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IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog - Megathread


Dejimon11

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Just now, Shadowlax said:

Shadow exists, so that's not gonna happen?

While yes, Rouge and Omega are a bit more morally gray than a lot of other characters. Shadow is the leader and kind of moral center of that team. That is along with, Rouge isn't going to join a bad guy team specifically for jewels even in SA2 it she was a spy on the bad guy team. And omega's lust isn't for blood its for the destruction of eggman and his robots.

So yeah.

Not only do they have a leader in place to prevent that, they just aren't those sorts of people. That is ontop of, even if shadow went evil they would chew shadow out about that. So its vice versa.

 

Shadow could be put out of commission somehow. 

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The hard truth is that Sally and friends are no longer relevant to Sonic, I'm not against them appearing in minor roles, but as long as they don't outshine Sonic again, I'm fine. It kinda is a subjective thing, maybe X person prefers Sally instead of Tails for example but I just want the main characters of the series to be, well, main characters. That includes Knuckles and Amy. Sticks (another example) isn't relevant to Sonic anymore either, since Boom is over, I still want her to appear in some way, but I won't be mad if she doesn't. I have a lot of favorites, my interest doesn't just revolve around Sticks or lack of FFs. Tangle and Whisper don't outshine Sonic, maybe that's why I like them.

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9 minutes ago, Miragnarok said:

Shadow could be put out of commission somehow. 

Even with shadow out of commission i don't think it would cause either character to become bad guys. Also if shadow was missing for too long, While sega might have dropped the ball on this I feel at least Ian would probably have rogue looking for where he is.

Like there are plenty of interesting stories where sonic can fight shadow or " team sonic " can fight " Team dark " that doesn't really require anyone being bad guys. This is ontop of if there was a scenario whrere that did happen, you wouldn't need to many more characters because those two teams fighting would be the focus

EDIT: The scenario would have to be , it seems like something sonic did is why shadow is out of commision. Like sonic told shadow not to be so callous and mean and not to like kill someone, and then that person seemingly killed shadow. Upset at this rouge and omega take up beef with sonic blaming him and his friends for what happened to shadow. Meanwhile shadow is actually like awake somewhere else... I dunno talking to someone who reveals the truth about this hypothetical plot.

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Asking for the Freedom Fighters to be in every issue as Sonic's regular supporting cast in IDW is I think obviously not acceptable given IDW's direction, and the contemporary state of the franchise in general. They're legacy characters at this point that are best utilized a celebration of the franchise's history. I do think that means they could be used as occasional characters like the Chaotix, Whisper, Tangle etc. Not characters we see in every issue, but every once in a while we see one of them teaming up with Sonic. I think someone who's against using them to that extent is being unfair to other readers. Like, there's nothing stopping someone from being disinterested every time they show up, but it'd be like someone who hates Silver constantly complaining when Silver's in an issue, on the basis he shows up like once or twice a year. There's no difference to me between someone excited the Freedom Fighters get to be in an issue and someone excited the Battle Bird Armada gets to be an issue.

As for the status quo of Sonic and the Freedom Fighters on a team fighting tyranny, I'd actually welcome a SatAM spin-off book at some point. If the book continues to be successful for IDW, I'd like to see them expand by having short mini-series as pilots to see if other Sonic books were viable. Obvious first choices would be to see if a Classic or Shadow book would work, but after that I'd be open to them trying a Boom book (depending on how much value Sega still has in that) or a SatAM book (meant as to placate those clamoring for the main book to be more like Archie). Having Ian write a book set in SatAM's universe I think would allow the setting to get a more modern Sonic vibe, bringing an old concept back in a modern interpretation.

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1 hour ago, Miragnarok said:

Flynn might care. Maybe. And Rouge’s jewel cravings and Omega’s bloodlust are good reasons.

I don't like your attempts of ruining the characters for the sake of giving lame excuses to shove freedom fighters . Rouge might have some selfish personal desires(not everyone with selfish desires has to be a villain ) , but that doesn't mean she is gonna trade the world safety for a piece of jewel , she can balance between her personal desires and her duties , planning to help and keep a a little for herself . Also how is Omega has blood lust when he is just want to revenge from Eggman , saking for revenge isn't a blood lust . Shadow being a villain makes no sense at all , since he promised his human friend to help the world , not destroy it .  If you want FF to comeback that's fine , but not at the coast of changing other characters to accommodate their presence . Give them their own comics with Sonic as alternative universe , have their own in IDW whatever , but don't change other characters .

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Just wanted to stop in and remind everyone here to be civil. Been seeing a number of the tired cynical post that only aim to get a rise out of one side so here's a reminder to lay off that. This whole discussion point is very opinionated so please understand and respect both sides here when stating your thoughts.

