Jump to content
Dejimon11

IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

Recommended Posts

24 minutes ago, thumbs13 said:

I mean, from a utility "Shadow doesn't need the other two" perspective I can see the argument, but characters aren't just functions. Shadow teams with Rouge and Omega for the same reason Superman and Batman are both on the Justice league and Thor and Hawkeye are both on the avengers.

No That's not a good comparison actually. The reason the JLA exist is because there were a bunch of super powered individuals and that saw the need to band together because there are large global, sometimes galactic level threats that need cooperation. That is in theory what the resistance is.

Team dark is just...friends. Who in the end have very different goals. When you look at those characters solo books, batman and supes aren't on a team. They are solo characters who occasionally may appear in another ones's book. Which is what team dark should be. Otherwise they should just be doing their own thing.

Black canary hanging out with batman isn't a super team, black canary and I dunno cyborg came to town did a thing and then bounced. And that's all that needs to be really. The friendship helps them get along, but they would do better if they had their own stuff that needed doing.

Quote

Despite all the DBZ comparisons, Sonic has never really gone "fuck the other characters, only he can do anything now" aside from maybe in Shadow the hedgehog. 

Here's the thing he can't do anything, but he can do what rouge and omega do , effectively. If he was on a team with a super duper smarty pants like tails that would work because while shadow isn't dumb , he isn't a genius. And having folks with that level of technical knowledge is literally something he cannot do and from the jump creates a dynamic where shadow can just be wrong and beaten in ways his strength cannot compensate for. Or someone like blaze or knuckles who has powers over other emeralds and gems he doesn't understand and could maybe help if there's some weird mysticism shit or fire magic stuff he doesn't understand. Or heck the chaotix, they are literally detectives shadow's a pragmatic strait get to the point guy. But being a detective requires nuance and specific touch that allows you to decern a situation that might not be immediately noticeable. Or hey maybe silver the guy who can time travel.

Its just that the spy , and the robot seem kinda eh next to that guy who can teleport , is black so he's undetectable at night and can be his own arsenal. Just kinda seems redundant.

11 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

@Shadowlax That is only true if you operate under the assumption that Shadow can do everything by himself.

But I never ever got that feeling at all. Because going by that logic, Sonic makes Tails and Knuckles redundant as well but you yourself said that's not the case.

Tails is a genius  and Knuckles can knock the super out of him. Tails can also fly. Knuckles has access to a floating island he can hide out on occasion.

 

Quote

 

Shadow isn't omnipotent; he's not the strongest, or smartest character around, so there's little reason to assume that he can just do everything and anything and carry his team on his back.

He's not.He however can do the other two's jobs, which was my point. I also list a bunch of other characters in a response before this one that basically states the same.

Quote

 

The only time that ever felt like the case was 06; the team was much more balanced out in Heroes.

 

That's not accurate. Because team dark is only a team in that game. And that's not really true in that game. Omega isn't stronger than him, nor is rouge smarter than him. She just convinces the robot and the hedgehog with ptsd to calm down and omega...does nothing. That example is also bad given what we know about what heroes was supposed to be, rouge wasn't even supposed to be on a team with shadow. She was supposed to be on a team with amy , she was just thrown onto that team because they decided shadow was going to live. And their team is just as weirdly put together as it was designed. She was thrown on that team not because of a dynamic, she was there because shadow needed a stable.

To get back to the core of my point off that. Shadow no longer needs that stable, he arguably never did and the other two rouge and omega can function on their own. Break them up. Team dark's dynamic was flawed from the jump

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I still think you're making way too many assumptions based on little evidence; there's very little to suggest that Shadow is both smarter than Rouge and more powerful than Omega.

That was my point when I said that you're assuming Shadow is way more capable than his peers, or just downplaying his peers' abilities.

Now granted, it's not always obvious but I feel the comics have done enough to diversify the team enough where I think that complaint that Shadow outdoes them both isn't valid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When was Rouge shown as "smarter" than Shadow before he went Full Vegeta? Manipulative and more "caring" sure since she's the only female in her team as a femme fatale character.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well that depends on what type of intelligence we're looking at; she's manipulative like you said, and possess espionage skills. 

That already gives her a set of skills that Shadow lacks. And before someone points out SA2, Shadow was acting on someone else's behalf there, he's never shown to be manipulative type like Rouge otherwise.

