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Classic and Modern - More than just a Stylistic Choice

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I prefer to think of them as one in the same, personally. Then again, I used to think Paper Mario was just a stylistic choice, rather than a separate character/world.

By that same token, though, if setting them up as more distinct individuals means we can get more Classic Sonic stuff like Sonic Mania, I'm all for it. Heck, I was all for using Classic Sonic separately for 2D games after Sonic Generations.

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I feel like when people try to claim that modern Sonic diverged too hard from classic Sonic to be considered the same, its an unfair assessment. 

Sonic is a character subject to constant evolution since the very first game, with an art style and set of character designs that were always getting tweaked and featuring some specific quirk. Sonic 1, 2, CD, and 3K for example are all considered probably the most consistent era in the series, and even they wildly differ in visual, musical and presentation style.

Maybe they didn't go far off the deep end like some later titles did, but i dont think that makes any difference to what design is used. The beginnings of the modern designs (1998 - 2002) featured gameplay mechanics and some visual flair in the Adventure and Advance titles that were undoubtedly a continuation of the original games, making the disconnect only even more pointless.

The positive of having of a classic side series is that fans get to breathe new life into the core gameplay of the originals and remind people looking back why the series became so beloved in the first place, while the modern games (whilst still potentially keeping that core) can look and move forward, meaning both sides bring a sense of unity to the series.

The negative is how many people will use that as a starting platform to essentially segregate the series into two blanket-statement "eras" because of a high personal bias for one or the other, which to label as brand-damaging if Sega just fullon accepts that is at least three shades of understatement!

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3 minutes ago, Azoo said:

Sonic is a character subject to constant evolution since the very first game,

Well that's the thing about evolution: eventually it produces a different species. If you change enough, no matter how gradual or logical the changes may be, you eventually end up with something that hardly resembles the original.

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As if you couldn't just throw modern Sonic's design in a title with Generations-esque visuals and use the old gameplay and have it work. The general public wouldnt bat an eye, and most fans wouldn't either; in fact they'd probably love it!

There's nothing about Sonic's current design that tells me it should be considered a different series. The only people adamant about it are the ones upset that it doesnt align to the utmost specifics of their expectations.

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5 minutes ago, Azoo said:

As if you couldn't just throw modern Sonic's design in a title with Generations-esque visuals and use the old gameplay and have it work. The general public wouldnt bat an eye, and most fans wouldn't either; in fact they'd probably love it!

There's nothing about Sonic's current design that tells me it should be considered a different series. The only people adamant about it are the ones upset that it doesnt align to the utmost specifics of their expectations.

Further backing up that point, they've already done so and those games are regarded as some of the best the series has released 

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Honestly, I don't think a lot of the modern stuff is too much of a departure from what we started with. Only Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic '06 feel genuinely out of place, and even then, Sonic '06 only feels out of place because it takes itself way too god damn seriously.

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4 minutes ago, ThePrinceOfSaiyajins said:

Honestly, I don't think a lot of the modern stuff is too much of a departure from what we started with. Only Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic '06 feel genuinely out of place, and even then, Sonic '06 only feels out of place because it takes itself way too god damn seriously.

Agreed, actually there's a video about Sonic Heroes that actively discusses if a game out of the series is genuinely out of what's expected, and I think it's a genuinely good way to look at things.

 

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I don't see how splitting the two up will harm the brand.

There are people with a clear preference for the Classic Sonic design and gameplay, and vice versa. By having two teams do both, you get the best of both worlds. Yes, Modern Sonic could have been in Sonic Mania, for example, and it wouldn't have made a difference to the gameplay quality. But the general public associate classic gameplay with Classic Sonic, especially after Generations, and you just can't get around that now. There's also the fact that there are people who prefer the Classic design to be used in the Classic style games because it's cuter, and it's what they remember growing up with.

This creates more sales, and more interest in the brand, especially with people who went through a lapse period. How does this harm the brand in any way?

