Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[Tani Coyote]

4 minutes ago, Kintor said:

Fortunately then, your nihilistic and self-destructive views

Which is more than can be said for your attitude, when you'd rather destroy the Sonic franchise out of spite.

Dio isn't saying he wants the franchise destroyed out of spite. He's saying that he has no obligation to support it if he doesn't like the games, and feels that the franchise might be better laid to rest if it doesn't increase its quality and appeal. He's entitled to that opinion, and you're entitled to yours.

Anyway, what I'm here for as a moderator: let's avoid making this argument too personal. An easy way to do this is to avoid making assumptions about the other person's character, objectives, etc. Above all, though, remember we're all human beings with emotions behind our usernames and whatever argument we're making; would you want someone accusing you of nihilism or wanting to destroy others' enjoyment out of spite?

[Sega DogTagz]

4 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

I'll admit, I'm lovin' it to death.

 

Before we all go on that McDonald's run, its worth pointing out that BigRedButton was/is a Western company.

 

Both sides have some massive disasters to their credits.

[Chris Knopps]

1 minute ago, Gregg (Ogilvie) said:

Dio isn't saying he wants the franchise destroyed out of spite. He's saying that he has no obligation to support it if he doesn't like the games, and feels that the franchise might be better laid to rest if it doesn't increase its quality and appeal. He's entitled to that opinion, and you're entitled to yours.

Anyway, what I'm here for as a moderator: let's avoid making this argument too personal. An easy way to do this is to avoid making assumptions about the other person's character, objectives, etc. Above all, though, remember we're all human beings with emotions behind our usernames and whatever argument we're making; would you want someone accusing you of nihilism or wanting to destroy others' enjoyment out of spite?

I thought that said employment, I was about to guiltily raise my hand... lol

1 minute ago, Sega DogTagz said:

 

Before we all go on that McDonald's run, its worth pointing out that BigRedButton was/is a Western company.

 

Both sides have some massive disasters to their credits.

I still say it was SEGA of Japan's fault primarily for screwing them over with the sudden exclusivity deal so close to Rise of Lyric's end of development but... That's a song sung so many times it's getting... Meh... Now...

True but I think the greatest number has come from the East but... Could be wrong.

Could be.

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

On another note:

9 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

You're kind of making the conversation borderline personal man...

 

8 minutes ago, Kintor said:

Speaking of which, you should probably tone down that whole east vs west rhetoric. That's just not cool.

If you think someone's actually misbehaving, use the Report button. It's there for a reason. And if you don't think it's actually Report-worthy, you probably shouldn't be talking this way.

[Kintor]

9 minutes ago, Gregg (Ogilvie) said:

Dio isn't saying he wants the franchise destroyed out of spite. He's saying that he has no obligation to support it if he doesn't like the games, and feels that the franchise might be better laid to rest if it doesn't increase its quality and appeal. He's entitled to that opinion, and you're entitled to yours.

Anyway, what I'm here for as a moderator: let's avoid making this argument too personal. An easy way to do this is to avoid making assumptions about the other person's character, objectives, etc. Above all, though, remember we're all human beings with emotions behind our usernames and whatever argument we're making; would you want someone accusing you of nihilism or wanting to destroy others' enjoyment out of spite?

I've been called far worse for wanting to defend the boost gameplay over the years and it doesn't bother me but I see your point  I'll be more careful about making posts that seem too personal in the future.

6 minutes ago, Monkey Destruction Switch said:

On another note:

 

If you think someone's actually misbehaving, use the Report button. It's there for a reason. And if you don't think it's actually Report-worthy, you probably shouldn't be talking this way.

Fair enough.

[Chris Knopps]

3 minutes ago, Monkey Destruction Switch said:

On another note:

 

If you think someone's actually misbehaving, use the Report button. It's there for a reason. And if you don't think it's actually Report-worthy, you probably shouldn't be talking this way.

Eh, wasn't thinking about that at the time. Plus it's safe to assume in the Mania and Forces threads there's a mod here 24/7 at the moment anyways so it's pointing out a sign already practically plastered in mods faces as-is. lol

Has there been any word on the specific names of the smaller enemies seen in the city stage by the way? I know we got a name for the Death Egg robots but don't recall anything on the Wall-E Pawns.

[Sega DogTagz]

1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

True but I think the greatest number has come from the East but... Could be wrong.

Could be.

Numbers wise, you'd probably be correct. But if we utilized percentages, I'd be willing to wager that the ratio of quality to crap games issued by western and eastern teams would probably look shockingly similar.

