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Sonic Mania (August 15th 2017, Christian Whitehead, PS4, Xbox One, PC, Switch) - The New Classic

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3 minutes ago, ShroomZed said:

That's quite a good observation that even I didn't see. It's entirely possible, and with the issue of how much time it would take to put in alternate exits to every act, maybe there aren't alternate exists to every act. Kinda like how Starlight Zone act 1 had two exits but not every other act did. It could be one of those occasional odd things, but we'll see.  

Starlight Zone Act 1 has only 1 exit...

What do you mean 2 exits?

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Just now, Gemster312 said:

 

Starlight Zone Act 1 has only 1 exit...

What do you mean 2 exits?

xSfOJQH.png

Technically has two, just with the same signpost.

Saying that, Collision Chaos in CD has an act that actually does have two completely different exits; it even nabs you an achievement in CD 2011!

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And yeah Tracker is also correct with Collision Chaos Zone 2 having two exits. Collision Chaos Zone 2 is probably the better example actually with how more apparent it is. 

scd-cc-zone2bmap.png

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I guess i completely forgot about those.

Regardless, those could do it easy since the end of the act was nothing but a sign post (no boss), and it didn't "smooth transition" into the next act. Regardless where you ended the previous act, you began the next in the exact same spot. Would be more difficult in Sonic Mania xP

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Spring Yard Zone act 2 and Collision Chaos zone 2 both have two alternate signpost exits. And many Sonic 3&K levels have different starting/end points for Sonic and Knuckles.

What's the message I want to get across? DEFINITELY expect certain acts in Sonic Mania to have two starting or end points (maybe even three!).

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1 minute ago, Ajavalo said:

Spring Yard Zone act 2 and Collision Chaos zone 2 both have two alternate signpost exits. And many Sonic 3&K levels have different starting/end points for Sonic and Knuckles.

What's the message I want to get across? DEFINITELY expect certain acts in Sonic Mania to have two starting or end points (maybe even three!).

Oh yeah I forgot about Spring Yard act 2. Good catch. Yeah so we definitely aren't short on zones that have two exits when it's not the norm, so I can definitely see it in Mania. Agree completely dude. 

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Just now, Ajavalo said:

Spring Yard Zone act 2 and Collision Chaos zone 2 both have two alternate signpost exits. And many Sonic 3&K levels have different starting/end points for Sonic and Knuckles.

What's the message I want to get across? DEFINITELY expect certain acts in Sonic Mania to have two starting or end points (maybe even three!).

Oh i agree for the sake of different characters getting different paths (that's a no-brainer), as already evident in Mirage Saloon Act 2 knux different starting place.

But i mean, for Sonic to get multiple places he could fight the End-Of-Act 1 boss? Then have multiple different ways of starting out Act 2 depending where he finished Act 1? I'm no way saying that impossible, but that's a lot of work.

In Sonic 3 it worked because Knuckles had his own bosses, his own whole level design. To dedicate a whole new "extra path" just for characters who took an alternative boss battle, is so much more work if 90% of players wont experience it.

 

Does it make sense what im saying?

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Well, I don't know if it is really that much work to put the same boss in two locations, even with different boss arenas for variety. The boss object is already programmed. And I'm all for putting somewhat hidden content for those who like exploring.

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What if they do it so each character has an exclusive version of bosses only they can reach?

For instance, Sonic via the normal route, Knuckles via some barrier ala S3&K with Tails reaching his via flight?

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4 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

What if they do it so each character has an exclusive version of bosses only they can reach?

For instance, Sonic via the normal route, Knuckles via some barrier ala S3&K with Tails reaching his via flight?

source.gif

Knuckles routes are definitely a thing in Mania, so I'd be surprised if this weren't the case for a few levels at least, especially given Knuckles' different Mirage Saloon Act 2 startpoint.

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23 minutes ago, Gemster312 said:

In Sonic 3 it worked because Knuckles had his own bosses, his own whole level design. To dedicate a whole new "extra path" just for characters who took an alternative boss battle, is so much more work if 90% of players wont experience it.

That only depends on how these alternate routes are implemented, however. Not all hidden alternate routes need to be implemented in an ultra-vague/obscure manner. Otherwise people wouldn't be able to find almost any Giant Rings in Sonic 3&K, let alone the Giant Rings hidden under spikes in Flying Battery or underneath quicksand sandpits placed in the higher routes in Sandopolis.

Honestly, I don't mind the idea of some zones including alternate hidden bosses/exits that aren't tied to character-specific routes (either replacing or in addition to character-exclusive route exits). If anything, I've been hoping for them to be used as an access point for "secret" acts or zones not part of the main campaign (think the secret flagposts that unlock side acts in 2D Mario games). Taxman/Stealth already even experimented with this idea a bit with the remade Hidden Palace Zone in the Sonic 2 mobile remaster--you can only access it by going into what used to be Mystic Cave's notorious spike pit, and completing said zone simply takes you to the next zone in the standard level progression (Metropolis).

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On 3/12/2017 at 3:26 PM, Celestia said:

Speaking of breaking the game--and maybe I've said this before but I feel very strongly about this so--I really hope they bless us with debug mode. I think I spent more time messing with that then actually playing the games when I was younger.