And the comics also play up the idea that Rouge is more emotionally and socially mature than Shadow, who is generally much prone to acting first and thinking later.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Almar said:

When was Rouge shown as "smarter" than Shadow before he went Full Vegeta? Manipulative and more "caring" sure since she's the only female in her team as a femme fatale character.

Even before he went full Vegeta, he was always more prone to action. The scene in Shadow where they're trying to hack into the computer and Shadow just karate chops it is a good demonstation of that, I'd say.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Team Sonic should break up.

Like, Sonic can fly and scale walls because of the Wisps now, and those fuckers are just lying around on the planet. And Sonic was a pilot before he met Tails, he can obviously handle a plane and take care of any upkeep it might need. And he's only gotten stronger with every game to the point he doesn't actually need Super Sonic, he can literally ram into things to send them flying or break them. Honestly, Tails and Knuckles are just redundant.

 

 

 

 

If y'all can't tell this post is dripping in sarcasm, I can't help you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

you joke with sarcasm, but that felt like SEGA's view of the characters before Mania.

and even kinda after with forces.

Then it's settled, just make Tails and Knuckles power-ups. Heck, all of the extended cast. Tails Flight, Knuckles Climb, Shadow Chaos Control.. etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Forces goes out of it's way of establishing that the world is doomed without Sonic and everyone else is pretty much useless without him, so....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Kuzu said:

I still think you're making way too many assumptions based on little evidence; there's very little to suggest that Shadow is both smarter than Rouge and more powerful than Omega.

That was my point when I said that you're assuming Shadow is way more capable than his peers, or just downplaying his peers' abilities.

Now granted, it's not always obvious but I feel the comics have done enough to diversify the team enough where I think that complaint that Shadow outdoes them both isn't valid.

 

Yeah there is though?  The former canonically actually. Shadow canonically has an IQ of two hundred and strait up fixes omega in 06.

And omega has to date has not demonstrated any ability more capable than or average mid teir eggman robot.

I'm not down playing anything. Shadow is a character who litterally can turn themselves into a nuke. Who if generating enough energy can kill people by running past them. He is a character who in this comic beats a super entity who previously was beating sonic and knuckles by himself. And in this same comic where sonic says outloud "hey shadow isnt as strong, cuz he a zonbie" proceeds to litterally rip omega apart.

Omega is a mid teir eggman robot and has never shown to not be that. And rouge while capable as far as intelligence canonically is not as smart as he is. And he can also stealth.

Why would you shackle two interesting characters to that? Let them thrive next to someone who cant just nuke your problems.

And on that same token there's a bunch of other characters that outclass shadow or have things shadow cannot do, whether it just be ability wise or personality wise. That would make for far interesting interaction.

Now this isnt unfixable, they could just give omega and rouge more stuff. Maybe omega has something else under hood under than "shadow jailing device" that only Pops up in one game. Maybe he negates chaos energy. Thar would be a neat ability that would make him a direct threat to a lot of the heavy hitters. Heck maybe he just negates all gem energy. Maybe that's why infinite had to take him out. Or on rouge's end maybe they focus less on her ability to spy but the mentality of it. You can have entire scenarios where shadow is trying to spy but he cant because nuance is sort of lost him. Hes so pragmatic he creates future problems beating up or destroying things that need to be kept around or people.

 

I have just described to you two potential things that would make the dynamic work. Abilities given to them; that would help. But they won't get anything like that, ever. Because team dark's focus is shadow unfortunately. Then they just focus on shadow and then it feeds into itself. I'm now downplaying or overplaying anything. This is a problem, yeah mods are making sarcastic jokes but I'm genuinely scared for the future if these characters. Because they may just vanish ,  and I think there is a good chance that happening

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Kuzu said:

Well, as you said, they haven't really been written well at all and have stagnated as a result. Even the second Archie reboot mostly focused on Shadow whenever the three were together, despite being pretty well written in it's own right.

Rouge and Omega being supporting characters to Shadow only worked when Shadow was the lead character, otherwise it's a consistent complaint that he overshadows them whenever they show up.

Since Shadow is no longer written to be a main character, and they're playing up this "lone wolf" attitude of his, having Rouge and Omega split from him could actually allow them to develop more without it needing to be tied to Shadow.

