Megathread IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog - Megathread

[Kazhnuz]

17 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

The movies are possibly the biggest thing to ever happen to the franchise. They aren't going to stop with a prequel miniseries & a small collection

And the movie has been affecting them. Colors Ultimate only exists because the movie was a hit.

Yes, and it's why I talked about "using the visibility boost from the movies and targeting the children that have seen the movies". But we haven't seen yet proof that it influence the actual work (except some bonus), with stuff like asking for some actual type of stories from the comics.

Especially as the perfect moment to really use that would be when the movies is fresh, and that we can count that the IDW 50 (which end the current storyline) will be over in June. Maybe they'll be a Knux arc after that (tho the movies might not be the only cause of it if it happens, as people start asking for Knux since a while as he have only been in the Metal Virus finale for the moment since Y1)

[CertifiedNobody]

12 minutes ago, Kazhnuz said:

Maybe they'll be a Knux arc after that (tho the movies might not be the only cause of it if it happens, as people start asking for Knux since a while as he have only been in the Metal Virus finale for the moment since Y1)

Ian Flynn actually confirmed there's one coming in the future.

[SkyHorizon]

5 hours ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

You know, discussion is based on saying arguments, not "nu-un, you're wrong" and ending your post.

if in your opinion Adventure Amy was NOT exited and emotional civilian, introduced through Sonic to amazing world of adventures and willing to break personal space of people she likes, then please explain who she was.

Uhm... actually, just a couple of points:

1. @Kaotic Kanine didn't say that, his quote was: "-Both are highly energetic and passionate girls with the frequent tendency to glomp others (much to their discomfort), running about enthusiastically, and rousing spirits.". Now, if you think this description fit Amy, please feel free to do it. Just don't change it to "exited and emotional civilian, introduced through Sonic to amazing world of adventures", which is a far more fitting description for Amy but it's so bland that it could apply to... pretty much to half of the cast  (and that's why you had to add "willing to break personal space" like it was a character trait).

2. The @Kaotic Kanine quote I answered that way was: "then you were not around in the Adventure Era and you're wrong". It was a random statement without any beef behind it. Of course I answered the same way. But I can elaborate why I think he was biased if you want.

[Silvereyes]

5 hours ago, CertifiedNobody said:

Personally I hope Kit doesn't get redeemed.

Could be interesting if Kit was made out to be true neutral. Doesn't care about Sonic or Eggman or Starline, doesn't care about good or evil, just wants to be left alone and do his own thing. Surge is the psychopath, Kit is the sociopath.

[Kuzu]

2 hours ago, CertifiedNobody said:

The first movie was expected to flop so they didn't have much merchandise planned in general, and it also didn't really have much to influence in the first place. The only thing that could be added was Warp RIngs, which weren't really a selling point of the movie anyways. Sonic Movie 2 is being pushed much harder than the original was, and Tails and Knuckles are pretty much the entire point of the movie.

With the first movie, viewers who saw Sonic fighting Eggman would pick up the comics and see exactly that. With the sequel, they'll see Knuckles being an outright villain and then the three teaming up, but when the hop over to the comics, the characters that were treated like a big deal for months will often be secondary to characters they've never even heard of.

Whether you think they should or not, there's plenty of reason for Sega to want the comics to at least partially represent the movies. It happens with Marvel and DC whenever they have a big movie. Obscure characters get redesigned and relaunched, known characters get changes like Spider-Man briefly gaining organic webs to match the 2000s movies.

 

I could see small references here and there, but Sega have never shifted the main games all that much to resemble any alternate media. The closest you got was Shadow using his inhibitor rings from Sonic X, but that's a Sonic Team supervised product and had most of the staff working on it.

 

Sega tends to....not really care? I agree that it would be good marketing, but Sega and logical business decisions are never there lol. 

The games and comics are just gonna keep doing their thing. If anything the opposite happens.  The games influence the alternate media.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Keep in mind, we’re also getting a separate Sonic cartoon next year as well. Unless that also has a connection, neither the movie nor the cartoon are likely to influence the comic.

[Zaysho]

IDW is already doing something for the movie by giving it its own mini-series. That is the best promotion it can get. If kids see two Sonic comics they'll probably want both anyway.

[Sega DogTagz]

2 hours ago, CertifiedNobody said:

 the movie has been affecting them. Colors Ultimate only exists because the movie was a hit.

What? Isn't that more than a bit of a reach? 

