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Sonic Mania (August 15th 2017, Christian Whitehead, PS4, Xbox One, PC, Switch) - The New Classic

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Well, I personally love what I saw! I am excited for this game, and I am excited to see new zones in the future, and the game looks like retro fun! I can't even wait for spring to come along to play the game.

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7 minutes ago, BenderMania said:

"Spiritual Antithesis"/ The game can be considered this in regards to Sonic the Hedgehog 4. Both are throwbacks to Sonic's early games, but while Sonic 4 featured 2½D graphics, a retraux soundtrack inspired by the Sega Genesis games, and the modern character designs, Sonic Mania uses 2D graphics, a modern soundtrack inspired by Sonic the Hedgehog CD, and the classic character designs.

I think they forgot the whole "also Mania plays exactly like the classics and Sonic 4... well..." part. :P

I haven't really posted in here since the reveal (my post was pretty huge lmao) but that's because I don't have much to say in here. I'm pretty much taken by how amazing everything is, I basically have no words other than how ready I am to see what's to come! This whole game is a dream come true. <3

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So, I eased up on the game a bit and after seeing it's footage, I am really excited for this game and I will be one of the first to preorder when it comes out. I really like how the game has been that 2D classic people have been waiting for, for the past 16 years. Also to be honest, I don't see how this game is pandering to anyone since the levels and the ideas are new along with some remastered levels. The rolling physics in the game did make me really happy as well.

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8 hours ago, Soniman said:

Oh please God give me the Hydrocity remake Gens failed to deliver, I would literally kill, like, commit murder, to get this

Literally me

i can't say a word about this game that y'all haven't already said except, yeah, if you want to put a hit on someone and hire me to be your hitwoman in exchange for Mania Hydrocity I'd be down

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2 hours ago, Azoo said:

I think they forgot the whole "also Mania plays exactly like the classics and Sonic 4... well..." part. :P

I haven't really posted in here since the reveal (my post was pretty huge lmao) but that's because I don't have much to say in here. I'm pretty much taken by how amazing everything is, I basically have no words other than how ready I am to see what's to come! This whole game is a dream come true. <3

I feel the same. I have nothing else to say but I'd like to have more material to talk about (heck, spring 2017 is really far!). I was wondering: is Sonic Stadium planning on approaching RubyEclipse and Taxman for an interview? I'm sure there's a lot that can be said without spoiling the game. Currently I'd like to ask him:

-Has Sonic 3&K Remastered been discussed between Sega, Taxman and Stealth when they talked about starting Sonic Mania? Would there be a chance for it to be released if Sonic Mania is successful?

-Will Sonic 1 and 2 Remastered get ported to PC and consoles?

-Is there any chance of other Genesis franchises being brought to life with Retro Engine? I'm thinking of games like Ristar or Dynamite Headdy, as Taxman said in an old interview.

 

Now, about Sonic Mania:

-Although the game is announced for Xbox One, PS4 and PC, is there any chance that it also gets released on Android and iOS? I have Sonic 1, 2 and CD Remastered on Android and I'd like to have Sonic Mania in the same platform. 

-Will there be both special stages and bonus stages?

-Will there be cutscenes between levels?

-I assume Super Sonic will be available, but what about Super Knuckles and Super Tails? And Super Emeralds?

-Will there be alternate paths depending on the characters?

-Would it be possible to add more characters before the release date? Maybe unlockable?

-How many zones will there be?

-Will there be any collectible (I'm thinking of Red Rings) that unlocks new levels? This has always been something that for me make Super Mario or Donkey Kong Country a bit better than Sonic classics in terms of replayability. It's not very difficult to implement and I think it improves the game experience a lot.

 

 

By the way, Sonic Mania is a game many of us wanted for two decades, but after it's released, I'd personally like Sega to make a new 2D Sonic game in this same style, but with full hd graphics. And I wouldn't mind if modern Sonic is in. Sonic Mania could be a way to make amends with a big part of the fandom, but also a way to prove that a 2D sprite-based Sonic game is something profitable. Who wouldn't want a new Sonic game with Raymand Origins' style?

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After Sonic 4, Generations and Mega Drive (archie comic) I'm sliiiiightly getting tired of this pandering to classic series, but I guess the quality is what matters, and what they promise might be best Sonic game in years.

With that said, one thing that I would change: graphics. Maybe classic gameplay is the best, so it's logical to use it, but going back to 16-bit is pure nostalgia and nothing else. Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see how using graphics more like Rayman Legends or Shantae Half Genie would make game worse from objective point of view. (okay, "objective" might be a wrong word, but you get the idea).

Or adding unlockable playable Shadow. Tiny tip of a hat to modern fans and I swear, I won't complain about anything else.

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If Sonic 4 had been a real Sonic 4, I'm sure fans wouldn't claim for justice to the classic series. Sonic Mania is Sega saying sorry to that part of the Sonic community. 

Also, if Sonic 4 had lived up to its name, I think Sonic 5, 6, etc could have followed, but Sega didn't understand the mess they did, and for a few more years they buried what could have been a very profitable branch for the franchise. 

