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IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

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56 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

Am I the only one not really getting how this is any worse than robotication? Like I get the body horror element, even if I don't really find it that scary (I mean, it just looks like melted metal to me that suddenly reshapes, it's not like we're seeing guts or anything spilling out when damage is done to them). 

In Archie, to me the implications were a lot creepier, you'd be aware of everything you're doing, your mind was very much present and in-tact, but it was forcefully turned to Eggman's whims (Chuck especially, given when he was handed power rings, he could switch between his usual self, and a killer robot who had no issues killing Sonic and was aware of it when he got his mind back). 

Bar the kind of horror of having an infection that will slowly turn you into one of these things - which only Sonic is really going to experience, I really don't see it as particularly more interesting than robotication, especially since to me - it looks like it's going for a zombie infection more than anything else. I can already see this backfiring horribly on Eggman because knowing him, he'll realise that he created a zombie virus, and not a robotic one - as in the zombies won't see him as a master and decide to turn him as well.

I don't really understand Eggman's end-game here, because unlike Archie - where when they were robots, they were programmable and forcefully turned to his control, they couldn't be freed again and he was free to rule them as he pleased, where here, it just looks like a weird as hell zombie thing where those infected are simply brainless hollow shells that will try to turn anything nearby. What's the point of ruling brainless creatures with seemingly no ability to think or do anything other than turning more people? How can he ensure they keep in line? Hell, how can he ensure that he just isn't immediately infected? 

The overall reaction to the issue on Tumblr and Twitter does seem that people are taken a back by its Body-horror, like dont me wrong its not Uzumaki level body horror  DUH,. but Me and a whole bunch of other readers didn't expect it would turn out like this.

I find it much more interesting and a lot scarier then the old-archie/satam robotication, in the end it just looks like furry cartoon critters turning into....robot cartoon critters, and they just became ''cartoonly evil'' for a while. That never really freaked me out not even the scene where Sonic's mother was turned, which didn't age well because it now just reminds me '' hey its that TMNT artist that drew that and its obvious lol'' 

Where this time, there in a zombie-like-state, which I dont know to me that's a lot more dreadful, there not just dead outside but also dead inside..and seeing the limbs fall despite knowing its jut metal-shapes that can retash

there is something off about seeing a character move with a giant HOLE in their head and losing a limb. I mean for a kids comic its pretty woa. I'm just impressed because I was just expecting a modern-updated version of robotication which never fazed me the slightest. Some people are just going to prefer this over what archie did, and that's that. YOu don't have to agree with me but I'm not changing my mind.

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23 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

That's my problem here, I don't understand how you can say that with this one issue alone, they've done this concept better, or more horrifyingly than Archie or SatAM did.

I'm gonna assume it's because it's new.

 

The "body horror" aspect is kind of a draw back when you think about it, all it means is that they don't have to worry about killing/hurting them...which never came up before I think, but it means even less now.

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i wish this comic had more wild settings with interesting designs and the characters actually interacted with them in clever ways instead of just explaining everything directly to move the plot forward.

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I just read the issue and dear lord! The body horror... it's glorious!

Like, I really didn't expect this. When I likened the Metal Virus to a zombie apocalypse but with robots I kind of just figured it'd be people covered in a robot shell... but no. It's like an actual robot zombie, complete with decomposing sludge bodies on top of being soulless. Those poor flickies. I feel worse for them now. It's so horrific and scary. I'd have eaten this up if I had read this as a child. I always did like being scared by horror targeted at my age demographic. Stuff like Courage the Cowardly Dog or the Halloween special of my favorite cartoon. Not really horror movies or anything like that. 

The fact that the virus is on Sonic now is great too. I knew it would happen but the imagery associated with how it affected Rough and Tumble and especially the cover for next month give off of this really welcome, uneasy and creepy vibe.

Damn Eggman, you scary. 

He's really, really scary actually.