The videogame market has been on a full blown remake/rerelease fad for at least half a decade now. It was only a matter of time before Sonic got in on it. ReColors was an inevitably. 

If anything, Origins is the release looking to cash in on the movie, since it looks to be timing it's release accordingly. 

[Rabbitearsblog]

3 hours ago, CertifiedNobody said:

How much of an impact will the second movie have on the comics? We know they're doing a collection of Sonic and Tails stories and a prequel comic. But a lot of the marketing (such as the leaked Fall Guys skin and the upcoming Jakks Pacific Movie Sonic & Movie Knuckles 2-pack) has been pushing Knuckles, I could see Sega requesting greater emphasis on the Sonic and Knuckles rivalry to appeal to movie fans, and more stories about Team Sonic as a whole.

The second movie probably wouldn't have that much impact on the comics.  For many years, SEGA never really implemented anything from other media into the games.  The closest they implemented was having the same voice actors from Sonic X come in and voice the characters in the games.  Heck, if anything that wasn't from the games impacted the games, we would have seen the Freedom Fighters pop up in the games by now.  Anyway, like everyone else mentioned, IDW is doing a prequel series for the movie sequel which seems separate from the mainline IDW comics.  But I think that that's the closest they will ever get with the movie impacting the comics.

[CertifiedNobody]

27 minutes ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

Keep in mind, we’re also getting a separate Sonic cartoon next year as well. Unless that also has a connection, neither the movie nor the cartoon are likely to influence the comic.

27 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

IDW is already doing something for the movie by giving it its own mini-series. That is the best promotion it can get. If kids see two Sonic comics they'll probably want both anyway.

I think you're missing the point. It's not specifically about promotion, it's about the main characters of the movie also being the main characters of the movie. Knuckles has a lot of hype right now, the most attention he's had since the 90s, and Sega will want that to carry over to the rest of the franchise.

Knuckles and Team Sonic are being introduced to hundreds of millions of people once the movie comes out and if Sega cares about small things like making Shadow the way he is and redoing Sonic's art in an issue to keep him in-character, they'll certainly want their "new" rival and the big finale team up to take high priority in the comics.

34 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

What? Isn't that more than a bit of a reach? 

The videogame market has been on a full blown remake/rerelease fad for at least half a decade now. It was only a matter of time before Sonic got in on it. ReColors was an inevitably. 

If anything, Origins is the release looking to cash in on the movie, since it looks to be timing it's release accordingly. 

Iizuka's explicitly stated in an interview that Colors Ultimate only exists so that new fans from the movie can have an introduction to Sonic.

33 minutes ago, Rabbitearsblog said:

The second movie probably wouldn't have that much impact on the comics.  For many years, SEGA never really implemented anything from other media into the games.  The closest they implemented was having the same voice actors from Sonic X come in and voice the characters in the games.  Heck, if anything that wasn't from the games impacted the games, we would have seen the Freedom Fighters pop up in the games by now.

None of those were big budget Hollywood movies that revitalized the franchise and are creating millions of new fans. The Freedom Fighter are an especially bad example as Sega hasn't approved of them since the 90s and the comic staff had to fight to keep them around as long as they did.

[Zaysho]

26 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

I think you're missing the point. It's not specifically about promotion, it's about the main characters of the movie also being the main characters of the movie. Knuckles has a lot of hype right now, the most attention he's had since the 90s, and Sega will want that to carry over to the rest of the franchise.

Knuckles has been central in the promotion of this series for so long, across multiple media and games (many of which you have to question why he's even in them), and already shows up plenty in the comic as it is. He isn't some underused character like Mighty or Nack.

  

20 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

Iizuka's explicitly stated in an interview that Colors Ultimate only exists so that new fans from the movie can have an introduction to Sonic.

That isn't what he meant, and moreover if anyone's mastered marketing speak it's Iizuka. Colors Ultimate was going to release regardless of the movie. The original is one of the better received games in the series' recent history, it's easy for the series' target demographic--kids--to get into, and it hasn't had an official means to be played on modern platforms, let alone in HD. Even games like the Adventures, Unleashed and Generations all have those. It wasn't done with the explicit purpose of tying into the movie, but the movie helped. There's a difference.

[Kuzu]

I think you're severely overestimating how much Sega cares about the movie. I can see them advertising it, but the shifting the entire focus of the franchise around it?

