Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[Kintor]

1 hour ago, Nepenthe said:

You keep missing the point that mockery of Sonic OCs as a concept is not limited to meme culture. Gamers and Sonic fans alike take stock in this shit as an indicator in quality. OCs and deviantART culture do not have a good reputation to the masses, and Sonic is the poster child for this shit.

OCs and deviantArt are the masses, that vast underbelly of Internet culture that still comprises  some of the most resolutely loyal Sonic fans you'll find anywhere. This push to ostracise anybody with an OC avatar or a fan character in their sig was never feasible. It only alienates large parts of the Sonic fanbase and won't do anything to appease those who blindly hate Sonic fans anyway. At least now, with an official character creator, those Sonic fans interested in OCs can again take pride in their creativity.

[StaticMania]

OCs are mocked because they typically weren't creative though...

[CleverSonicUsername]

1 minute ago, StaticMania said:

OCs are mocked because they typically weren't creative though...

I mean the trailer showed you can put a scouter on your original character, and it doesn't get much more creatively bankrupt than that.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

Kintor, buddy, stop. You're actually wrong here. Those are the definition of a vocal minority, the reason the fandom gets a bad rep, and any fandom does, is a vocal minority. You think all Steven Universe fans tell artists to kill themselves because someone drew Rose too thin? No. That's the logic of the idiots who aren't going to bother with a series based on shallow impressions of fandoms anyway.

 

[Nepenthe]

5 minutes ago, Kintor said:

OCs and deviantArt are the masses, that vast underbelly of Internet culture that still comprises  some of the most resolutely loyal Sonic fans you'll find anywhere. This push to ostracise anybody with an OC avatar or a fan character in thrir avatar was never feasible. 

I have three Sonic OCs that I still use in roleplays to this day.

I have never felt unheard or ignored because Sega never gave me the option to actually use them in a game until now. And I would imagine most people with OCs feel the same, because they have the good sense to keep their fiction to themselves.

The people who you're talking about- some random swathe of people who actually feel entitled to use Suck The Cock in a game just because they made him up themselves, and on top of this do not actually buy Sonic games as a result- cannot possibly comprise any notable demographic worth chasing.

If they do, I wanna see some fucking numbers. Or articles. Or previous mentions from Sega that these people exist in large enough numbers to give a damn about. Fucking SA3 has been asked for more than this and we still haven't gotten that shit yet.

[Chris Knopps]

6 minutes ago, Kintor said:

OCs and deviantArt are the masses, that vast underbelly of Internet culture that still comprises  some of the most resolutely loyal Sonic fans you'll find anywhere. This push to ostracise anybody with an OC avatar or a fan character in thrir avatar was never feasible. It only alienates large parts of the Sonic fanbase and won't do anything to appease those who blindly hate Sonic fans anyway. At least now, with an official character creator, those Sonic fans interested in OCs can again take pride in their creativity.

You know what...?

I'm givin' the kid this one. That's a statement I can actually appreciate in a way.

[Tyranno]

The weird, bizarre shit Sonic is "known for" is present in every fandom. Dragon Ball. Digimon. Pokemon. Marvel comics. Everybody.

Sonic gets highlighted a lot because it exists in this intersection of furry fandom and young children, which are all things that people on the internet think are totally cool and original things to mock. Combine that with specifically targeting a few people who legitimately have mental issues, this whole stigma is steeped in a lot of unfortunate things that the fandom continues to perpetuate.

That, in my opinion, is much worse and deserving of negative stigma than a bunch of "uncreative" OCs that are predominately created by children.

[Chris Knopps]

7 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

I have three Sonic OCs that I still use in roleplays to this day.

I have never felt unheard or ignored because Sega never gave me the option to actually use them in a game until now. And I would imagine most people with OCs feel the same, because they have the good sense to keep their fiction to themselves.

The people who you're talking about- some random swathe of people who actually feel entitled to use Suck The Cock in a game just because they made him up themselves, and on top of this do not actually buy Sonic games as a result- cannot possibly comprise any notable demographic worth chasing.

