Detective SSMB & The Case of the Sonic 25th Anniversary "P.g. 100 is the best... food discussion started."

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

I mean, the red ring thing isn't even forced! It's just a way to add replayablity into the game and the prize is that you get to say "I did it" and brag to your friends. Good games will add stuff for players to find even if it isn't part of the game, that is what makes a game fun and more replayable. 

[Chris Knopps]

8 minutes ago, Wraith said:

I'm surprised the replayability vs content debate is happening when any franchise worth a damn has at  least a decent grasp on both. We shouldn't need pick our poison. A fun, well put together 6-10 hour sonic game that you actually want play again is what everyone wants, I think.  

Finally a rational mind with a reasonable grasp on both sides of the conversation.

A hearty root beer toast to you, thank ye.

And Mikyeong... You're kind of the same as Diogenes in these types of conversations... Doing what I mentioned not long ago...

Collectibles are pointless/worthless if they unlock nothing save for one feature not really worth it in the end. And brag to your friends? Who the hell are you going to brag to for collecting all the red rings in a Sonic game that gave you jack sh@t for it...?

You'd be a laughingstock.

[Shadowlax]

24 minutes ago, Indigo Rush said:

Sonic is not about spectacle alone. Even the Adventure games had solid gameplay to back it up. (The speed levels, at least).

The real issue is the padding with noncongruous gameplay mechanics and the like meant to artificially lengthen the game. These games are flawed because of this, and the spectacle is the spray paint covering up the garbage.

I never said it was, but the visual design of all things sonic I think should get a hell of  alot more credit than it does. I think its kind of the reason, sonic has stayed afloat for so long , megaman hasn't been so lucky. Or metroid. 

To the bottom part, I never thought the mechanics were the problem, lets say for example the adventure games, the problem was the polish and exicution of said mechanics. This mantra could be used as a critique of most of the things wrong with sonic, a good idea with bullshit around it. That said, if I were in charge of a thing, I would instead of trying to just put in new mechnics, even now, I would just spin off those mechanics, into various games staring popular characters. They don't have to be large, but you could probably make a pretty penny of cheaper lower scale games, and possibly built to something else , expand your portfolio. I would buy shadow, platinum revengence in a heartbeat. Using their portifolio of characters is kind of a thing every company under the damn sun is doing right now, and I think would probably be a good idea.

I'm rambling my point is, as is with sonic, in a lot of cases, instead of rushing the product, taking your time and making a good product might be a better solution. 

[Wraith]

1 minute ago, Inspector Shaddy said:

Oh, absolutely. It's just that we haven't got one of those, and need to be smart when picking what kind of game we want to get instead.

Why? You don't get to decide in the end. 

 

Its just kind of tiring watching you guys argue over stuff like this when everyone ultimately wants the same. Modern fans don't WANT 2 hour games and Dreamcast fans don't WANT unfocused, unpolished mechanics. Take what works from both sides instead of arguing one half measure vs another.

[Chris Knopps]

4 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Why? You don't get to decide in the end. 

 

Its just kind of tiring watching you guys argue over stuff like this when everyone ultimately wants the same. Modern fans don't WANT 2 hour games and Dreamcast fans don't WANT unfocused, unpolished mechanics. Take what works from both sides instead of arguing one half measure vs another.

Again, hot sh@t this guy is good... You need to show up more often dude.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

6 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Why? You don't get to decide in the end. 

 

Its just kind of tiring watching you guys argue over stuff like this when everyone ultimately wants the same. Modern fans don't WANT 2 hour games and Dreamcast fans don't WANT unfocused, unpolished mechanics. Take what works from both sides instead of arguing one half measure vs another.

I'm not saying we should get one over the other instead of both, just that we probably will, and knowing which of those is better is all we can do.

9 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I'm rambling my point is, as is with sonic, in a lot of cases, instead of rushing the product, taking your time and making a good product might be a better solution. 

So what you're saying is you're really excited for Fire and Ice, right?

 

9 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

And Mikyeong... You're kind of the same as Diogenes in these types of conversations... Doing what I mentioned not long ago...

Collectibles are pointless/worthless if they unlock nothing save for one feature not really worth it in the end. And brag to your friends? Who the hell are you going to brag to for collecting all the red rings in a Sonic game that gave you jack sh@t for it...?

What did Sonic Unleashed give you for doing every mission and collecting every medal, which takes way longer than red rings and is less fun?

 

Also, you sure like telling Wraith how correct and smart he is while then continuing to argue the exact thing he's telling us to stop. I'm not claiming innocence, but I'm at least trying to be honest here.

[Guest]

My opinion about what Sonic games should be is that they should be good.

also awwww yeeeaaaahhh

(and now it's ruined)

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

46 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

-gasps-

You take that back son... That shit beat the HELL out of Perfect Chaos by a LONG shot! The hell you smoking?

The way the fight controls in the HD version is terribad. It's keen fun,  using tactics applicable to NiGHTS though in Unwiished.

[Enesephus]

1 minute ago, Inspector Shaddy said:

I'm not saying we should get one over the other instead of both, just that we probably will, and preparing for that is all we can do.

We shouldn't have to do that. And before you or anyone else says, "Well, this is SEGA we're talking about," it doesn't matter. We shouldn't have to choose. These are professional game developers, they ought to be able to give us both.

Quote

So what you're saying is you're really excited for Fire and Ice, right?

I realize you crossed this out, but where in his post did he ever indicate excitement?

