Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[Zippo]

24 minutes ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

Because isn't that what being a Sonic fan is all about right now? Feeling like you're in danger of being fucked over ALL of the time?

If you're hyped for Mania like many of us are, then in that particular case, no. We have pretty much nothing to worry about when it comes to quality of that. For the first time in ages, it's a Sonic game where we can be 100% confident that the game is in the absolute best hands possible, and is guaranteed to be great, at the very least. You can take that to the bank. 

[Indigo Rush]

I always find the dichotomy between the Forces thread and the Mania thread to be intriguing, if not telling. I know the demographic of these forums tend to lean towards the more seasoned Sonic fans (be it retro fans, modern fans, general fans, whatever), but the fact that one game is so universally anticipated with glee (rare exceptions aside, and even then most just say "it'll probably be good, just not for me") while the other is met with overwhelming skepticism at best, and relentless doom-saying at worst (I'm super guilty of this, sorry y'all) is just disconcerting.

This is not the kind of split I want to see in the fanbase. Do you know how much I await the day where the divide isn't "this game is better than the other based off of the quality of work being put into them" and is instead "this game will be better for me because it caters to this style of Sonic." It would have been so wonderful if Forces really was just a run-of-the-mill Boost game with iterative improvements in control and scope, without any alternate gameplay baggage weighing it down. Even if it isn't the Sonic game I want, I wouldn't feel the need to say much more than the usual "not my kind of Sonic game, I wish they'd try something like Utopia but oh well," but instead I'm banging my head against the keyboard over how they're butchering the style of gameplay I actually really care about. Again. Since 2010.

If Classic Sonic wasn't in Sonic Forces and it was just another Modern Sonic alone romp, I wouldn't be here right now, I'd be content.

Like... every chance they get, they manage to find some new way to annoy me with this game. At first it was "oh, it's looking edgy, not my style but wha-" and then "-wait why is Classic Sonic here we have Mania" and then, "wow they did NOTHING to improve the level design from the earlier iterations of Modern Sonic," and "WISPS AGAIN?" then, "GREEN HILL AGAIN," then "they managed to find a way to miss the point of Classic Sonic's gameplay style even more, what's with the boosters and bottomless pits," and followed shortly by, "are they seriously introducing a dumb self-insertion fan-character creator (you can't convince me that this isn't that, that silhouette is too basic and that one post was far too accurate)" and now, "they can't even get the music right."

"They can't even get the music right."

Every time something about this game gets revealed, it just makes it worse for me. This is like, the opposite of the lead-up to Generations.

Guys I'm so tired of being angry about Sonic games.

When Rise of Lyric was revealed and during the lead-up to it's release, every time something got revealed, I became less and less excited to the point to where I thought it was genuinely funny how they could mess up a game this much. 

Sonic Forces stopped being funny, like, day one.

[Radiant Hero Ike]

I just like blasting through robots at the speed of sound. I'd like if that were the only thing I could do in Forces. But I'm not too bothered by Classic Sonic being in. The 3rd style, I dunno. I'll have to see that for myself, I just hope it's not beat em up style.

Well, regardless, it seems to me that this Sonic game is kind of... Experimental? But at the same time they want to play it safe. Like, for example, maybe they want this third style to be something they can use for later games, but they're too scared to use it on its own, so they have Modern and Classic Sonic gameplay as well.

I could be totally wrong, but there's gotta be some reason they'd keep the third style so secret. It just seems like it's something they don't want to risk a full game on to me.

[Diogenes]

Lost World was experimental, Forces is safe to the point of cowardice. That they might be doing something new with the third gameplay style doesn't override how stale the other 2/3 is. And at this point I'm betting that it's not going to be some new kind of gameplay anyway, just some variant of either Classic or Modern (or maybe some weird awkward mashup of the two), and the big secret is just that there's a character creator.

[Celestia]

Honestly I'm still leaning positive towards this game, I'm fairly confident it'll be fun for someone with my tastes. There's things that bother me--I'd prefer Classic Sonic not be here, and also that GHZ music just straight up sucks--but other than that I don't think it's a huge step back from Generations. It's not really a step forward, either, so I totally understand the general reactions so far, but eh. I'm excited to see more, for whatever that's worth. I just don't have much energy to actively post about the game since the doom and gloom gets really old and I can't exactly ignore peoples' posts, for obvious reasons.

I'm not even upset by the idea of creating a character, except from the angle of "I want to play as the pre-existing characters who are right there," but that's more an issue of what it isn't than what it is (if it's true, anyway).

[Radiant Hero Ike]

I'm all for a character creator. But I don't want that character's gameplay to be Werehog or Boom esque. I don't know what a mix of Classic and Modern could even be, either (Classic Sonic with homing attack exists already and that really wouldn't make much of a change).

I'm hoping for something at least similar to the Adventure games. But uh, despite me being very positive about Sonic games, I can't say I'm not worried that they'll do some other kind of weird new style, like Sonic Lost World's. I didn't dislike SLW, but it's not a game I want to play through again. Parkour is a fun concept but I don't think it worked with the level design that game had (like... Blocky).

