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IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

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8 hours ago, RictalRose0 said:

Well, i'll wait for a full interview on that to see what else they have to say.

It depends on how cool Sega is with it I suppose. They did have to be convinced Post-Reboot after all. Here's hoping though.

Anyway both of these seem pretty believable. I wouldn't be surprised if somewhere down the line they did try to negotiate Archie Reprints but that is such a mess right now I doubt they're going to bother at this moment.

Going straight reboot makes a ton of sense though. Sell the book on it's own merits and not deal with the baggage* of Archie. 

*Read as Penders/Fulop and Paul Kaminski's ridiculous suggestion that the Reboot still be tied to the old continuity instead of starting fresh not as the Freedom Fighter and OC's.

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3 minutes ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

Again, gonna wait for official word from IDW.  But if that is the route SEGA wants to go, again I have no need for a 32 page ad.  I'll stick with better books.

 

Though the book might still be salvagable if they just ditch the blue hedgehog and make Amy & Blaze the main characters. XD

Comic books based on liscned  products are almost always adds. The fact that the the book was deviating so much was it failing to do its job correctly. Folks are there for the characters and things that brought them into the franchise in the first place. So they are gonna make a book about that, because that's whats gonna sell, and that's what a lot of folks want

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28 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Comic books based on liscned  products are almost always adds. The fact that the the book was deviating so much was it failing to do its job correctly. Folks are there for the characters and things that brought them into the franchise in the first place. So they are gonna make a book about that, because that's whats gonna sell, and that's what a lot of folks want

No, the good ones aren't.  IDW does plenty of frsnchised books that aren't ads. The classic Disney books,  Star Trek, TMNT, Transformers, etc.  

 

If all your book does is serve as an overglotified ad than it is not worth the paper its printed on.  Thats why a lot of other liscensed comics failed in the 80's & 90's.  You have to create your own unique identity other wise readers have no reason to pick your book up.

 

 But hey, at least we still have Sonic Boom for at least another season, so there will be at least one worthwhile thing in the franchise till the end of the decade. XD

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Just now, SonicComicFanboy said:

No, the good ones aren't.  IDW does plenty of frsnchised books that aren't ads. The classic Disney books,  Star Trek, TMNT, Transformers, etc.  

Those are yes, all ads for other products. You don't think the the disney books, MLP and transformer books aren't toy and merchandise commercials, you need to think again. Yes these stories may have depth, be well written , and you make like them. But that's what they are, they are to get you to potential engage with another product, its a company trying to get you to give them more money by providing a you a service you make like and may interest you in another product to give them more money. They are not your friends, and artistically driven as some maybe, they are businesses and businesses run on money. 

Just now, SonicComicFanboy said:

If all your book does is serve as an overglotified ad than it is not worth the paper its printed on.  Thats why a lot of other liscensed comics failed in the 80's & 90's.  You have to create your own unique identity other wise readers have no reason to pick your book up.

You shouldn't probably stop reading most comic books, from about... the 80's forward.  And stop watching most cartoons from about the 80's forward. Especially the ones now. Because that's what a good chunk of them are. The mlp cartoon is a fine show, that lauran Faust helped make because she liked MLP as a child, it is also a toy commercial. Being ad doesn't mean that you can put care or interest in your work. People pay thousands of dollars to go to college just to learn how to create add's correctly. 

You sound like you have an attachment to businesses who don't really care about you. Just your dollerydoo's. And that's no good.

Just now, SonicComicFanboy said:

 

 But hey, at least we still have Sonic Boom for at least another season, so there will be at least one worthwhile thing in the franchise till the end of the decade. XD

Sonic boom is also a toy commercial/ad. Along with being a cartoon. And you like it, its almost as if that's totally fine.  

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1 hour ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

Again, gonna wait for official word from IDW.  But if that is the route SEGA wants to go, again I have no need for a 32 page ad.  I'll stick with better books.

 

Though the book might still be salvagable if they just ditch the blue hedgehog and make Amy & Blaze the main characters. XD

I don't how fair it is to assume the new comics will be bad because they won't have FFs or other Archie characters, especially before we even know much about it. Don't knock til you try it.

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3 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I'm not saying we need to give up on art, I do art. I love art. 

 

We just need to stop pretending that art and business are separate things. Folks triynna get paid fam

  Fair enough.  Still though, darn you money, thou doust continue to be the root of so many evils in this world!

Just now, RedFox99 said:

I don't how fair it is to assume the new comics will be bad because they won't have FFs or other Archie characters, especially before we even know much about it. Don't knock til you try it.

