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Sonic Forces E3 Trailer "The Next Generations" *Huge Spoilers in OP

Badnik Mechanic

By Badnik Mechanic
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ZinogreVolt Shadow the Hedgehog

ZinogreVolt

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In the end its really more about execution than premise for the final boss, but taking down the main villian while he's at his peak sounds more interesting and compelling as a longtime fan of the series than taking down an entirely new threat.

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Kuzu
Kuzu

I feel so sorry for anyone genuinely  excited for this,  because they're gonna get scrutinized so hard lol.   Such a welcoming community.

Badnik Mechanic
Badnik Mechanic

Announcement Day: "It's set in a world where Eggman won!" 3 months ago: "It's you Vs Eggman!"  Last Week: "It's you and your OC Vs Eggman!" Today: "It's you and your OC Vs Eggman...

SSF1991
SSF1991

To you. You even responded to someone that didn't feel that way. Again, to you. And why should this game "need to stop" when this is trying to appeal to potentially millions of people, includin

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Sega DogTagz Amy Rose

Sega DogTagz

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Well, looks like we can look forward to a return to more involved storytelling. Its fairly evident from what we saw in the character chatter in park avenue that each of them are pretty in the dark about what is going on around them, and the new foursome of villains is going to need some explaining.

 

<head canon>

My running theory is that Infinity can manipulate, traverse alternate realities and bring their denizens back with him. A Shadow who still thinks of Sonic as his enemy. A Zavok who still thinks Eggman holds the conch. A Chaos before he was reformed. And throw in Metal Sonic just because you can. Infinity could be a walking Endless Possibilities and that would explain the multitude of Death Egg Robos, Dragoons and the like. 

A real thinker is what he would have been attempting to achieve by bringing Classic Sonic over. There has gotta be a motive there...

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Nepenthe Miles ‘Tails’ Prower

Nepenthe

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Just now, Sega DogTagz said:

Well, looks like we can look forward to a return to more involved storytelling. Its fairly evident from what we saw in the character chatter in park avenue that each of them are pretty in the dark about what is going on around them, and the new foursome of villains is going to need some explaining.

 

<head canon>

My running theory is that Infinity can manipulate, traverse alternate realities and bring their denizens back with him. A Shadow who still thinks of Sonic as his enemy. A Zavok who still thinks Eggman holds the conch. A Chaos before he was reformed. And throw in Metal Sonic just because you can. Infinity could be a walking Endless Possibilities and that would explain the multitude of Death Egg Robos, Dragoons and the like. 

A real thinker is what he would have been attempting to achieve by bringing Classic Sonic over. There has gotta be a motive there...

I would be pretty happy with this, although what I still don't get is Sega's shoe-horning of alternate-dimension stuff.

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Wraith Miles ‘Tails’ Prower

Wraith

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4 minutes ago, Soniman said:

sonic's world and human world are diffrent dimensions, maybe thats what eggman meant :P

Classic Sonic's dimension is treated as a seperate one though so now there's at least 3

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Dr. Detective Amy Rose

Dr. Detective

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1 hour ago, Nepenthe said:

Does the final boss particularly matter? Neither scenario is all that unique or interesting, particularly since most bosses in Sonic- final status or otherwise- are kinda mediocre. It's either going to be Eggman, who has been the final boss the most times in series history, or it's gonna be Infinity/a monster, which is the series' second biggest boss trope.

The most interesting thing they could do is an environmental finale where you have to complete objectives to prevent disaster instead of fighting something. Like, End of the World except not terrible or something.

I care more about making sure the final boss feels awesome and climactic from both a story and gameplay perspective. Eggman being the final boss in Colors and Lost World didn't win those games any points from me. I still thought he was cooler in Sonic Unleashed.

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Sega DogTagz Amy Rose

Sega DogTagz

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3 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

I would be pretty happy with this, although what I still don't get is Sega's shoe-horning of alternate-dimension stuff.

