Have Sonic characters been given more stereotypical personalities?

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

1 hour ago, shdowhunt60 said:

Isn't that how it generally is these days? I mean, everyone is clearly built off of core, central character traits, but they're allowed to be a bit more rounded beyond that. It gives them a strong sense of identity, while keeping them flexible. Can we think of a Sonic game where, for instance, Tails acted like an indignified brat for half of an arc (in a way that's actually relatable, NOT Sonic Lost World?).

I mean, I get that part of that is because as a comic it can get away with more of these things, but in general I read everyone who is in the comics these days "as they should be".

 

I'm...not sure what you're getting at, because that was kinda what I was talking about as far as not being so one-note or rigid with the characters.

[shdowhunt60]

2 minutes ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

I'm...not sure what you're getting at, because that was kinda what I was talking about as far as not being so one-note or rigid with the characters.

Was I rambling again? It's entirely possible that was the case.

[Green Eyes]

On 18/09/2016 at 9:10 PM, Diogenes said:

So...not really. Not nearly as much as some people act like the have, anyway.

Truth is, most characters in the series have always hovered around certain archetypes. What changes they've made to the characters lately, I feel, has had more to do with reestablishing their character traits after a period of bland characterization than of making them stereotypical or "flanderized" or whatever buzzword people want to use.

 

Comparing Knuckles' scene here to Boom! Knuckle's idiocy seems like a REALLY big stretch to me, same goes for Shadow.

Knuckles had something to be proud of, and he was gullible largely because he's socially awkward, not just because he was "dumb". and Shadow is a jerk but he doesn't decide to beat up Sonic for no reason like in Boom.

 

[Diogenes]

8 minutes ago, Green Eyes said:

Comparing Knuckles' scene here to Boom! Knuckle's idiocy seems like a REALLY big stretch to me, same goes for Shadow.

Boom's an entirely separate continuity with intentionally different interpretations of the characters; comparing them to their main series equivalents at all is almost unfair, so I assumed we weren't.

[Green Eyes]

In that case, current interpretations of Knuckles and Shadow just kind of seem...there, I wouldn't say I can gather much from them to say what their personality is. They've been around for like what... a minute. For all that bragging Knuckles doesn't do shit like he probably should, but he's kind of just kind of "here for 20 seconds and has to say something" and that's what happens when Sonic Team doesn't actually want him to do anything.

EDIT: just realised the OP mentioning Mario&Sonic @ Rio Olympics

If we're talking Mario&Sonic at Olympics, I'd say characterizations do seem a bit odd throughout the entire Mario and Sonic series and I take it with a massive pile of salt   The example of Shadow does seem rather excessive to me, he seemed to at least respect Sonic after SA2, even if there was dislike. I'd more easily imagine him saying something curt but text doesn't easily carry tone of voice I guess.

[Sparky]

Shadow during SA2 and Heroes was just a darker incarnation of Sonic, and so lines like "I'm the coolest!" and stuff fit that description perfectly. But with his own game onwards, Shadow became even darker and edgier, so much that it's a bit hard to see how his personality is "Dark-Sonic" since he's become so brooding, serious, and stoic that he rarely ever smirks and says those kinds of lines anymore at all. Shadow is meant to be a Dark-Sonic, but they've been putting so much emphasis on the DARK part and not enough on the SONIC part. 

 

[Shadowlax]

On 9/22/2016 at 2:21 PM, Diogenes said:

Boom's an entirely separate continuity with intentionally different interpretations of the characters; comparing them to their main series equivalents at all is almost unfair, so I assumed we weren't.

I wouldnt say its unfair for a few reasons. One well...its still sonic, at the end of the day its a version of the character and still will be compared to that character. And if it fails to justify itself and how the character in relation to its world it will be criticized. I feel like the first excuse is to yell its for kids and its a different, but its still sonic. It still has to justify itself for being that, there are or were better comedic takes on things still respectfully present then its why you almost never hear folks shitting on batman brave and the bold but folks will shit on ttg and sonic boom because you can do that sort of thing well. I dont think its unfair, i think its up for discussion.

But two outside of shadow, everyone in boom seems like how sega views these characters in end game. And on thst level I feel like its worth discussing, because you can make a legit argument that these characters may have an effect on the main versions at some point. 

I feel like they are worth talking about. Being in a different universe does not exempt you from criticism. If anything it makes you more susceptible because now you have to justify why you are a spin off rather than sonething new entirely 

[Diogenes]

17 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I wouldnt say its unfair for a few reasons. One well...its still sonic, at the end of the day its a version of the character and still will be compared to that character.

