Sonic Forces Impressions

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Lord-Dreamerz said:

Are you talking about the lack of story telling in fan games? Because yeah it is a problem with fan games, doesn't help most fan devs are not artists or story writers and whenever a Sonic fan project does want to focus on story the fan devs at that point often suck at gameplay... and after that you have good handful of the community telling fan devs that story doesn't matter and should not be anything they should focus on.

Yeah, that's a big part of it. There are other things like the ratio of completed 2D games versus 3D ones, which characters I've seen get utilized in the fan projects (surprise, surprise, the ones I like don't get used very often), as well as a varying amount of worry about new levels and locations and what not. Specifically I worry about this more when it comes to the 3D ones. 

Plus, they also don't have Mike Pollock. Gotta have my pops.

[Lord-Dreamerz]

13 minutes ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

which characters I've seen get utilized in the fan projects (surprise, surprise, the ones I like don't get used very often)

Yeah being a big Blaze & MetalSonic fan myself I can relate to being disappointed at only seeing Sonic/Tails & Knuckles being playable over 90% of the time. I thought about many times even starting my own fan game projects... but it's hard to find the time for them when I have other projects I should be working on more.

[Shiny Gems]

I have a question, was the EGX Build any different from the one at Gamescom, by any chance?

[Blue Blood]

4 minutes ago, CrystalStorm51 said:

I have a question, was the EGX Build any different from the one at Gamescom, by any chance?

It was the same build (and the Switch build has been the same since E3). New generally builds include new content, and normally new builds aren't made very often. It's a lot of effort for little gain.

[Shiny Gems]

1 minute ago, Blue Blood said:

It was the same build (and the Switch build has been the same since E3). New generally builds include new content, and normally new builds aren't made very often. It's a lot of effort for little gain.

Are you saying the Switch version was what was at EGX?

[Blue Blood]

4 minutes ago, CrystalStorm51 said:

Are you saying the Switch version was what was at EGX?

The PS4, XB1 and Switch versions were at EGX.

The PS4 and XB1 versions have had two demos - E3 build and Gamescom build. The Switch version has had the same build since E3.

[Badnik Mechanic]

Fun fact:

At the end of each day Sega deleted the demos from the systems.

Meaning each day they had to reinstall them on 20+ systems.

No Sonic 2 beta leak this time.

 

Also I was a bit cheeky and accidentally hit the PS Home button and saw a bunch of beta information, didn't stick around on that screen for long though.

Mind you loads of people were doing it, you could do a similar thing on the Switch version.

[Zippo]

20 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Fun fact:

At the end of each day Sega deleted the demos from the systems.

Meaning each day they had to reinstall them on 20+ systems.

No Sonic 2 beta leak this time.

 

Also I was a bit cheeky and accidentally hit the PS Home button and saw a bunch of beta information, didn't stick around on that screen for long though.

Mind you loads of people were doing it, you could do a similar thing on the Switch version.

Was there anything noteworthy in there?

[Badnik Mechanic]

5 minutes ago, Zippo said:

Was there anything noteworthy in there?

Well it was either a dev console or dev PC tower since it wasn't the usual PS4 home menu and it clearly said debug in small white letters.

There was also a build number, no I don't remember it.

A few other dev and debug options but if you're asking for any Forces spoilers, wasn't any, just your basic dev console info.

 

The Switch debug screen was more interesting, a lot more options on it, but again nothing amazing.

[Eternal EX]

11 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Well it was either a dev console or dev PC tower since it wasn't the usual PS4 home menu and it clearly said debug in small white letters.

There was also a build number, no I don't remember it.

A few other dev and debug options but if you're asking for any Forces spoilers, wasn't any, just your basic dev console info.

 

The Switch debug screen was more interesting, a lot more options on it, but again nothing amazing.

So as of right now. If you preordered the game. Would you get your refund and wait? Or would you keep it and see how the full game turns out? I mean I need a new 3D sonic game. But with nothing popping up and the lack of any other console besides X1, I can't touch Lost world (even though it didn't catch my interest)

[Badnik Mechanic]

7 minutes ago, Eternal EX said:

So as of right now. If you preordered the game. Would you get your refund and wait? Or would you keep it and see how the full game turns out? I mean I need a new 3D sonic game. But with nothing popping up and the lack of any other console besides X1, I can't touch Lost world (even though it didn't catch my interest)

I have not and will not pre-order this game unless Sega releases something which shows off new areas in good detail that satisfies my criticisms.