The idea that because characters are part of a team they can't also work independently or that there's some arbitrary hierarchy of character importance which must be obeyed is ridiculous. The Avengers are a team, but the individual members still go on their own personal adventures without the others. Furthermore there's nothing saying Shadow has to be the main focus whenever Team Dark is together, he was in '06, but it's equally possible to write an Omega or Rouge-centric story with Shadow in a supporting role. Also, just because a character isn't the main focus of a given story doesn't mean they can't meaningfully develop on own. To use another Marvel example: look at Black Panther in Captain America: Civil War. He's on a team, and not even Captain America's team, yet he has a fully developed revenge arc that takes him from wanting to kill Bucky for planting the bomb that killed his father, to accepting that Bucky wasn't responsible, to sparing the one who actually was responsible, to granting Bucky asylum in Wakanda.

I find it kind of ironic that Omega and Rouge are the ones being hit with satellite character complaint, especially Rouge given that the games actually do have her working independently of Shadow as often as not. She helps him out in Battle but is mainly off doing her own thing; she's not working with him in Rivals 2; she joins the party (acting as a representative of GUN) well before he does in Chronicles; and, while she acts as mission control for Shadow in Forces' DLC, in the main story she's working with the Resistance from the get-go whereas the real Shadow doesn't show up until around the half-way point. Even in '06, where they definitely are supporting characters in Shadow's story, Omega and Rouge are still easily the best utilized of the Amigo characters, seeing as they actively contribute to the plot instead of just... existing... like the others. It's not like they're Knuckles, who has more-or-less sacrificed his core identity on the altar of Team Sonic.

As for being poorly written of late, the solution there is better writing, not disbanding Team Dark.

 

4 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

Hot take: I don't think team dark ever had a good dynamic. The occasional interesting conversation is not what a good dynamic makes. I think Blaze and shadow could talk some shit but they shouldn't be on a team together. I think from how the team was conceived to how the team was used, its not great. Breaking them up would benefit everyone, even if/when shadow stops being weird. The dynamic was " Shadow and his emotional support thief and robot"  to which if that's all they provide he can talk to other folks and call them on a phone. No need to limit the other two to that.

I think you underestimate just how valuable their relationship is to their characterizations. Let's start by looking at them individually. Rouge is a thief/spy for an organization dedicated to defending the world from Dr. Eggman and other threats. Shadow is a reformed villain who once tried to destroy Earth as revenge for a tragedy inflicted upon him by the very same organization Rouge works for. Omega is a killer robot created by Dr. Eggman for the purpose of keeping Shadow imprisoned but ultimately felt betrayed and swore revenge when his master abandoned him. These are the last three characters with a reason to trust anyone, least of all each other. They initially band together out of pragmatism, they're all looking for Dr. Eggman for their own reasons. Yet eventually the unlikely trio go from mere allies of convenience to comrades who genuinely care for and trust one another. Take the Wave Ocean scene in Sonic '06, all three characters have their guards down in that scene and we see a different side of them that they normally wouldn't show around anyone else. Omega shows capacity for sorrow and remorse, Shadow is clearly upset to learn that Omega turns against him in the future, and Rouge shows the heart behind the flirtatiousness and jewel obsession. The characters show their humanity around each other in a way they don't with others. It's part of what separates Shadow at his best from the edge-meme he's since devolved into and adds depth to Rouge and Omega's characters as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 

Yeah there is though?  The former canonically actually. Shadow canonically has an IQ of two hundred and strait up fixes omega in 06.

And omega has to date has not demonstrated any ability more capable than or average mid teir eggman robot.

I'm not down playing anything. Shadow is a character who litterally can turn themselves into a nuke. Who if generating enough energy can kill people by running past them. He is a character who in this comic beats a super entity who previously was beating sonic and knuckles by himself. And in this same comic where sonic says outloud "hey shadow isnt as strong, cuz he a zonbie" proceeds to litterally rip omega apart.

Omega is a mid teir eggman robot and has never shown to not be that. And rouge while capable as far as intelligence canonically is not as smart as he is. And he can also stealth.

