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Dejimon11

IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

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So I just read issue 4. Not bad. The story is extremely slow atm still and honestly I do not see it hitting the ground running hard till at least issue 20 maybe or 25.

As for tangle and blaze. I mean reading it 4 times people are really, really ,really digging to make someone saying wow your cool basically to equate to omg i love you lets make out. Seriously in no way does this issue even come close to hinting at anything and more so its just that rabid side of the fanbase that likes drawing fan fics all the time.

 

Also in terms of artwork. 2,4,1,3 in terms of how good the artwork was. Yet again I will say I hope we see more of issues 2 artist.

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17 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Plus ninja training and strict(?) sheltered upbringing.

Wait, she lived in that city?

Not city, "village". They're animal-people, they live in villages.

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7 hours ago, Razule said:

I wonder if it'll have anything to do with GUN.

 

4 hours ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

Meh. What I really want to see is Shadow looking for Infinite. In hands of the competent writer, this could be a really interesting plot.

I don't think that would be interesting. There's nothing infinite could do to shadow at this point he couldn't stop. Shadow literally being removed from the plot for no reason is an admission of this. Along with that, there's no reason for him to care about infnite. He has no beef, infinite has beef with him. If infinite was looking for him, it would make more sense, infinite is another jerk who tried to take over the world and lost and some other jerk he beat the shit out of. The onus is on infinite to try and find him.  And I doubt as mentioned above shadow cares about his public image for that to be a reason to find him. 

No you might be like " well gun might send them to arrest him " one, they don't seem like the arrest squad, they seem like the destroy squad. But two, gun exists.... in human land. And probably doesn't really care about infinite and probably wont be mentioned at all. So that's not a thing. Especially given the synopsis of the plot seems to be more so about shadow trying to kill eggman for something. And I know goddamn well he ain't working knuckles, he barely works for gun as is. 

And I dunno , lastly Shadow's a cool interesting character. I rather he not waste his time with infinite who is not. Along with that, there is a good chance if infinite does come back he has no jewel. And if he has no jewel, then he's just some asshole who is worth even less time. I wouldn't be surprised if Sega Mephilies-ed, infnite. 

So I'm gonna have to dissagree hard. Its no reason for shadow to look for infnite. And infinite isn't that interesting. Sometimes you make mephilies, it happens. Rough and Tumble in pages were more interesting that infnite was in an entire video game.

I would be more interested in seeing the aftermath of being framed, or seeing where he went during that point in sonic forces plot he was removed because if he literally went directly to sonic would have solved the problem after the first level in the game. 

 

 

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Infinite can work in the comic, given he is not confirmed dead. His cruelty, ego and inferiority complex has some potential if done right. In description he sounds more like a villain from the comics anyway. tbh I see him as an edgier fanfic-version of Shadow. 

3 hours ago, Razule said:

Not city, "village". They're animal-people, they live in villages.

What...is the difference between city and village (and town)?  I never really thought about it....

 

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16 minutes ago, KoDaiko said:

Infinite can work in the comic, given he is not confirmed dead. His cruelty, ego and inferiority complex has some potential if done right. In description he sounds more like a villain from the comics anyway. tbh I see him as an edgier fanfic-version of Shadow. 

What...is the difference between city and village (and town)?  I never really thought about it....

 

A village implies a handful of relatively small buildings like houses or cottages in rural areas, while a city implies lots of larger buildings throughout numerous streets, thus creating an urban setting. A town is arguably something of a middle-ground of the two.

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51 minutes ago, KoDaiko said:

Infinite can work in the comic, given he is not confirmed dead. His cruelty, ego and inferiority complex has some potential if done right. In description he sounds more like a villain from the comics anyway. tbh I see him as an edgier fanfic-version of Shadow. 

 

I don't think he's that cruel, nothing he did is above anything particularly villainous, and even his " torture " resulted in sonic being fine. All he does is show illusions to people, and is incompetent. The inferiority thing could be interesting, but that would require a basis for someone to feel inferior to.. and he doesn't really have that organically. The closest thing he has is calling himself the ultimate mec, but the only reason he said that was more so for the audience and marketing than any real connection to shadow. As he promptly after showing shadow green hill zone for like 50 seconds...just leaves and never bothers with him again. So clearly he didn't actually care that much. And him being upset at sonic for beating him... isn't really unique. 