And keep in mind Sonic is far from the only franchise to do this. Mega Man did it for years, to a much bigger extreme, and it worked out well.

I don't think the fact that the version of Sonic being used is irrelevant to how the game plays, matters at all. The fact is, if they can pull more people in by doing something as simple as using a different design, there's no reason not to do that.

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18 minutes ago, ChikoLad said:

I don't see how splitting the two up will harm the brand.

There are people with a clear preference for the Classic Sonic design and gameplay, and vice versa. By having two teams do both, you get the best of both worlds. Yes, Modern Sonic could have been in Sonic Mania, for example, and it wouldn't have made a difference to the gameplay quality. But the general public associate classic gameplay with Classic Sonic, especially after Generations, and you just can't get around that now. There's also the fact that there are people who prefer the Classic design to be used in the Classic style games because it's cuter, and it's what they remember growing up with.

The reason for this is because its been treated as separate, because of a sequence of horribly bad games. Its not intentional. If Sonic games were of surpassing quality (Mario Galaxy level and above) from 2001 to 2011, then nobody would have given a flying fuck about separating them.

If anything I thought the purpose of Gens was to unify everything. Classic Sonic is simply Modern Sonic's past. They are two different people in the same sense that myself from now is different to myself from 15 years ago. Same person, but I've changed and grown since then. 

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This creates more sales, and more interest in the brand, especially with people who went through a lapse period. How does this harm the brand in any way?

Does it create more sales? Any way of proving this? The reason Sonic games sell at all is due to how well known the character and the brand is.

 

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And keep in mind Sonic is far from the only franchise to do this. Mega Man did it for years, to a much bigger extreme, and it worked out well.

No it didn't. Megaman is dead now.

 

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I don't think the fact that the version of Sonic being used is irrelevant to how the game plays, matters at all. The fact is, if they can pull more people in by doing something as simple as using a different design, there's no reason not to do that.

But does it? Do people outside of the extremely nitpicky fucking fanbase give a flying fuck about what Sonic looks like? I certainly don't and I consider myself a pretty hardcore fan. Most people think of Sonic as Sonic. The only reason outsiders would consider them separate entities is if SEGA forces them to think that way, by treating them as two separate entities.

The reason 2001 - 2011 games were badly received was because they were bad games, not because the design was fucking different.

If a new Sonic game was made and was repeatedly shown to be a constant 9.5/10 game and was regarded as such by metacritic or whatever, would it not generate more sales on the virtue that its an excellent fucking game? Would the design matter at that point? Would all the little specifics about lore and all that shite matter? No, because its a good fucking game. If that hypothetical 9.5/10 Sonic game had gameplay that combined what was excellent about the classics and what was learned from the mistakes of the adventure and boost and lost world and boom formulae (as well as the elements that were good), would it matter to anyone?

If someone didn't like or buy the game because it doesn't align with their expectations of a Sonic 5 and Knuckles or Sonic adventure 3, then they can go suck a duck for all I care. As long as the fundamentals are there and its executed as near to perfectly as is physically possible, I don't care.

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31 minutes ago, Scar said:

No it didn't. Megaman is dead now.

Not to mention, Mega Man's way of doing things works for Mega Man because they're all different robots made in different timelines / universes, and thus different characters altogether. 

Sonic is like Mickey Mouse; despite the various changes over the years in both design and the type of content he's been in, you're to assume that the Mickey Mouse from Steamboat Willie is the same Mickey as from the 30s/40s shorts is the same as the Mickey from the 80s/90s cartoon specials / movies is the same Mickey from the House of Mouse is the same as the Mickey from Epic Mickey is the same as the Mickey from the current Paul Rudish cartoons. Even after all this time, Mickey is still Mickey, the one and the same, in all media.

And sure, you may have a Mickey from a certain era you prefer. And if they made a side-series devoted to the beginnings of Mickey, it'd probably be wonderful and a huge benefit for the franchise as a whole! But it's never meant to replace and/or separate itself from who Mickey is as a character or a franchise.

