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IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

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Amy is at her best when she's actually given a character beyond just loving Sonic, so I'm all aboard things that allow her to grow out of just being a fangirl. 

 

If people just love her because she obsesses over Sonic and want her to be defined by that, hey I'm not gonna tell you that's wrong. But I think it's important to understand why that's not really popular nor does it make for a very interesting or engaging character and does in fact, get really fucking grating. 

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2 hours ago, DabigRG said:

It wasn't really Amy making Cream nervous at the beginning of Casino Park so much as Cream wondering the true nature of Sonic's feelings regarding Amy aloud and scratching the train of thought once she realized Amy was listening, hence her awkward little giggle.

Granted, I'm not familiar with the Japanese version of the scene and the voice direction of the English scene might've been a little off, but as far as the visual collaboration goes, Amy didn't seem to really catch on to what Cream was actually thinking and was honestly curious as to what her take on his running is.

Looking it up, Amy certainly sounds more...intense... in the Japanese version. I've always assumed it was meant to be an "and what exactly are you implying?" kind of moment that the English voice actor/director flubbed, because the alternative is just boring.

On the subject of Amy in general, while she should be more than just Sonic's #1 fangirl, I wouldn't want them to downplay that side of her too much. I like my Sonic character personalities to be big, bold, and flawed, and if they focus too much on making her less annoying and more "useful" she might end up just being boring and generic. Plus, I think some amount of conflict and tension between the heroes is important, and she's one of the rare sources of it, even rarer that it's not based in rivalry. A bunch of characters working together effectively and without issue doesn't make for much of a story, and conflict from within can be just as compelling as conflict from without.

And as far as IDW Sonic's take on Amy, issue 2 was pretty good; a little verbal jousting between them, a bit of swooning on Amy's end, and some solid combat teamwork. They've clearly got a different dynamic than other characters, and one that's not entirely without tension. Past that she's been kinda dull, though; just being a reasonably competent leader isn't that interesting and it doesn't really play to her strengths. Though in fairness at this point they're juggling over a dozen characters and there isn't enough space to give any of them much focus, so maybe they'll do better once they're past this mess.

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I'll take in charge leader Amy over "MY SONIC! I'M GOING TO FORCE YOU INTO MARRIAGE AGAINST YOUR WILL AND IF YOU LOOK AT ANOTHER GIRL IN ANY CONTEXT I'LL BECOME TERRIFYINGLY VIOLENT!"

Like seriously never bring that back if you ask me. 

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12 hours ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

I can understand not wanting two Sonic’s, but why are we still insisting that the FF took all the screentime when that isn’t true? Especially when it came to post-reboot Archie—it’s no different than having Tangle and Whisper around here in IDW.

There is a big difference though, the Freedom Fighters were everywhere in the main book even during the reboot, almost every issue, there was one where Sally was even in both stories and Sonic only in one of them (it's just one case though). The focus should be on game characters in my opinion. I do believe the Freedom Fighters were taking over in the reboot, while with Tangle and Whisper there is barely screentime for them, in fact I would say we haven't seen much of them. Besides, the focus should be on few characters, not a giant cast, so the pattern of having Sonic with an ally works really well, even though it gets repetitive, I admit, if you have fewer characters you can provide more attention and exploration to them. That's just my thought. Then there are fans who really dislike comic exclusive characters and would prefer a 100% game comic only, those are a lot more strict than I am, I would gladly welcome more comic characters and even the FFs in small doses.

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9 hours ago, Diogenes said:

Looking it up, Amy certainly sounds more...intense... in the Japanese version. I've always assumed it was meant to be an "and what exactly are you implying?" kind of moment that the English voice actor/director flubbed, because the alternative is just boring.

 

Huh. Well look at that.

The slight differences between how the two scripts phrase certain things is kinda interesting.

9 hours ago, Diogenes said:

 

On the subject of Amy in general, while she should be more than just Sonic's #1 fangirl, I wouldn't want them to downplay that side of her too much. I like my Sonic character personalities to be big, bold, and flawed, and if they focus too much on making her less annoying and more "useful" she might end up just being boring and generic. Plus, I think some amount of conflict and tension between the heroes is important, and she's one of the rare sources of it, even rarer that it's not based in rivalry. A bunch of characters working together effectively and without issue doesn't make for much of a story, and conflict from within can be just as compelling as conflict from without.

Bery fair point.

9 hours ago, Diogenes said:

 

And as far as IDW Sonic's take on Amy, issue 2 was pretty good; a little verbal jousting between them, a bit of swooning on Amy's end, and some solid combat teamwork. They've clearly got a different dynamic than other characters, and one that's not entirely without tension. Past that she's been kinda dull, though; just being a reasonably competent leader isn't that interesting and it doesn't really play to her strengths. Though in fairness at this point they're juggling over a dozen characters and there isn't enough space to give any of them much focus, so maybe they'll do better once they're past this mess.