If Sonic Mania's goal is to put everything in its right place, I wouldn't bet for it to have modern stuff, like adding Shadow or other modern characters. However, it could be a perfect bridge to make more games in this style, but with hd graphics and modern stuff. I mean, I wouldn't ask Sonic Mania for more than delivering a great classic sequel and add a couple of new things. After that, I'd expect Sega to go further.

I'd suggest people to enjoy Sonic Mania for what it seems it will be: a great classic game. Many of us have dreamed with it for years. Let's enjoy this and not rise our expectations higher than what's reasonable :)

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I'm assuming it's closer to 32-bit, Tax has said that it's Saturn inspired. More likely 16-bit but with the added features the Saturn could deliver to a sprite based game. Think SNES Mode 7 features like scaling, rotating, reflection, shearing, translation and using multiple layers. Except unlike Mode 7 the sprites themselves could be altered not just backgrounds. It could also lend itself to minor 3D effects or texturing tho I'm doubting Sonic Mania would break rank with its goal to be retro like the classics and use any major 3D effects.

Also no Shadow please, wouldn't make sense, if its meant to be taking place during the classic era timeline then Sonic wouldn't have even met him yet. Just my personal opinion. There's plenty of other classic characters they could slot in there as extras that would make sense over one that doesn't.

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26 minutes ago, Tenko said:

Also no Shadow please, wouldn't make sense, if its meant to be taking place during the classic era timeline then Sonic wouldn't have even met him yet. Just my personal opinion. There's plenty of other classic characters they could slot in there as extras that would make sense over one that doesn't.

Agreed. That can be done in another game that is still 2D but not 100% classic. 

It would make sense and would be really cool being able to unlock the Chaotix, or at least some of them, but if there are going to be alternate paths, well... More than 3 characters would make that task really difficult.

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31 minutes ago, Tenko said:

Also no Shadow please, wouldn't make sense, if its meant to be taking place during the classic era timeline then Sonic wouldn't have even met him yet. Just my personal opinion. There's plenty of other classic characters they could slot in there as extras that would make sense over one that doesn't.

I'm not going to argue, it's just a whim on my part, not worth fighting for.

I just want to ask why? I'm talking about unlockable bonus like Metal Sonic in SA1, something that classic fans can just ignore. Since Colors, classic fans are getting all the love, 'dreamcastians' are getting cameos (generations, runners) or kick in the balls (Rise of Lyric). I'm not asking him to be a full fledged part of experience, no story or anything. Just acknowledging that he in fact exists, in something that isn't Olympic Games. Would that really offend you guys that much?

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Like her or not, Amy would be the only real first logical choice to add to Sonic Mania or other new retro Sonic titles later for multiple reasons. Playable Metal-Sonic would a nice choice too in a possible future retro title. The Chaotix are also possible... but are less likely considering SEGA doesn't see them half as important as they do Amy or Metal. While modern characters maybe could be cool to see, but is highly unlikely and is questionable if they should even be in classic Sonic games to start with.

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I'm not offended at all :) Sorry if I sounded like that. 

For me it's just a matter of coherence. I mean, if it's a classic, in my opinion it should stay as a classic. Metal Sonic as a playable character makes sense to me, but Shadow doesn't fit in a true classic sequel (yet). 

If Sonic Mania is really successful, I think Sega could have Taxman develop on that 100% classic branch and maybe hire another team to use Retro Engine to make more sprite-based 2D games but using full hd sprites and modern characters. I would like that to happen. I think it would be fun to play. But I just don't think Sonic Mania should go there. There's so much for Sonic Mania to achieve already, and if you appeal to pure classic Sonic fans and introduce a modern element, you're risking too much unnecessarily.

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27 minutes ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

I'm not going to argue, it's just a whim on my part, not worth fighting for.

I just want to ask why? I'm talking about unlockable bonus like Metal Sonic in SA1, something that classic fans can just ignore. Would that really offend you guys that much?

/start minor rant

Its not about offense, its about being logical and fitting with the world that's been built. Metal Sonic as an unlockable in Sonic Adventure DX isn't a good example of what your after at all. Even as an unlockable it still makes sense. Metal Sonic's debut was in Sonic CD, long before Sonic Adventure, he's been around ever since. He was even shown to be in the stasis tanks on Eggmans base in the game itself. Being unlockable in that game made sense.

Shadow's first appearance was in Sonic Adventure 2, long after the events of the classic era, he's not a classic era character. While he existed at that time, he was confined in stasis. He didn't awaken until Eggman found him in Sonic Adventure 2. To have him unlockable in a game presumably taking place in the classic era, arguably based in the past based on Generations, with a classic era black eyes Sonic and all that, wouldn't make any sense.

There are other characters that were around back then, ones that haven't been in a game a lot longer than Shadow. Ray the Flying Squirrel, Mighty the Armadillo, Fang the Sniper, Bean the Dynamite Duck and Bark the Polarbear to name a few. As well as ones like Amy Rose who have a classic era design that could be utilized and make a lot more sense than a modern era character who should be in stasis at the time.