In that same kind of way, there's no problem with making a classic side-series to evoke that 90s Sega feeling and the core mechanics of the original games again. Mania's a more than welcome start to that! But that's not a good reason to go for a split when the series as a whole has way more in common together than it doesn't.

tl;dr it's pointless.

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1 hour ago, ChikoLad said:

I don't see how splitting the two up will harm the brand.

There are people with a clear preference for the Classic Sonic design and gameplay, and vice versa. By having two teams do both, you get the best of both worlds. Yes, Modern Sonic could have been in Sonic Mania, for example, and it wouldn't have made a difference to the gameplay quality. But the general public associate classic gameplay with Classic Sonic, especially after Generations, and you just can't get around that now. There's also the fact that there are people who prefer the Classic design to be used in the Classic style games because it's cuter, and it's what they remember growing up with.

This creates more sales, and more interest in the brand, especially with people who went through a lapse period. How does this harm the brand in any way?

And keep in mind Sonic is far from the only franchise to do this. Mega Man did it for years, to a much bigger extreme, and it worked out well.

I don't think the fact that the version of Sonic being used is irrelevant to how the game plays, matters at all. The fact is, if they can pull more people in by doing something as simple as using a different design, there's no reason not to do that.

Separating the brand hasn't caused a rise in sales because the series' sales have declined over time. Let it be known that Sonic Generations with all of its pandering Classic Sonic glory and the backing of three consoles sold less than Sonic Adventure managed to do on one console. While that could be due to any number of factors (platformers becoming less popular, brand consolidation, brand trust, presumed game quality, marketing, etc.), there's also a very real chance that splitting the franchise has, in a way, only split the number of sales any individual game can now attain from any demographic.

After all, if you're insistent that Sonic fans have strong enough preferences to not even buy the 3D games because they're not classic enough and vice versa, what you're actually saying is that you can't count on us as fans to put a supermajority backing into any one game anymore. In a fandom of for example 100,000 individuals, Sega doesn't actually have 100,000 guaranteed sales. What they have now is that maybe ~50,000 classic fans are gonna buy Mania while the other half aren't gonna bother. The same goes for the public.

It's also weird that you talk about Mega Man doing anything successfully when the franchise is basically dead right now.

What Sonic needs is consolidation. It needs a single major identity that is properly developed and cultivated over time and thus draws in a more reliable and thus bigger audience, and if it wants to explore other gameplay avenues, basic spin-offs that are not trying to muscle in on the main platformers' job. No more splitting the series into major sects like Boom (which has done little to nothing for anyone), Modern, and Classic. Sega needs to pick one.

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1 minute ago, Scar said:

The reason for this is because its been treated as separate, because of a sequence of horribly bad games. Its not intentional. If Sonic games were of surpassing quality (Mario Galaxy level and above) from 2001 to 2011, then nobody would have given a flying fuck about separating them.

...But it is intentional. They are deliberately separating the two. The reasoning behind it is irrelevant (and frankly, doing it because they want to improve the quality of both halves and have them done by two different teams is the best way to do it).

2 minutes ago, Scar said:

Does it create more sales? Any way of proving this? The reason Sonic games sell at all is due to how well known the character and the brand is.

 

Yes, because you literally have two different games. Sonic Mania wouldn't exist if it wasn't meant to be a Classic throwback. And if it becomes a series, then that's a series Sonic Team never would have made by themselves. Iizuka even flat out said in the Q&A at the party, that he hired Taxman and co. to make a game like Mania because Sonic Team themselves have struggled to recreate the Classic gameplay perfectly by themselves. So they are giving it to someone who knows what they are doing.

It's like, Sonic Boom didn't sell well on it's own, true. But if they didn't make it at all, there wouldn't have been a Sonic Team game to replace them, as it was a different team. More games = more sales and general activity for the brand. It's as simple as that.

