The General American Politics Thread

[KHCast]

Surprised how split the Hispanic vote was 

[MadmanRB]

Actually not surprised here, those who are legal have a lot to say about illegal immigrants.

[Tani Coyote]

So. While tonight has been crap overall, I was thinking on some silver linings:

-The President’s Party almost always loses the midterms. The Senate is likely going to turn Democrat in 2018, so the damage is limited to 2 years over 4. The House will likely remain Republican.

-The Democrats still have a strong minority in the Senate, so can fall back on the filibuster to block the worst pieces of Republican legislation.

-Depending on how the Democratic Party perceives what caused the loss, the Democrats might shift leftward or rightward. On one hand, they might see forcing Hillary as a candidate alienated a lot of people and lowered turnout; on the other, they might think moving leftward on their platform is what cost them support.

-Never again can a Republican use “lack of experience” to criticize a Presidential candidate.

-The closeness of so many races will hopefully encourage higher turnout in future races, which favors Democrats.

-2020 is a redistricting year, which might favor Democrats if they take state governments in 2018.

-2020 is likely the more important election based on the odds of retiring/dying SCOTUS justices. A four-term Party hold on the White House is rare, so the Democrats losing 2016 might give them control in 2020 and 2024.

-If the Democrats take the Senate in 2018, they can obstruct Trump and ruin his Presidency and re-election bid (i.e. the same thing the GOP did to Obama the last 2-6 years).

-Outside the federal government: legalized recreational marijuana in California, Massachusetts, Maine and Nevada and medical in Florida, Montana and North Dakota. This is a huge blow to prohibition and the federal government will be under pressure to revisit the War on Drugs, which will benefit minority communities.

Looking forward?

We need to turn out, and turn out hard, in 2018. We don't need to just try and flip the Senate to end the GOP monopoly, but we need to try and flip as many state Governorships and legislatures as possible. If we do that, the Democrats will be in a position to redistrict and break the GOP hold on the House.

So long as there's not some enormous screw up, it should be possible to kick Trump out in 2020. His mandate isn't broad enough to secure re-election, provided the Democrats put someone really good forward. The Democrats will be in a position to seize the House, Senate, and Presidency all in one fell swoop, and we could quite possibly have the White House for two terms.

Also. We need to follow Bernie's advice and aggressively lobby our Congress members. We need to be sure they don't think it was the move leftward that cost the Democrats the election.

[Celestia]

25 minutes ago, WakanoBaka said:

Exactly, people think change happens over night, hell there isn't even a guaranty of any change

Of course there isn't going to be any change overnight. (Especially since he's not even officially the president yet, loool.)

Any immediate consequences are going to be because of assholes who feel emboldened by their guy winning. I won't be too surprised if we get reports of minorities (some groups more than others) being under attack--I mean, more than usual. I'd love to be wrong about that, but we'll just have to wait and see.

Edited November 9, 2016 by Celestia

[Patticus]

@Noelgilvie Any word on the single payer healthcare ballot measure in Colorado? I'm eager to see it pass.

[Tani Coyote]

I'll take a moment to remind people that Executive Orders are incredibly powerful barring speedy Supreme Court review. The President can direct the departments and agencies as he wishes, so long as his Orders are extensions of Congressional law. This is why the EPA is able to pass environmental regulations without Congress signing off on it, for example (though Congress can overrule the EPA at any time).

Trump can do a lot of damage the moment he is sworn in. He can order the military anywhere in the world for less than 60 days if he so wishes.

I'm not saying it'll be the apocalypse, but these next two years are probably going to be shit. Fortunately, a lot of Congressional legislation takes time to take effect... which means we need to seize control of one of the Houses in 2018 so they can short circuit the 2017-2019 Congress' agenda.

@Patticus Colorado rejected the universal healthcare proposal by a margin of almost 80%. I am legitimately surprised.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Alright everyone, so we lost a huge battle.

It's not the end of the war. Hypocrites helped get an inexperienced and potentially moronic person elected as president, so now it's time to fight and show why that was a BIG mistake.

Still this is gonna leave a shockwave. I can't imagine what will happened to all the hard work done prior to now, but I get the feeling it's going to bite this country in the ass and all because people wanted to stroke their egos. I'd love to be wrong on that, but I'm not counting on it.

[WakanoBaka]

6 minutes ago, Celestia said:

Of course there isn't going to be any change overnight.

Any immediate consequences are going to be because of assholes who feel emboldened by their guy winning. I won't be too surprised if we get reports of minorities (some groups more than others) being under attack--I mean, more than usual. I'd love to be wrong about that, but we'll just have to wait and see.

That's a bit of a generalization don't you think?

[Patticus]

Another silver lining to add to your list, @Noelgilvie:

In 2020, Donald Trump will be the establishment candidate. If the GOP suffers big losses in 2018, he may also have to face Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio and other so-called "anti-establishment" candidates in the primaries.

[-Robin-]

Hate crimes got a 41% jump because of Brexit for the day afterward. Don't discount the possibility of a similar hike for the next week given similar demographics.

[Tani Coyote]

I'm seeing some friends of mine advocating looking at the Trump camp's point of view, and how they feel marginalized.

For one, that ignores the fact they're backing someone who will marginalize someone else. For two? Problems haven't been solved for most of Obama's term because of the GOP. The solution isn't to give more power to the GOP.

Those people are idiots. I'm not going to empathize with them. They're not victims. They're victimizing themselves.

But in short. I think this election is the result of emboldened bigotry, a Democratic candidate who has a questionable reputation and who seemed unjustly forced on the Democratic base, and a large amount of disaffected voters who didn't care to back either. Let this be a lesson in coalition building, Democrats.

We really need a new FDR.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Really goes to show how the DNC corruption actually screwed them over, huh?