I think his potentially is low, he's super generic with nothing interesting going on. That will probably get nerfed if he ever does return. 

I don't think he's an edgier version of shadow. He's what you get when you try to make another shadow, and don't understand why shadow worked. He's the version of shadow we would have gotten from much more cynical people. And sort of my fear going forward for multiple characters if Sonic Team ever is compltely gone from the franchise. 

 

 

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14 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Eh? There are a few characters that are just citizens... and It would actually be interesting to see them interact with them more often. For example I think I mentioned in this thread, seeing shadow interact with people who thought he was a bad guy for months might be weird. And everyone else has their own personal stakes. They have friends, some characters even have family, or people close enough they see them as family. That doesn't really make her special in any regard. 

Oh Ho but it does. While there are a handful of characters whom could be considered normies or citizens, almost all of them fail to meet the mold of Tangle. Mostly because they lack roots or investments in any single defined location (the Chaotix have no real home turf in IDW so far, Big is a social outcast and Amy is as much of a globetrotter as the rest of her friends these days). The only characters that really have a possibility of having an established "Home" and "Roots" would be Cream and Vanilla - but you could easily argue their access to Sonic's inner circle makes that kind of mute.

Tangle is a true civilian. She doesn't have the connections to super friends, nor is she part of the resistance. She isn't caught up in the big picture, simply caught in the small scale scuffles in between. She can interact in ways with the core cast that are impossible for any of the current established characters. She is special in that she's not another super friend. She's just a chick that can brawl to defend her hometown. We don't have that yet.

 

 

14 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Unless its some needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few type shit I doubt it.

There are a lot of ways you can play it. Since she's not part of Sonic's circle, or the resistance, she is out-of-the-loop on much of what is happening elsewhere. A smart villain to leverage that to bait her and her town into making matters worse. She could lower her towns defenses to let Sonic in, only to be played for a sap by Metal. She could unintentionally make herself a target by nabbing a Chaos Emerald. She could shatter team dynamics by insisting to work with certain people over others, the possibilities are all over the place, you just gotta be creative.

 

 

14 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Why not... just instead of one character....just make multiple characters who do that for whatever respective militia is speaking. Relegating that to one character makes the world seem incredibly small. And can make that one character annoying...quickly.

Well yeah, she can only speak for her one town.

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4 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I don't think he's that cruel, nothing he did is above anything particularly villainous, and even his " torture " resulted in sonic being fine.

 

Actually, that was almost certainly Zavok's doing.

17 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Eh? There are a few characters that are just citizens... and It would actually be interesting to see them interact with them more often. For example I think I mentioned in this thread, seeing shadow interact with people who thought he was a bad guy for months might be weird. And everyone else has their own personal stakes. They have friends, some characters even have family, or people close enough they see them as family. That doesn't really make her special in any regard. 

Unless its some needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few type shit I doubt it.

I love how you mention how there are game characters who are just citizens...and then talk about Shadow.

2 hours ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Oh Ho but it does. While there are a handful of characters whom could be considered normies or citizens, almost all of them fail to meet the mold of Tangle.  The only characters that really have a possibility of having an established "Home" and "Roots" would be Cream and Vanilla - but you could easily argue their access to Sonic's inner circle makes that kind of mute.

Which is exactly why we need Tangle to interact more with said inner circle. :lol:

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3 hours ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Oh Ho but it does. While there are a handful of characters whom could be considered normies or citizens, almost all of them fail to meet the mold of Tangle. Mostly because they lack roots or investments in any single defined location (the Chaotix have no real home turf in IDW so far, Big is a social outcast and Amy is as much of a globetrotter as the rest of her friends these days). The only characters that really have a possibility of having an established "Home" and "Roots" would be Cream and Vanilla - but you could easily argue their access to Sonic's inner circle makes that kind of mute.

I don't think her being in a single location is a good thing. 