 

If you have pre-ordered it....

Switch: Get your cancellation in now. It's horrendous.

Everything else: Technically the game runs, but design wise it's awful, I'd probably cancel it since I want to play the game not enter Sonics automated adventure.

 

And I've been waiting since 2011 for a 3D Sonic game on a system I own.

[Dr. Mechano]

3 hours ago, Lord-Dreamerz said:

Are you talking about the lack of story telling in fan games? Because yeah it is a problem with fan games, doesn't help most fan devs are not artists or story writers

To be fair, Sonic Team aren't exactly great story writers either.

[Sonicka]

See, my difference is that having played the thing I now want to pre-order it. The downside is that there is no point as I'm still held up way back in last-gen currently. 

Personally, a few control issues aside (because I can't really lie and say the Sonic Forces was damn perfect), I found it really enjoyable to play and I don't really get where most of the negative fuss comes from... but saying that, I've been like that with most of the Sonic franchise in general (bar perhaps '06 and Boom) so maybe my tolerance is just higher on the Sonic scale of things from Sonic Teams experiments?

I've read both the recent previews on here from EGX and understand where you are coming from to a degree as we were playing the same game... but, I dunno, even with some of it's flailing this never really bothered me. It was easy to pick up and play and complete (well, Avatar takes some getting used too) but that's all I want. As for weather the game was really that bad/good, or the level design was sloppy etc... I dunno, it's subjective really. I just know I liked it which is fine, and gives me a yet another reason to look forward to a new Sonic title when it gets released. 

I will say I found on the scale of Platformers I played at EGX that I did find it as enjoyable as Mario Odyssey - and that game (as polished and different as it is) had it's fair share of problems that irked me, but like Sonic Forces this wasn't enough to knock my excitement and pleasure of playing during the demo.  

[Detective Kaito]

I have to ask, has there ever been a time where the Sonic fanbase said that a Sonic game will be bad but it ended up being great instead? 

[Whatever the WhoCares]

If this game is anything less than a 7/10, my question won't even be "why?" so much as... "how?"

[Dr. Detective]

I'm certainly going to buy it. I'm not opposed to better level design, of course, but I'm a fairly simple person when it comes to Sonic. 

If it feels good in my hands then I'll enjoy it alright. Even better if it has a narrative I like.   

[Badnik Mechanic]

11 minutes ago, Whatever the WhoCares said:

If this game is anything less than a 7/10, my question won't even be "why?" so much as... "how?"

Well...

The Switch version runs at below 30fps in docked mode.

The textures are blurry when the game is not in motion, early ps3 level at best mid ps2 level at worst.

When in motion the textures become even worse.

Then add onto that the boost speed blur effect and graphically you look at the equivilant of chocolate pudding slowly melting onto the screen.

The controls are significantly worse, precision platforming is worse, not helped by the low frame rate.

The loading times are much longer.

And it's £10 more expensive.

 

And that's before we even talk about the gameplay.

26 minutes ago, Detective Kaito said:

I have to ask, has there ever been a time where the Sonic fanbase said that a Sonic game will be bad but it ended up being great instead? 

I had to think a long way back.

But Sonic Rivals.

It's not an absolute masterpiece stunner of a game, but a lot of people believed it would be bad and most everybody else ignored it.

The few PSP owners we had here at the time who had it couldn't stop raving about it. 

Several years later I got a psp and found out they were kinda right, Rivals was somewhere between a good and a great game.

[Detective Kaito]

16 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

I had to think a long way back.

But Sonic Rivals.

It's not an absolute masterpiece stunner of a game, but a lot of people believed it would be bad and most everybody else ignored it.

The few PSP owners we had here at the time who had it couldn't stop raving about it. 

Several years later I got a psp and found out they were kinda right, Rivals was somewhere between a good and a great game.

Huh. Funny story, I actually bought a PSP when I was a kid because I thought Sonic Rivals looked cool, but now that I look back at it, that was a pretty stupid reason cause even though I spent a lot of time on Rivals 1 & 2 (unlocking every card), I still felt that both games were just okay/mediocre, definitely not a reason to pick up a PSP but I still had fun with tons of other games on that system, but I digress.