 

And besides, Knuckles is already a main character as far as marketing is concerned. They've been using the Team Sonic iconography in marketing forever, they were literally just in Team Sonic Racing a little over two years ago. 

 

Like relax, the series isn't gonna shift that much 

[Mauro Fonseca]

4 hours ago, CertifiedNobody said:

The movies are possibly the biggest thing to ever happen to the franchise.

I feel you might be losing your sense of perspective and proportion somewhat, here, if you're arguing the movies are bigger for the franchise than something like Sonic 2 being released back in the day.

[Rabbitearsblog]

4 hours ago, CertifiedNobody said:

And the movie has been affecting them. Colors Ultimate only exists because the movie was a hit.

While I agree that the movie was responsible for the decision to do a remaster of Sonic Colors Ultimate, the movie itself never affected the story of Sonic Colors. The only thing that they added to Sonic Colors Ultimate that involved the movie was some skins for Sonic like the electrical powers and provided a Baby Sonic keychain if you pre ordered this game.  Other than that, the story and the characterization of the characters remained the same as the original game.

[Kuzu]

Like, I'll fully admit the movie is the most culturally relevant Sonic has been in years. But I think its pretty backwards to think the games will reflect the movies, its more accurate to say the movies will start reflecting the games.

[Rabbitearsblog]

2 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Like, I'll fully admit the movie is the most culturally relevant Sonic has been in years. But I think its pretty backwards to think the games will reflect the movies, its more accurate to say the movies will start reflecting the games.

I agree.  They are already making the sequel more video game accurate by having a plotline similar to Sonic 3 and Knuckles, so I can't see SEGA wanting to change everything in the comics to fit into the world of the movies. 

[CertifiedNobody]

20 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

Knuckles has been central in the promotion of this series for so long, across multiple media and games (many of which you have to question why he's even in them), and already shows up plenty in the comic as it is. He isn't some underused character like Mighty or Nack.

Even though he hasn't appeared in the main comic in over a year?

21 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

That isn't what he meant, and moreover if anyone's mastered marketing speak it's Iizuka. Colors Ultimate was going to release regardless of the movie. The original is one of the better received games in the series' recent history, it's easy for the series' target demographic--kids--to get into, and it hasn't had an official means to be played on modern platforms, let alone in HD. Even games like the Adventures, Unleashed and Generations all have those. It wasn't done with the explicit purpose of tying into the movie, but the movie helped. There's a difference.

It didn't begin production until after the movie, and you're just speculating that it would release regardless.

22 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

I think you're severely overestimating how much Sega cares about the movie. I can see them advertising it, but the shifting the entire focus of the franchise around it?

I don't think I am. They've been working closely with the crew this time around.

24 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

And besides, Knuckles is already a main character as far as marketing is concerned. They've been using the Team Sonic iconography in marketing forever, they were literally just in Team Sonic Racing a little over two years ago. 

And what else before or since? Free Riders maybe? I don't know, I haven't played it. And marketing doesn't mean much. infinite was marketed as an intriguing and intimidating character, and he's yet to live up to that potential.

27 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Like relax, the series isn't gonna shift that much 

I wasn't expecting a massive shift. I was expecting greater emphasis on Tails, Knuckles, and their dynamic with Sonic given the massive emphasis it'll have in the movies.

 

14 minutes ago, Mauro Fonseca said:

I feel you might be losing your sense of perspective and proportion somewhat, here, if you're arguing the movies are bigger for the franchise than something like Sonic 2 being released back in the day.

Bigger than Sonic 2? Unless we're talking about it in a "If this thing didn't exist than your thing wouldn't either" way, the movie is much bigger for the franchise than any single game. Maybe not for fans, but it's been huge in revitalizing the franchise for the public and creating new fans. 

 

16 minutes ago, Rabbitearsblog said:

While I agree that the movie was responsible for the decision to do a remaster of Sonic Colors Ultimate, the movie itself never affected the story of Sonic Colors. The only thing that they added to Sonic Colors Ultimate that involved the movie was some skins for Sonic like the electrical powers and provided a Baby Sonic keychain if you pre ordered this game.  Other than that, the story and the characterization of the characters remained the same.

Well yeah, it was a remaster, not a remake. The first movie only focused on Sonic and Robotnik, and guess who the main characters of Colors are? There wasn't really a lot to change aside from adding some electrical effects. The second movie is another situation altogether.

