The General 'Murican Politics Thread

[Tani Coyote]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/17/politics/fl-democratic-party-chairman-resigns/index.html

The head of Florida's Democratic Party has resigned due to inappropriate behavior towards women. The behavior includes suggestive remarks, leering towards younger women, and routinely inviting women onto his private jet. It became an informal policy that no woman was allowed to be left alone with him.

It really is Douchebag Takedown Season.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/17/politics/trump-supreme-court-list/index.html

Trump has added five possible nominees to his list of Supreme Court pick choices. This is in spite of no justices announcing retirement, but it's possible he's trying to encourage conservative justices to step down and replaced.

http://www.wbur.org/news/2017/11/15/house-criminal-justice-bill

Massachussetts, one of the most liberal states in America, passed a criminal justice reform bill in its state House. The state Senate has included an amendment in its criminal justice bill that turns police officers into a protected class, establishing a mandatory minimum of one year (and maximum of ten years') imprisonment for assaulting an officer. What few Democrats dissented raised the concern this will complicate police brutality rallies.

This is why the left needs to pay attention to primaries and not just general elections.

 

[Tani Coyote]

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/360946-alabama-governor-believes-moore-accusers-but-will-vote-for-moore-anyway

In what surprises no one, the Alabama Governor has said she will vote for Roy Moore even though she has zero reason to disbelieve his accusers. She insists on waiting for the facts of the case (so, yes, you DO disbelieve the accusers you stupid shit) and also says a Republican is needed in the Senate no matter what.

What the fuck, Alabama.

http://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/361024-gop-governors-up-in-2018-discuss-how-to-keep-trump-away-from-states

The 11 GOP Governors eligible to seek re-election next year are contemplating how to best handle Trump in light of the New Jersey and Virginia races. They're unsure whether to embrace him fully or to stay quiet on him.

Maine Governor LePage (who is disqualified from running next year), gave the tone deaf "he's our leader so we have to stand by him" take.

States in bright red have term-limited Republican incumbents, states in dark red do not. There are decent odds for the GOP being wiped out in Nevada, New Mexico, Florida, Maine, and Michigan, while incumbents running for another term in New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Wisconsin, Illinois, Iowa, and Arizona also have a tough road ahead. Even red states like Kansas could be tossups, as the last Democrat to run for Governor actually came fairly close against the Republican.

Georgia and Tennessee will be interesting races. Georgia's been steadily shifting more Democrat, while Tennessee might have a popular former Democratic Governor running for its Senate seat, which could deliver downballot votes to any Democrat running for Governor.

The GOP has used its control of Governorships nationwide as a bragging point the last 8 years, but the fact many of them can't run for re-election and that Trump is an unpopular President could see the situation radically reversed the day after November 6, 2018.

[Tani Coyote]

http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/20/media/att-time-warner-deal-lawsuit/index.html

The Justice Department is set to sue to block AT&T's acquisition of Time Warner.

It's an unusual move for the government to block mergers that don't have demonstrable harm to consumers, but Time Warner owns CNN.

Naturally, everyone's assuming Trump's personal drama with CNN has a hand in this.

http://www.newsweek.com/americans-dont-trust-cnn-believe-trump-way-less-635426

Just a reminder that despite Trump's war on the media, all major media outlets have a higher net credibility rating than him. CNN has a net rating that is higher by 2 percentage points.

So we can be thankful that while Trump has emboldened the worst of the right to froth at the mouth that the biased media is just now outright fake, most Americans don't buy into that. They buy into the more reasoned take that all media outlets have their biases and so it's useful to follow multiple.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/20/politics/tax-bill-senate/index.html

Rundown of the key Senators on the tax bill. Ron Johnson is a no so far, while Rand Paul has become a likely yes, but routine defectors Murkowski and Collins haven't said where they stand, though Collins has reservations. McCain, Flake, and Corker, the first unlikely to reach re-election and the latter two not seeking re-election, are wild cards who have it out for Trump.

A provision that is costing the support of many Senators is the fact the tax cuts expire in 2025, something included to meet reconciliation (e.g. simple majority) requirements. Add in the fact Trump regularly burns bridges with several Senators who have nothing to lose (3 who aren't interested in re-election and 2 who are extremely popular because of their moderate approach to politics), and this bill has a shaky future.

Even moreso if Jones pulls off an upset in next month's Senate race. A 51-49 Senate will basically toast the Trump Presidency, because now moderates like Collins and Murkowski are in a position to be kingmakers on any law.