3 hours ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Tangle is a true civilian. She doesn't have the connections to super friends, nor is she part of the resistance. She isn't caught up in the big picture, simply caught in the small scale scuffles in between. She can interact in ways with the core cast that are impossible for any of the current established characters. She is special in that she's not another super friend. She's just a chick that can brawl to defend her hometown. We don't have that yet.

She does have connections to super friends. She got those connections as soon as she was introduced, which makes your point moot. Her getting caught up in larger things is something that describe sonic himself. Sonic is... literally just some homeless dude that likes to run fast. And about interactions, Not at all? If you want someone who can speak for more normal folks, there are characters who can already do that. The chaotix aren't sueprfriends, amy isn't a super friend, heck tails isn't a super friend. Most sonic characters aren't super friends, those are exceptions. The blazes, shadow's, silvers, knuckles, are exceptions, most of them are just people who get caught up in some shit and then the adventure begins. No different from tangle. 

3 hours ago, Sega DogTagz said:

There are a lot of ways you can play it. Since she's not part of Sonic's circle, or the resistance, she is out-of-the-loop on much of what is happening elsewhere. A smart villain to leverage that to bait her and her town into making matters worse. She could lower her towns defenses to let Sonic in, only to be played for a sap by Metal. She could unintentionally make herself a target by nabbing a Chaos Emerald. She could shatter team dynamics by insisting to work with certain people over others, the possibilities are all over the place, you just gotta be creative.

Why do I care about her town? Her being out of the loop isn't an interesting thing to me, I'm familiar with sonic. The chaos emerald thing is a thing, but I would assume everyone knows about chaos emeralds in sonic land and knows people want them...so I doubt it would be much of a surprise. And I don't think anyone cares if she works with anyone or not. Everyone can handle themselves and don't really need her in their dynamic. 

I'm not saying you can't do anything with tangle, its just that nothing you said makes her unique in any regard, nor does it indicate any lasting story potential besides " clueless audience surrogate" 

 

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6 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I don't think he's that cruel, nothing he did is above anything particularly villainous, and even his " torture " resulted in sonic being fine. All he does is show illusions to people, and is incompetent. The inferiority thing could be interesting, but that would require a basis for someone to feel inferior to.. and he doesn't really have that organically. The closest thing he has is calling himself the ultimate mec, but the only reason he said that was more so for the audience and marketing than any real connection to shadow. As he promptly after showing shadow green hill zone for like 50 seconds...just leaves and never bothers with him again. So clearly he didn't actually care that much. And him being upset at sonic for beating him... isn't really unique. 

I think his potentially is low, he's super generic with nothing interesting going on. That will probably get nerfed if he ever does return. 

I don't think he's an edgier version of shadow. He's what you get when you try to make another shadow, and don't understand why shadow worked. He's the version of shadow we would have gotten from much more cynical people. And sort of my fear going forward for multiple characters if Sonic Team ever is compltely gone from the franchise. 

 

 

Actually he killed several resistance members and I swear In the second fight he basically says something about you wanting to embrace death or something. Sega made a op villian and had to dumb his powers down

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7 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I don't think he's that cruel, nothing he did is above anything particularly villainous, and even his " torture " resulted in sonic being fine. All he does is show illusions to people, and is incompetent. The inferiority thing could be interesting, but that would require a basis for someone to feel inferior to.. and he doesn't really have that organically. The closest thing he has is calling himself the ultimate mec, but the only reason he said that was more so for the audience and marketing than any real connection to shadow. As he promptly after showing shadow green hill zone for like 50 seconds...just leaves and never bothers with him again. So clearly he didn't actually care that much. And him being upset at sonic for beating him... isn't really unique. 

I think his potentially is low, he's super generic with nothing interesting going on. That will probably get nerfed if he ever does return. 

I don't think he's an edgier version of shadow. He's what you get when you try to make another shadow, and don't understand why shadow worked. He's the version of shadow we would have gotten from much more cynical people. And sort of my fear going forward for multiple characters if Sonic Team ever is compltely gone from the franchise. 

