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IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog - Megathread


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Hey everyone. Sadly Sonic The Hedgehog #25 has been delayed to January 29, 2020. The original release date was January 22, 2020. Let’s not be too upset about this! It will definitely be worth the wait!

 

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17 minutes ago, Sonictrainer said:

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"Let’s not be too upset about this! "

 

Anyway, funny how Blaze, Big, and Froggy are on this cover.

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Just now, thumbs13 said:

...Big's not debuting this issue, right? It's one of those lying covers?

Could be. There are 48 pages.

But for real though, he has a story in the annual, so maybe not.

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4 hours ago, Ellipsis-Ultima said:

Aaaaand Issue 25s date is pushed to February 5th.

Holy Crap that was a fast turn around.

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Issue will be $4.99 (according to comiXology), so that must be a misprint. Doubt it's double length or anything though. It probably just has a few extra pages like #13 did.

Double length IDW books aren't less than $8 usually (which is, frankly, too fucking much, but that's another story)

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Issue 24 by far the best issue yet. The artwork was amazing and tangles expressions to be carried by sonic (both saying it and it happening were amazing* and glad starline is finally taking up for himself. He has a lot of potential as his own villian

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31 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

What are your hopes after the end of Metal Virus saga??

It would be nice if Sonic will go off his planet and back to the human world. (Maybe they could draw inspiration from the movie and Sonic could use a ring to go there) I wanna see G.U.N be a thing again. The 'Shadow Fall' arc in Sonic Universe was awesome.

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MetalSkulkBane
35 minutes ago, Myst said:

It would be nice if Sonic will go off his planet and back to the human world. (Maybe they could draw inspiration from the movie and Sonic could use a ring to go there) I wanna see G.U.N be a thing again. The 'Shadow Fall' arc in Sonic Universe was awesome.

Maybe, but hardly because humans were involved. Shadow, rest of the Team Dark and Eclipse, they made the highpoints. Humans were window dressing that smoothed out the narrative, otherwise Shadow would had to steal rocket from Eggman or something (...that sounds kinda sweet).

As much as I hate loosing any narrative element, since everything has potential uses, humans were very MINOR part of Flynn's work on Archie. With exception fo Hope and Snively (and Eggman of course, maaaybe Iron Queen), I can't think of single human or scene with humans (in Archie comics) that I would miss / couldn't remake to work without them.

I don't want to be "your subjective opinion is wrong" sort of guy, but I feel we cry over humans much more than they deserve.

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1 minute ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

Maybe, but hardly because humans were involved. Shadow, rest of the Team Dark and Eclipse, they made the highpoints. Humans were window dressing that smoothed out the narrative, otherwise Shadow would had to steal rocket from Eggman or something (...that sounds kinda sweet).

As much as I hate loosing any narrative element, since everything has potential uses, humans were very MINOR part of Flynn's work on Archie. With exception fo Hope and Snively (and Eggman of course, maaaybe Iron Queen), I can't think of single human or scene with humans (in Archie comics) that I would miss / couldn't remake to work without them.

I don't want to be "your subjective opinion is wrong" sort of guy, but I feel we cry over humans much more than they deserve.

And Pickle

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Maybe this ends with the planet being completely taken over (becoming like it is in Silver's time), and Sonic and friends along with any remaining Sonic's Worldians escaping on Angel Island to the Human World. This was all a way to restore the pre-Two Worlds setting.

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6 hours ago, Marco9966 said:

What are your hopes after the end of Metal Virus saga??

Stories that focus on other characters, namely those who could actually use it.

5 hours ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

As much as I hate loosing any narrative element, since everything has potential uses, humans were very MINOR part of Flynn's work on Archie. With exception fo Hope and Snively (and Eggman of course, maaaybe Iron Queen), I can't think of single human or scene with humans (in Archie comics) that I would miss / couldn't remake to work without them.

There are the scenes where Julian tests out the Ultimate Annihilator, the Gun Commander's niece/daughter/relative, and Segata Sanshiro, off the top of my head.