He really is a dipshit with his alienation tactics, to say the least.

Also lol at the fact he cites polls when they agree with him.

[KHCast]

He really is a baby 

[SSF1991]

So.

Net neutrality.

What are the odds that that Obama-era FCC ruling goes away?

[Cobalt_Bolt]

Odds are not in our favor if Trump's puppet Ajit Pai has his way.  Hopefully there is enough outrage to stop him from causing the lack of said Net Neutrality that Portugal is going through otherwise it was nice knowing you guys.

[PaddyFancy]

7 minutes ago, Cobalt_Bolt said:

Odds are not in our favor if Trump's puppet Ajit Pai has his way.  Hopefully there is enough outrage to stop him from causing the lack of said Net Neutrality that Portugal is going through otherwise it was nice knowing you guys.

I don't understand. Does that literally mean getting cut off?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-military-transgender/second-u-s-judge-halts-trumps-ban-on-transgender-troops-idUSKBN1DL2J6

Some slightly better news. A second US federal judge has blocked the ban on transgender troops in the military.

[KHCast]

Exactly how did they think this WOULDNT result in a big ass backlash? I mean the republicans are clearly doing whatever the fuck they want and damning the consequences. The pipeline, net neutrality, tax breaks/cuts for the rich, while fucking over the common people,etc. And if anyone actually defends this, then they're fucking lunatics that don't get the fundamental privileges and rights America is supposedly built on. The Republican Party atm is just a bunch greedy rich 90's villains from a Captain Planet episode Jesus Christ. How do people stil claim dems to be the problem?

[8ther]

Wtf?

[Candescence]

While the attempted repeal of net neutrality by the FCC is a given at this point, what isn't so much a given is the whole attempt making it through the courts, because make no mistake, the FCC is gonna get sued immediately after making the decision. They're gonna have to properly justify the decision to the courts, and that's gonna be difficult - it's not the sort of regulatory decision that can be made without proper evidence-based justification (because the Administrative Procedure Act prevents regulatory agencies from making "capricious" decision, to prevent said agencies from just changing position whenever control of the government changes hands), and the Pai-controlled FCC simply doesn't have it.

What Pai and his anti-regulation associates are hoping for is for congress to pass "net neutrality" legislation literally written by the telecom lobby so it's basically worthless. Fortunately, the Dems aren't gonna stand for that bullshit, so that route is still fraught with problems.

Edit: Wired has a good article on why the FCC will have an extremely difficult legal fight on its hands in much more detail.

[SSF1991]

That's probably the first good news I've even heard about net neutrality's fate...

[Sonicfan34]

I generally consider myself a liberal on free healthcare and school, aswell as welfare (with the role that the person actually want to work, if not by councelor or himself then warnings and then discarding support if he/she refuses to actually want to get a job) Like i don't really think of them as socialism since socialism as an ideology is pretty much evil on some absolutes. Its just ideas that happens to have some roots or similarity in it, to me its just about caring or common sense.

What i don't agree with liberals with is the victimhood culture. Like for example i find it annoying that they get mad when addressing illegals, like border or national security is important, if its to keep criminals who simply don't come in legally then get out, easy. The same thing with that crime is somewhat rewarded by the politically correct left in USA which i don't get why they defend? Like if the stats shows criminals being criminals then address it. Its one of the reasons why i kind of am ashamed of the dishonest view they have in the US.

[Tani Coyote]

https://wtop.com/virginia/2017/11/va-elections-board-wont-certify-results-in-2-stafford-fredericksburg-house-races/

Northam and Fairfax have been officially certified as the Governor and Lieutenant Governors of Virginia, respectively, while a discovery that many votes were cast in the wrong districts has prompted 2 of the 100 House of Delegates races in Virginia to be denied certification.

There could be a recount, or two new special elections.

Of the certified results, it's 49-49 towards the GOP. Of the two races not certified, both were won by Republicans, only one narrowly, and with enough votes wrongly assigned to change the outcome.

Democrats have a right to file for recounts in two other races as well, meaning it's possible the Democrats could end up with a 50-50 House, or even a 51-49 majority.

https://wtop.com/virginia/2017/11/after-danica-roems-win-gop-wants-to-end-gendered-titles/

The GOP has said they intend to retire gendered titles in the Virginia House of Delegates, prompted by Danica Roem's victory as the first transgender representative and apparent confusion on how she would be addressed. All delegates would simply be called "delegate" from now on.

Democrats have condemned the decision, no doubt because it seems to stem from a desire to avoid addressing Roem as a woman.