We have to remember that SEGA always had trouble portraying characters like they intended to. I mean, we've been complaining how Tails/Amy/Knuckles/anyone's portrayal was one-dimentional and useless in recent games. Do they lack potential? What if Infinite was also the same victim? 

While many may consider Infinite as "bland" and "lame" in game, in concept he is SUPPOSED to (I think??) be this sadistic & elitist, but sorta complex villain character. He even has a backstory and all that. So if you didn't feel that in game, the comic can fix that. Just like the comic brought back Tails and Amy's intended character. They can flesh out his personality more, and even build off from there. Given people praised Archie for making certain character likable and enjoyable, I'm sure IDW can do the same.

That is, as I said earlier, if he isn't dead. If he's dead, then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ or maybe SEGA has a different plan? who knows....

Infinite being Shadow's edgier fancharacter was sort of a joke. He reminded me of how certain people portray shadow in their fanfic or treat it as canon.

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10 hours ago, Razule said:

Retcon

This tangent is so bizarre that I suspect you're leading us all on a ruse cruise, but just in case: there being a small town--and said town being informally called a "village" in one panel--does not mean cities don't exist. Source: I live in a relatively small town but there's a city half an hour away!

Re: the whole normal citizen thing...Tangle's actually exactly the kind of character I expected would be in this, tho' 1) I was thinking someone based on the Avatar (in retrospect I guess it makes more sense not to do that so that readers can fill in the blank with their own Avatar or whatever) and 2) based on what we've seen and heard, she isn't going to be regularly recurring, at least not at the moment. There's certainly things you could do with a newbie versus characters who have been at this for a while (even other "citizen" types like Cream), but who knows if she'll even appear often enough for that to be viable.

...Y'know, if we get something like Universe, I'd kinda like to see an arc with her and Blaze going on wacky adventures.

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...is village/town thing worth discussing? I don't even remember any mobian settlements in games before Forces... unless you count Emerald Town in Sonic Battle. No visible humans there.

Anyway, reasons why I would like to see Shadow look for Infinite
1) It continues Archie tradition of Shadow being a secret superhero (with GUN or without). When Sonic takes care of obvious problems at hand (Eggman, Dark Gaia, "Chairman"), Shadow works behind the scenes, stopping Dark Arms invasion or making sure Infinite is down for good, stopping th threats before they arise. It just fits him.
2) If Infinite lost his powers, this is great moment to get any depth from him. Will he crack? Look for his team? Pretend he's still demigod? "When we' hit our lowest point, we're open to greatest change" to quote. And if Sega wants to keep him for later, him not learning anything will tell us much about him as well. What makes comic's Loki great villain is that he can't stop lying to everyone including himself, otherwise he would have to face what a bastard he is.
3) And if you consider Infnite a worthless character, he will make a decent foil to Shadow. It's a good remind that power doesn't make the man worthy, it's the man who gives worth to power. Or something like that.

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1 hour ago, KoDaiko said:

We have to remember that SEGA always had trouble portraying characters like they intended to. I mean, we've been complaining how Tails/Amy/Knuckles/anyone's portrayal was one-dimentional and useless in recent games. Do they lack potential? What if Infinite was also the same victim? 

While many may consider Infinite as "bland" and "lame" in game, in concept he is SUPPOSED to (I think??) be this sadistic & elitist, but sorta complex villain character. He even has a backstory and all that. So if you didn't feel that in game, the comic can fix that. Just like the comic brought back Tails and Amy's intended character. They can flesh out his personality more, and even build off from there. Given people praised Archie for making certain character likable and enjoyable, I'm sure IDW can do the same.

That is, as I said earlier, if he isn't dead. If he's dead, then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ or maybe SEGA has a different plan? who knows....

Infinite being Shadow's edgier fancharacter was sort of a joke. He reminded me of how certain people portray shadow in their fanfic or treat it as canon.

That is very true.

Besides, IDW is allegedly taking inspiration for the games rather than full out incorporating them, so unless there's a Dr. Nega type embargo on him, it would the perfect place to recontextualize Infinite's character ala Big and Silver.