There has been many times, IIRC, were fans thought that a Sonic game will be good, but it ended being the other way around.

My main point here is that fans have been more or less correct every time they say that a Sonic game will be bad, with, of course, reasoning to back up their claim. That's what scares me, but I hope for once that we're wrong since we haven't seen much of this game.

[Whatever the WhoCares]

30 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Well...

The Switch version runs at below 30fps in docked mode.

The textures are blurry when the game is not in motion, early ps3 level at best mid ps2 level at worst.

When in motion the textures become even worse.

Then add onto that the boost speed blur effect and graphically you look at the equivilant of chocolate pudding slowly melting onto the screen.

The controls are significantly worse, precision platforming is worse, not helped by the low frame rate.

The loading times are much longer.

I'm talking about, "how did the developers regress so badly after having over twice the development time?"

[Badnik Mechanic]

1 minute ago, Detective Kaito said:

My main point here is that fans have been more or less correct every time they say that a Sonic game will be bad, with, of course, reasoning to back up their claim. That's what scares me, but I hope for once that we're wrong since we haven't seen much of this game.

It's never happened then.

You can probably find cases of people saying X game is bad and it ended up being good but in terms of mass consensus...

It's never happened, certainly not on here, the consensus has usually nailed it, especially since we're now more critical on titles.

We've grown to learn why we like games, not just Sonic games, games themselves, and not just Sonic fans, everybody.

Unless a games marketing is especially good or especially bad, I'd say most people call it right all the time.

Just now, Whatever the WhoCares said:

I'm talking about, "how did the developers regress so badly after having over twice the development time?"

Ah right my mistake...

I... kinda know the answer to this but... found out some gossip at EGX but... not sure at the moment how I should say it, if it all.

It's not anything like "They were making Gens 2" (though they probably were) and switched it. 

It's more the plan was gonna be one thing, then ended up being another.

[Indigo Rush]

16 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

It's more the plan was gonna be one thing, then ended up being another.

If you sliiiiiiide some of those deetz into my DM's, I wouldn't mind <3

 

 

 

 

I believe it, though.

[Graystripe2000]

The thing is is, saying something is good or bad is someone's opinion. Those vary from person to person and, as such, a game may not be as good or bad to you as other people say. For example, people hated Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric, but I found the game to be decent.

[Detective Kaito]

29 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

It's not anything like "They were making Gens 2" (though they probably were) and switched it. 

It's more the plan was gonna be one thing, then ended up being another.

I knew it, they were making Sonic Adventure 3.

[Gabz Girl]

Ohhhhh boy! Guess you won't spill the rumour beans until after Forces is released? 

[Eternal EX]

1 hour ago, Son-icka said:

See, my difference is that having played the thing I now want to pre-order it. The downside is that there is no point as I'm still held up way back in last-gen currently. 

Personally, a few control issues aside (because I can't really lie and say the Sonic Forces was damn perfect), I found it really enjoyable to play and I don't really get where most of the negative fuss comes from... but saying that, I've been like that with most of the Sonic franchise in general (bar perhaps '06 and Boom) so maybe my tolerance is just higher on the Sonic scale of things from Sonic Teams experiments?

I've read both the recent previews on here from EGX and understand where you are coming from to a degree as we were playing the same game... but, I dunno, even with some of it's flailing this never really bothered me. It was easy to pick up and play and complete (well, Avatar takes some getting used too) but that's all I want. As for weather the game was really that bad/good, or the level design was sloppy etc... I dunno, it's subjective really. I just know I liked it which is fine, and gives me a yet another reason to look forward to a new Sonic title when it gets released. 

I will say I found on the scale of Platformers I played at EGX that I did find it as enjoyable as Mario Odyssey - and that game (as polished and different as it is) had it's fair share of problems that irked me, but like Sonic Forces this wasn't enough to knock my excitement and pleasure of playing during the demo.  

I kinda agree with you. While I have not played SF, only seen screenshots and trailers. It still catches my interest. Plus the soundtrack sounds great. I mean after going back and playing Unleashed, I need my SONIC fix already. And since I don't own a NES system. Forces and Mania (which I skipped because I wanted 3D) are all I got.