I'd say it's the right thing for the wrong reasons. Screw gendered titles, honestly. The real end goal of the gender debate is retiring it entirely, not reinforcing the binary and telling people "one or the other."

[SenEDDtor Missile]

I think this year and last year have done more to sour me to the notion of a good Republican existing than every other year of my life combined.

[SSF1991]

Quote

What i don't agree with liberals with is the victimhood culture.

What?

 

12 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

Like for example i find it annoying that they get mad when addressing illegals, like border or national security is important, if its to keep criminals who simply don't come in legally then get out, easy. The same thing with that crime is somewhat rewarded by the politically correct left in USA which i don't get why they defend? Like if the stats shows criminals being criminals then address it. Its one of the reasons why i kind of am ashamed of the dishonest view they have in the US.

Again, what? The left has made many arguments about "illegals". I don't even know what this has to do with "victimhood culture" either.

1. There already is border and national security, and it did a good enough job as it was. A wall is very expensive, unnecessary, wil rip apart Americans' homes, destroy the enviornment, and more.

2. "Illegals" have decreased immensely in the past 20 years. It's not the problem that the right is claiming it is.

3. What's also a problem manufactured by the right: that they're "taking your jobs". They're not.

3. Liberals have absolutely no problem with calling out people who commit crimes. I mean, the left called out Kathy's decapitated Trump head "joke"! Every Democrat accused of sexual assault has been told off, and rarely do left-wing criminals actually remain in power. I don't know where you got this idea that "crime is rewarded by the left", because that's just outright untrue.

4. The stats don't show "criminals being criminals" in the "illegals sense". In fact, stats show that Americans born in America, rather than illegal and legal immigrants, are more likely to commit crimes. The problem isn't that "criminals being criminals aren't being addressed". It's that the right keeps scapegoating the wrong people. Like, for example, the many mass shootings are still not addressed. Liberals have been trying to address that, but the GOP doesn't even bother.

5. They get mad because it's racist. That's why. Have you heard of the things said about Mexicans? Trump called them "rapists". If you're insulting a race of people for who they are and what they look like then yes, that's racism. The right seem to think that America should be English-only, where whites work all the jobs and have the power. Anyone of a different color or culture should "get out of the country" because it's "theirs". Again, that would be racism. It's racism disguised as political policy. Because the right knows they can't get away with racism like they used to (part of why they're trying to "Make America Great Again"), so they're trying to sneak it in. And even then, you will find many quotes that really suggest the true motives behind the "illegals" thing.

Long story short the whole illegals thing is simply not true, statistics have actually proven that it doesn't exist, and the right are, well, racist.

[Sonicfan34]

1 hour ago, SSF1991 said:

Long story short the whole illegals thing is simply not true, statistics have actually proven that it doesn't exist, and the right are, well, racist.

Was it the same people who said Trump will not win?. For me American politics is just about populism. You can make up any crap aslong a candidate wins. Really both sides lies about lots of things. But Obama was a terrible president, he did nothing for american workers. As much as you may dislike Trump atleast he got eyes on the balls on that. Fun fact, ISIS is defeated as in Syria and Iraq now. It took Obama 2 years without it resulting in anything. The incompetance of his presidency was what escalated. Bush was terrible too since he started the war, but Obama was even worse for escalating the environment without no solution to solve the problem, he just left, just overall horrible on foreign policies overall. And left are likely sympathizers on that side of terrorists which is the morals of nihilism in a sense. I have a feeling left secretly love ISIS, crime is only ok to talk about if its not minority groups doing it. Lets not hold all people to the same standards is the philosophy of left wing propaganda.

 

Everyone is somewhat a racist since it can justify any form of injustice like against any ethnic minority or majority. But i am against open discrimination just because you are of that race etc to say the least, or if a culture doesn't harm anyone like harmless tradition. Basically the golden rule is a good virtue to use in that case.

[Dizcrybe]

1 hour ago, Sonicfan34 said:

Was it the same people who said Trump will not win?. For me American politics is just about populism. You can make up any crap aslong a candidate wins. Really both sides lies about lots of things. But Obama was a terrible president, he did nothing for american workers. As much as you may dislike Trump atleast he got eyes on the balls on that. Fun fact, ISIS is defeated as in Syria and Iraq now. It took Obama 2 years without it resulting in anything. The incompetance of his presidency was what escalated. Bush was terrible too since he started the war, but Obama was even worse for escalating the environment without no solution to solve the problem, he just left, just overall horrible on foreign policies overall. And left are likely sympathizers on that side of terrorists which is the morals of nihilism in a sense. I have a feeling left secretly love ISIS, crime is only ok to talk about if its not minority groups doing it. Lets not hold all people to the same standards is the philosophy of left wing propaganda.