 Nah, I know what I like & don't like.  I knew the Emoji Movie was gonna be garbage the second I heard about it.  So yea i'm able to tell pretty early on if i'll enjoy something or not.

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2 minutes ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

  Fair enough.  Still though, darn you money, thou doust continue to be the root of so many evils in this world!

 Nah, I know what I like & don't like.  I knew the Emoji Movie was gonna be garbage the second I heard about it.  So yea i'm able to tell pretty early on if i'll enjoy something or not.

To be fair I think a majority of people guessed that. I understand though what you mean. A comic without the FFs to you is not your cup of tea. The problem is that your making it sound objectively that the new comics will be bad and just overglorified ads.

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On 7/28/2017 at 7:13 PM, antyep said:

I do have to agree. As amazing a writer Flynn is, he tries way too hard to make Sally an endearing character, which kinda backfires. I have nothing against homosexuals (thank you Steven Universe) but using Sally for this stunt seems forced.

Sally's gay?

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Uhm... about the FF in Worlds Unite; I recall that Mr. Flynn has stated (maybe in that Sonic Sez issue 30 one, I'm not too certain please feel free to correct me) in some podcast they were put in because some people were asking why they weren't in Worlds Collide. Just that you know @Shadowlax. So I'd deduct it like there actually were people wanting to see them on a game crossover.

About this glorified ads thing; Yes, Sonic comics are pretty darn good glorified ads. They're that kind of glorified ads I'm willing to pay, that are more than just ads! They are ads, but not just ads. There's a difference for me. Since they're better than just ads, I wouldn't buy "just ads" ads. So they're more than just ads, at least for me, while still being ads. I suppose I got you all confused by now? Good.

15 minutes ago, Marcello said:

Sally's gay?

Go and read this topic for more speculation, the latest pages mind you (if that tweet wasn't enough); "Archie Sonic Main Discussion". No links but it's on the forum, I think you'll find it easily enough if you're interested enough. ;)

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14 minutes ago, BlueSky said:

Uhm... about the FF in Worlds Unite; I recall that Mr. Flynn has stated (maybe in that Sonic Sez issue 30 one, I'm not too certain please feel free to correct me) in some podcast they were put in because some people were asking why they weren't in Worlds Collide. Just that you know @Shadowlax. So I'd deduct it like there actually were people wanting to see them on a game crossover.

About this glorified ads thing; Yes, Sonic comics are pretty darn good glorified ads. They're that kind of glorified ads I'm willing to pay, that are more than just ads! They are ads, but not just ads. There's a difference for me. Since they're better than just ads, I wouldn't buy "just ads" ads. So they're more than just ads, at least for me, while still being ads. I suppose I got you all confused by now? Good.

Go and read this topic for more speculation, the latest pages mind you (if that tweet wasn't enough); "Archie Sonic Main Discussion". No links but it's on the forum, I think you'll find it easily enough if you're interested enough. ;)

Weren't most of the FFs busy or unable to help during the first crossover

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Sometimes people ask for things, sometimes you say " no " and then don't do them. As much as I wanted were sonic to fight a bunch of RE and DR zombies like a big monster fight, you don't listen to me because that isn't appropriate for the comic. Sometimes you see your fan base asking for something and you go no. Now having more game characters in the crossoever wouldn't have fixed it. Worlds unite was butt for a multitude of reasons, but that was just another complaint added to the flame... that honestly didn't need to exist. 

I think harada the tekken producer said it best, sometimes people ask for characters and you go, no. 

And if said shadow should have been in that grand finally for the unleashed ark, I would have been like no. He had nothing to do with that story. Even when its characters I like, sometimes you say no. 

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5 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I think harada the tekken producer said it best, sometimes people ask for characters and you go, no. 

That's pretty profound when you think about it. I constantly find myself thinking "Why don't the writers use this character more?" or "Why can they make things more serious?"; but I need to remember that the writers don't have to cater to my every whim

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Just now, RedFox99 said:

That's pretty profound when you think about it.

Think about it, you making a fighting game. Like harada often does, heck he's the head of namco's fighting game department now, but anyways. You making a fighting game, a single character has insane costs to produce, and someone asks you for a character you know they aren't going to play no one else plays and they only want them there because they want them to be there. That's a waste, you say no, and keep that shit moving. 

Now obviously comic books and video games aren't in the same situation, you could produce a large number of comic books with the cost of one character alone in some fighting games. But sometimes you are in a situation where folks are asking are asking for comic exclusive characters in a video game crossover. Sometimes you say no, you will see that character after the crossover is done, the majority of this audience was here for the game part .