 

Omega was created to contain Shadow. He's on Shadow's level by definition. He's the Metal Sonic to Shadow's Sonic.
Rouge is as strong as knuckles, so she's definitely in Shadow's level too even if they only focus on her flight nowadays.
Also, I'm pretty sure Shadow has never had the time to sit down and take an I.Q Test. How would that be documented? Why would that be documented? Did he take the I.Q test before or after he lost his memory?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Shadow canonically has an IQ of two hundred and strait up fixes omega in 06.

Bro.

Rouge gives Omega an Emerald in the past to help Shadow in the future and gives him a date to wake up to. Shadow doesn't interact with the broken Future Omega at all in that game.

Seriously, if you're going to claim something is "canonical" for the love of Christ make sure you aren't just making up something that can be verified by a YouTube search. EDIT: I will admit I didn't remember him even checking the future Omega, so I'll grant that. Claiming he fixed him is literally wrong, though.

 

40 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I'm not down playing anything. Shadow is a character who litterally can turn themselves into a nuke. Who if generating enough energy can kill people by running past them. He is a character who in this comic beats a super entity who previously was beating sonic and knuckles by himself.

He gets a sucker punch in before granting Neo Metal Sonic the key thing he needed to become Master Overlord and being forced to team up with Sonic and Knuckles. This is a very, very generous interpretation of that scene.

 

 

40 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

This is a problem, yeah mods are making sarcastic jokes but I'm genuinely scared for the future if these characters.

I am willing to admit I went overboard, so sorry if I'm downplaying something here, but my point is that I don't believe Team Dark, as a unit, is redundant. The major difference is that I'm going off things that are actually in the games and official materials, whereas I think you're too focused on selling a particular idea of Shadow that I don't think holds up to any scrutiny when looking at what he actually does in any media he's been featured in: he's not a walking arsenal, he's not stealthy or subtle. He can just blow his problems up, but how many times has it been shown to not actually be effective and put his opponent in a position for a counterattack? Literally nothing about him strikes me as a potential replacement for the other characters just because you think there's an idea hidden in his design or writing that is never shown and oftentimes outright contradicted. It's, frankly, incredibly fanboyish and makes the character sound boring and strips away anything that I think is actually interesting or likeable about the character--something Sega evidently doesn't need much help with anyway.

 

I do agree that I would like to see Rouge and Omega separated from Shadow for a time and get to do their own thing, and likewise Shadow gets to team up with somebody else for a bit (maybe someone who will get this version to calm the fuck down), and I wouldn't want them to go away either. I just don't think your points convey anything about the character as he actually is in any media that I've seen, and it starts to feel more like Rouge and her second horrible adopted son, Omega, are getting shuffled off to the side rather than being given a chance to break out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

Rouge gives Omega an Emerald in the past to help Shadow in the future and gives him a date to wake up to. Shadow doesn't interact with the broken Future Omega at all in that game.

Actually, he does. At the end of Shadow's Crisis City, he and Rouge see Omega inactive. All he does is look inside of some kind of back compartment to confirm that he's in stand-by mode though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 

Yeah there is though?  The former canonically actually. Shadow canonically has an IQ of two hundred and strait up fixes omega in 06.

And omega has to date has not demonstrated any ability more capable than or average mid teir eggman robot.

I'm not down playing anything. Shadow is a character who litterally can turn themselves into a nuke. Who if generating enough energy can kill people by running past them. He is a character who in this comic beats a super entity who previously was beating sonic and knuckles by himself. And in this same comic where sonic says outloud "hey shadow isnt as strong, cuz he a zonbie" proceeds to litterally rip omega apart.

Omega is a mid teir eggman robot and has never shown to not be that. And rouge while capable as far as intelligence canonically is not as smart as he is. And he can also stealth.

Why would you shackle two interesting characters to that? Let them thrive next to someone who cant just nuke your problems.

And on that same token there's a bunch of other characters that outclass shadow or have things shadow cannot do, whether it just be ability wise or personality wise. That would make for far interesting interaction.

Now this isnt unfixable, they could just give omega and rouge more stuff. Maybe omega has something else under hood under than "shadow jailing device" that only Pops up in one game. Maybe he negates chaos energy. Thar would be a neat ability that would make him a direct threat to a lot of the heavy hitters. Heck maybe he just negates all gem energy. Maybe that's why infinite had to take him out. Or on rouge's end maybe they focus less on her ability to spy but the mentality of it. You can have entire scenarios where shadow is trying to spy but he cant because nuance is sort of lost him. Hes so pragmatic he creates future problems beating up or destroying things that need to be kept around or people.