You sound like a "liberal" in the same sense that Sargon thinks himself to be one. i.e., a neo-conservative reactionary that's too scared to publicly identify as conservative.

One, name one good thing Trump has done for American workers. Cause he sure ain't bringing coal back. Two, since you think the left are sympathizers of terrorists, maybe you'd like to tell us your thoughts on the numerous acts of white terrorism in the US, including, but not limited to, multiple attacks on mosques and Islamic people. Two, perhaps you'd also like to cite evidence, as SSF1991 has, that the left lie just as much as the right or that Obama "escalated" the war?

Also, one of the most notorious terrorists of the previous decade was killed under Obama's presidency. I guess that doesn't count as "anything" to you?

Oh, and since you wanna talk "victimhood" let's talk about how a large part of the white nationalist/supremacist/neo-nazi narrative is that white people are under attack; that their livelihood is being threatened and their country being taken away from them. And all of these people? They voted for Trump. So if you wanna talk about victimhood, we should probably talk about this. After all, "both sides", right?

[KHCast]

I don't know Obama helped me get my gay rights while trump is working hard with his party to restrict rights of people like me. And I'm black and we all know Trump's views of guys like me. Call me biased, but those two things ALONE makes Obama immensely better than Trump.

[Tani Coyote]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/roy-moore-leads-democratic-challenger-in-poll-that-leans-toward-gop-voters/article/2641600

A new poll finds 47% of Alabamans backing Moore and 40% backing Jones. 13% remain undecided.

This would be concerning, but the poll's respondents are 62% Republican and 38% Democrat. That means a sizable minority of Republicans have decided to back Jones or are holding off on fully endorsing Moore.

Of course, the privacy of the ballot box is everything. Those 13% could easily be mostly embarrassed Moore supporters.

We'll know for sure on December 12th.

Moore's odds have been helped by Trump coming out in his defense, as well. Given Trump's popularity in Alabama, it's likely to buoy the campaign.

9 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

But Obama was a terrible president, he did nothing for american workers.

If you have a pre-existing condition, you can get insurance for the same rate as a healthy person, thanks to Obama.

If you're young and working and/or in college, you can stay on your parents' insurance plan until age 26 now, thanks to Obama.

If you're less than twice the poverty level, you can get Medicaid now in most states, thanks to Obama.

If your state has legalized pot, you could largely indulge in it with no fear of federal reprisal, thanks to Obama.

If you were gay, you could marry in all 50 states without worry the federal government would try to change that, thanks to Obama.

If you were brought here as a child and grew up thinking you were American, you did not have to worry about deportation, thanks to Obama.

If you were black, you had the assurance that the federal government would investigate what happened in the event you were shot by police, thanks to Obama.

Obama tried to push for every American being able to buy a Medicare-like plan that was non-profit to reduce costs, only to be sunk by his own Party.

As for Obama's Presidency being largely meh, let's remember he spent 6 years of it was spent with the GOP controlling one chamber of Congress and most state governments  (the House and said state governments promptly being gerrymandered to give Republicans an advantage in future races), and all of them engaged in historically unprecedented obstruction. A lot of Obamacare's failures are most pronounced in red states, not blue states, because the state GOP has refused to cooperate with the federal government.

It's unfair to pin everything that goes right/wrong entirely on Obama, but it should be more apparent than ever from the dysfunction within the GOP - which controls almost everything in this country right now and yet claims "Democratic obstruction" lmfao - that he's not entirely to blame at all for not having a magnificent term.

9 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

As much as you may dislike Trump atleast he got eyes on the balls on that.

That moment when the factories he was promising wouldn't close down have all shut down.

The "jobs growth" Trump is bragging about is actually a continuation of the trend that has been going on for years under Obama.

And the best part of all this? We're almost at the point we were prior to the Great Recession. We're due for an economic crisis in the next 4 years.

Let's see how MAGA Trump is after that.

9 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

Fun fact, ISIS is defeated as in Syria and Iraq now. It took Obama 2 years without it resulting in anything.

Does it occur to you that maybe this isn't because of Trump, but ISIS naturally running out of steam after it pissed off just about every country in the world?

Look at the experience of Germany in the first World War. Economic isolation will not bode well for a war effort in the long term.