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

Same. For someone like me I am excited about this game. This game pretty much fits my standards perfectly when it comes to graphics and gameplay. Classic Sonic looks more berable than Generations. 

However I do wish they would make a product that would unite all Sonic fans that fans both new and old can enjoy. 

[StaticMania]

1 minute ago, Miki said:

Classic Sonic looks more berable than Generations. 

How can you tell? The level design doesn't show off his control all that well.

[Solly]

3 minutes ago, Radiant Hero Ike said:

I could be totally wrong, but there's gotta be some reason they'd keep the third style so secret. 

I think this is just SEGA being dumb with reveals. They always start off by showing us something familiar or safe-looking, and then the game's "catch" that makes it immediately distinguished from other games shows up much later. It generates discussion, for sure, but I think it's annoying how long they're willing to leave people in the dark over what could be a major part of the game. 

So I guess I wouldn't say that they have a real reason to keep it secret other than "this is just how they go about business." I agree that it could turn out to be an experiment, though. They emphasized that it will 'bridge' the modern and classic styles IIRC, so whatever they create could be used in the future if it's popular. 

2 minutes ago, Celestia said:

Honestly I'm still leaning positive towards this game, I'm fairly confident it'll be fun for someone with my tastes. There's things that bother me--I'd prefer Classic Sonic not be here, and also that GHZ music just straight up sucks--but other than that I don't think it's a huge step back from Generations. It's not really a step forward, either, but eh. I'm excited to see more, for whatever that's worth. I just don't have much energy to actively post about the game since the doom and gloom gets really old and I can't exactly ignore peoples' posts, for obvious reasons.

I'm not even upset by the idea of creating a character, except from the angle of "I want to play as the pre-existing characters who are right there," but that's more an issue of what it isn't than what it is (if it's true, anyway).

Yeah, for as much as I'm willing to criticize the game's direction, I'm still looking forward to it and I'm sure I'll have fun playing it. Nothing really looks outright bad about it, to me. 

[D.K.]

I'm going to copy and paste what I said in a PM conversation with Blue Blood.

Quote

My philosophy with modern Sonic games is that, if the game itself is fun and plays well, I can look past the bad story or poor decisions and do the same thing I do with the Genesis games - Play the game for the levels themselves, and nothing else. If the game itself isn't fun and plays bad, then it's a bad Sonic game.

After 5 long years of mediocre spinoff after mediocre spinoff, I've lost all reason to care about anything in a Sonic game other than fun factor and execution. Good writing and storytelling is just a nice bonus in between levels. I'm fine with Classic Sonic's inclusion as long as he's fun to play as, with Wisps coming back as long as they're fun to use, and with Green Hill 2: Suburban Boogaloo as long as it's fun to speedrun.

The gameplay itself is what I play a Sonic game for and will make or break my enjoyment with it, and while the game so far is full of stupid decisions, I'm sure that I'll enjoy the levels for what they're worth.

[Bobnik]

I guess I'm in somewhat of a minority here, because I still liked what I saw of this game, because I already lowered my expectations about Classic Sonic to the ground after the CG trailer. Sure, Classic should not have been here at all, but I'm not going full negative on this game because of his existence. Modern Sonic comes back with boost formula, which IMO they should've done after Generations. I know I'll have fun with these 2 gameplay styles. Now the 3rd style might be a make or break for me - if it is something that I'd consider fitting for the franchise (aka not fishing in SA1, mech stages and treasure hunting in SA2 or beat-em-up or tubes and sausages as stages) and is fun to play, then it'll be okay for me.

 

...I just don't want to see Lost World gameplay, cuz that was NOT fun at all. Thankfully, I'm not seeing it here. (for now)

[JosepHenry]

I'm also really excited for this game, as much as I am excited for Mania, that game will be just a delicious snack before lunch. I treat 2D games like that, I like 3D games more.

But, Forces as said before, is giving all kinds of bad impressions. I was hoping a bit of plot showing Sonic's friends, Classic Sonic in a place that isn't Green Hill Zone (And look what I got) and beautiful music (AGAIN, look what I got.)

That's why I hope E3 is the Zelda E3 2016 of Sonic Forces. A trailer, all three characters shown, a playable demo, more music, artwork, all kinds of stuff.

Is like they want to show the worst first, and I gotta tell you, that's dumb.

[Blue Blood]

7 minutes ago, Solly said:

Yeah, for as much as I'm willing to criticize the game's direction, I'm still looking forward to it and I'm sure I'll have fun playing it. Nothing really looks outright bad about it, to me. 

Except that Green Hill music. Eeeeeeeeeesh!

When I say that Forces looks bad, unappealing, lazy etc etc, I'm only really talking about in comparison to the rest of the series as a pretty seasoned fan. I'm sure I'll get some enjoyment out of this game. The Modern levels and the Classic levels in Generations were fun, afterall. It was an overall solid experience. It's the lack of confidence that SEGA have in themselves, non-existent development of ideas and complacency in execution that make me dislike the game so much. It's six years since Generations. Instead of building on it, they're just doing it all again without doing much to make it better. And in many ways, it's failing to accomplish what you would reasonably expect from it when you place it next to the indie-developed-but-officially-endorsed Mania. That's bad.

