The General American Politics Thread

[Tani Coyote]

On the other hand, homophobia is easier to tackle because most people know what it's like to love someone. It makes it a lot easier to create empathy. Most people do not know what it's like to be a marginalized race.

 

There's also the fact sexuality is largely invisible barring the more flamboyant individuals. You can avoid a lot of homophobia simply by not disclosing that information.

 

Racial minorities, on the other hand, don't have that privilege (barring a few lighter skinned individuals).

[Patticus]

The anti crowd can't reverse this and they know it, but they can and will head quickly down the Roe v Wade path, making it as difficult as possible for same sex couples to get married. Don't be surprised if a bumper crop of Right To Discriminate bills appear over the next year, brought to you by the American Taliban, portraying themselves as oppressed victims. The battle is won, yes, but as with abortion rights, the war is far from over. Expect a truly vile backlash, and soon.

[Tani Coyote]

With interracial marriage, for years clerks would refuse to issue licenses even after the Loving decision, leading to lots of litigation.

 

I presume in the more conservative states this is going to happen an awful lot with gay marriage as well.

 

This in itself will be a huge hurdle for gay people because of legal costs...

 

Fortunately it's possible to get around this by going out of state and getting married somewhere else, but it's still going to be a pain in the ass.

 

Then I can only imagine the individuals doing whatever they can to hurt the process, e.g. denying visitation rights regardless of what the law says.

[Kevin]

Words cannot describe how overjoyed I am at today's Supreme Court ruling! What a historic day!

[shdowhunt60]

I have to admit, I'm not that overjoyed about gay marriage going through. But that's because something like this shouldn't have taken so long, and had to have so much melodrama. It shouldn't have been a question in the first place. I hear the comparisons to Roe v. Wade, but the matter of abortion is an entirely different issue altogether. There's something worth debating over there. With gay marriage, that certainly is not the case. Any arguments against that is dictated by pure emotion and zealotry.

[Tani Coyote]

So apparently there are calls from ISIS for global jihad during Ramadan this year, with ISIS claiming those who commit jihad will be rewarded more than those who did it off-season. From what I'm reading, bombings and other attacks have already happened in several countries immediately after the call. The US government is naturally concerned about safety during the upcoming 4th of July celebrations.

 

I'm just amazed that ISIS would call for this. Why, you ask? Well you see, groups like Al-Qaeda can call for jihad all they want because we can't point to a map and know where they are. We know where ISIS is. All they're doing is shoring up Western support for an all-out invasion.

 

People tend to not like the Iraq War because it looks to have been for nothing, whereas the invasion of Afghanistan finds a lot more support because there were concrete links between the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. By doing this, ISIS is making itself the next Taliban. Despite the negative connotations of Iraq, I wouldn't be surprised if there were calls to go back in full force if ISIS does anything here.

 

And strong as they are now fighting off airstrikes and third world armies, I imagine ISIS forces will - much like Saddam's massive military - melt if a large Western force goes against them in the field.

 

Americans as a whole are generally okay with tyrants, terrorists, whomever doing what they want in their corner of the world. When you bring it to our corner, however...

[nintega137]

So apparently there are calls from ISIS for global jihad during Ramadan this year, with ISIS claiming those who commit jihad will be rewarded more than those who did it off-season. From what I'm reading, bombings and other attacks have already happened in several countries immediately after the call. The US government is naturally concerned about safety during the upcoming 4th of July celebrations.

 

I'm just amazed that ISIS would call for this. Why, you ask? Well you see, groups like Al-Qaeda can call for jihad all they want because we can't point to a map and know where they are. We know where ISIS is. All they're doing is shoring up Western support for an all-out invasion.

 

People tend to not like the Iraq War because it looks to have been for nothing, whereas the invasion of Afghanistan finds a lot more support because there were concrete links between the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. By doing this, ISIS is making itself the next Taliban. Despite the negative connotations of Iraq, I wouldn't be surprised if there were calls to go back in full force if ISIS does anything here.