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CrownSlayer’s Shadow
8 hours ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

Maybe, but hardly because humans were involved. Shadow, rest of the Team Dark and Eclipse, they made the highpoints. Humans were window dressing that smoothed out the narrative, otherwise Shadow would had to steal rocket from Eggman or something (...that sounds kinda sweet).

As much as I hate loosing any narrative element, since everything has potential uses, humans were very MINOR part of Flynn's work on Archie. With exception fo Hope and Snively (and Eggman of course, maaaybe Iron Queen), I can't think of single human or scene with humans (in Archie comics) that I would miss / couldn't remake to work without them.

I don't want to be "your subjective opinion is wrong" sort of guy, but I feel we cry over humans much more than they deserve.

Abraham Tower, Madonna Garnet, and Prof. Pickle.

Also, at least two had knowledge over the Gaia Temples that the entire plot centered on. Humans in Archie were only “minor” in the sense that the cast is mostly dominated by anthros by an overwhelming  margin, not so much the narrative department.

Also, if you can remake a scene without humans, you can remake it without anthros—narratively speaking, that’s not really a deciding factor.

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1 hour ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

Abraham Tower, Madonna Garnet, and Prof. Pickle.

Also, at least two had knowledge over the Gaia Temples that the entire plot centered on. Humans in Archie were only “minor” in the sense that the cast is mostly dominated by anthros by an overwhelming  margin, not so much the narrative department.

Also, if you can remake a scene without humans, you can remake it without anthros—narratively speaking, that’s not really a deciding factor.

I think two out of three of those kinda prove his point. modonna and tower aren't really memorable or interesting or important or necessary. And Modonna in particular, in how and when she was introduced and the reaction to it proves a very blunt point, if GUN isn't in service of team dark existing no really cares and for most people don't serve a narrative purpose worth investigating. And she didn't show up long.  Tower wasn't particularly that important in retrospect either, because don't even need to do that could they be replaced with anthros.... they didn't really need to be there. As I think @MetalSkulkBane suggests that entire story could have been just them stealing a ship going on the black arms ship and beating up aliens and all of shadows insecurities and what not play out the same. They didn't even need to be around.

Prof pickle works because it played with themes of the game, and as well in the comic. The whole thing besides the werehog thing is sonic going around the world and visiting places and people in the human world. Now all of these could have been anthros and I think that would be more visually interesting and I would prefer it. I would genuinely like to see anthros themed around different cultures the only one who kinda has that is knuckles and that's through backstory and arcetecture with angel island a lot of the past echidnas clearly being based on like old central american civilizations like the mayans. But even then knuckles himself is kind of a black slate , and that's the intention. They want these characters to be identifiable to everyone. So while I would like a sonic game with different takes on real world cultures with anthros. I get why proff pickle and the humans in that game exist in that game and in the comics. He's important to the visual themes of that story if not that important to the narrative itself.

GUN doesn't have that luxury , and its why they seem very irrelevant. GUN is a faceless nameless organization that only served to be a government based badguy in comparison to eggman's environmentalist-ruination and dictatorial based bad guy. They served their narrative purpose in sa2 being a part of shadow's backstory and a government based badguy and have actually never had any narrative importance since and that has translated into the comics. Even though flynn has tried to give a crap about them, even he couldn't really make them that narrative important. This is even before sega stepped in the first time. Everything with hope could have just been done with him having a very vivid memory of maria and even outside of hope GUN itself didn't really need to exist. The only purpose it served pre-reboot was why team dark wasn't around for one arc. And post reboot, it served none. And now they are just gone and I feel like given the current problems with shadow and team dark , people are worried about a lot of other things that aren't GUN.

Humans in sonic have never really been that important with very few exceptions and there's a reason for that. They generally serve two narrative purposes

To be an allegory for you to hang out with the sonic character in the story

To serve a very particular thematic purpose for a stint

Outside of that, just kinda window dressing.

