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IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

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3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Actually there's precedent for it. Not just sega desiring certain stories. But Sega particularly demanding authors to write more shadow stuff .

When? If this is about editors at Archie making Penders use Sega characters, prior to 2006, then I don't care. That certainly doesn't matter now.

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Odds are the fanbase will make noise about it, the people who manage the community will know about it, one of which is the guy who got Ian flynn hired. And questions will be asked. And this information gets to someone who's handling the sonic franchise higher than that, demands will be made. Because its actually happened before.


All of this is just you guessing.

 

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Second point. My example was to paraphrase myself , if sega or idw comes asking  " hey why isn't there more shadow material " Ian flynn can't just go " well I don't like how his character is right now" because they will just go " Do your job " and he would have to or get fired. So in that scenario yes he may infact loose his job. This is a scenario he talks about on his podcast where he's worked with stuff, he didn't like, or understand because he likes having a job and he's replaceable.

[...]

They care as much as the fanbase cares. And Shadow's really popular so they do

And yes he could get fired if he doesn't comply with the people who employ him, he will tell you that himself. He's a contract worker.

I don't care what imagined scenarios you come up with where you project your obvious fanboyism onto the rest of the fanbase and make it sound like that will compel IDW and Sega to sit Ian down and force him to write Shadow comics. Especially because you somehow missed the point of the post you quoted. I specifically said "Ian isn't going to lose his job for not proposing Shadow comics," because if he doesn't have one planned right now, they aren't going to be asking "WHERE'S SHADOW!?". I even strongly implied in the same post you quoted that he'd jump at the chance to do it if they had their own proposal. By this logic they should have done something about the Freedom Fighters by now. I seem to recall a decent amount of demand for them recently.

Maybe you should actually read what I'm saying instead of putting words in my mouth and then trying to sound smart with posts about how it's all just a job and implying I don't understand that (when it should also be understood Ian seems flexible and is an actual professional; dude said he doesn't like Heroes and he included Metal Overlord anyway for those fans--he's never treated these books like his personal playground where only he is satisfied and that's obvious to anyone who's read more than the pages with their favorite character on them). It's especially insulting when I'm responding to exactly what you write.

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I think Ian flynn said recently he would rather avoid telling a shadow story because he has to be written a certain way. Ontop of that people ask him about aspects of his character, he kinda just sighs depressed because he can't do anything because he has to be written a certain way. I don't think he's jumping at the chance these days like before.

But he would try his best , and at least I would appreciate it.

I'm not doubting Ian is frustrated by certain things not being in his control--who wouldn't be--but you inferring what goes on in his head with this book because he explains what his limits are doesn't interest me.

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

I say this in all due respect. What in the hell are you talking about? did you read my words. No one said anything about anyone being upset or suggesting that shadow be ignored.

That's more addressing an ongoing problem in this thread damn near monthly regarding this character. And it's same thing every month. And you are almost always at the center of these arguments. Go figure.

3 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

That's my point, a rather depressing criticism of capitalism in this situation. I don't know how you got shadow fanboyism out of that. I'm quite literally confused. My posts are above this or if this ends up on the next page, they are on the previous one. You can find them.

Your posts on this page imply it's imperative Ian write a Shadow mini, claiming it's something people want and it's something that Sega is going to want to satisfy an imagined demand you're proposing. Your posts indeed sound like you think Shadow is being ignored so I don't think me reading fanboyism into that statement is too far off (this post from Friday by you sounds an awful lot like something with Shadow would need to be addressed). It's ironic coming from someone who wants to come off as being all "in the know."

In summary: Shadow isn't as important as you want to make him out to be, and Sega isn't going to make IDW fire Ian over it because it's never going to come up the way you say it will. In the off chance Sega requests or suggests something, Ian would do it because he's a professional. So for the last time read my posts, and if you can't actually respond to the words I'm writing or approach discussion about this character with a hint of intellectual honesty or without throwing around your imagined scenarios as an understanding of the comics business (that you somehow are the only one who understands), then do not bother replying to me.

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9 hours ago, Zaysho said:

Maybe you should actually read what I'm saying instead of putting words in my mouth and then trying to sound smart with posts about how it's all just a job and implying I don't understand that (when it should also be understood Ian seems flexible and is an actual professional; dude said he doesn't like Heroes and he included Metal Overlord anyway for those fans--he's never treated these books like his personal playground where only he is satisfied and that's obvious to anyone who's read more than the pages with their favorite character on them). It's especially insulting when I'm responding to exactly what you write.

Metal Overlord looks more like an attempt to satisfy SEGA rather. To get quick approvals for publishing. Ian wanted to build a good relation with them so he adapted Sonic Heroes story to please Iizuka.

To make it easier for them to accept his more crazy stories, he had to do the most basic Sonic story first.