 

And strong as they are now fighting off airstrikes and third world armies, I imagine ISIS forces will - much like Saddam's massive military - melt if a large Western force goes against them in the field.

 

Americans as a whole are generally okay with tyrants, terrorists, whomever doing what they want in their corner of the world. When you bring it to our corner, however...

[Vectorman]

 

 

People tend to not like the Iraq War because it looks to have been for nothing, whereas the invasion of Afghanistan finds a lot more support because there were concrete links between the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. By doing this, ISIS is making itself the next Taliban. Despite the negative connotations of Iraq, I wouldn't be surprised if there were calls to go back in full force if ISIS does anything here.

 

 

Americans as a whole are generally okay with tyrants, terrorists, whomever doing what they want in their corner of the world. When you bring it to our corner, however...

[TailsTellsTales]

Woman climbs pole, removes Confederate flag

(CNN)Dressed in climbing gear and a helmet, Brittany "Bree" Newsome shimmied up a 30-foot flagpole on the grounds of the South Carolina state Capitol early Saturday and removed the Confederate battle flag that has reignited national debate over the emblem's place in modern America.

Newsome removed the banner hours before a pro-flag rally was scheduled to take place at the monument in Columbia. By the time the flag was raised again, the moment had made its mark in the ongoing debate over the Confederate banner on the State House grounds -- and its value in American society 150 years after the end of the Civil War.

Newsome was arrested after she returned to ground with flag in hand. Video shows fellow activist James Tyson waiting at the flagpole's base inside the wrought-iron fence to help her out of her climbing gear. She posted bond and was released from jail Saturday afternoon, spokesman Mervyn Marcano said. Calls to her attorney have not been returned.

Newsome and Tyson, both 30, were charged with defacing a monument, a misdemeanor, and a new flag went up within about an hour, according to the S.C. Department of Public Safety. Not long after they were led away in handcuffs, Newsome became an online hero, a trending topic on social media and the subject of an online fundraiser.

Opponents of the flag, including celebrities, politicians and civil rights activists, used #FreeBree to applaud Newsome for doing what many thought lawmakers should have done sooner. While filmmaker Michael Moore offered to pay Newsome's legal fees, advocacy group ColorofChange launched an online petition calling for the charge to be dropped and an online fundraiser was set up pay Newsome's legal fees.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Americans as a whole are generally okay with tyrants, terrorists, whomever doing what they want in their corner of the world. When you bring it to our corner, however...

[Patticus]

The only way the US is going to march headlong into another expensive Middle Eastern quagmire so soon after it left its old two behind, is if a senseless war-hawk is elected to the presidency next year. Frankly, considering that the aforementioned previous two military adventures resoundingly failed, and actually created the threat we are now debating whether to invade over, I'd have serious doubts as to the likelihood that any new military adventure in the region could possibly succeed.

 

The west has been at war for over a decade, and there is little will to go back in guns-blazing. In a few years, or if certain countries are threatened, I'm sure things will be different. Right now, however, the locals (Turkey, Iran, the Kurds, the Arabian Peninsular, Israel etc) need to co-ordinate and drive IS' forces back to the dark holes from whence they crawled. The US, Europe and whoever else wants to join in's roles should be dispensing ordnance, supplies and intelligence from above, as well as training and equipping local forces.

[Tani Coyote]

Well technically both conflicts were for nothing, if you count oil as nothing.

[Patticus]

Even after a steady ramping up of aid, I can't see active engagement by US ground forces (except maybe special forces) happening without an attack on the US, or a threatened invasion of Israel. Those will certainly light the fires of righteous fury necessary to kick off an American invasion, but short of that, nope. It's important to keep the local nations on-side and prevent the spread of radical Islam, so whatever the US does after it ramps up its assistance has to be carefully calculated, or it risks fanning the flames of extremism, rather than damping them down. A lot like throwing water on a grease fire, actually..

 

As for the confederate flag being taken down by someone, that's great. Next time, someone should set it ablaze and send it back up the pole - that would make for an iconic photo and probably rile up a few insecure rednecks.