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As @Gumbit implies, changing the world and characters is part of where the FFs got some their hate in the first place so using that as a means to get them back into a Sonic comic would definitely be disastrous. That's not to say that there isn't room for them to be squeezed in. I've said it in the past, using Amy and Sally's post-reboot friendship as a basis no less, that they would actually be a good group to hand the Resistance off to so that he Resistance would still be relevant while giving Knuckles and Amy some much needed freedom to be themselves. Heck, using the Resistance as a grounds for introducing characters I've even suggested that Sticks could be introduced as an agent who only trusts and reports to Amy as it would take advantage of her friendship with Amy and anti-government/robot/dictator/alien/mythical artifact/etc paranoia.

To me, as much as the Resistance currently limits the game cast, it also provides so many avenues to build up the world and bring in characters like Sticks and the FFs if you just logically apply what has been shown with them before. If a fan on a forum like me (attempted writer regardless) can just use as little as I have to introduce the FFs and Sticks without compromising anything than it is definitely possible for them to make it in and work. All we need is competent writing along with knowledge of and understanding of the franchise to make it work and we all know that Flynn fits those criteria. The only real question at this point to me is does it fit with the current goals of the comic. I can't answer that unfortunately, but I don't think we need to give up hope on seeing some of our favorite legacy characters or despair that their potential arrival will destroy everyone else when we know that Flynn is very good at reconciling disparate parts of the franchise into a reasonably cohesive whole. Maybe it won't happen in the timeframe we want, but we have a competent and knowledgeable writer with an understanding of the franchise at the head so for know all we really need is some patience to let him work his magic.

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21 minutes ago, Gumbit said:

I don't like your attempts of ruining the characters for the sake of giving lame excuses to shove freedom fighters . Rouge might have some selfish personal desires , but that doesn't mean she is gonna trade the world safety for a piece of jewel , she can balance between her personal desires and her duties , planning to help and keep a a little for herself . Also how is Omega has blood lust when he is just want to revenge from Eggman , saking for revenge isn't a blood lust . Shadow being a villain makes no sense at all , since he promised his human friend to help the world , not destroy it .  If you want FF to comeback that's fine , but not at the coast of changing other characters to accommodate their presence . Give them their own comics with Sonic as alternative universe , have their own in IDW whatever , but don't change other characters . 

Even if I agree with the basic message of "we shouldn't change the character just to add some more", I disagree with one big point : being a villiain doesn't necessarily mean "destroying the world".

Theoretically, Team Dark could just be doing some things that are right on their view, but not right for the view of the protagonists. Rouge could steal important things, or do stuff that isn't right for the heroes (without going as far as in Treasure Team Tango issue of endangering the entire Blaze's Dimension). Omega could be attacking someone related to Eggman, without making the distinction (and as Flynn portray him as loving destruction, he could maybe not even care about this distinction) between destroying a bot and destroying a living being. So those part of their character being used doesn't mean that they'll destroy the world or kill everybody for that.

I don't agree with changing them, but I don't disagree with showing them as antagonist or even villain, if it's done in an interesting way.

 

Actually, I think that having every story revolving about "protecting the world" is a problem in itself, but that's another subject XD

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2 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

FUCKING THIS

There are probably some who don't. But as of currently they aren't the focus, intrusive and were introduced in this comic so they might not be annoying people yet.

But even then, its still not the same situation because again, there was a whole section of the audience who didn't know who these "FF's" were or were from. Where are tangle and whisper from, this comic. You can read it, they are relevant to this book

By that same logic, the Freedom Fighters were relevant to Archie, particularly the reboot.

2 hours ago, I Love Sticks said:

. I also don't like some characters from the games, such as Cream, so it's not true that I'm only in favor of game characters, Cream for example is presented as a cute face and nothing else, that kind of bugs me. I have my favorites and disliked ones, like everyone does.

There's a little more to her than that. The problem with Cream is that she was never really given the type of spotlight/focus the other characters were given to really establish and flesh her out; the fact that most of game appearances have been games with large casts and/or questionable levels of canon-ocity doesn't help.

I've said before that she's one of the game characters who consistently benefits from being in other media.

2 hours ago, Marco9966 said:

The only way we get the FFs back is to have new characters but similar to them

(like Rough and Tumble instead hooligans, Dr.Starline instead of Dr. Finetevus)

Rough and Tumble were intended to coexist with the Hooligans, though.

Not to mention they're entirely different.

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4 minutes ago, Kazhnuz said:

Even if I agree with the basic message of "we shouldn't change the character just to add some more", I disagree with one big point : being a villiain doesn't necessarily mean "destroying the world".

Theoretically, Team Dark could just be doing some things that are right on their view, but not right for the view of the protagonists. Rouge could steal important things, or do stuff that isn't right for the heroes (without going as far as in Treasure Team Tango issue of endangering the entire Blaze's Dimension). Omega could be attacking someone related to Eggman, without making the distinction (and as Flynn portray him as loving destruction, he could maybe not even care about this distinction) between destroying a bot and destroying a living being. So those part of their character being used doesn't mean that they'll destroy the world or kill everybody for that.

