might be a win considering that their main consistent roadblock(having to drop a Sonic game every year so Sega stays relevant.) Seems to be out of the picture, but we'll see.

[Kuzu]

so either they keep making decent to good minimalist game that critics will like but many fans will will claim they're stale, boring, souless, etc. Or they go big and (knowing Sonic Team's track record) turn in a game that excels in some areas but fais in other that all together makes a subpar product that might be enjoyed by fans but probably hated by critics. 

Sonic Team just cannot win :')

In the hands of competent developers, those aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

[Soniman]

I think the next one might be a win considering that their main consistent roadblock(having to drop a Sonic game every year so Sega stays relevant.) Seems to be out of the picture, but we'll see.

even so SLW was a little over two years ago, which isnt a terribly long time to moveto development on the next game for a 2016 release

 

In the hands of competent developers, those aren't necessarily mutually exclusive. Like this

True but this is Sonic Team, so its what we have to put up with sadly

Edited December 16, 2015 by Soniman

[azoo]

even so SLW was a little over two years ago, which isnt a terribly long time to moveto development on the next game for a 2016 release

Take note that Sonic Team splits into two to make games, though.

Lost World was mostly worked on by people who made Colors, which made the Storybook games. That's one team. The other team is the team behind Generations, which mostly worked on Unleashed.

Besides them probably working on other games at Sega (since they seem to move non-key members around a lot), this will be that end of Sonic Team's first effort in almost 5 years, with at least 3 of those years I imagine working on this upcoming title.

Whatever it'll be, it'll probably be the biggest thing we've had from ST in a long ass time.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Azoo

[Soniman]

Take note that Sonic Team splits into two to make games, though.

Lost World was mostly worked on by people who made Colors, which made the Storybook games. That's one team. The other team is the team behind Generations, which mostly worked on Unleashed.

Besides them probably working on other games at Sega (since they seem to move non-key members around a lot), this will be that end of Sonic Team's first effort in almost 5 years. Whatever it'll be, it'll probably be the biggest thing we've had from ST in a long ass time.

Ah I forgot about that, though considering the "A" Team's last effort was probably the most barebones 3D Sonic game so far im gonna remain skeptical

[azoo]

To be fair, it was an anniversary title, and was also rushed. Classic Sonic and the story in particular were kind of last minute additions, and Iizuka mentioned it took them a while to decide if they were doing an anniversary game or not so... yeah.

Plus, Colors came in and cut production in half (since they couldn't port Gens to Wii), and the initial the plan I assume was for both teams to work on the game so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

Edited December 16, 2015 by Azoo

[LeTreuBleu]

Basically, Colors onward (everything that comes after Black Knight).

Less care for anything close to an engaging plot (along with a rather mute tone that never really engages on anything mildly threatening, and when it does it just forgets it never happened any never goes back to it), while having much more uniform gameplay and less glitchiness overall... though, perhaps at the cost of feeling stale??

A blatantly huge over-usage of the Green Hill Zone color palette, at least as far Lost World is concerned.  Colors at least had more it expressed overall (living up to it's namesake! ;D)

Almost no other characters beyond the normal 5.  Not even Shadow gets very much spot-time.

And, an almost worrysome obsession with sticking to nostalgia, seldom expanding outward.

so either they keep making decent to good minimalist game that critics will like but many fans will will claim they're stale, boring, souless, etc. Or they go big and (knowing Sonic Team's track record) turn in a game that excels in some areas but fais in other that all together makes a subpar product that might be enjoyed by fans but probably hated by critics. 

Sonic Team just cannot win :')

Or they could end up making something like Generations and have it turn out awesome

[D.H]

Half assed stories, bad comedy, a focus on only Sonic, Tails, Eggman, Orbot, & Cubot, with Amy & Knuckles being left to cameos, a ridiculous focus on nostalgia, and an overall sense of apathy.

That pretty much sums up the post-Unleashed era to me.

 

[Kuzu]

Take note that Sonic Team splits into two to make games, though.

Lost World was mostly worked on by people who made Colors, which made the Storybook games. That's one team. The other team is the team behind Generations, which mostly worked on Unleashed.

Besides them probably working on other games at Sega (since they seem to move non-key members around a lot), this will be that end of Sonic Team's first effort in almost 5 years, with at least 3 of those years I imagine working on this upcoming title.

Whatever it'll be, it'll probably be the biggest thing we've had from ST in a long ass time.

I read in an interview that most of the "A" team actually came to work on Lost World...so take that what you will. I'd imagine since we're not getting annual releases anymore, both teams will probably be able to work together more.