I also appreciated the fact that Sonic made mention of how he wouldn't normally punt Rough and Tumble down what looked like a bottomless pit but desperation kind of took over there. The last image of him and Amy just staring at the goop on Sonic in silence was hella effective.

And apparently, Eggman's just gonna... release it.  In something called the Clinical Trials...! 

My heart did a tiny bit of a flip there. I wanna see. People are just barely getting over the war and yet the apocalypse is on the way. Mr. Tinker, where are you in our time of need?

I enjoyed this one a lot. I thought it was structured well and it got across what it needed too, clearly and concisely. The battle with the tank didn't take up the majority of the issue so the focus was on what it needed to be. I'm happy Ian managed to get something like this out of just seeing the Metal versions of the characters from Sonic Heroes. Unlike Master Overlord, this is how you take inspiration from the games and expand upon it. 

I cannot wait. I think I have butterflies in my tummy. 

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I just realised something - 

Spoiler

We know that no matter what - the virus attaches to the user through touch. It does so by attaching to Sonic's glove, and slightly to his wrist before he does that...

...but then why doesn't he also have many random touches around his head and body as well? He spin-dashed multiple times against Tumble, enough to leave severe impacts each time, and the Spindash - whilst powerful - doesn't provide armour or protect, so by all accounts, Sonic's infection should be a lot more worse than just his hand and mouth. Especially since it was shown earlier that multiple touches/infections heavily speeds the process. 

 

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1 hour ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

Again, this is part of my problem - we're taking something that had two issues of build up and saying this is superior to something Archie did and explained for over 100 issues, and the only real point it has is that it had body horror, and it can be spread around by a virus. That's my problem here, I don't understand how you can say that with this one issue alone, they've done this concept better, or more horrifyingly than Archie or SatAM did.

Uh, are we?

Feel free to point out any presumably previous instances, but every comment I've seen here is just talking about what it is.

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3 hours ago, DabigRG said:

I just noticed something else:

  Reveal hidden contents

What is that in her hand on the top right?

Also, Megadrive boxart.

Appropriate profile pic.

...You want her to be religious?

Holy shit, I sorta had Mecha Sally on the brain a teeny bit, but I never considered that!

Oh, is that what happened? I just assumed that it was an art oversight.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

Ch'yeah.

Dangit! :lol: 

That's a total rebranding and/or separate continuity though.

That was Dave Manak?!

 

Perhaps. It's pretty likely, given that new character's timing.

Yeah.

Also, third.

Holy smokes, I hope that's what they're doing!

Pffft--wait, what?!

I meant a villain and sadistic. How my phone wrote that i have no idea lol.

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3 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Uh, are we?

Feel free to point out any presumably previous instances, but every comment I've seen here is just talking about what it is.

If you look at the first post where I discussed this, you can see a post that basically implied that Flynn one-upped the concept in this one issue alone, which is why I was originally responding to.

In which case, if you're assuming I was referring to a blanket "everyone is saying this", that doesn't make sense, because otherwise I'd be including myself in such a statement. The "you" are well was not referring to you specifically, but a general you - as in "I don't see how someone can say this is better based off the one issue and minor details we have".

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Its all a matter of preference, but I feel the Zombot virus gets more points for the body horror aspect. That's something Robitization lacked, and it definitely adds a level of uneasiness to the whole situation. That said, the art really doesn't sell what should be an extremely horrifying situation that well. We only get one panel of Rough and Tumble reacting before they're converted, and not much attention is drawn to the body horror or Sonic & Amy's reactions to it. They both seem mildly surprised and annoyed at worst, which is a really bad way of selling this so far.

 

Hopefully later artists are able to sell this better, because it IS a horrifying and scary situation, it just needs the right amount of focus to sell it. 

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1 hour ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

I just realised something - 

  Hide contents

We know that no matter what - the virus attaches to the user through touch. It does so by attaching to Sonic's glove, and slightly to his wrist before he does that...