If they do, I wanna see some fucking numbers. Or articles. Or previous mentions from Sega that these people exist in large enough numbers to give a damn about. Fucking SA3 has been asked for more than this and we still haven't gotten that shit yet.

I get the problems with everything going on right now but isn't that a little bit much/harsh man?

Have some tea, get a tasty burger, enjoy the sun or the stars depending on the time.

With the custom character likely being the thing for the next few days/weeks it's worth bringing up the potential for the two versions of SONIC to gain custom outfits too. I doubt they'd reserve that just for the OC character himself.

If they do, THAT is definitely wasted potential.

[blazefan519]

Ayy, wondering when someone would do this.

[Chris Knopps]

2 minutes ago, blazefan519 said:

Ayy, wondering when someone would do this.

It'd be nice if SEGA would commit to the concepts and/or tone the game is trying to set up to market it like that.

Gotta keep that lightheartedness in tact though.

[blazefan519]

Just now, Chris Knopps said:

It'd be nice if SEGA would commit to the concepts and/or tone the game is trying to set up to market it like that.

Gotta keep that lightheartedness in tact though.

Uh...okay then, mate. The tone seems just fine if you ask me. I mean, yeah, Green Hill is there with it's happy music, but it's most likely the starting stage, if that's what you're going on about.

[Nepenthe]

6 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

I get the problems with everything going on right now but isn't that a little bit much/harsh man?

No.

We've gotten to the point where we're entertaining this as an actual net positive for both the game and the franchise because maybe ten people demanded Sega do it at the risk of no buy.

Meanwhile me and hundreds if not thousands of over people can't even get Tails, Knuckles, or Shadow as playable characters in a 3D game back and we've been screaming at them for years about this.

This shit is stupid.

[Sonictrainer]

Landing and Explosion Gifs by Sonic Gifs on Tumblr

 

[CleverSonicUsername]

1 minute ago, Nepenthe said:

This shit is stupid.

But you can make a cat and put glasses on the cat and

[Chris Knopps]

3 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

No.

We've gotten to the point where we're entertaining this as an actual net positive for both the game and the franchise because maybe ten people demanded Sega do it at the risk of no buy.

Meanwhile me and hundreds if not thousands of over people can't even get Tails, Knuckles, or Shadow as playable characters in a 3D game back and we've been screaming at them for years about this.

This shit is stupid.

Well, there's still Sonic Runners Adventure now that I think about it, so we've got Mania and that at the very least.

Though you don't fancy Mania too much either...

So perhaps Runners Adventure will be more your cup of tea.

It's hard to understand why you'd dislike Mania though when it's delivering what you want, just in a pixelated 2D manner from the way I see it...

Still, we'll just have to see how that mobile game turns out.

[Tyranno]

They're not doing this because it's something "people asked for", either.

They're doing it because customizable characters are something a lot of games have utilized and it's an easy to grow a game conceptually and add elements that diversify an experience and give players an opportunity to put themselves into a character's shoes.

The worst thing Sonic Team could do is do something people "have asked for", given this fandom is a hot mess of contradictory and often ill informed voices that are focused more on where the franchise has been than where it could go.

Sonic Mania is their response to what people have "asked for". "Forces" is them building on something that was already successful with a new idea that they saw working elsewhere and wanted to try themselves. That's all there is to it.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

I don't see why for so long we've been screaming that ST listens to none of their fans and somehow now this new thing is based on them listening to the wrong fans. If anything, this is proof ST's still just doing whatever the fuck they feel like, since if anything otherwise had actually been the case, this would have come much earlier and with entirely different presentation.

And also, y'know, this can't have turned anyone away from the game.

Because anyone who wasn't going to buy this already decided due to something else.

You can't look at a game like this, think "yeah that's great!" for six months and then suddenly decide "fuck no I'm not doing that" just because of an avatar-creation system that doesn't even play that different from the rest of the game.

And if it's about fanbase/franchise reputation? Then who the fuck cares? Nobody would stop hating Sonic or it's fandom if this wasn't a thing.