5 minutes ago, Scar said:

No it didn't. Megaman is dead now.

Dunno what you're talking about since he got into Smash Bros, just had a new release this year that came with a Gold amiibo, is getting a new TV show, and is rumoured to get a new game with said TV show. There's also the Archie Comics, which are ongoing (including crossovers with Sonic!). And there's been plenty of cool Mega Man merchandise as of late.

My point was that, for years, the Classic Mega Man and Mega Man X franchises flourished together. Battle Network also did really well as another sub-series. Another example is Batman - we have dark and gritty Batman from stuff like the movies and Arkham games, and then we have stuff like The Brave and The Bold, and the LEGO Batman movie which is much more light-hearted and aimed at a younger audience. Has this hurt the Batman brand? Much like the three main versions of Sonic we have, it's still the same character at it's core. Batman still uses gadgets, fights for justice, and doesn't attempt to kill people (most of the time). They just change the kind of world he's in, and the tone of the stories, as well as the character design.

So there's no reason to say Sonic doing the same thing is inherently bad. There are literally tons of major franchise that do this and it's worked.

SEGA splitting up Classic Sonic and Modern Sonic is only bad and hurts the brand, if the products made for either side of the brand start becoming of a poor quality. So we'll just have to see how the new Classic game, and the new Modern game (that also happens to have Classic Sonic in it for some reason...we'll have to see what that's about) hold up before we can say this is bad for the brand.

21 minutes ago, Scar said:

But does it? Do people outside of the extremely nitpicky fucking fanbase give a flying fuck about what Sonic looks like?

Yes, like it or not, most people outside of the core fanbase prefer the Classic design because 1) they remember growing up with it and thought it was just fine, and 2) they associate it with Sonic's golden age of good games and being this hugely relevant icon. It's like how people much rather the older Pac-Man design than the Ghostly Adventures one.

23 minutes ago, Scar said:

If someone didn't like or buy the game because it doesn't align with their expectations of a Sonic 5 and Knuckles or Sonic adventure 3, then they can go suck a duck for all I care. As long as the fundamentals are there and its executed as near to perfectly as is physically possible, I don't care.

I agree with you. Hell, I'd argue I'm less picky than most of you here because I don't give two shits if Classic Sonic suddenly becomes a "different person" or canon or whatever. The Sonic lore has become too contrived and all over the place for that stuff to matter to me anymore. Likewise, I also don't care which design for Sonic is in which game on a personal level. I wouldn't even care if Boom Sonic's design became the permanent design for all future Sonic games, because it's still Sonic to me.

However, the general public does not think about it that way. For the most part, the general public couldn't give less of a shit about Sonic's ongoing canon, for the same reason's I've personally stopped caring about it (too contrived and convoluted for it to make enough sense to remotely matter).

And by that same token, the general public prefer Sonic's Classic design, and don't care if using it fucks up the canon or whatever. Most non-gamers tend to favour either casual games, shooty-shooty bang-bang army games like Call of Duty, or "retro" games. Classic Sonic is strongly associated with that last one, but Modern Sonic is not. Therefore, it makes perfect sense to split the two, as long as they approach it correctly. And on that note, I think it's too early to be concerned.

I mean for one, they haven't split Classic Sonic into his own canon just yet, and we don't know if they plan to. Sonic Mania's story and plot details, or even if it has a story to begin with, still isn't known yet. We don't know what the deal is with Classic Sonic in Project 2017, but most likely he's back through time travel shenanigans. So I'm not sure why people are concerned. I'm personally not concerned either way, I don't care if Classic Sonic is Sonic's younger self, his little brother, his ancestor, or just a different person entirely. As long as they all feel like Sonic and have good games, the three Sonic's we have right now in the games are fine.

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Mega Man might not be the best example considering that it's basically dead, but that doesn't necessarily mean that ChikoLad is wrong about Modern and Classic Sonic being able to exist simultaneously. Take Zelda for example. Nintendo may not have explicitly split it up into different series but for the last 18 years it's been fielding two very distinct styles of game.