 

I have just described to you two potential things that would make the dynamic work. Abilities given to them; that would help. But they won't get anything like that, ever. Because team dark's focus is shadow unfortunately. Then they just focus on shadow and then it feeds into itself. I'm now downplaying or overplaying anything. This is a problem, yeah mods are making sarcastic jokes but I'm genuinely scared for the future if these characters. Because they may just vanish ,  and I think there is a good chance that happening

Where the fuck is it ever stated that Shadow has an IQ of 200? He never even fixed Omega, he just checked to see if he was still functioning.

You say that Shadow is smarter than Rouge and can stealth better, but like...when?

I can concede on Omega at least, but when has Shadow ever displayed half of the traits you're claiming he has? I'm genuinely lost and feels like you're making things up about him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Razule said:

 

Actually, he does. At the end of Shadow's Crisis City, he and Rouge see Omega inactive. All he does is look inside of some kind of back compartment to confirm that he's in stand-by mode though.

Ah, forgot about that. I just remember Rouge returning to the past and giving Omega the Emerald to help Shadow later on. My mistake on that front.

 

 

That still doesn't account for Shadow's "200 IQ" or his apparent ability to repair Omega though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the problem with team dark so called dynamic is simply.....it's not market worthy. When shadow is major marketing appearance, the first thing hes pushed in is with sonic or a group about sonic. Shadow represents being in Sonics shadow, and rouge and omega are always riding sonic or shadows coattails as supporting characters, this there isnt as much investment in seeing them together.

I believe rouge and omega need to stick with shadow more and more to codify and settle shadow as a major figure in the series. Add a more significant aspect to him being more than just a rival to sonic and a twin clone. Rouge's character story carried from Shadow's plot and continues to be shared with shadow as a character, omega was made from eggman which was carried from the previous game while expanding eggmans lore. These three owe it to shadow to be more pivotal outside of shadows story.

Rouge being outside of shadows side is like tails being outside of sonic side. Some characters dont work without working with principle dynamics for a long period of time. Plus I get salty when I see rouge paired with characters like knuckles or tails all because shes interacted with them to become meme'd with. Shadow actually gave Rouge a reason to be softer and kinder person, and explored her serious side as a result of teaming with shadow. Omega is just the third guy, but hes more comfortable being shadows muscle than say sonic or creams.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm having a harder time responding right now, but I will note that Team Dark is the most well developed of the greater than two teams and the two amigo characters can easily have their own limelight due to having their own tangible goals and skills.

Also, Omega woke himself up to fulfill his mission of assisting Shadow, standby mode. And he was actually capable of seriously harming Mephiles from the get-go, with the implication that Mephiles copying Shadow gives him an immunity to his non-Chaos charges attacks but makes him vulnerable to the specifically designed Omega.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Robojerk said:

I think the problem with team dark so called dynamic is simply.....it's not market worthy. When shadow is in a series, the first thing hes push in is with sonic or a group about sonic. Shadow represents being in Sonics shadow, and rouge and omega are always riding sonic or shadows coattails as supporting characters, this there isnt as much investment in seeing them together.

Not really. Shadow isn't designed to be in Sonic's shadow, he's designed to be Sonic's shadow, as in representing a dark Sonic. That has always been the original concept of Shadow as a character, and it goes as far back as his original beta name - Terios - which literally translates to "Reflection of". 

He was always meant to be a dark reflection of Sonic's traits. Shadow's fast, proud, arrgoant, and competitive, sharing traits with Sonic. But he's also got darker reflections of Sonic's personality, he relies on his own power and cares little for others originally, while Sonic not only relies on his own strength, but others as well. Sonic cares about the planet, the people, and his friends, and so fights for their freedom. 

Shadow's development is him letting go of his past and lightening up, and Team Dark as a dynamic is vital to that. That's the point he officially allows himself to make new bonds of friendship and teamwork with other people, when before he'd been using everyone as pawns to fulfill his ultimate goal of avenging Maria's death. His role as a G.U.N member and team leader of Team Dark in 06 is the point he has overcome his issues with his past and moved forward to the future alongside his new friends and teammates.