I'd be stoked. It backdoors the character derailment issues and gives you a pretty good reason to punch Shadow in the face

More importantly, it also means the final boss may well be

 

Spoiler

vs Super Classic Sonic

 

Infinity would have had to have been involved in bringing him over. Imagine that guy being the mole that brings the resistance down.

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Nepenthe Miles ‘Tails’ Prower

Nepenthe

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1 minute ago, Sega DogTagz said:

I'd be stoked. It backdoors the character derailment issues and gives you a pretty good reason to punch Shadow in the face

More importantly, it also means the final boss may well be

 

  Reveal hidden contents

vs Super Classic Sonic

 

Infinity would have had to have been involved in bringing him over. Imagine that guy being the mole that brings the resistance down.

I'm...I'm so sad because I'm getting suddenly hyped now for something I'm not even certain is going to happen. Goddamn you, DogTagz!!!

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Sega DogTagz Amy Rose

Sega DogTagz

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@Nepenthe

THE HYPE EXISTS!

NEVER LET IT GO!

 

 

1 down a few more million to go. Who else needs convincing. :P

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Pawn Dr. Eggman

Pawn

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6 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Well, looks like we can look forward to a return to more involved storytelling. Its fairly evident from what we saw in the character chatter in park avenue that each of them are pretty in the dark about what is going on around them, and the new foursome of villains is going to need some explaining.

 

<head canon>

My running theory is that Infinity can manipulate, traverse alternate realities and bring their denizens back with him. A Shadow who still thinks of Sonic as his enemy. A Zavok who still thinks Eggman holds the conch. A Chaos before he was reformed. And throw in Metal Sonic just because you can. Infinity could be a walking Endless Possibilities and that would explain the multitude of Death Egg Robos, Dragoons and the like. 

A real thinker is what he would have been attempting to achieve by bringing Classic Sonic over. There has gotta be a motive there...

I'd be wondering though... where is present Shadow? They could easily explain this away (ie. captured, sent to another dimension) I suppose, but are they really going to go through the effort of telling newcomers why the old Shadow was so pissed?

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Nepenthe Miles ‘Tails’ Prower

Nepenthe

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@Sega DogTagz Now you know 

If Sega doesn't even come close to rectifying these disparate elements in this way

I'm fucking you and Kishimoto up, right?

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KHCast Miles ‘Tails’ Prower

KHCast

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What if infinity can implant or rearrange memories? So he makes shadows memories from SA2 his most current ones, erasing everything else that happened after? 

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Forte-Metallix Knuckles the Echidna

Forte-Metallix

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1 minute ago, Pawn said:

I'd be wondering though... where is present Shadow? They could easily explain this away (ie. captured, sent to another dimension) I suppose, but are they really going to go through the effort of telling newcomers why the old Shadow was so pissed?

I imagine that Infinite is manipulating space/time in such a way that only one version of each character can exist- namely, the ones who want to kill Sonic and can't/won't rebell against Eggman.

That raises the question of why Classic Sonic's here, but I'm willing to bet that was just a fluke- Classic saw the villains messing things up in his time/dimension, so he rebelled and accidentally got sent to the present/modern universe.

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Sega DogTagz Amy Rose

Sega DogTagz

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1 minute ago, Forte-Metallix said:

I imagine that Infinite is manipulating space/time in such a way that only one version of each character can exist- namely, the ones who want to kill Sonic and can't/won't rebell against Eggman.

That raises the question of why Classic Sonic's here, but I'm willing to bet that was just a fluke- Classic saw the villains messing things up in his time/dimension, so he rebelled and accidentally got sent to the present/modern universe.

 

The more likely answer is probably plot armor. While other characters (like the current Shadow) are thrown into limbo when the alternates are introduced, Classic Sonic was probably more than likely spawned as an abnormality.

 

Sounds like something Sonic Team would cook up.