[Zippo]

33 minutes ago, Celestia said:

Honestly I'm still leaning positive towards this game, I'm fairly confident it'll be fun for someone with my tastes. There's things that bother me--I'd prefer Classic Sonic not be here, and also that GHZ music just straight up sucks--but other than that I don't think it's a huge step back from Generations. It's not really a step forward, either, so I totally understand the general reactions so far, but eh. I'm excited to see more, for whatever that's worth. I just don't have much energy to actively post about the game since the doom and gloom gets really old and I can't exactly ignore peoples' posts, for obvious reasons.

I'm not even upset by the idea of creating a character, except from the angle of "I want to play as the pre-existing characters who are right there," but that's more an issue of what it isn't than what it is (if it's true, anyway).

This sums up my thoughts perfectly. I want more than what's being offered, sure, but not fixing what isn't broken doesn't bother me too much. Waiting with baited breath to see how Modern Sonic and this new character is going to turn out. 

[Roboat06]

12 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

Except that Green Hill music. Eeeeeeeeeesh!

Yep. I totally agree.

Which is worse: Roger Craig Smith or Green Hill music in Forces?

[Diogenes]

Just now, Roboat06 said:

Which is worse: Roger Craig Smith or Green Hill music in Forces?

Trying to pose that as a difficult question, as if RCS is a bad VA.

[Zippo]

5 minutes ago, Roboat06 said:

Yep. I totally agree.

Which is worse: Roger Craig Smith or Green Hill music in Forces?

Wow. This is uh...yeah.

Roger Craig Smith is the best Sonic we've ever had. In my opinion of course. 

[Roboat06]

Just now, Diogenes said:

Trying to pose that as a difficult question, as if RCS is a bad VA.

Yeah, I actually like Roger, but I'm asking that because I know most people hate him.

[Blue Blood]

2 minutes ago, Roboat06 said:

Which is worse: Roger Craig Smith or Green Hill music in Forces?

I think I'd prefer to hear Roger humming the original Green Hill theme as background music than listen to any iteration of the Forces Green Hill theme.

[Scar]

18 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

Except that Green Hill music. Eeeeeeeeeesh!

When I say that Forces looks bad, unappealing, lazy etc etc, I'm only really talking about in comparison to the rest of the series as a pretty seasoned fan. I'm sure I'll get some enjoyment out of this game. The Modern levels and the Classic levels in Generations were fun, afterall. It was an overall solid experience. It's the lack of confidence that SEGA have in themselves, non-existent development of ideas and complacency in execution that make me dislike the game so much. It's six years since Generations. Instead of building on it, they're just doing it all again without doing much to make it better. And in many ways, it's failing to accomplish what you would reasonably expect from it when you place it next to the indie-developed-but-officially-endorsed Mania. That's bad.

This is where I'm at.

It'll be a fun game. It just won't be a great game, and lord knows I want this franchise to produce a great game. And I mean a truly great game that stands the test of time. None of this SA1/2/Colours/Generations type of great that turns out to not be so great after a few years.

Also, I'm not going to write off the music this early. That weird Green Hill Music aside, I think it'll have a pretty good OST.

[Solly]

8 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

Except that Green Hill music. Eeeeeeeeeesh!

When I say that Forces looks bad, unappealing, lazy etc etc, I'm only really talking about in comparison to the rest of the series as a pretty seasoned fan. I'm sure I'll get some enjoyment out of this game. The Modern levels and the Classic levels in Generations were fun, afterall. It was an overall solid experience. It's the lack of confidence that SEGA have in themselves, non-existent development of ideas and complacency in execution that make me dislike the game so much. It's six years since Generations. Instead of building on it, they're just doing it all again without doing much to make it better. And in many ways, it's failing to accomplish what you would reasonably expect from it when you place it next to the indie-developed-but-officially-endorsed Mania. That's bad.

I said nothing looks bad. I didn't say anything about how it sounds. 

I agree with pretty much all of your other points, though.

Also there are people who still think Sonic shouldn't talk, but Roger being widely disliked anywhere would be news to me. He's great, both as Sonic and in his other work. 

[Zippo]

5 minutes ago, Roboat06 said:

Yeah, I actually like Roger, but I'm asking that because I know most people hate him.

Really? I haven't heard many complaints about him at all, besides the fact that he didn't shut up in Rise of Lyric, but then again, no one ever shuts up in Rise of Lyric. 

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

I'd perfer to hear Silver saying "it's no use" more than the GHZ music 

[Meta77]

Calling it now forces will be a mostly 6 or 7 game. All we can do is wait

[Dr. Detective]

2 hours ago, Zippo said:

If you're hyped for Mania like many of us are, then in that particular case, no. We have pretty much nothing to worry about when it comes to quality of that. For the first time in ages, it's a Sonic game where we can be 100% confident that the game is in the absolute best hands possible, and is guaranteed to be great, at the very least. You can take that to the bank. 

Lucky you. It must be nice to be hyped for Mania. It's not for me.