Another example Persona 4 arena they the fans and the developers of the fighting game spin off wanted Dojima and Nanako as playable characters, the creators of the persona series said " No, are you stupid". Sometimes the answer is no and should be no

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38 minutes ago, SBR2 said:
Also I fail to see how this is a "Stunt" to make Sally popular because Sally's still pretty popular.

I think the stunt is "including homosexual/bisexual relationship in Sonic", and usually adding representation for lgbt and minority is a great deal for many people. I think they're saying using Sally who has mixed reputation (I heard she was considered writer's pet before reboot? Even post-SGW I remember people annoyed at Ian's "attempt" at making her likable by adding very minor flaws*) for something that usually has positive reaction and influence from fans had mixed reactions.

* I think it was when the Sky Patrol was attacked and she was shown to be nervous. Also bad at cooking. Either here or on Tumblr, I saw people complain Sally is never given a fatal flaw or important negative trait like the other members have.

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1 hour ago, RedFox99 said:

Weren't most of the FFs busy or unable to help during the first crossover

I have no idea, maybe Mr. Flynn has said something about that but as far as I can tell they weren't around. Like, they might've existed (in somewhere else than where the action was), but not in a way they existed in the comics normally.

1 hour ago, Shadowlax said:

Sometimes people ask for things, sometimes you say " no " and then don't do them. As much as I wanted were sonic to fight a bunch of RE and DR zombies like a big monster fight, you don't listen to me because that isn't appropriate for the comic. Sometimes you see your fan base asking for something and you go no. Now having more game characters in the crossoever wouldn't have fixed it. Worlds unite was butt for a multitude of reasons, but that was just another complaint added to the flame... that honestly didn't need to exist. 

I think harada the tekken producer said it best, sometimes people ask for characters and you go, no. 

And if said shadow should have been in that grand finally for the unleashed ark, I would have been like no. He had nothing to do with that story. Even when its characters I like, sometimes you say no. 

Well, I suppose what Mr. Flynn thinks about Worlds Unite nowadays is something akin to "there were too many characters", at least that podcast I mentioned before left me that kind of feeling.

I can agree people should sometimes stick to their guns. But after all, what I personally was after, was the fact there actually were people who wanted to see the FF in on the crossover. Again, different people and different needs.

48 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Another example Persona 4 arena they the fans and the developers of the fighting game spin off wanted Dojima and Nanako as playable characters, the creators of the persona series said " No, are you stupid". Sometimes the answer is no and should be no

Not for you personally but for anyone who says to someone something like that; there are no stupid questions. Stupid answers are another case though.

Gee, however stupid you think some question/questioner is, this is by no means a way to answer to someone... No is all right, it can be said politely. No need for insults. Or some good questions may never escape the lips of the ponderer...

I think we all, especially I, should try and remember that... -_-

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3 minutes ago, BlueSky said:

I have no idea, maybe Mr. Flynn has said something about that but as far as I can tell they weren't around. Like, they might've existed (in somewhere else than where the action was), but not in a way they existed in the comics normally.

Well, I suppose what Mr. Flynn thinks about Worlds Unite nowadays is something akin to "there were too many characters", at least that podcast I mentioned before left me that kind of feeling.

I can agree people should sometimes stick to their guns. But after all, what I personally was after, was the fact there actually were people who wanted to see the FF in on the crossover. Again, different people and different needs.

Not for you personally but for anyone who says to someone something like that; there are no stupid questions. Stupid answers are another case though.

Gee, however stupid you think some question/questioner is, this is by no means a way to answer to someone... No is all right, it can be said politely. No need for insults. Or some good questions may never escape the lips of the ponderer...

I think we all, especially I, should try and remember that... -_-

Maybe Worlds Collide could've worked if it was just Sega characters and it left out Capcom.

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No, the issues with world collides run deeper than that. 

To just list two, they tried to do an event that they , tbh honest needed bunches and bunches of books going on at the same time to do. When marvel and DC does an event, everyone is in on the event the have bunches of books running so not every single characters take needs to be condensed into a few books

The 2nd problem being this was an editors bad fanfiction and it showed

Worlds unite was doomed from the start

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1 hour ago, KoDaiko said:

I think the stunt is "including homosexual/bisexual relationship in Sonic", and usually adding representation for lgbt and minority is a great deal for many people. I think they're saying using Sally who has mixed reputation (I heard she was considered writer's pet before reboot? Even post-SGW I remember people annoyed at Ian's "attempt" at making her likable by adding very minor flaws*) for something that usually has positive reaction and influence from fans had mixed reactions.