I suppose next time, they'll learn not to do that shit again.

[WakanoBaka]

6 minutes ago, -Robin- said:

Hate crimes got a 41% jump because of Brexit for the day afterward. Don't discount the possibility of a similar hike for the next week given similar demographics.

It seems like a reach. Kinda like people saying gun control in Japan works as an example of it would supposedly work in the USA. People aren't the same for the most part.

[Celestia]

3 minutes ago, WakanoBaka said:

That's a bit of a generalization don't you think?

...In what way?

[Tani Coyote]

6 minutes ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

Really goes to show how the DNC corruption actually screwed them over, huh?

I suppose next time, they'll learn not to do that shit again.

It just seems so petty in hindsight. Realistically there was no way Bernie was going to get the nomination.

And yet they insisted on pushing the issue, all so they could get a few more weeks of Clinton dominance.

A lot of good it did her. Hope those jackasses are seriously reconsidering what they've done and how they have to really make the GOP out as the bad guys for 2018.

[Dark Qiviut]

>Trump promising to double the growth of the economy

If by "the economy" he means "his penis," then I can see that.

[Patticus]

Clinton's biggest mistake through this whole campaign was having that vegetable Tim Kaine on the ticket, instead of Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, Joaquin Castro or someone else who could rally the base.

[WakanoBaka]

12 minutes ago, Celestia said:

...In what way?

>Any immediate consequences are going to be because of assholes who feel emboldened by their guy winning.

>I won't be too surprised if we get reports of minorities (some groups more than others) being under attack

I mean, how do you know the losing side won't just get mad and start hurting any white red blooded male American they can get their hands on? I've literally seen Hilary supporters attack this old black lady who was a Trump supporter. I've also seen vice versa.

For all we know minorities might rise up and pull a BLM, when they went through that town, burning buildings and attacking any random white person they saw.(That was fucking stupid btw, and they wonder why I don't ride with them)

[Patticus]

Pro Tip for the Democrats: Lessons must be learned now so that the Senate can be flipped in 2018, and an effective presidential bid can be launched in 2020. No civil war, no endless blame game, no continual hand-wringing, just get on with the task at hand.

[Nepenthe]

5 minutes ago, WakanoBaka said:

>Any immediate consequences are going to be because of assholes who feel emboldened by their guy winning.

>I won't be too surprised if we get reports of minorities (some groups more than others) being under attack

I mean, how do you know the losing side won't just get mad and start hurting any white red blooded male American they can get their hands on? I've literally seen Hilary supporters attack this old black lady who was a Trump supporter. I've also seen vice versa.

For all we know minorities might rise up and pull a BLM, when they went through that town, burning buildings and attacking any random white person they saw.(That was fucking stupid btw, and they wonder why I don't ride with them)

Because the losers of large political battles rarely retaliate:

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/06/brexit-increase-racist-attacks-eu-referendum-160628045317215.html

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

And despite everything...I'm not moving to Canada.

...okay, maybe for a visit.

[Tani Coyote]

You know, the DNC really should vote to either cut or eliminate the superdelegates. It would be a strong conciliatory gesture.

They need to reunify the Party, and it looks like not even Trump was enough to do it. They need to admit they really screwed up with their oligarchic tendencies.

I mean, it's pretty damned sad that the GOP is the party of suppression in the general election, but seems to be more democratic in its primary processes, albeit via winner take all. Then again, the GOP is just modeling the general election with their primary choice, unlike the Democrats.

The Democrats probably would have benefited from a winner take all primary system. It would have given Clinton a huge lead and erased the idea Bernie had the nomination taken from him, which has likely played a huge hand in Clinton's defeat.

Now that the Clinton juggernaut is gone, who's going to be the Party favorite?

[KHCast]

7 minutes ago, WakanoBaka said:

>Any immediate consequences are going to be because of assholes who feel emboldened by their guy winning.

>I won't be too surprised if we get reports of minorities (some groups more than others) being under attack

I mean, how do you know the losing side won't just get mad and start hurting any white red blooded male American they can get their hands on? I've literally seen Hilary supporters attack this old black lady who was a Trump supporter. I've also seen vice versa.

For all we know minorities might rise up and pull a BLM, when they went through that town, burning buildings and attacking any random white person they saw.(That was fucking stupid btw, and they wonder why I don't ride with them)

Your credibility was lost when you generalized BLM as a hate group that just destroys shit.

And sorry, but Trump Supporters spout actual hate and are shouting hang the n*gger and are now entitled in their feelings.

[Patticus]

11 minutes ago, Noelgilvie said:

Now that the Clinton juggernaut is gone, who's going to be the Party favorite?

Joaquin and Julián Castro are considered rising stars within the party, delivering speeches at multiple DNCs. I could see one of them running in 2020.

Beyond those two, all I know are the old guard, who will all be too old to run in 4/8 years' time.

[WakanoBaka]

7 minutes ago, KHCast said:

Your credibility was lost when you generalized BLM as a hate group that just destroys shit.

And sorry, but Trump Supporters spout actual hate and are shouting hang the n*gger and are now entitled in their feelings.

I legit don't care about that. BLM is useless because it's nothing more than a useless group/name/hashtag for injustice. A person getting shot for a fucked up reason.It's called racism. Doesn't need a hashtag or a social trend or whatever. All lives matter, and I don't mean the hashtag, I mean everybody is important. Just because I'm black, I'm suppose to support something blindly and willingly just because blacks are in on it?

Answer me this, what makes you think that America(not the government, the people) majority don't care about black lives?

I don't care what Trump Supporters do, they can be racist, problem is if they try to act on it.

 

9 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

Because the losers of large political battles rarely retaliate:

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/06/brexit-increase-racist-attacks-eu-referendum-160628045317215.html

Again, pointing to people that are technically different in this case...