5 minutes ago, Rabbitearsblog said:

I agree.  They are already making the sequel more video game accurate by having a plotline similar to Sonic 3 and Knuckles, so I can't see SEGA wanting to change everything in the comics to fit into the world of the movies. 

It's not about changing the actual world, I don't expect Tom to pop up or Sonic to blast Eggman with electricity then floss on his corpse. I expect characters who are receiving a lot of attention in the movies to become more significant elsewhere.

[Zaysho]

13 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

Even though he hasn't appeared in the main comic in over a year?

So this character that is mandated to stay on his island for the first time in over twenty years, per the writers themselves, and only show up when there's trouble--like he normally does in most media except for Boom and most of the games--is suddenly underused?

13 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

It didn't begin production until after the movie, and you're just speculating that it would release regardless.

So I'm just speculating but you know for sure that the game only began production after the movie came out. Got it.

[Rabbitearsblog]

36 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

It's not about changing the actual world, I don't expect Tom to pop up or Sonic to blast Eggman with electricity then floss on his corpse. I expect characters who are receiving a lot of attention in the movies to become more significant elsewhere.

I do think that yes, there will be some characters getting a lot of focus in the comics, like Tails and Knuckles since they are in the movies.  However, I don't see other characters like Blaze, Silver, Tangle, Whisper and many others being pushed to the wayside any time soon because of the movies.

[Kuzu]

44 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

Even though he hasn't appeared in the main comic in over a year?

It didn't begin production until after the movie, and you're just speculating that it would release regardless.

I don't think I am. They've been working closely with the crew this time around.

And what else before or since? Free Riders maybe? I don't know, I haven't played it. And marketing doesn't mean much. infinite was marketed as an intriguing and intimidating character, and he's yet to live up to that potential.

I wasn't expecting a massive shift. I was expecting greater emphasis on Tails, Knuckles, and their dynamic with Sonic given the massive emphasis it'll have in the movies.

Since...literally forever? Knuckles has always been used in advertising my guy. He's a classic and well known character long before the movie was relevant, unless the movie substantially changes his core, I don't see it changing much.

 

Even the dynamic of Team Sonic isn't all that underutilized. As I said, they were literally just in Team Sonic racing, and Sega uses that iconography on their products.

 

You're setting yourself up for disappointment if you think the entire franchise is just gonna start downplaying every other character and drop plotlines to focus on Team Sonic.

[Diogenes]

54 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

I expect characters who are receiving a lot of attention in the movies to become more significant elsewhere.

The characters who are in the movies are already among the most significant characters elsewhere in the series. That's why they're in the movies in the first place.

[CertifiedNobody]

57 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

So this character that is mandated to stay on his island for the first time in over twenty years, per the writers themselves, and only show up when there's trouble--like he normally does in most media except for Boom and most of the games--is suddenly underused?

It doesn't matter if there's a valid and canon reason for him not to be there. What matters is that he isn't there. We've gone though the discussion about Knuckles' role and how it's hard to write around it, but compare Knuckles' appearances so far to TSR, Heroes, Sonic X, the Adventure games, and Archie. In those, he's absolutely a main character, here, he's not. Sure, he's not nearly as underutilized as Fang or Mighty, but he's still by far the least utilized main character.

57 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

So I'm just speculating but you know for sure that the game only began production after the movie came out. Got it.

The difference is I'm getting my info from interviews, your argument is that Iizuka's just saying stuff and that it doesn't mean anything because you said so.

18 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Since...literally forever? Knuckles has always been used in advertising my guy. He's a classic and well known character long before the movie was relevant, unless the movie substantially changes his core, I don't see it changing much.

Sorry but I don't understand what you're arguing here.

18 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

Even the dynamic of Team Sonic isn't all that underutilized. As I said, they were literally just in Team Sonic racing, and Sega uses that iconography on their products.

But it's just advertising. I'm not saying that Sega doesn't acknowledge or use the team at times, but what I am saying it that in a lot of media, particularly the IDW comics, it's been heavily downplayed, and we never actually see the trio together AS Team Sonic, when both Team Dark and Team Chaotix have been shown off.

18 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

You're setting yourself up for disappointment if you think the entire franchise is just gonna start downplaying every other character and drop plotlines to focus on Team Sonic.

32 minutes ago, Rabbitearsblog said:

I do think that yes, there will be some characters getting a lot of focus in the comics, like Tails and Knuckles since they are in the movies.  However, I don't see other characters like Blaze, Silver, Tangle, Whisper and many others being pushed to the wayside any time soon because of the movies.