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CrownSlayer’s Shadow
4 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I think two out of three of those kinda prove his point. modonna and tower aren't really memorable or interesting or important or necessary. And Modonna in particular, in how and when she was introduced and the reaction to it proves a very blunt point, if GUN isn't in service of team dark existing no really cares and for most people don't serve a narrative purpose worth investigating. And she didn't show up long.  Tower wasn't particularly that important in retrospect either, because don't even need to do that could they be replaced with anthros.... they didn't really need to be there.

His point was that Humans are minor, not unnecessary—that statement could very easily be said for the anthro cast that make up the majority for much of the same reasons.

My point regarding that is because the number of humans that do make a presence—Madonna, Tower, and Pickle—are only minor because there’s several times more anthro characters that do the same, because the number of named humans barely even reaches the double digits.

Just because you can replace them with anthros doesn’t mean they don’t need to be there—that’s not how storytelling works, and you could just as easily say the opposite and use that to make more humans, in which that doesn’t mean anthros are unnecessary either. If you can turn those humans into anthros...that just means you turned them into anthros—they’d still have the same minor appearance regardless. 

Lanolin the Sheep, for example, isn’t important just because she’s an anthro. She’s still a background in a even lesser role than the three humans I listed.

And by virtue of Madonna and Tower playing narrative roles and moving the plot along, they by all rights and purposes are important and necessary in the context of their appearance—one is the Commander in Chief of a military force and the head boss of Team Dark (which by association makes him very important since he’s giving them their orders), the other is an internal affairs officer keeping track of possible sabotage from a wildcard in their ranks that could destroy them from within if they’re not careful. Those are not roles to brush off and ignore as unimportant, even if you yourself aren’t captivated by that, as being memorable or interesting is subjective. They’ve barely gotten to do much because Archie ended by the time Ian could even do more with them, but he was definitely setting something up given Madonna’s interrogation of Snively by Tower’s orders.

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MetalSkulkBane

Pickle could been easily replaced with Relic if she wasn't busy. Heck, Uncle Chuck could just visit library and fins Gaia Manuscripts. I guess some people like Pickle, but I never got why his cucumber sandwiches are so funny.

Madonna and Amanda Tower exist, but leave no impact.  Station Square could been populated by Mobians and saved by new FF side-group and story wouldn't be poorer in anyway. Same goes for any human key-guardian.

So after reading @Conquering Storm’s Servant and @Shadowlax posts I'm not even sure if we disagree or not.

My point is that lack if humans in IDW might be annoyance, but not problem that needs instant fixing. If comics goes for 100 issues without GUN or Pickle, I'll  be just fine. Maybe Shadow won't be able to talk about Maria again, but
1) "Modern" Shadow seems unable of emotions like that anyway
2) but if he can, I'm more than happy to see Shadow do something new other than brood about his past.


With that said, I agree that humans mostly COULD be removed. To me in most of Sonic continuities they have only 2 significant roles
1) As background for Eggman and expansion for his family (SA2, thus link to Shadow, Hope, Snively and thus Iron Queen). But Eggman works just fine without those elements. Some stories can't be told (sucks), but plenty other await.
2) As background for Shadow (GUN), cause SA2 was good, but already a strangely dark story and replacing human soldiers with rabbits wouldn't make contrast less jarring. And him working for GUN was a very handy plot device.
Anyone else CAN be humans, but just as easily could be Mobians. We would avoid some drama with Elise. I bet Shara and Merlina would be more popular as well.

On 1/20/2020 at 3:28 AM, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

Just because you can replace them with anthros doesn’t mean they don’t need to be there—that’s not how storytelling works, and you could just as easily say the opposite and use that to make more humans, in which that doesn’t mean anthros are unnecessary either. If you can turn those humans into anthros...that just means you turned them into anthros—they’d still have the same minor appearance regardless.

Trrrrue, but you can't turn Sonic or Blaze into human, and even if you can, few people will be glad. This is franchise about talking animals, it's save to assume that we prefer mobians.

No one played Star Fox and thought "this game would work better if Peppy was a human".

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