...but then why doesn't he also have many random touches around his head and body as well? He spin-dashed multiple times against Tumble, enough to leave severe impacts each time, and the Spindash - whilst powerful - doesn't provide armour or protect, so by all accounts, Sonic's infection should be a lot more worse than just his hand and mouth. Especially since it was shown earlier that multiple touches/infections heavily speeds the process. 

 

Spoiler

Remember that Sonic's movement delays the progress of the Metal Virus...because plot armor.

 

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2 hours ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

If you look at the first post where I discussed this, you can see a post that basically implied that Flynn one-upped the concept in this one issue alone, which is why I was originally responding to.

In which case, if you're assuming I was referring to a blanket "everyone is saying this", that doesn't make sense, because otherwise I'd be including myself in such a statement. The "you" are well was not referring to you specifically, but a general you - as in "I don't see how someone can say this is better based off the one issue and minor details we have".

Oh okay, it honestly just looked like a long, lone comment when I first saw it. My bad

Anyway, I think it was just a memetic comment on how inherently disturbing it is meant to be. And if it makes you feel better, Kells doesn't like Archie in general, so him saying that is normal. 

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I was playing catchup with the Bumblekast with Episode 80, 81, and 82 got some insight on the idea behind a few original characters:

  • Spoiler

     

    • First off, The Skunk Bros. Rough and Tumble were inspired by a little Team Rocket, a little Wrestling, a lot of 80s. They are bad guys we like to see fight and like to see lose.
    • Whisper was conceptualized as a contrast to most female Sonic characters in personality, abilities, and appearance, being quiet, normal, and muted compared to the likes of Amy, Rouge, Cream, and Wave. There were a plethora of design details like hairstyles, color schemes, and Wispon variations(many that we haven't seen) for her that the final design was cobbled from per SEGA's handpicking. Speaking of her variable Wispon, Mr. Flynn was nervous about it when pitching to SEGA, but they thought it was cool and actually made further suggestions of what it could do at some point.
    • Dinosaur characters have been in his back pocket for quite some time and there are some potential pitches involving them down the road.
    • Starline was created as part of a trio with a mechanic in mind that has allegedly shifted to the point where it will probably be unrecognizable. He does acknowledge that Evan Stanley deems the final design as a spiritual successor to Dr. Finitevus and Dr. Zachary. He also notes how there will likely be mostly not conscious parallels with newer characters as well.

     

     

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While I haven't read any of the IDW Sonic comics in any significant capacity (just kinda skimmed), based on what you guys are talking about, I do have the concern that much like the Mr. Tinker shtick in Year 1, they'll end up rushing through this new plot point and end up skirting over the implications and possibilities of such an event for the sake of a tawdry or anti-climactic resolution to maintain a forced status quo.

Don't get me wrong, this sounds like something noteworthy, but so was the Mr. Tinker idea as well, and that just got bumrushed through and the implications brought up regarding the morality of allowing the amnesiac Eggman to continue despite the risk of him regaining his memories, the possibilities regarding how much of the Mr Tinker personality remains after his return to his usual self, the whole Shadow vs Sonic morality thing...it just got brushed aside, and I don't think it would reflect well on the comics if they do the same here for the sake of maintaining a forced cheery/lightheartedness that so much of the modern era of Sonic suffers from while ignoring the disturbing implications they raise.

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1 hour ago, SenEDDtor Missile said:

While I haven't read any of the IDW Sonic comics in any significant capacity (just kinda skimmed), based on what you guys are talking about, I do have the concern that much like the Mr. Tinker shtick in Year 1, they'll end up rushing through this new plot point and end up skirting over the implications and possibilities of such an event for the sake of a tawdry or anti-climactic resolution to maintain a forced status quo.

Don't get me wrong, this sounds like something noteworthy, but so was the Mr. Tinker idea as well, and that just got bumrushed through and the implications brought up regarding the morality of allowing the amnesiac Eggman to continue despite the risk of him regaining his memories, the possibilities regarding how much of the Mr Tinker personality remains after his return to his usual self, the whole Shadow vs Sonic morality thing...it just got brushed aside, and I don't think it would reflect well on the comics if they do the same here for the sake of maintaining a forced cheery/lightheartedness that so much of the modern era of Sonic suffers from while ignoring the disturbing implications they raise.