* I think it was when the Sky Patrol was attacked and she was shown to be nervous. Also bad at cooking. Either here or on Tumblr, I saw people complain Sally is never given a fatal flaw or important negative trait like the other members have.

And this is the thing. No matter what Ian does there will be people blindly hating it. It's a cycle it really is.

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7 hours ago, VEDJ-F said:

1. Even with the mandate, the FFs were getting more focus than most game characters. As I keep mentioning, the Babylon Rogues didn't even get a chance to appear in the end (I mean, it sounds like Ian was planning something, but it got dropped somewhere along the line and the new plan didn't get actioned in time). By comparison, the FFs (either all or some) got Light in the Dark, Hidden Costs, Spark of Life, multiple one-off back-ups, and they were the drive for Countdown to Chaos and the upcoming Freedom Fighter arc in Universe. 

Babylon Rogues seems like an odd comparison when they've barely appeared in any games in quite some time, and rarely outside of Riders.

5 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I think it speaks to the level of the problem when there was a video game crossoever where several game characters were dead or missing whilst comic book characters got to hang out with video game characters like those were the things people wanted to see in said video game crossoever. That in combination with multiple legal issues, archies fubling that lead to said legal issues them having to intervene before when they were putting too much on comic exclusive characters before the reboot and the other shenanigans that were happening at the time. And archie just wanting to move on is why we are at point b. 

I think what speaks to specially the notion of characters not overshadowing game characters, is their handling of boom while I don't agree with mayor D , or rather the level he was taking it. They specially sought out to basically make everyone who wasn't the sonic crew, shadow, and the badguy useless, background. 

I don't think they want any part of that sort of thing anymore. They want their characters to be the ones in the lime light

I brought this up before, but the problem with most of the SEGA cast is that they're literally designed to not be hanging out as a group unless you do like SEGA and ignore key aspects of their profiles, like Knuckles guarding the Master Emerald. 

Worlds Unite was made to be more directly in-continuity than Collide (I.e. no rewriting reality/history/time hijinx), and since it apparently came up as a "we're doing this now," Ian was working with who was on hand, as they were, on both the Sonic and Mega Man sides. 

So yeah, it made sense for the Freedom Fighters to be there. Their absence and the lack of direct continuity were the two big complaints the first time around, so they tried to address it.

Under the circumstances and restrictions imposed by the IP holders and editors, Unite probably went as well as it could have. I'm not saying whether it's good or bad (I liked it, even though it obviously felt really shackled), but I doubt anyone else would have been able to pull off much better under executive meddling, and the FF were probably the least of the problem there.

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6 minutes ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

Babylon Rogues seems like an odd comparison when they've barely appeared in any games in quite some time, and rarely outside of Riders.

They've still got a presence in the mainline franchise and are part of the recurring cast (they were included in the 25th anniversary stuff and they had two playable reps in the last Mario and Sonic game from last year). So SEGA would still likely rank them as being a higher priority than the Freedom Fighters. 

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4 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Comic books based on liscned  products are almost always adds. The fact that the the book was deviating so much was it failing to do its job correctly. Folks are there for the characters and things that brought them into the franchise in the first place. So they are gonna make a book about that, because that's whats gonna sell, and that's what a lot of folks want

Even Ian Flynn said that the  comics are adds for the Sonic brand. And some people got mad at him for saying that. :rolleyes:

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8 hours ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

I felt it was a given that they wouldn't be used from the get go but I don't wish to keep people from holding out hope or waiting for more official confirmation if they feel they must. Whatever works for you is the method you should choose to do.

At the moment I'm convinced though.

 

I don't doubt the possibility of them not being around.

I just felt the reasoning was hella off given there were numerous other factors involved and the ones on the characters was specifically singled out. Even given how the focus was spread among non-game characters, you'd think that Sega would've put their foot down earlier if sich was the case.

8 hours ago, Dr. Detective Mike said:

I felt it was a given that they wouldn't be used from the get go but I don't wish to keep people from holding out hope or waiting for more official confirmation if they feel they must. Whatever works for you is the method you should choose to do.

At the moment I'm convinced though.

 

I don't doubt the possibility of them not being around.

I just felt the reasoning was hella off given there were numerous other factors involved and the ones on the characters was specifically singled out. Even given how the focus was spread among non-game characters, you'd think that Sega would've put their foot down earlier if sich was the case.

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