 

I guess what I'm trying to get at is I don't care who makes the games. I just want them to be good. ^^

 

Between Sega's new found willingness to delay games that aren't ready (Sonic Boom Shattered Crystal and Sonic Mania) and the elongated, AAA development cycle - Forces seems to be free of much of what has been historically dogging the quality 3D Sonic games. Lets see what they will have to show for it.

[Chris Knopps]

Just now, Sega DogTagz said:

Numbers wise, you'd probably be correct. But if we utilized percentages, I'd be willing to wager that the ratio of quality to crap games issued by western and eastern teams would probably look shockingly similar.

 

I guess what I'm trying to get at is I don't care who makes the games. I just want them to be good. ^^

 

Between Sega's new found willingness to delay games that aren't ready (Sonic Boom Shattered Crystal and Sonic Mania) and the elongated, AAA development cycle - Forces seems to be free of much of what has been historically dogging the quality 3D Sonic games. Lets see what they will have to show for it.

Ehhhhhhh....

What... DID that delay do for Shattered Crystal...?

I still think that was just a delay for the sake of delaying...

Totally get what you mean using Mania as an example though.

[FriendBot]

2 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

Has there been any word on the specific names of the smaller enemies seen in the city stage by the way? I know we got a name for the Death Egg robots but don't recall anything on the Wall-E Pawns.

Pretty sure those are Buzz Bombers, similar look and color scheme. Just more intimidating I guess?

[blazefan519]

1 minute ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Numbers wise, you'd probably be correct. But if we utilized percentages, I'd be willing to wager that the ratio of quality to crap games issued by western and eastern teams would probably look shockingly similar.

 

I guess what I'm trying to get at is I don't care who makes the games. I just want them to be good. ^^

 

Between Sega's new found willingness to delay games that aren't ready (Sonic Boom Shattered Crystal and Sonic Mania) and the elongated, AAA development cycle - Forces seems to be free of much of what has been historically dogging the quality 3D Sonic games. Lets see what they will have to show for it.

It was Fire and Ice that was delayed, not Shattered Crystal. But I agree with you wholeheartedly. As long as I'm playing a good game, who develops it doesn't matter to me.

[Chris Knopps]

Just now, Soni said:

Pretty sure those are Buzz Bombers, similar look and color scheme. Just more intimidating I guess?

No no, not those, I mean the white Egg Pawns, do they have a new name or is it just Egg Pawns still?

[blazefan519]

1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

Ehhhhhhh....

What... DID that delay do for Shattered Crystal...?

I still think that was just a delay for the sake of delaying...

Totally get what you mean using Mania as an example though.

They delayed Fire and Ice, and in an interview they said that they were given the option to delay the game even though it was ready so that they could further polish it and make it look better.

[FriendBot]

Oh, I don't think they're white; just a faint shade of orange. So I'm guessing they are Egg Pawns.

But no official confirmation from them.

[Sega DogTagz]

1 minute ago, blazefan519 said:

It was Fire and Ice that was delayed, not Shattered Crystal. But I agree with you wholeheartedly. As long as I'm playing a good game, who develops it doesn't matter to me.

Fire and Ice and Shattered Crystal were practically the same game

Whoops, minor oversight there. Thanks for the correction.

[Chris Knopps]

1 minute ago, blazefan519 said:

They delayed Fire and Ice, and in an interview they said that they were given the option to delay the game even though it was ready so that they could further polish it and make it look better.

Ooohhh...

Just now, Sega DogTagz said:

Fire and Ice and Shattered Crystal were practically the same game

Whoops, minor oversight there. Thanks for the correction.

Same here.

I wouldn't say they were practically the same game by any means though. Although it can still be said that I fail to see what the year long delay did for the game in the long run since by and large it doesn't look too different, some backgrounds look outright terrible and the compression was just sickening.

Not to mention the stage designs/progression made zero sense...

The game is like, half Sonic 3, then goes into some weird Sonic version of a Disney game...

[blazefan519]

2 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

Ooohhh...

Same here.

I wouldn't say they were practically the same game by any means though. Although it can still be said that I fail to see what the year long delay did for the game in the long run since by and large it doesn't look too different, some backgrounds look outright terrible and the compression was just sickening.

Not to mention the stage designs/progression made zero sense...

The game is like, half Sonic 3, then goes into some weird Sonic version of a Disney game...

I believe the main thing they changed was fully voice acted and animated cutscenes, with some slight enhancements to the backgrounds, but that was it really. Nothing all that major.

[Chris Knopps]

Anyone post this yet?

 

[Kintor]

Alright! Time for a bit of mood-whiplash!

Let's change the tone of this thread and talk about the Chao Garden!

