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Sonic Mania (August 15th 2017, Christian Whitehead, PS4, Xbox One, PC, Switch) - The New Classic


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44 minutes ago, Adamabba said:

Iizuka just said on the aforementioned stream that there will be more Classic levels than new ones.

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On a more serious note, this just makes me more interested in seeing how re-imagined the returning stages really are. While the level retreads are probably the only thing I dislike about Mania, I probably won't be too bothered if the developers ended up throwing some really creative twists into whatever environments we revisit.

I've seen people throw around the idea of exploring the underwater remains of the destroyed Death Egg as an example of a neat re-imagining. Getting a chance to see old levels in that same "familiar, but extremely fresh" kind of nature is definitely something I would be okay with.

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Initially when I heard the classic stages will outnumber the new ones, it felt as though a huge weight just came crashing down on me. But after 10 or 15 minutes I got over it and it doesn't really bother me at all anymore. I'm incredibly excited to see stages from Sonic 3 & K and CD I love with these beautiful crispy new graphics, smooth as eggs 60 fps, and remixed tracks YES please ?!!

Besides, I like to think if this game does well, they may make another, with more original stages, and maybe even an extra character or two like Amy or even Mighty (I'm not gonna let myself get excited about Mighty, but let me tell you the fact Iizuka didn't completely shoot down the idea of Mighty coming back really gets me going) 

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So only Sonic, Tails and Knuckles and more old than new.

Not even surprised, I mean did people really think Mania is going to really push barriers? I mean, I would love to see Amy in a playable form in a Classic game and have new and original stages as well.

But I don't expect any of this to realistically happen for Sonic Mania... 1.

I mean, despite of the bumouts, It's not like this is preventing people of just not buying Mania? Is it

Because if people seriously won't buy Mania because of this then those people are just being unreasonable.

I mean, it's not like Gens 3DS that they're literally pasting Classic levels, design and everything, and give it a modern; pixelated makeover.

I mean, we already saw from Green Hill alone that it's a much bigger stage than the original than it looks; with high paths and it goes to some caverns. Not even Generations did that.

So yeah, this doesn't change anything for me. Not disappointed or excited, I was expecting this.

This is the first attempt of StealthTax and PagodaWest making a Classic Sonic game, you can't expect them to go all out on the first try.

 

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2 minutes ago, Soni said:

This is the first attempt of StealthTax and PagodaWest making a Classic Sonic game, you can't expect them to go all out on the first try.

 

No, that's EXACTLY what I would have expected them to do. Given how much these guys have worked on remakes, have been hyped up by the fanbase as the second coming of the Genesis, I would've expected that their first original take on the series would've been more.... You know... original. But instead we're only getting more nostalgic pandering, and it only adds to the feeling of this being a glorified fangame than being an all new Sonic game.

Especially with Mania being hyped as it is with a $20 price tag retail price tag and with a ridiculous and overblown preorder special edition going for $70, I would've expected more. Why would I get what invokes the feeling of being a romhack, when I could get something that feels more like I'm getting an original Sonic game like, I don't know, Spark the Electric Jester?

I remain unimpressed with Christian Whitehead. He's just far too technical, and not enough of an artist in my opinion. I can tell he's genuinely invested in what he's making, but I'm a romanticist when it comes to Sonic. I want more people like Lake Feperd making Sonic games, because people like him GET the romantic side of Sonic.

 

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Oh yeah, this was also pointed out in the stream.

 

In the Sonic Mania infomercial, if you pay close attention to the Iizuka fan club T-Shirt, the grin on it gets bigger as the video goes on.

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Man you must really want Sonic and Amy to kiss /s

I don't mind more old levels than new levels. If they can bring in old levels that I didn't like and make them better, that'd be awesome. Or improve on stages I did like and make those even better, like Chemical Plant or Marble Gardens or whatever that was called.

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1 hour ago, Soni said:

This is the first attempt of StealthTax and PagodaWest making a Classic Sonic game, you can't expect them to go all out on the first try.

They probably would have tried to go all out if Sega had let them. I believe Stealth implied over on the Retro forums that the whole "returning stages" thing is something Sega wanted them to do.

I mean, it's not like a Mania sequel is guaranteed at this point, so I don't see any reason why a bunch of Sonic fans would decide to play it safe when they finally get a chance to develop an official Sonic game and purposefully hold onto all of their really creative ideas until production on the sequel starts.

1 hour ago, shdowhunt60 said:

I remain unimpressed with Christian Whitehead. He's just far too technical, and not enough of an artist in my opinion.

I suppose it's a good thing that he's more involved with the technical side of Mania then? I'm not sure why you're singling him out when the game is being developed alongside other people as well.

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I'm going to cautiously assume that we're going to get about the standard number of new levels for a classic Sonic (let's say somewhere around 8). If that's the case, I honestly don't mind there being a lot of returning stages.