The mobile remasters of Sonic 1 and 2 had debug mode, so the possibility of it being included isn't entirely out of the question.

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One more thing I'm not liking too much...

Is anyone else bothered by how PINK they made Knuckles tone in this game? I like him more on the red side, but I guess it's not terrible... It nags me nonetheless.

(Edit)

Don't get me wrong, still love the S3&K and Chaotix combination going on in design, but do wish he wasn't quite so pink as that's what made his super/hyper form so unique to me too.

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2 hours ago, Chris Knopps said:

One more thing I'm not liking too much...

Is anyone else bothered by how PINK they made Knuckles tone in this game? I like him more on the red side, but I guess it's not terrible... It nags me nonetheless.

(Edit)

Don't get me wrong, still love the S3&K and Chaotix combination going on in design, but do wish he wasn't quite so pink as that's what made his super/hyper form so unique to me too.

I'm fine with it, but I definitely would like it to be a bit more red.

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6 hours ago, TailsBot said:

Something which has peaked my curiosity since Mania's reveal back in July is the new highest route towards the end of act1 of Green Hill. I think if you go as high as possible it will lead to a second high-up exit where you'll fight the mini-boss and then continue into act 2 from a higher-up starting point (Mirage Saloon act2 has two different starting points - one for Sonic & Tails and the other for Knuckles - so I think it's okay to assume other zones will as well).

It's been disappointing that in the many playthroughs we've seen no one has managed to stay on the highest route until the end. Having watched the full act 1 & act 2 continuous playing which Aaron did a commentary on, I now believe my suspicions are correct.

Case in point: I took this screenshot from the video at 1:20, Sonic is just about to go down the tube which takes him lower. However, if you have a keen eye you will notice a yellow spring at the very top of the screen (which you can see has blue sky background around it) which heavily implies there is something up there to explore.

FnXmM5C.png

Now, if you take a look at the video which I have embedded from 1:10. When it gets to 1:18 you'll notice a diagonal placed yellow spring at the (right) top-edge of the loop-de-loop which I believe will propel Sonic, Tails or Knuckles to the spring at 1:20 in my aformetioned screenshot, which will in-turn bounce Sonic higher. As I said, I believe this will lead to a second higher-up exit.

 

At the start of Mania's GH act2 once Sonic has bounced up you can backtrack to what was the original starting point of GH act3 from Sonic 1. Perhaps the theorized higher-up exit in act1 will lead to the original act3 starting point? Or maybe there's an even higher starting point for act2?

So, what do you guys tthink. Is it a good theory?

It *was* a good theory. 

And yes, I did really make an account just to post this.

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2 minutes ago, andrew2 said:

It *was* a good theory. 

And yes, I did really make an account just to post this.

I heard the players call the villain Robotnik, wonder why we can't just have him called Robotnik in this new 2D series and Eggman in the 3D series so everybody wins with that finally?

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1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

I heard the players call the villain Robotnik, wonder why we can't just have him called Robotnik in this new 2D series and Eggman in the 3D series so everybody wins with that finally?

Because his original name is Dr. Eggman anyway. :v Might as well go for consistency now it's established. 

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Just now, Tracker_TD said:

Because his original name is Dr. Eggman anyway. :v Might as well go for consistency now it's established. 

Eh... I just consider it another issue of Japan being "Give us what WE want!" and bawling over it.

I don't MIND the name Eggman mind you, but it would be nice to see both names used OFFICIALLY to some degree again, asides that brush off thing they did in Generations which is as bad as L.O.G. dissing collectathons in Nuts and Bolts.

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3 hours ago, Chris Knopps said:

Eh... I just consider it another issue of Japan being "Give us what WE want!" and bawling over it.

I don't MIND the name Eggman mind you, but it would be nice to see both names used OFFICIALLY to some degree again, asides that brush off thing they did in Generations which is as bad as L.O.G. dissing collectathons in Nuts and Bolts.

They should handle it like they did in the Adventure games. I personally love the name Robotnik. Menacing, but not too serious and it somehow still sounds goofy and fits his personality, not that I mind "Eggman".

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6 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

Eh... I just consider it another issue of Japan being "Give us what WE want!" and bawling over it.

I don't MIND the name Eggman mind you, but it would be nice to see both names used OFFICIALLY to some degree again, asides that brush off thing they did in Generations which is as bad as L.O.G. dissing collectathons in Nuts and Bolts.

Given the considerable Japanese styling the devs are taking with this (evident in quite a few of Sonic's animations, being based on old Japanese Classic artwork, plus all the promo art), it's more likely the devs prefer to stick to the original Japanese canon (being the Sonic superfans they are). It's also evident through the design choices in the game, such as the EggTV banners; I also swear I've seen the classic "EGG" logo seen in Wing Fortress around in Studiopolis, but I can't think exactly where. All stuff that the devs do to tie it into the Classic aesthetic, that wouldn't work with "Robotnik" everywhere (SEGA never localised the ingame graphics for Sonic 1-3)

I prefer them sticking to the original canon anywho. 

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Just now, Chris Knopps said:

Eh... I just consider it another issue of Japan being "Give us what WE want!" and bawling over it.

And yet the English scripts have been allowed to establish that Robotnik is his "real" name and Eggman's his supervillain title. I mean, it isn't brought up very often, but it doesn't really need to be.

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