Hopefully we don't see other game adaptations after Sonic Heroes's adaptation in IDW...

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8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

When? If this is about editors at Archie making Penders use Sega characters, prior to 2006, then I don't care. That certainly doesn't matter now.


All of this is just you guessing.

 

I don't care what imagined scenarios you come up with where you project your obvious fanboyism onto the rest of the fanbase and make it sound like that will compel IDW and Sega to sit Ian down and force him to write Shadow comics.

" Oh hey folks like shadow and might ask for a comic " isn't an imagined scenario? Its very reasonable. And literally part of the reason we are talking about this

So this is something that is going to be a theme in my response. You seem to be responding to argument that doesn't exist.

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

 

Especially because you somehow missed the point of the post you quoted. I specifically said "Ian isn't going to lose his job for not proposing Shadow comics,"

I didn't. You missed the point of what I posted and was correcting you on the matter. It wasn't about shadow comics, its a hypothetical scenario where he doesn't comply with his employers. This conversation is about shadow, so it includes him. But I had this exact same conversation or response months ago about in other shit in the comic.

Ian Flynn is a contract worker that effectively works for two entities. Both of these entities needs to be content if he is to continue working with them, not complying with one or both of these entities may result in him not having a job. Him avoiding shadow stories is kinda hard because the character is extremely popular and there is high damand to see him places. If a scenario rises where they want him to do a story about him, he will kinda of have to do it. And there is no expectancy on when sega will decide to act right.

Nothing I posted there  was incorrect. Everything I said is factual and Ian will tell you himself and has on podcast the only thing I added was.

" It might be better than avoid it, just rip the bandaid off, so we can see what new shadow is like " and " I think him lacking defined story telling is contributing to the character's weirdness "

And the point of it all, is that shadow is going to be hard to avoid and because of that he will not be able to avoid him long enough and will most likely see a lot of that bad version in the future. Yes he may loose his job if he does not comply with his employers, but he wont because he's  a professional. So odds are more bad shadow, even in miniseries will pop up.

 

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

because if he doesn't have one planned right now, they aren't going to be asking "WHERE'S SHADOW!?".

No one is saying that it would be immediate. Chill, like you are jumping to conclusions. Read my words, like actually.

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

I even strongly implied in the same post you quoted that he'd jump at the chance to do it if they had their own proposal. By this logic they should have done something about the Freedom Fighters by now. I seem to recall a decent amount of demand for them recently.

He's a contract worker , and the people in charge don't want them. If he could just write whatever he wanted, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. Shadow would just...be better. But he can't, he has two bosses one or both don't want those characters around.  And if he were to try and attempt to not comply with his employer's wishes. He would not have a job. But he wouldn't do that , because he's professional , so due to who that character is he may not be able to avoid him for long

Which was my point.

 

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

Maybe you should actually read what I'm saying instead of putting words in my mouth and then trying to sound smart with posts about how it's all just a job and implying I don't understand that (when it should also be understood Ian seems flexible and is an actual professional; dude said he doesn't like Heroes and he included Metal Overlord anyway for those fans--he's never treated these books like his personal playground where only he is satisfied and that's obvious to anyone who's read more than the pages with their favorite character on them). It's especially insulting when I'm responding to exactly what you write.

You seem to be confusing several different things. No one said Ian flynn wasn't flexible. No one said ian flynn wasn't professional. Both qualities I have praised of this man before.

I'm not talking about him not wanting to work with things. He has thebest marine the racoon that exists. And the rogues, and IIRC he doesn't like either of them. My point is , he made a specific note that he would like to not work with shadow because he would have to write him weird. And that's a fair take. If I were writing this , I would be on the same shit.

But shadow's a popular guy, a really popular guy. And seemingly going forward important to sega's marketing again. He may be asked to do more things with the character. Whether it be the fanbase itself or pushes from his employers. And that will make shadow a particular character who's hard to avoid. Even now, shadow seems to be a character they break out every summer to have a block buster fight. He's gonna be hard to avoid.

Nothing I just said is untrue. Or crazy . You are not responding to what I write . To be blunt, you are responding to an idea you have of me. Read the words I wrote.

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

I'm not doubting Ian is frustrated by certain things not being in his control--who wouldn't be--but you inferring what goes on in his head with this book because he explains what his limits are doesn't interest me.

That's more addressing an ongoing problem in this thread damn near monthly regarding this character. And it's same thing every month. And you are almost always at the center of these arguments. Go figure.

Sure man

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

Your posts on this page imply it's imperative Ian write a Shadow mini, claiming it's something people want and it's something that Sega is going to want to satisfy an imagined demand you're proposing.

I think its a good idea to sort of , rip the bandaid off, See what we are working with and move forward.