Yes, I will acknowledge that for as excited as I definitely still am right now, that is a very real concern. I enjoyed the build up that happened during the first arc but the rushed climax with the uninspired Master Overlord (still a shit name by the way) did pretty much nothing for me. I do see the concern here considering that I barely registered how we didn't get to see much of Rough and Tumble's reaction to what was happening to them before it happened. Though I will say that I do think Sonic and Amy's reactions were perfectly fine as an initial response. I want them to be able to take their time a bit more.

Ian seems confident in how much more freedom he has under the IDW banner but it does seem like there are some obvious drawbacks on display here make the structure of what's going on stand out in a way that sometimes doesn't jell with people. I've been okay with it but that's mostly because it hasn't become much of a hinderance with the specific stories he's been telling up to this point. I do worry there will come a time when it will. 

Right now though I'm hyped as hell. I cannot tell a lie. I'm ready. Let's fucking go!

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I think it's safe to assume Shadow was right and no thanks to status quo looks stupid for letting Sonic convince him in sparing Eggman. I think Shadow is darker than anything eggman could be, so basically this is unimpressive to acknowledge for Eggman as evil feats go when characters like Mephiles existed once.

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17 minutes ago, Dash Speed said:

I think it's safe to assume Shadow was right and no thanks to status quo looks stupid for letting Sonic convince him in sparing Eggman. I think Shadow is darker than anything eggman could be, so basically this is unimpressive to acknowledge for Eggman as evil feats go when characters like Mephiles existed once.

Stop with the Shadow Wank. It's annoying.

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Honestly, while stripping the person of their personality is one way to go about horror, letting them keep it can be horrifying too. Anyone remember Terminator Genisys, where hero John Connor got turned into a nanite creature loyal to the main antagonist, but he still had all his memories and personality from before? It naturally just made things unsettling.

Personally, I can't help but wonder if we won't see Rough and Tumble for a while, everyone will forget about them in the pit, and somehow they'll regain free will/consciousness but keep the nanite bodies while everyone else was cured. This would pave a way for them to be legitimately dangerous as returning villains, if still dumb.

What's more, they'll probably be just as eager to kill Eggman as Sonic when this is all over, and that's going to lead to interesting situations.

9 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Which arc was starting again?

I'm referencing something from Dragon Ball Super, don't mind me.

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8 hours ago, SBR2 said:

Honestly the old Roboticization wasn't that scary either. Uncle Chuck just kinda casually mentions that they're aware of everything going on but nothings ever done with that. He never seems all that upset about the fact he was a mindless slave, he uses his cool upgrades no problem and he seems mostly ok.

Just saying it kinda undercuts the implied horror of your concept if everyone is perfectly fine after its undone. 

You mean,aside of how Bunnie hated looking like a freak,or how terrified people looked when they got robotizated?Or that one story when Bunnie had a nightmare that Robotnik turned into a full robot to make her kill her friends,showing how scared she is of herself? Or the fact that she has to constantly update her robot part to survive,reducing her chances of ever being normal? Or the fact that in the Mecha Sally arc Sally was also tore apart for Eggman to weaponize her,making it nearly impossible to turn her back and making her hurt her friends and family and how broken she was in the reboot when she remembered it? Or the fact that there was also that whole removing some of the organic parts of his soldiers to replace with robot part with either a bomb or a device that paralize them and remember that they also captured innocent people and forced them to this! Yeah,not scary at all.