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2 minutes ago, Tracker_TD said:

You really think it was Whitehead's decision alone to add in all the old levels and stuff? You don't think maybe that was a compromise from SEGA, to tie into the Anniversary? 

I highly doubt that. Even before Whitehead and company were doing official stuff for SEGA, their focus was on copying the Classic games rather than doing anything NEW.

2 minutes ago, Tracker_TD said:

This post's daft anyways (the romantic side of Sonic? Eh?) but I'm not worried. Tiny details like the Marble UFO streetlights and Club SEGA refs in Studiopolis show more than an understanding of art direction and developing an interesting and populated world, and the engine is perfect for Classic Sonic. If Spark the Electric Jester is to your fancy... maybe it's not a Sonic game you're after then? 

It shows that they're fully committed to fanservice. The whole Studiopolis level is basically precisely that. "Oh, look at that popcorn machine thing that we discovered in the level", sit back for a second and imagine someone who's NOT a Sonic fan for a second: who is even going to GET that reference?

And set aside Spark for a second and look at Before and After the sequel. Those games did a better job at creating and presenting a world. Hell, even Freedom Planet looked like it presented a more credible world.

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Whitehead more focused on the technical side of this particular game is a bad thing? Color me surprised.

There's a lot more creative juices flowing up there for ol' Christian than what you may have lead to believe I bet. Besides its not just a one man team with him anymore, and having older levels over newer ones is a SEGA-mandated thing at least they won't be copypasta'd entirely. 

Personally, expected what has been revealed today; doesn't change my outlook on the game any either.

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4 minutes ago, shdowhunt60 said:

It shows that they're fully committed to fanservice. The whole Studiopolis level is basically precisely that. "Oh, look at that popcorn machine thing that we discovered in the level", sit back for a second and imagine someone who's NOT a Sonic fan for a second: who is even going to GET that reference?

If they don't get it, it comes off as something new and fresh. Which is supposedly what you want.

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I'm a bit disappointed by no-new levels, but it's not horribly damning. It does make me hope more fervently that this isn't StealthTax's last classic-Sonic-styled outing, though, and that a game with all new levels by them will come along some day.

No new characters other than those shown doesn't surprise me a tiny bit and doesn't really annoy me at all either. But if StealthTax does make another game, more characters could be fun.

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Disappointed more so about classic trio only than mostly old levels. With the "mostly old levels", maybe we'll get lesser known games like the Game Gear titles and Chaotix. With characters, it seems it's at least better than 2017 (for now), but they will likely appear in the story to soften the blow. Maybe the "new item" is an assist partner to soften it further? 

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Sonic Mania was always going to be a casual buy for me anyway so it doesn't matter too much to me on a personal level. Not to mention, I'm not all too familiar with the Classic stages as I've never been all that in-tune with the Classic titles. 

That said, this news on it's own is still a little lame. We'll have to wait and see if it means something different from what we're all thinking though.

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As long as Hidrocity or Ice Cap are represented, 'SALL GOOD MAN.

Anyways, lets no get all fuzzy about what Iizuka said. So what there are more classic levels? As long as the game is, as a whole, fun and replayable, it's great. Yeah, "rehashes", but I suspect the other returning zones will be DRASTICALLY different, and not a Sonic 4 (ew). Also, if it's already longer than Gens, which takes 3 or so hours to finish, it's already longer than the classics. Most if not all classic games can be beaten in less than 2. And Mania will most likely have a shitload of things besides the main game (trials, time attack, ring attack), a solid story, more than one ending.

And I bet you two, not one, TWO FINGERS, that this "tree" will give more fruits soon enough. Buy this game, buy the shit out of it and believe these guys.

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To be honest, I'm not even surprised that there aren't any more playable characters. Not just because it was explicitly shown who was playable, but because the retro branch as it stands doesn't really have opportunity for it. The only character who's in the retro branch and has potential viability in the standard set-up (so not a villain perspective story) is Amy, but since she wasn't playable in the classic quadrilogy and Sonic Team seem to be reluctant to make her an action girl in that part, she was unlikely anyway. Anyone else simply wasn't and isn't viable. 

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No one should be surprised there aren't more playable characters. I haven't even bothered talking about other playable characters with regards to this game because I knew this was a once in a blue moon situation with regards to even Tails and Knuckles. 

I wouldn't be surprised if we had another decade before this happened again with those two actually. I'm not even joking.

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Well that sort of bummed me out a bit, but not enough to deter me from buying the game; I'm still interested in the level layouts at least. Lack of a new playable characters is nothing new under the sun and I'd take having Tails and Knuckles again than simply defaulting to only Sonic.

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7 minutes ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

I wouldn't be surprised if we had another decade before this happened again with those two actually. I'm not even joking.

I wouldn't go that far, especially if there was a sequel. Tails and Knuckles being playables has been a mainstay in the Taxman games, and them three being playable in explicitly classic games has retro appeal in of itself. 

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