I don't agree with changing them, but I don't disagree with showing them as antagonist or even villain, if it's done in an interesting way.

 

Actually, I think that having every story revolving about "protecting the world" is a problem in itself, but that's another subject XD

The issue is , at least with the omega thing.  I don't think anyone in sonic actually cares if anyone kills in anyone in sonic land. The only reason sonic cared in issue 6 was because eggman had no memory and he felt like that wasn't fair. As for rouge , rouge is pretty sensible in this interpretation dunno if that would even happen, unless the thing she's stealing isn't that important and if that's the case that just sounds like a small story that doesn't require you inserting other characters in. And that's the thing, nowadays the only things team dark is fighting any other group of heroes for are smaller spats that don't require much time, if at all.

They are good guys, and their leader might be the goodest guy sometimes, or at least most selfless.

That said, I did above think of a scenario where that happens, but it require people thinking shadow died

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2 minutes ago, Sonic Fan J said:

As @Gumbit implies, changing the world and characters is part of where the FFs got some their hate in the first place so using that as a means to get them back into a Sonic comic would definitely be disastrous.

I don’t think that really holds water as a reason for the hate towards the FF when the games themselves change their world on a whim, especially given the Two Worlds thing that Archie actually avoided like the plague even when it got rebooted. That just comes off more as scapegoating, when that isn’t really something the FF are at fault for.

Ironically enough, the world of Archie and characters were somewhat more consistent (not counting the artstyle), and changes were usually gradual and reasonable within the context that only had problems when broken.

Change isn’t really a bad thing tho, it’s really how you execute it. The FF themselves went through drastic changes come the reboot, but it was bad in itself (despite those who get a kick out of demonizing Ian and folks for doing this). Mind you, we’re not that far into IDW, so not much if anything really has to changed if they were to bring the FF back somehow.

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14 minutes ago, Kazhnuz said:

Even if I agree with the basic message of "we shouldn't change the character just to add some more", I disagree with one big point : being a villiain doesn't necessarily mean "destroying the world".

 

I don't agree with changing them, but I don't disagree with showing them as antagonist or even villain, if it's done in an interesting way.

 

Actually, I think that having every story revolving about "protecting the world" is a problem in itself, but that's another subject XD

There are people who have established that they would enjoy that, too.

10 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

I discovered something interesting:

The base in issue 11 is actualy Final Egg from Sonic Adventure, which is in Mystic Ruins! So what does it mean for the animal-human world split??

"The fact that this was the Final Egg was first confirmed by artist Evan Stanley on Twitter"

http://sonic.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Egg_(IDW)

latest?cb=20181129200017

Oh shoot, I didn't even think of that.

5 minutes ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

I don’t think that really holds water as a reason for the hate towards the FF when the games themselves change their world on a whim, especially given the Two Worlds thing that Archie actually avoided like the plague even when it got rebooted. That just comes off more as scapegoating, when that isn’t really something the FF are at fault for.

That wasn't [known to be] the case back then, though.

Historical context is kinda important when talking about trends.

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Just now, DabigRG said:

That wasn't [known to be] the case back then, though.

Historical context is kinda important when talking about trends.

Which era? Penders or Flynn?

Because I can understand if that was the case for the former, not so much the latter.

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10 minutes ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

I don’t think that really holds water as a reason for the hate towards the FF when the games themselves change their world on a whim, especially given the Two Worlds thing that Archie actually avoided like the plague even when it got rebooted. That just comes off more as scapegoating, when that isn’t really something the FF are at fault for.

Ironically enough, the world of Archie and characters were somewhat more consistent (not counting the artstyle), and changes were usually gradual and reasonable within the context that only had problems when broken.

Change isn’t really a bad thing tho, it’s really how you execute it. The FF themselves went through drastic changes come the reboot, but it was bad in itself (despite those who get a kick out of demonizing Ian and folks for doing this). Mind you, we’re not that far into IDW, so not much if anything really has to changed if they were to bring the FF back somehow.

Well I never said it was the only reason, just part of it, and mostly based on what I saw. As for where I saw a lot of that; that would be the SEGA Forums while they were still around, though to be fair most of the hatred that stemmed from changes and differences were usually based off of what the poster felt was an extreme change which undermined a core component of the altered character (Sonic not being a vagabond adventurer being one thing at minimum). Realistically, I think natural change is good for a narrative as it grounds the story and brings with it a sense of believability and relatability that further invests the audience. However, when one has drastic change without grounds or basis for it just to fit something else into the narrative it is not only jarring but text book bad writing and a lot of the hate I've seen in the day stems from the differences from medium to other involving those difference with the FFs involved pre-reboot.