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3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I don't think her being in a single location is a good thing. 

Every character doesn't need to follow the same mold. Its not a bad thing to have a small handful of capable people who aren't globetrotters. We have more than enough of those already.

 

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

She does have connections to super friends. She got those connections as soon as she was introduced, which makes your point moot.

I wouldn't go that far. Thats like saying the milita in previous issues have super friends just because Sonic showed up to save the day.

 

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

 The chaotix aren't sueprfriends, amy isn't a super friend, heck tails isn't a super friend. Most sonic characters aren't super friends, those are exceptions.

Tails is a mechanical prodigy on par with Eggman. Amy is capable of holding her own against almost any character and is of the hardest hitting members of the canon. Vector, despite his goofy demeanor, has a proven track record of being an ace detective. Espio is a god damn ninja. Charmy is a kid... he gets a pass.

Any one of those lot are capable of bringing down SuperBadniks in their sleep. That makes them super-friends by any stretch of the world. They are far above and beyond the normies. They took up arms against Eggman before the resistance became necessary. Thats all you really need to know about them.

 

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I'm not saying you can't do anything with tangle, its just that nothing you said makes her unique in any regard, nor does it indicate any lasting story potential besides " clueless audience surrogate"

The fact that she can be tied down to a single place, have investment and stakes in a hometown is what makes her unique. Its something no other character can really provide right now.

In the old days, if Eggy came knocking on the door of Knothole, or if somebody came unannounced on Angel Island and started making trouble, Sonic and Knux would take that personally. They would have that extra tension involved in dealing with that threat.

Guess who is the only character who has that right now. I'd say that's plenty unique.

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1 minute ago, Sega DogTagz said:

The fact that she can be tied down to a single place, have investment and stakes in a hometown is what makes her unique. Its something no other character can really provide right now.

Well, I really hope Ms. Tangle actually stays in this eventually unnamed town/city/village...because it could be just a phase.

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9 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Every character doesn't need to follow the same mold. Its not a bad thing to have a small handful of capable people who aren't globetrotters. We have more than enough of those already.

Not every character needs to be a globe trotter, however if one wants to have interaction with the larger world. They kind of need to travel, unless every goddamn thing is gonna happen in tangles town.

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I wouldn't go that far. Thats like saying the milita in previous issues have super friends just because Sonic showed up to save the day.

...yeah. Unless you are dealing with a character like ...anyone from team dark or blaze or something friendship is literally " we teamed up guess we are friends now" , as much as I like when it takes its sillyness seriously...its a comic for kids. 

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Tails is a mechanical prodigy on par with Eggman. Amy is capable of holding her own against almost any character and is of the hardest hitting members of the canon. Vector, despite his goofy demeanor, has a proven track record of being an ace detective. Espio is a god damn ninja. Charmy is a kid... he gets a pass.

Tails is still just a kid. That description of amy is stretching it, and not really on the hard hitting thing. It really depends on the interpretation , for the most part she's just a girl that likes sonic. Detectives can be normal people, and often are. Espio... ok you got me. 

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Any one of those lot are capable of bringing down SuperBadniks in their sleep. That makes them super-friends by any stretch of the world. They are far above and beyond the normies. They took up arms against Eggman before the resistance became necessary. Thats all you really need to know about them.

Not really? For example, there are some normal humans in marvel and DC comics that can be fodder. Doesn't make you super... its just fodder. I don't think amy is that far above a normal person, I think the reason she's special ( besides that magic thing she never does ) is the fact thats he decides to get up get out and get something. 

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The fact that she can be tied down to a single place, have investment and stakes in a hometown is what makes her unique. Its something no other character can really provide right now.

I don't think that's valuable. But to each their own

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In the old days, if Eggy came knocking on the door of Knothole, or if somebody came unannounced on Angel Island and started making trouble, Sonic and Knux would take that personally. They would have that extra tension involved in dealing with that threat.

I mean sonic defending some random town that would happen to have a friend of his in it would have the same tension tbh

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Guess who is the only character who has that right now. I'd say that's plenty unique.

I guess. I don't think that's valuable at all though

 

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