Yeah, I didn't really care for how Part 1(I forget the issue number) showed her, admittedly.

4 hours ago, StaticMania said:

Sonic Heroes' character fights are nothing but forced nonsense...

Nonsense that still counts, for better or worse.

But then again, isn't that the whole series from a conceptual level?

2 hours ago, I Love Sticks said:

There is a big difference though, the Freedom Fighters were everywhere in the main book even during the reboot, almost every issue, there was one where Sally was even in both stories and Sonic only in one of them (it's just one case though). The focus should be on game characters in my opinion. I do believe the Freedom Fighters were taking over in the reboot, while with Tangle and Whisper there is barely screentime for them, in fact I would say we haven't seen much of them. Besides, the focus should be on few characters, not a giant cast, so the pattern of having Sonic with an ally works really well, even though it gets repetitive, I admit, if you have fewer characters you can provide more attention and exploration to them. That's just my thought. Then there are fans who really dislike comic exclusive characters and would prefer a 100% game comic only, those are a lot more strict than I am, I would gladly welcome more comic characters and even the FFs in small doses.

The Freedom Fighters were in so much of the reboot because they were being reestablished in the context of the new world, provided a convenient ensemble framework for getting everyone around the Unleashed setting via the Sky Patrol, and to help provide a stronger sense of story development in the wake of SEGA revised mandates over the book.

The comic was definitely making steps to move away from using them so much both during and after the Shattered World Crisis, which unfortunately we didn't get to see much aftermath of.

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7 hours ago, I Love Sticks said:

There is a big difference though, the Freedom Fighters were everywhere in the main book even during the reboot, almost every issue, there was one where Sally was even in both stories and Sonic only in one of them (it's just one case though). The focus should be on game characters in my opinion.

There’s also a big difference in the Freedom Fighters literally taking all the screentime as you claimed and them simply being present a lot of the time, or admittedly most of the time as they actually are—either way, it’s disregarding the two or more game characters there often right next to them. Just because you see Sally or Antoine all the time, for example, doesn’t mean she taking all the screentime, and them being around doesn’t invalidate the screentime given Tails, Amy, and Cream, a fact which many of the FF critics consistently ignore in favor of bashing the others for being around. And once again, no they didn’t take up all the screentime in post reboot—the game characters had just as much screentime with them and in more than one case, such as Champions, they sat back and let mostly the game cast take centerfold. 

In a lot of cases, there were more of the game cast than the FF just as there were the otherway around. You have arcs with Amy, Mighty, and Ray, fighting alongside Sally, Big and Sonic fighting with Rotor and Antoine, I could go on. 

But I know people can tell the difference here and see that the Game characters aren’t forced aside just because the FF happen to be present with them. Folks upset about their mere presence are just being shallow about it, and I couldn’t care any less if they get bitchy because Sally got 20% of the focus compared to Sonic’s 60 and then the next decided to give her more before sitting herout the next.

I mean really, it’s understandable to see the game cast more in a number of ways. But what does simply being from the games have to do with judging them from those not from the games? Because that’s all people are doing here—they’ll talk a lot about, say Tails’s characterization,  but when it comes to Sally or Rotor the response is typically “They’re not from the games” characterization be damned. Tangle and Whisper aren’t from the games, and no one yet has spited them for that so this makes no sense.

Quote

I do believe the Freedom Fighters were taking over in the reboot, while with Tangle and Whisper there is barely screentime for them, in fact I would say we haven't seen much of them.

A fair reminder that we’re barely ten issues in IDW where as Archie had almost 300 issues. That’s nowhere near enough for Tangle and Whisper to have as much a presence by comparison, but that doesn’t detract my point that these new characters are starting to gain focus no different to how Amy or Knuckles did early on despite not being from the games.

And your belief of them taking over doesn’t match with the reality of it. They were split evenly with the game cast post-reboot. I can go over individual issues and prove this: for every issue that had more of the FF than the game characters, there were issues where the opposite was true, one case being the very start of the reboot where they reintroduced the FF one by one while game characters like Sonic and Tails, and in one case Big had more screentime.

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7 hours ago, StaticMania said:

That was never a thing. Don't exaggerate the character's bad writing even more than it's already been.

For large part of the Dreamcast and Modern Era, that was the thing.

The only time that wasn't the thing was Sonic Adventure, Sonic Shuffle, and Shadow the Hedgehog.

Sonic and the Black Knight may also work but the true ending is debatable.

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2 hours ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

I don’t think you’re actually reading what people are saying then, much less what I was saying.

Not on this site at least.

 

Sorry, but I've seen people who don't think Amy's obsessed at a drop of a hat.