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4 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Oh okay, it honestly just looked like a long, lone comment when I first saw it. My bad

Anyway, I think it was just a memetic comment on how inherently disturbing it is meant to be. And if it makes you feel better, Kells doesn't like Archie in general, so him saying that is normal. 

her* I"m a she, 

Never said I disliked the whole part of robotiziation either, I Just never thought It was scary/body horror, more like ""turning characters into evil robots""

 

 

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2 hours ago, SenEDDtor Missile said:

While I haven't read any of the IDW Sonic comics in any significant capacity (just kinda skimmed), based on what you guys are talking about, I do have the concern that much like the Mr. Tinker shtick in Year 1, they'll end up rushing through this new plot point and end up skirting over the implications and possibilities of such an event for the sake of a tawdry or anti-climactic resolution to maintain a forced status quo.

Don't get me wrong, this sounds like something noteworthy, but so was the Mr. Tinker idea as well, and that just got bumrushed through and the implications brought up regarding the morality of allowing the amnesiac Eggman to continue despite the risk of him regaining his memories, the possibilities regarding how much of the Mr Tinker personality remains after his return to his usual self, the whole Shadow vs Sonic morality thing...it just got brushed aside, and I don't think it would reflect well on the comics if they do the same here for the sake of maintaining a forced cheery/lightheartedness that so much of the modern era of Sonic suffers from while ignoring the disturbing implications they raise.

If they do this, it would make sonic seem incredibly antiquated as a character. In an age where thing like my little pony can call out its main protagonist for fucking up real bad, for them to just slide past all this would date sonic more than a lot of his other mistakes.

Hopefully they don't do that.

1 hour ago, ShadowSJG said:

Stop with the Shadow Wank. It's annoying.

While it is, I do agree with the first part of his statement. The status quo kinda ruins that narrative, and maybe you shouldn't tell stories who's weight are broken, or actively countered by the status quo.Or you know, make a genuine attempt to break it it. The rest of his statement is whatever.

35 minutes ago, Legosi (Ogilvie) said:

Honestly, while stripping the person of their personality is one way to go about horror, letting them keep it can be horrifying too. Anyone remember Terminator Genisys, where hero John Connor got turned into a nanite creature loyal to the main antagonist, but he still had all his memories and personality from before? It naturally just made things unsettling.

 

  Hide contents

Personally, I can't help but wonder if we won't see Rough and Tumble for a while, everyone will forget about them in the pit, and somehow they'll regain free will/consciousness but keep the nanite bodies while everyone else was cured. This would pave a way for them to be legitimately dangerous as returning villains, if still dumb.

What's more, they'll probably be just as eager to kill Eggman as Sonic when this is all over, and that's going to lead to interesting situations.

I'm referencing something from Dragon Ball Super, don't mind me.

 

Oh like the mortal kombat thral's . So its just the evil version of those characters airing out their issues

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1 hour ago, Redbluethunder5 said:

You mean,aside of how Bunnie hated looking like a freak,or how terrified people looked when they got robotizated?Or that one story when Bunnie had a nightmare that Robotnik turned into a full robot to make her kill her friends,showing how scared she is of herself? Or the fact that she has to constantly update her robot part to survive,reducing her chances of ever being normal? Or the fact that in the Mecha Sally arc Sally was also tore apart for Eggman to weaponize her,making it nearly impossible to turn her back and making her hurt her friends and family and how broken she was in the reboot when she remembered it? Or the fact that there was also that whole removing some of the organic parts of his soldiers to replace with robot part with either a bomb or a device that paralize them and remember that they also captured innocent people and forced them to this! Yeah,not scary at all.

Some of this can be pretty much interchangeable with the current concept.

It's amazing, but they'll both have the same problems when it comes to curity.

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2 hours ago, StaticMania said:

Losing your free will is scary apparently...

The perspective is lost on both ends...

Honestly, it's only scary if you remain conscious during it. Then you're a prisoner in your own body.

If you are unconscious, it's just taking a long nap. Whether you wake up or not has no meaning to you in your oblivion.

(Go figure, this is why many philosophers say death is not a scary fate, since you're basically in a permanent, dreamless sleep. What is scary is pain.)

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