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7 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Oh shoot, I didn't even think of that.

maxresdefault.jpg

It's the same base, but is Mystic ruins in animal world or human world in the comics?

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1 minute ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

 

Which era? Penders or Flynn?

Because I can understand if that was the case for the former, not so much the latter.

Either context.

For example, Mr. Flynn didn't know about the Two Worlds thing when he crafted the reboot world. 

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As Sonic Fan J says, we don't have to change the existing character to add characters like the FF or Sticks… And I think that it's true for most of the other canon character, actually, as long as their "basic concept" is quite simple, basically if we can break down the group or character basic story in a way that we would keep the most important things, but be simple enough.

For the FF, it's simple enough. World well suited for them, Knothole Village could be a town where there would be the Town Militia, and it could be a way to play with how disorganized the Animal World seems to be (and have been shown in most stuff using that concept, for instance in Sonic X where the Animal World have been shown most time as pretty wild) and how Eggmans disrupted its tranquility. Same for Sticks. Her basic story is simple enough to be integrated. They could even play more on the "wild" side of Sticks, making that they didn't have many contact with civilisation before Eggman's invasion, and use that as a cause of her paranoia. If the first thing you see of the civilisation is a megalomaniac conqueror, it might be some normal reaction.

And what would be fun, would be to play that "game" for any other character of any other continuity XD A game of "how could characters from other canon could be adapted in Sonic IDW or in a game-like world" would be pretty fun, as I think that a lot of characters could be adapted as something that exists somewhere in the world. Some would need just some modifications, other more…

But that the kind of thing that would need to be its own topic xD

 

4 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

The issue is , at least with the omega thing.  I don't think anyone in sonic actually cares if anyone kills in anyone in sonic land. The only reason sonic cared in issue 6 was because eggman had no memory and he felt like that wasn't fair. As for rouge , rouge is pretty sensible in this interpretation dunno if that would even happen, unless the thing she's stealing isn't that important and if that's the case that just sounds like a small story that doesn't require you inserting other characters in. And that's the thing, nowadays the only things team dark is fighting any other group of heroes for are smaller spats that don't require much time, if at all. 

They are good guys, and their leader might be the goodest guy sometimes, or at least most selfless. 

That said, I did above think of a scenario where that happens, but it require people thinking shadow died 

Mmh, I'm not really sure about that first point, especially in this vision of Sonic. The "killing is bad, no matter what" is often a point in kids licences, so I really feel that it would be a possible thing (especially as it wouldn't be really controversial).

You are totally true about this vision of Rouge being pretty sensible, though.

 

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>points out the Final Egg location several posts ago

>one person acknowledges it with a like but nobody else talks about it

>someone else points out Final Egg location

>everyone starts talking about it

Sx1eA5.jpg

But anyway, either this means Mystic Ruins is on the animal world somehow, or “two worlds” does, in fact, not mean “two different planets”.

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1 minute ago, Earnest-Panda said:

>points out the Final Egg location several posts ago

>nobody talks about it

>someone else points out Final Egg location

>everyone starts talking about it

Sx1eA5.jpg

Ah sorry for not noticing, must have not catch up the last few pages.

Anyways, what do you think it means for the IDW sonic world?

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22 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

maxresdefault.jpg

It's the same base, but is Mystic ruins in animal world or human world in the comics?

No, I knew that immediately.

What I didn't remember was that the Final Egg was in the human world.

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12 minutes ago, Earnest-Panda said:

But anyway, either this means Mystic Ruins is on the animal world somehow, or “two worlds” does, in fact, not mean “two different planets”.

Or they took a portal off-screen!

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2 hours ago, Conquering Storm’s Servant said:

 

Regardless, I still wonder what people look at when it comes to the characters, because people phrase it as if it only a matter of whether they’re from the games or not. Or in the case of the general franchise, whether they’re from the Genesis era or post-Genesis at times. Sure, it’s really just the more vocal, but that still further begs the question of what the problem is and what is it that they elaborate on caring about. You know as much as I do that people don’t often practice what they preach when questioned, so that’s why I bring this up.


I, personally, don't mind the freedom fighters but just from an outsider or casual reader's perspective I'd be a bit put off if I wanted to read about the Sonic cast and got some unfamiliar characters instead. I warmed up to a lot of the original creations and decided that some of them are pretty endearing in their own right, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't interested in the comics in the first place to expand on some of the game characters I was interested in. Blaze and Tikal are my favorite Sonic characters, and there just isn't a ton of content focused around them even now. 

People have different perspectives on these things and while it's good to be open minded I have no trouble at all understanding some people's hesitance. 

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16 hours ago, Sonictrainer said:

Some Tracy Yardley Fanart of Sonic & Amy as Joker and Harley Quinn

47087352_10212749755723529_8806190172493

Thats just awesome. I want this in HD.

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