People do want it, its part of the reason we are having this convo, its actually the reason shadow got 3 or was it 4 in the last book. And possibly they seem to be getting more use out of the character as of late

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

Your posts indeed sound like you think Shadow is being ignored so I don't think me reading fanboyism into that statement is too far off (this post from Friday by you sounds an awful lot like something with Shadow would need to be addressed). It's ironic coming from someone who wants to come off as being all "in the know."

That post is about how human's in the movie may effect other media. And a bit about gun, I responded to that. That post, the chunky bit, is about how sonic has always been fighting " the man" and while GUN fit that bill, they have been stripped of their relevancy. Quite literally with the shadow disassociation . So a gun like entity isn't inherently bad, but you need to find a new government group.

Nothing I said was untrue. Did you mean to post this post? Because if you didn't I would get that. If you did , you read way too much into nothing.

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

In summary: Shadow isn't as important as you want to make him out to be, and Sega isn't going to make IDW fire Ian over it because it's never going to come up the way you say it will.

So you don't think shadow is important.

1) That is your opinion, cool.

2) I don't care in general. I also don't care, that's irrelevant to the conversation.

3)The fact or rather the context around this entire conversation proves shadow is pretty important to sega actually.

 

8 hours ago, Zaysho said:

So for the last time read my posts, and if you can't actually respond to the words I'm writing or approach discussion about this character with a hint of intellectual honesty or without throwing around your imagined scenarios as an understanding of the comics business (that you somehow are the only one who understands), then do not bother replying to me.

Like before, did. And Like before I responded. Now we are going to sit here and wit to see if you actually respond to my posts or respond to some idea of me that has nothing to do with what I am saying.

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26 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

And the point of it all, is that shadow is going to be hard to avoid and because of that he will not be able to avoid him long enough and will most likely see a lot of that bad version in the future. Yes he may loose his job if he does not comply with his employers, but he wont because he's  a professional. So odds are more bad shadow, even in miniseries will pop up.

All wrong. And I'll tell you why!!

Understand this: comic industry 101: IDW PAYS SEGA, to have authorization to make and sell Sonic Comics.

IDW PAYS SEGA A FIXED FEE

Then IDW gets the money from the comics sales! = IDW gets the comic money, NOT SEGA

So, SEGA doesnt care if the comics sell well or not! They only care if the publisher sticks to their "vision" of Sonic (example: Sonic is forbidden from wearing pants, just like Shadow is forbidden from having emotions😜).

Also, IDW is not gonna force Ian to make stories about Shadows if he knows and they know he cannot write a proper Shadow under SEGA's restriction

SEGA doesnt care, IDW doesnt care, there are other character with less TIGHT LEASH from SEGA.

(and the situation you're talking about only applies if SEGA forces Ian or any other writer to write a tie-in comic to a game, that's it)

 

Besides, Shadow is not that important, he was relegated to the back for the last decade, just like Silver, just like Chaotix. Just like them, he only got a role in Sonic Forces's story like everyone else. He is not as special as he used to be in 2002.

And frankly I would just prefer if Ian doesnt shove every game character in every single story. Why were the Chaotix even involved, why were Team Dark even involved?? That's another problem I have is that he shoves every single modern character.

I hope the story after the Zombot arc doesnt have all 20 characters each waiting for their turn to be Sonic's sidekick for one issue...

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@Shadowlax I said shut the fuck up.

Across these last few months I have had it with your inane conspiracy drivel surrounding anything and everything to do with Shadow and Ian, patronizing attitude towards others who don't agree with you in these topics, and your all-around tendency to ruin discussion for everyone else on this forum. There are people who refuse to post in this topic anymore because of you. So if it takes banning your sorry arrogant ass to make this thread having worthwhile discussion again then I'm happy to do just that. Ignore me one more time and you're gone. I'm not tolerating your bullshit rhetoric on this forum anymore and this is your last warning you will ever get.

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giphy.gif

So much politics.

1 hour ago, Marco9966 said:

Metal Overlord looks more like an attempt to satisfy SEGA rather. To get quick approvals for publishing. Ian wanted to build a good relation with them so he adapted Sonic Heroes story to please Iizuka.

To make it easier for them to accept his more crazy stories, he had to do the most basic Sonic story first.

Hopefully we don't see other game adaptations after Sonic Heroes's adaptation in IDW...

It wasn't an adaptation so much as simply using a few key elements from it. 

Those elements being Neo Metal Sonic, the Egg Fleet, and the idea of him turning into a giant monster with overlapping eyes. That's it--everything else was fairly original.

Plus characters like Cream, Big, Mighty, and Sticks were gonna be involved as well, which gives me the impression that there was more to the story arc initially.