[Kintor]

20 minutes ago, Razorsaw said:

The weird, bizarre shit Sonic is "known for" is present in every fandom. Dragon Ball. Digimon. Pokemon. Marvel comics. Everybody.

Sonic gets highlighted a lot because it exists in this intersection of furry fandom and young children, which are all things that people on the internet think are totally cool and original things to mock. Combine that with specifically targeting a few people who legitimately have mental issues, this whole stigma is steeped in a lot of unfortunate things that the fandom continues to perpetuate.

That, in my opinion, is much worse and deserving of negative stigma than a bunch of "uncreative" OCs that are predominately created by children.

I agree with sentiment. I'm part of many different fanbases such as Digimon and Transformers, to mention a couple of relevant examples. In that time I've seen some truly terrible things and I've akso seen some wonderful expressions of fan creativity. Yet nothing I've seen in those fanbases is any less extreme then what happens in the Sonic fanbase. The reputation around Sonic OCs is completely overblown.

[CleverSonicUsername]

1 minute ago, Razorsaw said:

The worst thing Sonic Team could do is do something people "have asked for",

Yes, recognizing what consumers want is a very poor idea. If they caved to player's expectations we'd get shit like Sonic Mania, and who would want that???

[Nepenthe]

1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

Well, there's still Sonic Runners Adventure now that I think about it, so we've got Mania and that at the very least.

Though you don't fancy Mania too much either...

So perhaps Runners Adventure will be more your cup of tea.

It's hard to understand why you'd dislike Mania though when it's delivering what you want, just in a pixelated 2D manner from the way I see it...

Still, we'll just have to see how that mobile game turns out.

I don't care to play anymore Sonic games that use the classic style. Nothing wrong with it; I'm burnt out. I played these games for years and I've no desire to play another.

I also have no desire to settle for a mobile game.

I want a console Sonic game that is:

• Mostly 3D in graphics and movement (no 2.5D).
• Features members of the established present secondary cast in significant playable and narrative roles again (no Classic Sonic or OCs)
• Utilizes a cleaned-up basic action gameplay style with rolling elements like Adventure did 19 damn years ago.
• Isn't written by Pontaff or leans primarily towards comedy in narrative.

Four simple-ass parameters. Despite what people say about Sonic fans, I know exactly what I want and would be quite easy to please with this.

[Tyranno]

5 minutes ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

Yes, recognizing what consumers want is a very poor idea. If they caved to player's expectations we'd get shit like Sonic Mania, and who would want that???

Sonic Mania hits the lowest common denominator (read, this is not a bad thing) of what multiple, myriad things a lot of what fans have clamored for, but it's also failed to succeed at pleasing everybody. I'm not saying that you should ignore expectations or feedback, I'm saying that "what fans have asked for" is far from being a single unified idea that everyone can unite behind. You have to pick and choose between what people have been saying and one's own judgements and new ideas.

[Nepenthe]

1 minute ago, Razorsaw said:

Sonic Mania hits the lowest common denominator (read, this is not a bad thing) of what multiple, myriad things a lot of what fans have clamored for, but it's also failed to succeed at pleasing everybody.

The thing is, no one is asking for Sega to please 100% of the potential customer base.

[Tyranno]

3 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

Four simple-ass parameters. Despite what people say about Sonic fans, I know exactly what I want and would be quite easy to please with this.

What's simple is how you boiled them down and your own admittance that it would be easy to please you with it, not that their implementation would themselves be easy and simple, and I have my doubts that it'd please the majority of people.

Adventure itself is a game I adore, but it has its share of half baked and unrefined gameplay elements that were difficult to build off over a decade ago, let alone picking it up again ages later.

[blazefan519]

Oi, so I had been doing some digging in the trailers and apparently you can choose Tails' shoes and Amy's shoes. So I guess you actually can recreate the characters, in a way. Would've preferred the real thing though.

[Chris Knopps]

1 minute ago, Nepenthe said:

The thing is, no one is asking for Sega to please 100% of the potential customer base.

Here's my solution...

Classic series for Classic fans - Starting with Mania

Adventure series for Adventure fans

Whatever for Whatever - Starting with Forces