V-pets are a quintessentially 90s idea and I love them. Once Tamagotchi became an insane hit everybody wanted to make a V-pet product of their own. Sega and Sonic Team were no exception, intergrating Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2 with a sophisticated 'A-Life' system they called Chao.

It's been quite some time since we've had a real Chao Garden. That glorified gallery in Sonic Chronicles doesn't count. But with Sonic Forces can the Chao make a real come back?

Just think of what Chao could mean with 2017 technology: achievements for breeding rare Chao, the ability to instantly share images and video of Chao across social media, smartphone apps to replicate the Dreamcast VMU's Chao Adventure minigame. All made possible through items collected and other progress made in the main game of Sonic Forces.

[RictalRose0]

I don't know dudes but Nakamura did say our perception would change once we saw a new trailer, whatever that means...

[Salamander]

At this point we're more likely to get Wisp Garden.

[Ajavalo]

Whoa whoa, what's happened while I wasn't here?! Last time I was with it, the boost gameplay wasn't nearly as bad as what I'm reading here!

[BlueFlare]

 

Anyone else wishing for some sort of hub areas like Unleashed has? For me, aside from the actual story, content like this is really a big plus. Maybe there could be a chao garden type of mini game included in a hub area. Chances are those won't probably happen , but I would greatly enjoy wandering in a place like Adabat's hub.

[RictalRose0]

Oh yeah I would love to see the return of Hubworlds. They always added that little extra to the world and it's people. It was one of my favorite parts of Unleashed. Would be rather interesing to see if there could be a Hubworld for Eggman's apocalyptic like world.

[JezMM]

7 hours ago, Kintor said:

Sonic Team will be fine though, they'll keep making new expansions for Phantasy Start Online 2.

Just so you're in the know, Sonic Team has nothing to do with PSO2, it's a common assumption because they made the original PSO, but they've been pretty ball-and-chain'd to the Sonic franchise for over a decade now.  If you knew that and were just implying the staff would be moved over there then fair enough.

7 hours ago, Kintor said:

You need to be realistic - no more profits for Sega means no more Sonic games for us. You're right in a way though, people realise when they're being sold crap. That's why few bought Lost World on the Wii U or it's later PC ports. That's why even less bought Sonic Boom, except in a handful of games when purchases were made ironically for YouTube fodder. However, people did really like Sonic Generations, Sega sold a ton of copies and it's been selling strongly ever since on digital markets, especially the PC version through Steam. This is why we've seen Sonic Forces being made as another boost game, Sega intends to replicate the profitable success of Sonic Generations by including the boost now.

See I feel the reasons Generations did so well has far more to do with the nostalgia angle than the boost gameplay.  Most reviewers praised either both equally OR leant towards preferring the side-scrolling.  I feel it's only really within the fanbase that people praise the modern Sonic gameplay as the best part of the game.

Unleashed, obviously had a very mixed reception, most people loving the daytime gameplay COMPARED to the Werehog but also often finding it too fast and unfair etc.  Also the important context that it was a bit step in a better direction after 2006.

And while Sonic Colours was also a success, it can't be ignored that THAT was a boost game that severely neutered everything that Unleashed introduced, focusing instead on fun-but-misguided blocky 2D platforming and power-ups and an overall reduced difficulty and lack of focus on speedy 3D platforming that I personally don't want to see again.  And like Unleashed being considered favourably after 2006, Colours was considered favourable for it's lack of Werehog.

 

That is to say I feel there isn't enough evidence to suggest that any of the boost games are beloved BECAUSE of the boost.  They all have too much extra baggage to assume their success came from the boost gameplay at it's core.  Even now I'm seeing LOTS of articles that are praising Forces simply because it's not Lost World or Boom again.  Praising it with full awareness that SEGA is not so much doing great things but "it's good to see them taking the only direction so far that's actually somewhat worked" without being particularly escatic for it either.

 

As said, maybe this'll be the boost game that changes everyone's minds, but we still need to remember that likely only 50%, or possibly even 33.3%, is gonna be boost gameplay anyway, so even this one isn't gonna have boost gameplay judged in a vacuum.  We're still dealing with a franchise whose flagship platforming style is the inability to settle on one.

[Detective Kaito]

5 hours ago, RictalRose0 said:

I don't know dudes but Nakamura did say our perception would change once we saw a new trailer, whatever that means...

Going by this and what IGN said about the game, I think it's safe to assume that the whole dark and edgy tone of this game is a fluke and only the first level has the tone I mentioned. Can't wait for more Baldy McNosehair jokes.

please let the people who wrote sonic unleashed write the story for this game