Shadow has never been a twin clone of Sonic. A reflection of Sonic's attitude and abilities, but in personality, story, and development, Shadow has always been vastly different to Sonic. Shadow had a competitive streak, but he was still a loner, fairly cold and distant, and views others as lower beings. That's why the end of SA2 works so well for him, a character who before was constantly putting others in danger for his vengeance, and thinking lowly of everyone else makes the ultimate sacrifice to save the planet below full of lower beings. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

Not really. Shadow isn't designed to be in Sonic's shadow, he's designed to be Sonic's shadow, as in representing a dark Sonic. That has always been the original concept of Shadow as a character, and it goes as far back as his original beta name - Terios - which literally translates to "Reflection of". 

He was always meant to be a dark reflection of Sonic's traits. Shadow's fast, proud, arrgoant, and competitive, sharing traits with Sonic. But he's also got darker reflections of Sonic's personality, he relies on his own power and cares little for others originally, while Sonic not only relies on his own strength, but others as well. Sonic cares about the planet, the people, and his friends, and so fights for their freedom. 

Shadow's development is him letting go of his past and lightening up, and Team Dark as a dynamic is vital to that. That's the point he officially allows himself to make new bonds of friendship and teamwork with other people, when before he'd been using everyone as pawns to fulfill his ultimate goal of avenging Maria's death. His role as a G.U.N member and team leader of Team Dark in 06 is the point he has overcome his issues with his past and moved forward to the future alongside his new friends and teammates.

Shadow has never been a twin clone of Sonic. A reflection of Sonic's attitude and abilities, but in personality, story, and development, Shadow has always been vastly different to Sonic. Shadow had a competitive streak, but he was still a loner, fairly cold and distant, and views others as lower beings. That's why the end of SA2 works so well for him, a character who before was constantly putting others in danger for his vengeance, and thinking lowly of everyone else makes the ultimate sacrifice to save the planet below full of lower beings. 

Well I simply meant as marketing wise, hes always meant to be a twin secondhand imitation of sonic and plays second to him in competition and being the second best of the two. Like knuckles.

Shadows thing he shares everything with Sonic, and graphically is infamous as a sonic adventure recolor or super sonic. And Shadow gets put on the spot having to compare to Sonic which often is made to make Sonic look good at Shadows expense despite how character wise their distinct.

 

Sonic 06 was retconned, Shadow at that point was pretty much omitted all his development to justify being a archetypical generic anime rival again. Which I feel always was deep down. If sonic team was allowed to make shadow feel more like a independent major role like shadow the hedgehog did, hed be more reknown than just what he is currently based on the current depiction regarding his role.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, thumbs13 said:

Omega was created to contain Shadow. He's on Shadow's level by definition. He's the Metal Sonic to Shadow's Sonic.
Rouge is as strong as knuckles, so she's definitely in Shadow's level too even if they only focus on her flight nowadays.
Also, I'm pretty sure Shadow has never had the time to sit down and take an I.Q Test. How would that be documented? Why would that be documented? Did he take the I.Q test before or after he lost his memory?

Being able to contain a thing or in omega case having the mechanism to do so doesn't meant you can fight the thing. As demonstrated by this comic. Also important here we are talking about omega fighting shadow, his ability to do battle in general and as far as what's been shown. He is a robot with guns. That's it

Also I'm sure tails and eggman ain't have time to take that test either. But these were important details to mention.

1 hour ago, Zaysho said:

Ah, forgot about that. I just remember Rouge returning to the past and giving Omega the Emerald to help Shadow later on. My mistake on that front.

 

 

That still doesn't account for Shadow's "200 IQ" or his apparent ability to repair Omega though.

Tiny detail in sonic 06 but an npc comments on the matter. You take an iq test as shadow she determined you or his iq is 200 and asks him to join her team. The omega scene i messed up on. He fiddles around with him but nothing happens that's my bad

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Tiny detail in sonic 06 but an npc comments on the matter. You take an iq test as shadow she determined you or his iq is 200 and asks him to join her team. The omega scene i messed up on. He fiddles around with him but nothing happens that's my bad

Ah. I've only ever watched playthroughs. I'm not familiar with the mini-games and sidequests at all. If there is a basis for that, then sure. My bad, too.