 

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

2 minutes ago, TimmiT said:

My opinion about what Sonic games should be is that they should be good.

"good" 

It depends on the perception. 

[therealfalconpawnch77]

On the topic of the 25th Anniversary Game, who thinks that it will feature more Characters than Sonic, Tails, Eggman, Orbot, Cubot, Amy, and Knuckles? Perhaps the triumphant return of one Mr. B.T. Cat?

[SSF1991]

1 minute ago, Hyper Enesephus said:

We shouldn't have to do that. And before you or anyone else says, "Well, this is SEGA we're talking about," it doesn't matter. We shouldn't have to choose. These are professional game developers, they ought to be able to give us both.

The fanbase can't even decide what they want from SEGA, let alone SEGA actually delivering it.

[Chris Knopps]

4 minutes ago, Hyper Enesephus said:

We shouldn't have to do that. And before you or anyone else says, "Well, this is SEGA we're talking about," it doesn't matter. We shouldn't have to choose. These are professional game developers, they ought to be able to give us both.

 

 

That's my issue...

Why are we getting such short games with nearly zero amount of content compared to past titles this being the case, especially with the staff being by and large the same, at least up top...?

And SSF...

Better writing, multiple playable characters, and no more whatever the f@$k RoL and LW was seems to be the general ideal... Not hard to make something based off those demands.

[Enesephus]

Just now, Mikyeong said:

"good" 

It depends on the perception. 

I think a game (even a Sonic game) can be objectively good, even if it's not to your tastes.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

Just give us a little bit a both: problem solved.

[Wraith]

3 minutes ago, Inspector Shaddy said:

I'm not saying we should get one over the other instead of both, just that we probably will, and knowing which of those is better is all we can do.

 

Well, yeah. Keeping  your expectations in check makes sense. Don't see a point in the heated arguments when neither direction is worth enthusiasm imo 

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

3 minutes ago, Hyper Enesephus said:

I think a game (even a Sonic game) can be objectively good, even if it's not to your tastes.

Naw, I'm not arguing that. I mean I despise Sonic 2 but it was a good game overall. 

EDIT: why isn't this post merged? I didn't mean tot double post.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

5 minutes ago, Hyper Enesephus said:

We shouldn't have to do that. And before you or anyone else says, "Well, this is SEGA we're talking about," it doesn't matter. We shouldn't have to choose. These are professional game developers, they ought to be able to give us both.

We shouldn't have to put up with any of this. But we don't have a choice. Please, tell me how we can fix Sega's problems.

5 minutes ago, Hyper Enesephus said:

I realize you crossed this out, but where in his post did he ever indicate excitement?

It was a joke because Fire and Ice was delayed to be made better.

3 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

That's my issue...

Why are we getting such short games with nearly zero amount of content compared to past titles this being the case, especially with the staff being by and large the same, at least up top...?

Because they chose quality over quantity for those games. There hasn't been a single Sonic game released since the classic days that had as much content as expected, and as well-designed gameplay as expected, and the series has changed a lot since then. These are things that we now know, and have known for about a decade.

How many circles do we want to go in here?

[Enesephus]

Just now, Inspector Shaddy said:

It was a joke because Fire and Ice was delayed to be made better.

Well, your joke made no sense. =P

[Shaddy Zaphod]

Just now, Hyper Enesephus said:

Well, your joke made no sense. =P

He said a game should be made better by using more development time.

I pointed out a game that is being made better by using more development time, and the joke was that I acted like he was excited for it, when I rightly know he isn't.

[SSF1991]

3 minutes ago, Mikyeong said:

Just give us a little bit a both: problem solved.

Give fans a little bit of what, though? Because no one can agree on it. Quite a few seem to operate under the mentality of "my way or the highway". It's hard to form a compromise at all when it seems fans are unwilling to do this.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

7 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

 

Better writing, multiple playable characters, and no more whatever the f@$k RoL and LW was seems to be the general ideal... Not hard t make something based off those demands.

Lost World's situation is highly debatable,  given the vast potential it did yield,  and the fact that there are many who do regard out positively,  if at the very least,  providing a new potential 3d playstyle, so it's not quite as simple as you make it out to be. 

Now bringing up RoL in a discussion centered on the main series makes no logical sense whatsoever on the other hand. 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Mikyeong said:

"good" 

It depends on the perception. 

Finally, I have found the person who will argue about literally anything.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

2 minutes ago, TimmiT said:

Finally, I have found the person who will argue about literally anything.

I'm sorry but you are wrong LOL . I wasn't even trying to start an argument. So look before you judge.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

4 minutes ago, SSF1991 said:

Give fans a little bit of what, though? Because no one can agree on it. Quite a few seem to operate under the mentality of "my way or the highway". It's hard to form a compromise at all when it seems fans are unwilling to do this.

The problem is, a little bit of both means an overall mediocre game. I'm working off what evidence we have here. I would love a modern Sonic game that gives great gameplay and plenty of content. But we've never had that, and we're likely not going to get that. Ergo, I explain the optimal conditions for a Sonic game that is as good as the last 3 main Sonic games (Colors, Generations, Lost World) have been, rather than a Sonic game that was as long as the 3 main Sonic games before those 3 (Shadow, 06, Unleashed).

2 minutes ago, TimmiT said:

Finally, I have found the person who will argue about literally anything.

Nah, Mikeyong is okay. I don't think she totally picked up on the idea of the ridiculously blunt albeit totally correct statement amidst a flurry of people arguing which parts of a Sonic game should be good, is all.