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7 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

Here:

  Reveal hidden contents

latest?cb=20191117135040

latest?cb=20191117135041

latest?cb=20191117135042

 

Ah, I was hoping I'd get em to work first. Tch, ah well.

Nice to see Eggman out in the field again.

2 minutes ago, Noodle Panda said:

Jack Lawrence art just keeps getting better ^^

Eh, Eggman looks fine, but the Mobians still look a little funny.

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1 hour ago, Sean said:

@Shadowlax I said shut the fuck up.

Across these last few months I have had it with your inane conspiracy drivel surrounding anything and everything to do with Shadow and Ian, patronizing attitude towards others who don't agree with you in these topics, and your all-around tendency to ruin discussion for everyone else on this forum. There are people who refuse to post in this topic anymore because of you. So if it takes banning your sorry arrogant ass to make this thread having worthwhile discussion again then I'm happy to do just that. Ignore me one more time and you're gone. I'm not tolerating your bullshit rhetoric on this forum anymore and this is your last warning you will ever get.

I literally don't understand what you are talking about and everything I said in this past post is reasonable.

I don't know what you want here man. And not only that I haven't been rude to anyone, and yet here you are. I didn't post a conspiracy theory. Ya'll don't like me, that's fine, its whatever man. But it seems as though ya'll are posting about the idea of me, rather than the stuff i'm posting. Because its a reasonable and neutral take. And even went out of my way when responded to to elaborate on it further where I agree with the sentiments being lodged at it.

If a neutral take criticizing businesses decisions made by sega, on Ian's side suggesting that his work is hard and it might be hard to avoid certain hard to write about topics. Is a conspiracy theory, something I have dealt with myself working on comics myself. And writing for things myself . Is somehow a conspiracy theory I literally don't know what you want.

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Ideally would be for you to stop posting at all, but if you have to at least stop with the fucking absurd conspiracy theories targeted at the comics staff that you bring up every time your the word Shadow pops up in your notifications for this thread.

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Just now, Tornado said:

Ideally would be for you to stop posting at all,

 

Just now, Tornado said:

but if you have to at least stop with the fucking absurd conspiracy theories targeted at the comics staff that you bring up every time your the word Shadow pops up in your notifications for this thread.

Nothing I posted on that page was a conspiracy. Its literally

" Hey shadow is popular, if an flynn wishes to avoid him. Might be hard, might be a push for a comic at some point. "

That's it, that's the whole point. Which is based of something he just said saying he wants to avoid writing him because he has weird restrictions.

Where is the conspiracy?

 

If you all just want to be bullies and get me out of here, just ban me. If you want to actually have a discussion. Then I'm asking you where did I create a conspiracy theory? Because my point at its core is simple.

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Why should anyone on this forum expect to be able to have a discussion with you at this point?

 

Our concern as moderators is more preventing you from chasing any more people out of this and similar threads at this point whenever they bring up something that you cannot stand they don't agree with you over; again, as members have told us directly that your attitude and "debate" style have done before.

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I'm liking the art from issue #24. Dumb question, with issues #22-#24 all taking place at the same time, has Dr Starline talked to Deadly 6 before or after the events of #24, or do we not know that yet?

As an aside, thinking about what concept a second Sonic book can have, how about basically have a superhero team? Was watching Atop the Fourth Wall's Marvel's Exiles Retrospective, a superhero teambook where the cast keeps changing every few issues. Perhaps something like that could work with Sonic?

Like say, the team always has 6 members. New character is the leader of the team. The other 5 slots are taken up Sega Sonic characters, IDW newcomers, or just new characters entirely. 4 issue storylines, each story featuring a configuration of team members. Sonic is in the first story but runs off to do his own thing in his book. More secondary characters like Silver or Rouge or Espio stay with the team for longer stretches of time. New characters can be introduced to do their own thing, perhaps throw intrigue into the plot like perhaps being an Eggman agent, or perhaps are a good character that winds up getting killed at the end of a story.

It's a basic idea, one that I'm sure at least a few people have thought up some variation on. I just would like to see more focus outside Sonic himself in someway. Can't wait for the 2020 annual, hope it actually makes March this time.

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3 minutes ago, Silvereyes said:

I'm liking the art from issue #24. Dumb question, with issues #22-#24 all taking place at the same time, has Dr Starline talked to Deadly 6 before or after the events of #24, or do we not know that yet?

He talked to them between everyone getting to Freedom HQ and everyone splitting up. 

5 minutes ago, Silvereyes said:



As an aside, thinking about what concept a second Sonic book can have, how about basically have a superhero team? Was watching Atop the Fourth Wall's Marvel's Exiles Retrospective, a superhero teambook where the cast keeps changing every few issues. Perhaps something like that could work with Sonic?

Some people associate that with the Freedom Fighters, so they won't go for it.

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