 

Just now, Adamis said:

She did try to force into marriage in Sonic Heroes.

There's hardly any force in that fight if you look at how the other characters force people to do stuff,  it was really cute how Amy wanted to get Sonic's attention like that.

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22 minutes ago, Fire-N-Space said:

it was really cute how Amy wanted to get Sonic's attention like that.

By trying to beat him and his friends up and knock them off a platform hundreds of feet in the air? You have a very strange definition of "cute".

And before you say Team Sonic did the exact same thing, it was self-defense. Sonic even says at the start of the fight, "Amy, knock it off! There's no time to play!" And that, by the way, is a perfect example of Amy's affections getting in the way of Sonic's mission to save the world.

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3 minutes ago, Fire-N-Space said:

Ok, what is it then I can't read minds.

I literally told you the first time around.

Stop twisting words and you’ll be able to see what I’m telling you, because I’m not going to engage with you on whether Amy is obsessed or not when I know you’re going to ignore points as you’ve done to others already.

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6 hours ago, Adamis said:

And it's still in the story and it's canon. Amy did that, whether you like it or not.

Canon, ok? It's about as canon as any other example...I'm seeing a thing here that if the characters were given actual reasons to fight eachother it just wouldn't seem as stupid.

Is there even an "out of character" moment that people acknowledge besides Tails.

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Just now, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

I literally told you the first time around.

Stop twisting words and you’ll be able to see what I’m telling you, because I’m not going to engage with you on whether Amy is obsessed or not when I know you’re going to ignore points as you’ve done to others already.

Well this tells me nothing... just that there are people who don't agree with me and news flash people ignore my points to.

 

Just now, Fear-Metallix said:

By trying to beat him and his friends up and knock them off a platform hundreds of feet in the air? You have a very strange definition of "cute".

And before you say Team Sonic did the exact same thing, it was self-defense. Sonic even says at the start of the fight, "Amy, knock it off! There's no time to play!" And that, by the way, is a perfect example of Amy's affections getting in the self-defenseway of Sonic's mission to save the world.

"By trying to beat him and his friends up and knock them off a platform hundreds of feet in the air? You have a very strange definition of "cute".

        Yes lets make all games in the 2000's look like Breath of the Wild so we can show what really happen.

 

Sonic is using self-defense against a girl who wants to marry him... that just sounds wrong and she was trying to play with him not kill him. Also Vector attack Amy as well. 

 

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4 hours ago, Fire-N-Space said:

There's hardly any force in that fight if you look at how the other characters force people to do stuff,  it was really cute how Amy wanted to get Sonic's attention like that.

It's worth noting that the Japanese version has her mention getting him to marry her as well.

Also, "muh Daa-liiiiin!" :joy: 

3 hours ago, Fear-Metallix said:

By trying to beat him and his friends up and knock them off a platform hundreds of feet in the air? You have a very strange definition of "cute".

And before you say Team Sonic did the exact same thing, it was self-defense. Sonic even says at the start of the fight, "Amy, knock it off! There's no time to play!" And that, by the way, is a perfect example of Amy's affections getting in the way of Sonic's mission to save the world.

For what it's worth, that's sort of gameplay to story distortion. Now Sonic sometimes running straight off the edge....

 

 

Not to mention completely forgetting to ask him about Froggy and Chocola, forcing Cream and Tails to clear the matter up on the side.

3 hours ago, Fire-N-Space said:

 Also Vector attack Amy as well. 

 

To be fair in that case, that was a big misunderstanding. 

One mainly caused by Amy and especially Espio being dismissive/sketchy, but a misunderstanding nonetheless.

3 hours ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

How about Knuckles in general?

What about him?

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8 hours ago, StaticMania said:

Canon, ok? It's about as canon as any other example

Yes. Because those Cutscenes are canon. Amy Canonically tried to force Sonic to marry her. This is literally a thing that happened. 

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1 minute ago, knuckles20 said:

I’ll never understand the argument of the Freedom Fighters stealing the spotlight from the game characters, given how the FF were in the comic since day one.

Well, that's just where the stealing started.

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5 minutes ago, knuckles20 said:

I’ll never understand the argument of the Freedom Fighters stealing the spotlight from the game characters, given how the FF were in the comic from the start.

 

... what you said makes no sense?

Comics and the brands they are based on as well as their audience can change

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1 minute ago, Shadowlax said:

... what you said makes no sense?

Comics and the brands they are based on as well as their audience can change

How does it not make sense?

I’ve seen arguments about the characters who have originated from the comics are taking away screen time from characters who originated from the games. 

Even as someone who prefer the game characters, I find that to be a giant load because reading through the Archie series pre and post Genesis Wave I found the screen time balanced between the two groups.

Sure the brand has changed over the years but it doesn’t mean I don’t see it as a ridiculous argument.

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