While that is an interesting detail though, all it says is that he's intelligent (and would track with his origins) but I don't think it adds anything to him. His idea of hacking is karate chopping a keyboard, after all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

Ah. I've only ever watched playthroughs. I'm not familiar with the mini-games and sidequests at all. If there is a basis for that, then sure. My bad, too.

While that is an interesting detail though, all it says is that he's intelligent (and would track with his origins) but I don't think it adds anything to him. His idea of hacking is karate chopping a keyboard, after all.

I'm not trying to say he has more socially smart either. I can see plenty of situations where rouge has to teach him how to be a functional person in society. Like rouge explaining to him how like a bank works. ( I just imagined he just took all his money and stuffed it under his bed). Or maybe beat people up less so they tell you things.

But I think in think in battle it just adds to the idea his like a tactical battler. If you ask him to rescue someone he might have a myriad scenarios go through his head about what he can do. But if you ask him for emotional help, it's one brain cell floating about his head like the DVD logo. Though to be fair, shadow may just have anxiety. I think it makes him a bit different. It even kinda explains the whole thing with sonic in this book weirdly enough. Sonic is coming from a very emotional place. And shadow while his heart is in the right place,is a lot more cold . I think that is kinda of a neat thing. And while it doesn't add too much, it flashes out stuff that was there.

It's like if they made my head canon of rouge being a poor orphan real. It dont add much, it flashes out what's there a lot more. She had to steal to survive

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the idea of Team Dark being tied to GUN is more limiting than Team Dark itself. In a narrative like the comics, in particular Archie which had more factions, it makes sense because it solidly defines what role the character serves - that they are a more militaristic approach to Freedom Fighter group concept employed by the United Federation. In the games though, that sort of continuity has been out of favor at Sonic Team for quite some time and continuing to acknowledge it would only frustrate and confuse fans more than anything. It made sense back in 2006 when the games cared more about the world the characters existed in and had the plot disrupt the status quo but not now when world and status quo feel constantly in flux.

But Team Dark itself? Nah. I think the supposed problem here is that in order for Team Dark to exist they have to be Team Dark all the time, which they really don't. Just as Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles can have their own stand alone characteristics and roles where they can operate independently of a group dynamic while also operate as team on occasion which focuses on their interplay as a set, Team Dark can and I would argue does do the same. Forces is a perfect example. In the main story, Shadow is fighting copies, Rouge is spying on the Death Egg, and Omega was clearly fighting on his own too. In Episode Shadow, Shadow is communicating with Rouge and attempting to reach Omega. The group and individual characterizations can both be utilized where appropriate without negating the other. I personally enjoy seeing the Chaotix acting individually in the IDW comics or games because I find their dynamic a bit played out, so I like seeing how they bounce off other characters more. Do I want Team Chaotix dissolved though? No way, they do have a fun chemistry between each other and I don't want that dynamic abandoned. I just want more variety from time to time.

And all this applies to my thoughts on the Freedom Fighters' potential roles in IDW too by the way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Chaotix are so rarely together in the games that seeing them seperate from each other stands a chance at being more played out at this point, honestly.

They're together for the entirity of Heroes, together for two scenes in Shadow the Hedgehog, and... ... Charmy throws some chili-dogs into Vector's mouth in Generations.

They're all there in Forces but they never show off their dynamic in that game. Its all mostly interchangeable dialogue thrown into the ether that anyone can say. The closest we get is when they all speak one after the other in the Park Avenue level and that one shot of them standing together at the end of the game.

I feel like we've seen Team Dark together and interacting in the games far more often then the Chaotix, really.

Even TSR, where Team Dark has less to do than the Chaotix (including Espio and Charmy who aren't even in the game but still manage to do something plot relevant) they've gotten more of a chance to show off their dynamic.

I like Team Dark a lot. There's nothing about it thats upsetting or holding them back from anything. They're Team Dark when they decide to work together and they're Shadow, Rouge, and Omega when they decide to work alone. Same with Team Sonic.

The ones who should be working together more often are the Chaotix by the nature of their occupation and even that doesn't happen often. Now that Team Dark isn't officially beholden to GUN, anyone fearing for their individuality has even less to worry about.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

You must read and accept our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy to continue using this website. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.