Well, it's Sonic and it's not Sonic. Obviously Boom couldn't have existed without the Sonic series coming before it, and no doubt it's going to take inspiration from other interpretations of the character, but it's still going to exist apart from them. Everything you know about these characters is justifiably up for revision, and it's hard to make a case for the Boom versions to be out of character when they are fundamentally not the same people as their main series counterparts.

17 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Being in a different universe does not exempt you from criticism.

Never said otherwise.

[FantasticMrRobb]

I can't say all of them, but Knuckles has been the biggest example of change, at least in my eyes. I'm sure I'm not the only one who believes that.

He used to be the more silent type of tough guy, but of course he's been turned into the brawn no brains kind of hero. Very typical and more common nowadays.

I mean yeah, he's been fooled by Eggman a good handful of times, but that's because (I've always believed) he has a good heart, I think something in the X series made me believe that. However, anymore it doesn't take jack squat to fool Knuckles. Boom Knuckles could probably fool himself if he wanted to, lol.

I didn't think much of Tails until that little whatever you want to call it in Lost World, he wasn't even acting like Tails. Just some brat, lol. Tails is a genius and until then has always acted a little more mature than his age.

[Dere]

On 9/18/2016 at 5:23 PM, Mad Convoy said:

I think on Sonic Team's part, yes, there have been a lot of problems with flanderization which have resulted in the characters being less entertaining to watch. But this isn't new-- if you're defining flanderization as the exaggeration of one aspect of a character at the expense of the character's other traits, the earliest I can pinpoint it where it had any sort of influence is Sonic X, which began airing all the way back in 2003.  Sonic X relished in shallow archetypes, making preconceptions like "Knuckles the Chump", "Shadow the Edgelord", "Sonic the Generic" a reality with its poor writing and bad understanding of what made them work.

I'm sorry, but unless you're talking about the crappy 4kids dub, I have to say that's a load of rubbish. Sonic X just took the characterizations from the Sonic Adventure era and made them more nuanced. Where Adventure Sonic was written as a generic hero with hardly any personality who was said (but not shown) to be laidback and adventurous, Sonic X actually made him laidback and adventurous, while at the same time giving him a cocky and somewhat aloof attitude to round his character. Where Adventure Knuckles was said to be tough but gullible, yet written as stoic and gullible, Sonic X actually gave him a tough guy personality while still keeping his stoic and gullible traits. And no, he wasn't just a chump. His main trait was his tough guy personality, while his foolish side showed up every now and then, just like in the Adventure series. In addition, that side was written in a way that made him likable and flawed, rather than just a bumbling fool like in the games from Heroes onwards. And if you think Shadow was nothing more than an edgelord in Sonic X, then clearly you haven't watched the conclusion to the Sonic Adventure 2 adaptation.

So as far as characterizations go, the Sonic X incarnations of Sonic and Knuckles are what the characters were supposed to be like in the Adventure series, but weren't due to poor writing, instead being characterized as more generic and personality-free. Because of that, Sonic X has the best incarnations of Sonic and Knuckles so far. And I say that as someone whose favorite characters are Sonic and Knuckles.

[Austroid]

On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2016 at 12:01 PM, FantasticMrRobb said:

I can't say all of them, but Knuckles has been the biggest example of change, at least in my eyes. I'm sure I'm not the only one who believes that.

He used to be the more silent type of tough guy, but of course he's been turned into the brawn no brains kind of hero. Very typical and more common nowadays.

I mean yeah, he's been fooled by Eggman a good handful of times, but that's because (I've always believed) he has a good heart, I think something in the X series made me believe that. However, anymore it doesn't take jack squat to fool Knuckles. Boom Knuckles could probably fool himself if he wanted to, lol.

I feel the exact same way about Knuckles! 

He was much better as the good-natured lone wolf who'd occasionally help Sonic and friends out, compared to the meathead they make him now.

I liked how in Sonic X he'd genuinely believe Eggman's lies; because he wanted to see the good in him and help a guy out, despite what others said. Sonic X nailed his character pretty good for the first couple seasons. Once we got to the Metarex saga though, he became more of what he is now with constantly being the source of comic-relief.

Ugh... does the Master Emerald even exist in the games anymore?

[Your Vest Friend]

Hey, the Master Emerald was in Mania. 

The most pathetic forcing in of it I've ever seen, but still.