In particular the handheld games are played from a 2-D top-down perspective with gameplay, structure, and aesthetics, hearkening back to the original games:

Zelda-A-Link-to-the-Past005.png   zelda_minish_cap_image17.jpg

 

The console games meanwhile are full 3-D, played from a behind-the-back perspective, and structurally and stylistically resemble Ocarina of Time:

OcarinaOfTimeBattle.JPGskyward-sword-best-worst-zelda-3.png

 

Granted Breath of the Wild looks to be taking things in a somewhat different direction, but the fact is that the series has maintained this division for nearly 20 years without issue. I'm not saying that it's necessarily the best thing for Sonic, or that SEGA would actually be able to make it work, but it  can be done successfully.

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I really do think this split between Modern and Classic was just really caused by the amount of fans outcrying how terrible the 3D games were compared to the 2D games, and started associating the newer designs with the series` overall quality drop. As a result, you got people actually believing that anything with Modern Sonic's face on it being automatically terrible, simply because of how far the series started to deviate from its roots. Like someone said, its more incidental than anything else than a conscious brand decision. 

Its not necessarily bad either, but you can't deny that Sonic is very unique as its the only franchise that does this. Nobody makes any clear distinctions between 2D Mario and 3D Mario, its exactly; 2D Mario and 3D Mario, same with every other old school game from the 90's. Mega Man does not count in this case because the different incarnations of Mega Man are just that, different incarnations. They're entirely different characters with no shared history aside from having the character's namesake. Classic Mega Man is not Mega Man X, and neither of them are related to Volnutt or his Battle Network or Starforce counterparts. 

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Nintendo does not consider the 2D or 3D Zelda games separate series. They're all equally main titles, and are advertised as such.

No one's arguing that Sega can't put out a side-series focusing on different gameplay (classic, in this case), but the moment they try to tell me that yes, classic Sonic is an entirely separate line of Sonic from modern, then I'm out.

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1 hour ago, Bowbowis said:

Mega Man might not be the best example considering that it's basically dead, but that doesn't necessarily mean that ChikoLad is wrong about Modern and Classic Sonic being able to exist simultaneously. Take Zelda for example. Nintendo may not have explicitly split it up into different series but for the last 18 years it's been fielding two very distinct styles of game.

In particular the handheld games are played from a 2-D top-down perspective with gameplay, structure, and aesthetics, hearkening back to the original games:

Zelda-A-Link-to-the-Past005.png   zelda_minish_cap_image17.jpg

 

The console games meanwhile are full 3-D, played from a behind-the-back perspective, and structurally and stylistically resemble Ocarina of Time:

OcarinaOfTimeBattle.JPGskyward-sword-best-worst-zelda-3.png

 

Granted Breath of the Wild looks to be taking things in a somewhat different direction, but the fact is that the series has maintained this division for nearly 20 years without issue. I'm not saying that it's necessarily the best thing for Sonic, or that SEGA would actually be able to make it work, but it  can be done successfully.

I wouldn't call Zelda the best example of this either. The division between the two styles is considered to be overall to the detriment of the franchise in the long run to the point where Breath of the Wild is about reconciling the two styles. 3D mario went through a similar attempt to reconcile recently with 3D Land/World. Sonic team should be doing the same.

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The thing with Zelda is that the games don't take place in completely alternate universes that don't interact with one another. Every Zelda game- regardless of whether it's 2D or 3D- takes place in a single continuity that just so happens to have a split timeline due to Nintendo actually having to reconcile continuity issues with the way time travel works.

There's no justification for splitting Sonic's games up into completely different universes based on nothing but art style differences, especially when different Zelda games on any given branch of the timeline have different art styles. Skyward Sword doesn't look like the fucking Minish Cap, but under Sonic Fan Logic™ y'all would put Minish Cap into the timeline of games started by Wind Waker just because of the way he looks.