Think of the classic era fans who haven't seen a character in any game, not even a spin-off title, for 23 years.Shadow being represented as playable in spin-off titles, a boss in main games and still being plastered on merchandise till the cows come home is nothing compared to being gone from the franchise for 20 odd years except for making appearances in the Archie comic books.

/end rant

No hard feelings or offense intended, you did ask for a reason. Is that good enough as to why Shadow should be at the bottom of the list of bonuses when it comes to a classic era game?

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38 minutes ago, molul said:

if you appeal to pure classic Sonic fans and introduce a modern element, you're risking too much unnecessarily.

So you're admiring that putting Shadow would offend someone.

5 minutes ago, Tenko said:

Shadow's first appearance was in Sonic Adventure 2, long after the events of the classic era

Sure because unlockable extras have to be 100% logical. Just like unlocking Gray Fox in Metal Gear games. Or Batman Beyond skin in Arkham Games.

Or Metroid Fushion suit in Metroid Prime games (take place before Fusion). Or when Megaman X had hadoken, Or Green Hills in SA2. Or when Smash Bros added 3rd party characters, or when Shovel Knight (classic nostalgia) had a Kratos in it (modern game), or Protoman in Megaman Powered Up. Or when Pokemon started to remake games and adding future generations to old games. Or Model a in Megaman ZX Advent.

This is why Sonic fans can't never agree on anything. You're getting 3 games with classic elements: Mania, "project 2017" and Lego. But when I ask for one tiny modern element I get "I'm not racist, but I don't want you to sit next to me" thing. Thanks people, thanks. (I guess I lied a little about not arguing. Sorry people, I'm done here anyway).

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It has been said many times already but this game feels very much like Sonic CD, aesthetically. Still more fluid gameplay wise like Sonic 3. That 'minor' boss theme sounds a bit like CD's JAP boss music. I like that. What would you like the major boss theme be like? I personally like Sonic 3 boss theme the best, then Sonic 2 & CD (JAP).

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55 minutes ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

So you're admiring that putting Shadow would offend someone.

 

Admiring? :wacko:

Well, I see someone getting angry because Shadow most likely won't be there, so I guess it's possible that other people get upset for the opposite. Not my case. I wouldn't mind if Shadow was there, but I don't find any logic in including him.

 

55 minutes ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

This is why Sonic fans can't never agree on anything. You're getting 3 games with classic elements: Mania, "project 2017" and Lego. But when I ask for one tiny modern element I get "I'm not racist, but I don't want you to sit next to me" thing. Thanks people, thanks. (I guess I lied a little about not arguing. Sorry people, I'm done here anyway).

You realize that you're one of those fans that can't never agree on anything, right? I mean, if you weren't, you wouldn't be so pissed off for Shadow not being there. Think about it.

A part of Sonic fandom has been granted their long time anticipated wish. It's something to be happy about. I mean, I don't like Sonic Adventure, but if Sonic Adventure 3 had been announced, I'd be very happy for those who wanted it so bad, and I wouldn't get angry for suggesting a Classic Sonic skin and seeing how people dislike it. Call me crazy.

 

 

Now, ontopic, Taxman said this on Neogaf:

Quote

 

All the screens and footage of GHZ are from the playable demo, which was just the first act. GHZ Act 1 is probably the tamest classic level of the lot, but I can't say much more than that until Sega reveals more info on the story and stuff in the future.

The reception for Sonic Mania has been pretty wild, and I'm really happy most people seem to dig it. I realise Saturn-esque retro 2D stuff isn't for everyone but this was the most effective way for our indie sized team to develop a good chunk of fun content in the time frame, rather than something like 4 zones with potentially forgettable HD graphics.

P.S. there are some nice CRT filters in addition to those "highest quality, uncompressed pixels" ;)

 

 

I see some people at Neogaf asking for a Sonic 3 sprite evolution, and I couldn't agree more. The new one is cute, but it looks like a step backwards in terms of evolution (unless Sonic Mania occurs between Sonic 2 and 3).

I hope there's at least a skin selector or something.

 

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I've been kind of speechless since the reveal (partly due to being hungover but enough about that). This is something I didn't realise that I wanted. I thought I'd be less enthusiastic about a return to the old art style and even though revisiting old levels isn't ideal, it's great to see new ideas like the drop dash and the fantastic Studiopolis in action. That is not to mention all of the clever SEGA references and how absolutely beautiful Sonic's new sprites look. I cannot wait to see how Tails and Knuckles look and if they have any new abilities themselves. Tail swipe anyone?

I'm assuming that the game will be half new, half nostalgia; given that the five Classic games are getting a level each. I'd love to see Ice Cap with a brand new CD-inspired track that somehow manages to reference the original without causing legal issues. Either way, so as long as there's a good variety on offer (and more commonly referenced stages like Labyrinth and Metropolis are avoided), I'm so on board.

Can I also say that the trailer was beautifully executed? It really hit home with that animated text and awesome music on top of SEGA's usual snappy editing. I only wish that the 2017 teaser had been as sharp and informative, but we can't have everything I guess!

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Just now, Pawn said:

...any new abilities themselves. Tail swipe anyone?

It might seem pointless, but extra abilities would be pretty nice. As long as they carry momentum...unlike in the Advance games.

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