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NegaMix Amy Rose

NegaMix

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Anyone think that Infinite might be an Eggman creation that he made from studying the Time Eater? I mean, he's bound to have kept some notes on the thing, right? Only this time, he uses Infinite to recruit various enemies of Sonic from different timelines (and probably having a way to keep them all obedient), overwhelming the heroes and granting him near-total control of the world.

As for why Classic Sonic and his alternate dimension start appearing... maybe Infinite's power begins to get a little out-of-control, bringing elements of this other dimension into Modern Sonic's world. Whether Infinite does this intentionally or not is unknown.

I dunno. That's just the kind of typical summary that I could imagine from a Sonic game at this point.

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KHCast Miles ‘Tails’ Prower

KHCast

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I wonder if Modern Sonic will mistake this Sonic for Gens Classic at first in a cutscene. Would be interesting to see how they handle that

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StaticMania Amy Rose

StaticMania

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9 minutes ago, Ice Vec said:

So if Chaos is free, that means Tikal might be around somewhere too

No that's not likely...she ascended. Chaos ascended too, but he wasn't dead...so he just stuck around.

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Goldenlink64 Shadow the Hedgehog

Goldenlink64

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8 minutes ago, Ice Vec said:

So if Chaos is free, that means Tikal might be around somewhere too

The idea would be nice but the writer(s) for Forces probably don't even know who she even is.

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Alienrun Rouge the Bat

Alienrun

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5 hours ago, Plasme said:

Finally, a new Sonic game that isn't scared to get a little dark!

I think my opinion is that lore really does hold this franchise down at times. Who cares that Shadow turning dark contradicts lore. Who cares that Chaos coming back contradicts lore. I really think that seeing these cool characters again is good enough in itself. I really couldn't give two hoots to how this contradicts lore. You don't get this in other mascot platformers. You don't get Mario turning down the Koopa Kids because they were beaten in Mario World.

You claim to want a darker story but then turn around and diss the lore? What? The point of having a darker story is because the tension actually matters, what is the point if its retconed every other game?

The reason Mario doesn't have to worry about lore is because Nintendo thinks about there story structure very very VERY carefully every single time, It doesn't have to worry about that because its designed to be flexible and cohesive, Zelda does the same thing and that franchise was a mess to put chronilogically prior to skyward sword. Only the hardcore fans really cared about that, but noone said the story was bad because of that, it was still Zelda and that's what mattered.

Just cause they are doing a darker story doesn't mean they are doing it right. Lore isn't supposed to "hold back" franchises, its supposed to enhance its identity...either Sega gives us good explanations for why Shadow is bad or they give us a new villian (surprise surprise they do both.). The question is less "should shadow be bad?" and more "Is shadow being bad a good thing in this context?"...while we don't know for sure, I don't blame people for thinking its not.

Admitting you don't care about lore (or overlapping stories for that matter) is admitting that your lowering your standards on purpose...and honestly in that regard what right does that give you to call out others for bashing on the story for legitamite reasons? Some of us (including me) are going to enjoy the story anyways...

...that doesn't mean that Sega is doing a good job showing it off right though.

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Mad0Mura Mighty the Armadillo

Mad0Mura

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11 minutes ago, Goldenlink64 said:

The idea would be nice but the writer(s) for Forces probably don't even know who she even is.

I'm tired of people saying Graff and Pontaff wrote the game. The game is being written in Japan, while they're localizing it.

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Goldenlink64 Shadow the Hedgehog

Goldenlink64

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Just now, Mad0Mura said:

I'm tired of people saying Graff and Pontaff wrote the game. The game is being written in Japan, while they're localizing it.

Do you know where you found this out by any chance?

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Kellan Big the Cat

Kellan

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1 minute ago, Mad0Mura said:

I'm tired of people saying Graff and Pontaff wrote the game. The game is being written in Japan, while they're localizing it.

I mean, to be fair:

 

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Celestia Knuckles the Echidna

Celestia

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Writing a script doesn't necessarily mean coming up with the scenario(s), or who does or does not show up.

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