Thee point was never that plots would be dropped and characters would be ignored, it was that (Presumably after Imposter Syndrome and the buildup to issue #50 is done) We'll see Team Sonic in action as a group at least sometimes, Knuckles will be given a bit more of a focus, and we'll see him working alongside people like Whisper or Silver more.

12 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

The characters who are in the movies are already among the most significant characters elsewhere in the series. That's why they're in the movies in the first place.

I agree, but the comics are the only constant in the franchise. Games only happen every few years and TV shows are even more inconsistent. At the moment they have a team that's been underutilized but will be the main focus of a massive movie that'll bring in tons of new people to the comics. Does it not seem reasonable to have "Sonic's cool rival" be given a slightly bigger role?

[Mauro Fonseca]

1 hour ago, CertifiedNobody said:

Bigger than Sonic 2? Unless we're talking about it in a "If this thing didn't exist than your thing wouldn't either" way, the movie is much bigger for the franchise than any single game. Maybe not for fans, but it's been huge in revitalizing the franchise for the public and creating new fans. 

The franchise would have been dead 30 years ago without games like Sonic 2, yes.

 

Also this is a bit of a cold conversation now but I went to sleep before saying this, but when people were talking about Surge being more popular than Kit or whatever:

While obviously I think part of it is just that Surge's an extravert and very clearly action active character who's fun to draw running about and sparking and in action poses, plus the delinquent-esque attitude and attire, while Kit's demure-er and more quiet going by what you guys have to work from so far, I think part of it also falls simply on this:

Surge is my first big character design assignment on this franchise. As said before, she was co-designed with Evan just like how I co-designed Kit (and obviously Sega and IDW editorial and Ian had input), but the final Surge design and the general direction beyond Ian's initial pitch is mine. Counter that, Kit's the same but for Evan.

Surge obviously appeals a lot to me as a character design, having a lot of traits that people pointed out to me I reuse a LOT; I like Kit too but don't have as direct a connection (though odds are if I ever get to draw a story with him I'll grow more attached, I tend to do that to characters I have to draw repeatedly).

As a result, as soon as she was public, I talked about her more. I posted doodles, I posted an influence sheet, a couple gifs. This coupled with her very fun-to-draw big action energy having caused a few other IDW artists doodling her meant there was more behind-the-scenes and pseudo-official material of her to start with for the public audience.

Evan on the other hand is more mature with this, more experienced. Kit's a design she loved doing but is also not the first time she designs a big important character for this franchise. So she didn't feel the need to go and speak so openly about him. There's no big twitter thread about her influences in designing Kit, or concept art doodles, or gifs explaining his power. She's saving all that stuff for whenever the comic's out and whenever IDW Marketing posts the character model sheets, I'm sure.

So, entirely unintentionally, I feel we inadvertently caused this disparity in reception, somewhat. I immediately put nearly all my cards on the table and went "look, Surge!". Evan's holding her cards back, so people don't know what to make of Kit as well yet.

Luckily I think things'll balance out as soon as Imposter Syndrome starts coming out, as you guys will get a good view of both characters and their fun dynamic.

[Wraith]

The movie definetly eclipses fandom darlings like Unleashed in scope, but Sonic 2's reach shouldn't be understated. That game made Sonic an international success and carried Sega on it's back along with it. There's a reason that, when the franchise was on a downturn in the 2000s, they pivoted hard to imagery from Sonic 2. 'Sonic and Tails vs Eggman' is what comes to mind when a lot of people think of Sonic. It's the most beloved Sonic has ever been. People line up to buy new versions of it on every platform. It's more important than any of the games released after it combined, and I'm counting fandom darling Sonic 3 in that.

Sonic 2 is the reason you had the freedom fighters, Sonic the Comic and the OVA(all...liberal adaptations that still make Sonic and Tails's friendship a focal point.) It's the reason a Sonic movie is even a viable concept. There's a reason the film series is placing a lot of emphasis on Tails in the logo for the second one.

[Meta77]

I would not go that far haha. Sonic 2 i s good and I have good memories of it as a kid in the 90s but would not put it as a game id "line up" for every release. Though it was a big reason but Sega at times reads things wrong. It why instead of seeing Chao come back they keep putting wisp in everything and classic sonic. Seriously still baffled why he was brought into forces.