[Badnik Mechanic]

Sonic games had heart and effort put into them and use to mean something!

How does colours, Generations and unleashed not have those things? Granted Unleashed has a huge problem with the werehog.

But my god this sounds like propeganda from a splinter group fanbase if people seriously don't think that the games were getting better had more effort put into them with each incarnation.

As for the 'used to mean something' part... forgive the pun here but what does that even mean? No really. It sounds like something someone yells when they're complaining about the good old days as opposed to actually debating or measuring something tangible.

[Kuzu]

How does colours, Generations and unleashed not have those things? Granted Unleashed has a huge problem with the werehog.

But my god this sounds like propeganda from a splinter group fanbase if people seriously don't think that the games were getting better had more effort put into them with each incarnation.

As for the 'used to mean something' part... forgive the pun here but what does that even mean? No really. It sounds like something someone yells when they're complaining about the good old days as opposed to actually debating or measuring something tangible.

I don't think anyone will question the games getting better, but the games themselves just lack a sense of anything to care about. What doesn't help is that the games themselves are getting shorter with nothing really to keep you invested beyond a single playthrough. There's also the fact that Sega don't even seem to care about engaging the fanbase and throw out little easter eggs like they did with Unleashed. Its like they're saying "Here's your game, hope you like it. See you next year."

[Soniman]

I don't think anyone will question the games getting better, but the games themselves just lack a sense of anything to care about. What doesn't help is that the games themselves are getting shorter with nothing really to keep you invested beyond a single playthrough. There's also the fact that Sega don't even seem to care about engaging the fanbase and throw out little easter eggs like they did with Unleashed. Its like they're saying "Here's your game, hope you like it. See you next year."

Personally I was never fond of this narrative that people try to weave that Sonic Team doesn't care about the  Colors onward games they make just because the FANS happen to not like the games, almost like they need to find a way to reason to blsme why they feel that way about the games simply because its not suited to their tastes. Sonic Generations may be bare but it's hard to argue the amount of fan love and nods and stuff that IS there, unless you mean easter eggs in a diffrent way.

I also don't recall Sonic Team engaging the fanbase any more or less then any other game release. You got interviews, QAs, the usual stuff that comes with every pretty release build up?

Actually adding to what hogfather yeah with boom and stuff i feel like they engage more now then back then

Edited December 17, 2015 by Soniman

[Badnik Mechanic]

I don't think anyone will question the games getting better, but the games themselves just lack a sense of anything to care about. What doesn't help is that the games themselves are getting shorter with nothing really to keep you invested beyond a single playthrough. There's also the fact that Sega don't even seem to care about engaging the fanbase and throw out little easter eggs like they did with Unleashed. Its like they're saying "Here's your game, hope you like it. See you next year."

Games getting shshorter is an industry trend due to the fact that the entire PS360 had an increase in develooment costs and no real way to offset that unless you included tons of DLC/Microtransactions. We're seeing it now with games being so much more expensive compare to last gen. But the jump in price from PS2/Xbox/GC to PS360 was tiny if anything at all.

Also not caring about the fanbase... what... come on seriously? Sega were one of the first companies to start holding dedicated fan events. Run Sonic Run, Generations of Skate, Macy's parade, they turned up to comic cons and threw parties just for the sake of it.

Generations had that code hunt thing and have we all do gotten that Iizuka and Hoshino both asked if they could come to Boom and SOS because they wanted to meet the fans and Jun requested time to actually walk about and mingle with them?

Sega don't care/didn't engage? Lol wut.

 

[LeTreuBleu]

 It sounds like something someone yells when they're complaining about the good old days as opposed to actually debating or measuring something tangible.

Didn't'cha know?  Not many sonic fans do that lol

[Kuzu]

Personally I was never fond of this narrative that people try to weave that Sonic Team doesn't care about the  Colors onward games they make just because the FANS happen to not like the games, almost like they need to find a way to reason to blsme why they feel that way about the games simply because its not suited to their tastes. Sonic Generations may be barbies but it's hard to argue the amount of fan love and nods and stuff that IS there, unless you mean easter eggs in a diffrent way.

I also don't recall Sonic Team engaging the fanbase any more or less then any other game release. You got interviews, QAs, the usual stuff that comes with every pretty release build up?

If a product does not please me, I have every right to voice my displeasure with it. Sorry you don't agree :\

Games getting shshorter is an industry trend due to the fact that the entire PS360 had an increase in develooment costs and no real way to offset that unless you included tons of DLC/Microtransactions. We're seeing it now with games being so much more expensive compare to last gen. But the jump in price from PS2/Xbox/GC to PS360 was tiny if anything at all.

