Clark Kent the Wolf Gameplay Topic (Aka, Buddy/Rookie gameplay).

[Badnik Mechanic]

So the guys over at E3 asked us back here in merry old England, "How do you want us to report on Forces" since there was so much which could be covered. 

One thing that I thought would be really useful was an entire section dedicated to the third gameplay style since I didn't think many sites would go into much detail on it. 

Well here it is.

https://www.sonicstadium.org/2017/06/sonic-forces-custom-hero-e3-impressions/

One of the key differences is that this character has 'no special abilities' he relies completely on technology and gadgets to do stuff.

And also... he's not very good to play as...

Quote

Simply put, the Rookie’s jumping physics are awkward and stiff. It is very easy to overshoot or undershoot a jump and unlike other platformers, which allow you to freely maneuver a character after a jump to land more precisely, the Rookie is nearly uncontrollable. Once you jump, your ability to maneuver through the air is severely limited, making it nearly impossible to correct a jump. 

Full impressions at the link.

 

[Blue Wisp]

17 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

. Once you jump, your ability to maneuver through the air is severely limited, making it nearly impossible to correct a jump. 

Coldsteel the Hedgehog has Ghosts 'n Goblins/Castlevania syndrome? 

If so that fucking sucks.

[Bobnik]

Interesting and somewhat concerning preview for the custom character gameplay. Although looking at the IGN gameplay, it doesn't really look like OC is Castlevania-level uncontrollable and looks more like something I can deal with, so whatever. Also I guess stomp might be a problem solver for overshooting, so that might be less of a problem. Also the bird has double jump iirc, so that might improve platforming (which is weird, when only one type of characters have improved platforming capabilities).

Thanks for the impressions for that gameplay style, really wanted to know about it.

[Dee Dude]

So they screwed up the jump? That seriously sucks, at best I could hope they buff it for the final release.

At this point, I gonna find it hilarious that people are still gonna call out the Custom Hero for being "fanfiction tier" when we should know by now that they don't even have any super abilities. Hell, they're already weak on their own so atleast we won't get any "Gary Stu/Mary Sue" remarks.

I'm actually pretty interested we're gonna be having a Batman/Robin type of hero who relies on machinery and gadgets so it's somewhat of a "Badass Normal" case.

Coming from someone who obviously didn't go to E3 and play Forces, I'm not too keen on hearing about 'Rookie' not playing too well since I'm taking people's word for it but I guess I'll try for myself when it comes out.

[NegaMix]

The jumping issues brought up make me wonder... why couldn't ALL the species options have a double-jump? Judging from what's been said, it sounds like it would be very beneficial to the Avatar's gameplay, but they decided to just give it to the Bird species as its gimmick. Seriously? Surely they could've all had a double-jump, and have the Bird's gimmick be some kind of glide or something.

I feel like this may end up limiting what players will do with their avatars once the game's, too. Say that someone who makes a Hedgehog character doesn't like the jumping controls; Will they keep playing with the character they've made, despite the issues? Or would they instead switch to (possibly) better controls with the Bird, but no longer have the character they had in mind when they bought the game?

I dunno, it just seems like this could potentially affect the creativity of the Avatar for some players.

[Multikaris]

So I guess the OC's gameplay is more like how Archie/Fleetway/etc characters would generally play? And the jump stiffness seems like a fun challenge. But on the other hand, I wonder what damage negative reception would cause...?

 

EDIT: Apparently they're still faster than the average platform character? 

[Diogenes]

24 minutes ago, Dee Dude said:

At this point, I gonna find it hilarious that people are still gonna call out the Custom Hero for being "fanfiction tier" when we should know by now that they don't even have any super abilities.

But they're still so good at fighting that they can keep pace with characters that do. You may not get to be Superman, but you do get to be Batman.

That said if they did try to portray the Avatar character as less powerful it'd probably make them less fun to play, so there probably isn't a perfect solution.

[ChikaBoing]

One of the more enjoyable things of the avatar should be the same kinda thing that Adventure 1, 2 (and Unleashed) gave. Unlocking more and more Wispons, animals, customization options (we have confirmed multiple victory poses, different voices) should be a nice motivator for replay value. Dare I say it's like the Chao Garden, with the feedback loop (Rings, Chaos Drivers and Animals to collect in Action Stages to use in Chao).

[Radiant Hero Ike]

I did notice the jumping was a little odd, myself. It is pretty floaty. I feel like it'll probably be more of a problem in 3D, as I got used to the 2D jumping fairly quickly.

That said, they should still probably alter it a bit for more control.

[Sega DogTagz]

After watching the Avatar Park Avenue stage, I gotta say that left me with a good feeling. There seems to be a healthy balance in the utilization of wisps when it comes to traversal and combat. Its already easy to see that if your hunting of collectables (RSRs and who knows what else) your going to have to switch up your arsenal on the regular to find everything. There seem to be so many areas that can be reached with a well timed power-up chain. I like the freedom behind its implementation.

There are really only two things that worry me right now. One is that the CaC runs through a re-mixed version of Sonic's Park Ave only to run past Sonic's finish line into a large new area. I'm all for re-using assets when appropriate, and I'm actually fine with dashing by the same areas with a different character, but the thing that bugs me is that the CaC's stage is significantly larger than Sonic's. If anything, you'd want to lay more track for the guy running at Mach 1, but that isn't the case here. Park Ave Modern is already criminally short and its kind of like a spit in the eye to see the Avatar dash into a new section. That looks like the start of a trend that I pray does not go any farther than that stage. Sonic needs that extra track. At least give it to both of them...

My other problem is the 2D to 3D ratio. I'm willing to tolerate more 2D in the Avatar stages than the modern Sonic ones, but from the two levels we've seen so far its like 80/20 2D. They gotta do a better job creating challenges to tackle in 3D. That could bleed over into Modern Sonic as well