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Ah ah, Nepenthe, correction: the way it looks AND PLAYS. Ergo, Sonic Heroes clearly takes place in a separate continuity from SA1/2, which in turn are entirely separate from Unleashed/etc.

..Do any of you see how ridiculous this is? Would you actually attempt to argue that the Adventure games are of a separate continuity if we got more of them and Sega decided to go back to the Adventure style of gameplay after Unleashed?

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...But it is intentional. They are deliberately separating the two. The reasoning behind it is irrelevant (and frankly, doing it because they want to improve the quality of both halves and have them done by two different teams is the best way to do it).

That's the problem though. I don't want them to treat them as separate entities.

Yes, because you literally have two different games. Sonic Mania wouldn't exist if it wasn't meant to be a Classic throwback. And if it becomes a series, then that's a series Sonic Team never would have made by themselves. Iizuka even flat out said in the Q&A at the party, that he hired Taxman and co. to make a game like Mania because Sonic Team themselves have struggled to recreate the Classic gameplay perfectly by themselves. So they are giving it to someone who knows what they are doing.

It's like, Sonic Boom didn't sell well on it's own, true. But if they didn't make it at all, there wouldn't have been a Sonic Team game to replace them, as it was a different team. More games = more sales and general activity for the brand. It's as simple as that.

See Nepenthe's post. Also. Its like you've forgotten that games need investment (I.e. Money) to be made, so no, it's not that simple. If they don't make the money back the sales they generate mean fuck all. Boom so far as I'm aware was both a critical AND commercial flop. It didn't sell well enough to matter hence there not being a console sequel. Sega doesn't think a sequel is worth the investment.

Dunno what you're talking about since he got into Smash Bros, just had a new release this year that came with a Gold amiibo, is getting a new TV show, and is rumoured to get a new game with said TV show. There's also the Archie Comics, which are ongoing (including crossovers with Sonic!). And there's been plenty of cool Mega Man merchandise as of late.

My point was that, for years, the Classic Mega Man and Mega Man X franchises flourished together. Battle Network also did really well as another sub-series. Another example is Batman - we have dark and gritty Batman from stuff like the movies and Arkham games, and then we have stuff like The Brave and The Bold, and the LEGO Batman movie which is much more light-hearted and aimed at a younger audience. Has this hurt the Batman brand? Much like the three main versions of Sonic we have, it's still the same character at it's core. Batman still uses gadgets, fights for justice, and doesn't attempt to kill people (most of the time). They just change the kind of world he's in, and the tone of the stories, as well as the character design.

So there's no reason to say Sonic doing the same thing is inherently bad. There are literally tons of major franchise that do this and it's worked.

SEGA splitting up Classic Sonic and Modern Sonic is only bad and hurts the brand, if the products made for either side of the brand start becoming of a poor quality. So we'll just have to see how the new Classic game, and the new Modern game (that also happens to have Classic Sonic in it for some reason...we'll have to see what that's about) hold up before we can say this is bad for the brand.

How does it benefit anyone to manage and maintain several separate continuities and brands of Sonic, vs a single unified vision. Nobody is suggesting that spinoffs aren't allowed, but they should form a part of a collective whole, not be separate universes entirely

Yes, like it or not, most people outside of the core fanbase prefer the Classic design because 1) they remember growing up with it and thought it was just fine, and 2) they associate it with Sonic's golden age of good games and being this hugely relevant icon. It's like how people much rather the older Pac-Man design than the Ghostly Adventures one.

Really? According to who?

I know people will have their preferred design of Sonic, but are you seriously suggesting that it's so huge of an issue that people outside our quaint fanbase make their purchasing decisions based on sonics fucking appearance?

People certainly didn't like the Boom designs (I don't hate them, but Amy aside they are inferior to the classic and modern counterparts) but the reason that game failed isn't due to the character design. It's because the game fucking sucks.