[Tornado]

The main front runner of the Democratic bid is probably the most likely out of all of them to actually commit ground troops, so while a protracted out and out war certainly isn't inevitable ISIS is treading some dangerous ground if they are attempting to go full Taliban.

[Milo]

The anti crowd can't reverse this and they know it, but they can and will head quickly down the Roe v Wade path, making it as difficult as possible for same sex couples to get married. Don't be surprised if a bumper crop of Right To Discriminate bills appear over the next year, brought to you by the American Taliban, portraying themselves as oppressed victims. The battle is won, yes, but as with abortion rights, the war is far from over. Expect a truly vile backlash, and soon.

 

This probably doesn't add much to the discussion but I remember my teacher for an AP U.S. Government class I was taking saying nearly the exact same thing, two years ago. The context for this was that he was giving a lecture to the class I was in about the Roe v. Wade decision and how it was, in a sense, the last straw for the public's perception for not just abortion's rights, but women's rights in general-specifically, that after that law got passed, a lot of resistance was put up against later bills to extend further rights for women during that era. One law in particular concerning raising the minimum wage for women ended up stalled or shot down for some time. (Do correct me if I'm incorrect on any of this though, it's been a while). For comparison's sake in light of contemporary times, he then brought up some of the court cases in recent years that have ruled in favor of LGBT groups, and predicted that a similar backlash would happen should same-sex marriage get legalized nationwide. (Gotta note though he was speaking about both cases from a neutral perspective.)

[shdowhunt60]

So anyone else see that the Sonic the Hedgehog Facebook page dedicated an extra Fanart Friday for the gay marriage ruling?

 

https://www.facebook.com/Sonic/photos/a.406270927417.185036.23050342417/10153376989537418/?type=1&permPage=1

 

... And of course, people are talking about how Sonic and Tails should be a couple. Christ, people on the internet are so immature.

[Tani Coyote]

Even after a steady ramping up of aid, I can't see active engagement by US ground forces (except maybe special forces) happening without an attack on the US

[shdowhunt60]

It was inevitable that yaoi would enter the arena when the Sonic fanbase is involved. You need look no further than the fact Sonic x Shadow has its own website.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

As for the confederate flag being taken down by someone, that's great. Next time, someone should set it ablaze and send it back up the pole - that would make for an iconic photo and probably rile up a few insecure rednecks.

Or just strap a lighter on a drone and do it from a distance.

 

The aerial view of that would be amazing!

[Patticus]

Depends on the size of the crowd, the time of day and the weather. Time it right, with a large enough crowd, and you've got yourself an iconic bit of photography.
 
 
In the wake of the SCOTUS legalizing marriage equality, some pundits are saying that the American Renewal Project (ARP) is going to grow in popularity, as the religious right struggles with the concept that their government is not a theocracy, and that they are not the apple of the government's collective, Sauron-esque eye.
 
The ARP is an ongoing endeavor to inject religion into politics like never before, specifically by training pastors and other fervent believers in the ways of politics, some of whom will then go on to run for public office, and others presumably will make up campaign and office staff for the runners. The idea is that they want eventually to have enough of their people in political offices across the country to legislate against marriage equality (among other things) and drag America back into the 1950s.
 
As America moves on from the SCOTUS ruling, people get used to marriage just being marriage for a much larger swathe of the population, and as the baby boomer generation gradually passes on, I get the feeling that this movement will run out of steam and its political lapdogs will be voted out of office. Still though, that it even exists at all is quite scary. Will they ever learn that palling around with the religious right is not a viable campaign strategy in a liberalizing America?

[Tani Coyote]

Christian dominionism reached its heyday during Reagan's term.

 

This is just the last gasp of a dying movement. So long as people don't become complacent and make an active attempt to vote every election, I'm not seeing this really gaining much traction.

 

The right wing, barring the southeast (since as we know the southeast is the beacon of progressive thought in this country), doesn't do so hot when voter turnout is high. No matter how active conservative voters are, they will lose across the board if liberals and moderates make a point to vote. The reason you hear more about right wing attempts to suppress voters isn't because of some bias; it's the simple fact the right wing has more to lose from high turnout.