Also not caring about the fanbase... what... come on seriously? Sega were one of the first companies to start holding dedicated fan events. Run Sonic Run, Generations of Skate, Macy's parade, they turned up to comic cons and threw parties just for the sake of it.

Generations had that code hunt thing and have we all do gotten that Iizuka and Hoshino both asked if they could come to Boom and SOS because they wanted to meet the fans and Jun requested time to actually walk about and mingle with them?

Sega don't care/didn't engage? Lol wut.

 

I'm referring primarily to game marketing here, all of that other stuff is irrelevant to me. Maybe its just me being "longing for the old days" like you said, but I don't really care. Sonic does not interest me like it used it and I feel like the developers aren't giving me enough of a reason to be interested. And I don't want to feel this way like I said before, but I really just can't help it with how they've been handling the series in the most bare-bones and simplistic way possible.

If that makes me a whiner then I guess I'm a whiner, but I'm not gonna sugarcoat how I feel about this.

Edited December 17, 2015 by Kuzu the Boloedge

[Soniman]

If a product does not please me, I have every right to voice my displeasure with it. Sorry you don't agree :\

uhh thats not what I was saying at all, that wasnt even my point.

I just dont think the idea Sonic Team not caring about the games they make because others dont care about games themselves isnt an entirely valid one, especially when theres no way to really prove that.

[Kuzu]

uhh thats not what I was saying at all, that wasnt even my point.

I just dont think the idea Sonic Team not caring about the games they make because others dont care about games themselves isnt an entirely valid one, especially when theres no way to really prove that.

You basically said that fans who are voicing their displeasure with the series are, and I quote "making up reasons because its not suited to them" which basically translates to that we're wrong and we should just accept the series as it is.

The entire marketing of the series is an example of them growing more distant. Where the hell were the Sonic Colors/Generation shorts? The clever marketing? All of the hidden items and collectibles hidden throughout the levels? an actual world to explore? I'm pretty sure I didn't make those things up and they actually happened before.

[Wraith]

You basically said that fans who are voicing their displeasure with the series are, and I quote "making up reasons because its not suited to them" which basically translates to that we're wrong and we should just accept the series as it is.

 

I like how that's not really what he said or implied at all. 

"Personally I was never fond of this narrative that people try to weave that Sonic Team doesn't care about the  Colors onward games they make just because the FANS happen to not like the games, almost like they need to find a way to reason to blsme why they feel that way about the games simply because its not suited to their tastes."

 

He was attacking the constant implication that Sonic Team doesn't care. Not your own displeasure with the games. You even bolded this part and you still didn't get it. Like, where does the part where you have to accept the series as is even come from? Why do you always have massive leaps in logic like this?

 

 

[Soniman]

You basically said that fans who are voicing their displeasure with the series are, and I quote "making up reasons because its not suited to them" which basically translates to that we're wrong and we should just accept the series as it is.

that wasnt the actual quote but okay, i still didnt mean it that way as I explained, sorry if you thought otherwise/

 

The entire marketing of the series is an example of them growing more distant. Where the hell were the Sonic Colors/Generation shorts? The clever marketing? All of the hidden items and collectibles hidden throughout the levels? an actual world to explore? I'm pretty sure I didn't make those things up and they actually happened before.

well the restill give you, but what do you mean by "clever" marketing?

Edited December 17, 2015 by Soniman

[Kuzu]

I like how that's not really what he said or implied at all. 

"Personally I was never fond of this narrative that people try to weave that Sonic Team doesn't care about the  Colors onward games they make just because the FANS happen to not like the games, almost like they need to find a way to reason to blsme why they feel that way about the games simply because its not suited to their tastes."

 

He was attacking the constant implication that Sonic Team doesn't care. Not your own displeasure with the games. You even bolded this part and you still didn't get it. Like, where does the part where you have to accept the series as is even come from? Why do you always have massive leaps in logic like this?

I wasn't really addressing you buuuut. If that's what he was saying, then maybe he shouldn't be bringing up the idea that the only reason fans are upset is because they're making up reasons to be upset :\

well the restill give you, but what do you mean by "clever" marketing?

Clever in the sense of making use of the Werehog gimmick. I really liked how they styled a commercial after a horror movie flick and combined CG live action. That....doesn't happen anymore.

[Multikaris]

Polished, but very bland games with questionable humor. And now the polish left, and the plot got even worse... We're in a true downfall of Sonic, perhaps the end of a franchise as hardy as a cockroach Twinkie.