9 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

Obama was even worse for escalating the environment without no solution to solve the problem, he just left, just overall horrible on foreign policies overall.

By your logic, Neville Chamberlain was terrible because he didn't drag Britain into a world war after his country was recovering from one.

The fact is, any President would have inevitably been forced to pull out of Iraq. McCain would have been a one-termer if he didn't. The public support for the war just evaporated.

Obama's Presidency was about "change," not fighting in Iraq. He wanted two terms to maximize his odds to pass successful healthcare reform and new social policies.

9 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

And left are likely sympathizers on that side of terrorists which is the morals of nihilism in a sense. I have a feeling left secretly love ISIS,

The left aren't sympathizers of terrorists, so much as we tend to think "blow shit up" is terrible policy.

Because it is.

Money spent on munitions detracts from money that could be spent both on social programs and economic growth in general. So we are more averse to open warfare in this day and age.

The left also realizes that leaving large numbers of troops in Iraq just wasn't a viable strategy. It would have bled us dry and done nothing to fix Iraq's underlying problems.

The fact is Iraq as a country has a large amount of people in it who really don't want to be part of it. Saddam, while a brutal tyrant, kept the country together because he routinely played factions off of each other. Once he was gone, the country naturally became unstable, because now all the various groups were asked to live under a single banner with no strongman around to rein in people who wouldn't cooperate. While a lot of Iraqis have gotten on board with the new government, a sizable minority has not, and that has caused problems.

9 hours ago, Sonicfan34 said:

crime is only ok to talk about if its not minority groups doing it.

Okay, where are you getting this?

The "liberal" media actually overreports crimes committed by minorities.

The SPLC has black supremacists listed as a hate group category.

As for rank and file leftists, it's not so much leftists don't want to address crime, so much as we want to address causes of it.

The gem of "black on black crime," for example. Yes, it is true most blacks are victims of other blacks. But the thing is, a lot of that crime has its roots in white supremacy. Blacks are routinely denied economic opportunities, which will push many towards crime. People who go to prison become more violent and more likely to commit crime because of their altered mentality as well as the fact more doors get shut. Because one's opportunities are linked to social connections, white families have a much easier time escaping poverty usually, as they're more likely to have relatives they can tap for assistance. Blacks are regularly steered away from homeownership that would help them build wealth, and receive unfavorable loan terms that make it harder for them to compete and be successful. All this tends to contribute to majority-black neighborhoods that have worse economic opportunities and emotional factors that lead to... you guessed it, black on black crime.

The right tends to see criminals as demons who must be exorcised. The left tends to see them as victims of circumstance, which is why we generally push for softer terms on less severe offenders, while also trying to, surprise, change the circumstances that cause crime in the first place.

The way the debate is framed is really everything. Consider the word "terrorist." A lot of leftists are pushing to expand that word to include large numbers of white criminals. While this sounds fantastic, we've now created a large group of others that are everywhere in society, which may very well prompt the government to engage in civil liberties crackdowns. It would be better to avoid words like "evil" or "terrorist," because they cause us to see a perpetrator as inhuman, as someone we could never possibly be like.

Leftists don't think people like mass shooters are okay. Not in the least. We want them locked up the same as anyone else. But we do show an interest in studying them and finding out what caused their crime so we can prevent it from happening again. We see criminals as a product of a racist, classist system that could be easily avoided if we changed a few things in how we run our society.

[Tornado]

Alabama voters' insistence on being pro-pedo but anti-choice keeps reminding me of this every time I see it brought up on CNN:

 

[TailsTellsTales]

As somebody who has lived in Alabama, I can say that politics is strongly based on race in Alabama. Even though black and white live together and are very friendly and kind to one another, when it comes to serious issues, they typically segregate never hearing opposing views. I experienced this first hand. Truth is that candidate could be a sack of potatoes and would still get lots of votes simply because the opposite party is viewed that badly.

[8ther]

This is super worrying 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2017/11/21/trumps-new-census-bureau-hire-could-give-the-gop-a-big-boost/?utm_term=.44852e969a66

[SSF1991]

When does Trump do something that isn't super worrying?

[Kevin]

Well this is some story.  A woman approached The Washington Post with a false tale about Roy Moore. She appears to be part of undercover sting operation hosted by conservative outlet Project Vertias. They’re known for conducting “undercover” videos into what they deem left leaning outlets and selectively edit their videos to make it look bad.

[KHCast]

Not surprising that the side shouting fake news is the one doing it.