 

Liberal voters also need to avoid the "I don't like any of these liberals so I'll just stay home" schtick. While I admire the independent voting there, all it does is increase the power of conservative voters.

 

Those voters who stayed home are the ones to blame for the GOP taking the Senate.

[Patticus]

The mid-terms aren't even on the radar of most politically aware young people. If they were, the results would look a lot more like the presidential elections. The question Democrats have to ask is this: If we want to do well in future mid-terms, how do we make people (particularly young voters) give a shit, like they do in presidential races? I get the feeling the answer might be to make mid-terms feel more like presidential races, and get the incumbent Democratic president out on the campaign trail like his or her career depends on it.

 

OTHER NEWS THAT IS HAPPENING

 

Chris Christie's about to jump into the already overcrowded pool of Republican presidential hopefuls, even as he's still being dogged by Bridgegate, and that whole pension thing. The only thing that springs to mind with these new wannabe Republican presidential candidates, is the Simpsons scene in which Martin Prince's new epic pool is just full of kids, and then he jumps in, and the pool falls apart.

 

Donald Trump has been fired by NBC after his derogatory comments about how Mexico allegedly keeps sending its thieves and rapists, and, he assumes, some good people too, up to America. I assume that the only reason they're firing him for his comments now is because of his role in the upcoming presidential election, because the twat has been saying nasty things for years without consequence.

 

The SCOTUS has ruled that the EPA "unreasonably interpreted" the Clean Air Act to set limits on power plant pollutant emissions, without first considering the costs to the industry to adhere to these limits. Because apparently, we can't regulate or improve anything without first seeing how many more pennies the poor, oppressed, downtrodden corporations will have to scrape together from all their savings to not belch out toxic pollutants and cancerous wotsits. Wonderful.

 

And in a blow to the corrupt, ethically indefensible political practice of gerrymandering, the SCOTUS has ruled against the aforesaid gerrymandering.

 

The Supreme Court ruled Monday that states can try to remove partisan politics from the process of drawing political maps.

 

The decision was a victory for the proponents of independent commissions and a blow for state lawmakers who did not want to be drawn out of the process.

 

Voters in seven states — Arizona, California, Hawaii, Idaho, Montana, New Jersey and Washington — have turned to such commissions in an effort to reduce political "gerrymandering," the map-drawing method that leads to districts easily won by Democrats or Republicans.

[Tani Coyote]

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/national-international/Ted-Cruz-Today-Supreme-Court-Obamacare-Same-Sex-Marriage--310631561.html

 

Ted Cruz reveals his brilliant logic skills, namely by saying he doesn't feel an unelected body should be making political decisions.

 

So what he's really saying is he supports democratic bodies making decisions.

 

But to be democratic, you need everyone to be equal.

 

Which means every person's vote needs to have the same weight in federal elections.

 

Which means the Senate and Electoral College - which primarily benefit smaller, red-leaning states - need to go.

 

Cold feet all of a sudden, sir? Now why would that ever be? The idea of a perpetually Democratic Presidency and House doesn't please you? But it's democratic!

 

The Supreme Court is indirectly elected precisely because batshit people like the Tea Party come to power every so often. Having a non-partisan body that can review federal decisions to make sure they're more or less in line with our ideals is probably one of the best things about American democracy. I see how much shit people have to go through in countries like the UK where there are no independent courts, and holy lord am I grateful for the US Supreme Court, decisions like Citizens United and Plessy v. Ferguson be damned.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

It's all just a political equivalent of them throwing temper tantrums for not getting their way.

[Kevin]

Major developments in the normalization of US-Cuba relations, their embassies will officially reopen on July 20th.

This is a great step forward! Unfortunately, it's going to be a major fight between Obama and Congress over getting the funding to establish the embassy and appointing an ambassador. They've been trying to slip in some riders in must-pass funding bills that would try and derail the progress being made. However, Obama has threatened a veto against it.