I agree with you. Hell, I'd argue I'm less picky than most of you here because I don't give two shits if Classic Sonic suddenly becomes a "different person" or canon or whatever. The Sonic lore has become too contrived and all over the place for that stuff to matter to me anymore. Likewise, I also don't care which design for Sonic is in which game on a personal level. I wouldn't even care if Boom Sonic's design became the permanent design for all future Sonic games, because it's still Sonic to me. However, the general public does not think about it that way. For the most part, the general public couldn't give less of a shit about Sonic's ongoing canon, for the same reason's I've personally stopped caring about it (too contrived and convoluted for it to make enough sense to remotely matter) And by that same token, the general public prefer Sonic's Classic design, and don't care if using it fucks up the canon or whatever. Most non-gamers tend to favour either casual games, shooty-shooty bang-bang army games like Call of Duty, or "retro" games. Classic Sonic is strongly associated with that last one, but Modern Sonic is not. Therefore, it makes perfect sense to split the two, as long as they approach it correctly. And on that note, I think it's too early to be concerned.

I mean for one, they haven't split Classic Sonic into his own canon just yet, and we don't know if they plan to. Sonic Mania's story and plot details, or even if it has a story to begin with, still isn't known yet. We don't know what the deal is with Classic Sonic in Project 2017, but most likely he's back through time travel shenanigans. So I'm not sure why people are concerned. I'm personally not concerned either way, I don't care if Classic Sonic is Sonic's younger self, his little brother, his ancestor, or just a different person entirely. As long as they all feel like Sonic and have good games, the three Sonic's we have right now in the games are fine.

Having multiple identities is harder to deal with. It's far easier to have one and maybe a couple spin offs like Mario kart or whatever else someone wants to make. The point is consistency. Don't have you worry about maintaining Separate brands for a single Goddamn character.

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Ya know what, I can sort of understand "Sonic fan Logic " because the series has had such widely differing artstyles through its tenure, it can be very jarring to believe they belong to the same series if you weren't already familiar with it.

Like, would you honestly believe this game:

Shadow_the_Hedgehog_Coverart.png

Belongs in the same line and continuity as this game:

Sonic-Lost-World-Wallpapers-0.jpg

 

People still consider Shadow a spin off despite the fact that it shares the same gameplay, characters and plot universe with the the rest of the series. Its jarring as hell is what I'm saying, but it more on how Sega's handled the series than anything else.

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I must not have read things carefully enough. My bad.

To set the record straight: I'm not arguing that they should split the continuity, or treat Classic and Modern as completely separate entities. I'm simply saying that Modern and Classic style games don't have to be an either/or thing. You can have both at the same time, which was the crux of ChikoLad's argument as I read it.

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4 minutes ago, Bowbowis said:

I must not have read things carefully enough. My bad.

To set the record straight: I'm not arguing that they should split the continuity, or treat Classic and Modern as completely separate entities. I'm simply saying that Modern and Classic style games don't have to be an either/or thing. You can have both at the same time, which was the crux of ChikoLad's argument as I read it.

We're not arguing that there shouldn't be Classic and Modern games simultaneously, but that the demand for such a thing was born not out of an attempt to please fans of both styles, but because said fans started causing a huge backlash as a result of Sonic Team's incompetence with the series through the years, and that its more damage control on their part to keep whatever good will they have left. 

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OK I think I am getting the idea of the conversation; I thought it was more so pick a style and don't care about the other and in this case, if they pick classic then it's bye bye 3D style and boosting which it's OK I guess.I'm more than fine of letting go of that and I can always play Unleashed if I want a thrill ride.

But I think it's more people treating classic and modern Sonic like two separate characters. I've seen many games that to realise older but fresher versions of games along side modern games and they are in the same boat and not treated differently. Mario is a good example. But then, Mario's gameplay has always been consistent, Sonic's has not and has been experimental at it's best. 

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