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Dejimon11

IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog

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I suppose it's easier to just consider them dead anyway. They don't reappear (or even appear outside of the prequel comic) and they didn't seem to be treated as important even to Infinite; Shadow defeating them is just the first thing to piss him off, but getting his teeth kicked in hurt him more.

Kind of a shame they and Infinite are off-limits though. He had a cool design and while I think his writing and characterization in Forces was ass, I think he had potential so it was kind of a waste. I think Ian would have come up with some fun ideas to use him.

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12 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Rouge isn't a killer. And Omega has almost always aimed his violence at Eggman's robots exclusively.

Killer robot who threatens organic and refers to targets as meatbags isnt a killer.(sarcasm)

Rouge has not killed anyone personally doesnt mean she doesnt encourage.

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1 hour ago, Robojerk said:

Killer robot who threatens organic and refers to targets as meatbags isnt a killer.(sarcasm)

Rouge has not killed anyone personally doesnt mean she doesnt encourage.

I wasn't aware Rouge was a robot.

Also

 

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1 hour ago, Robojerk said:

Killer robot who threatens organic and refers to targets as meatbags isnt a killer.(sarcasm)

Rouge has not killed anyone personally doesnt mean she doesnt encourage.

Yes. Just like the A-Team never shot anything alive in all those shootouts, Omega won't even shoot Eggman if there are more important things going on.

Having the ability to kill doesn't mean you kill all the time, I thought we learned this after all those Dark endings in Shadow's game.

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1 hour ago, Wraith said:

If they didn't kill anyone on-screen it didn't happen. 

That's what I don't get about this discussion. Outside of the Evil Endings in Shadow the Hedgehog no Team Dark member has ever been shown killing. 

I guess you can use the IDW comic as an example of Shadow being willing to but after rereading that arc recently I couldn't help but notice once he was convinced Mr. Tinker was a different person than Eggman Shadow gave up on trying to kill him and Rouge clearly didn't want him to since she contacted the Chaotix to tip them off and help prove his memory loss was legit. 

And even then Shadow's reasoning isn't because he's a killer by nature but he saw Eggman crossing the line and decided it was time to put him down.  

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2 hours ago, Wraith said:

If they didn't kill anyone on-screen it didn't happen. 

It's actually the opposite logic here. If it happens off-screen, it likely means they are dead. In general, I wouldn't say that. But for a kid friendly franchise, it seems to me as an expedient to kill off characters without showing blood or violent stuff for kids.

See, in IDW: The Diamond Cutters.

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10 minutes ago, Jack at the Cinema said:

It's actually the opposite logic here. If it happens off-screen, it likely means they are dead. In general, I wouldn't say that. But for a kid friendly franchise, it seems to me as an expedient to kill off characters without showing blood or violent stuff for kids.

See, in IDW: The Diamond Cutters.

The details of their deaths weren't literally shown but the story confirms that they died. 

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34 minutes ago, Almar said:

Honestly, how do we know that in the gameverse proper (not the comics at all) that anyone in Team Sonic is notably against using lethal force on things that aren't robots?

Sonic was fine with killing King Arthur. They don't go out of their way to kill anyone, it just happens.  Another thing to note is that literally everybody let Metal Sonic and Eggman get away at the end of Heroes, so even robots are safe sometimes.

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44 minutes ago, Almar said:

Honestly, how do we know that in the gameverse proper (not the comics at all) that anyone in Team Sonic is notably against using lethal force on things that aren't robots?

Sonic has done things that could kill Eggman plenty of times and tells Shadow to smash up the Black Spawn.

And everyone assumed Knuckles literally ripped Chaos 6 apart.

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Ok, first basic rule: killing Black Arms, Eggman Robots, Dark Gaia Monsters or even attempting to kill Mephiles doesn't count as killing. They are monsters, even if they have mind and Sega writer pretty please ask that you don't think about this too long. Otherwise even Charmy killed in his live.

Cool? Let's move on.

In Sonic Heroes Omega wants to kill Eggman and we know from Shadow-Game "What If" scenarios that Omega would finish the job if given opportunity. And if he's okay with killing Eggman, he would probably have little problem with killing other 'bad guys'. I could buy he mellowed down in last few games (even if he doesn't want to admit it) but there is no evidence to think that.

Rouge never killed and there was no indication in that territory (other that assumption "Well government black ops have to kill, right"? No, this is Sonic, where missile to the face means large headache. Rules are slightly different.)
With that said, she was okay with Omega killing Eggman in Heroes, but tried to stop Shadow in IDW. Problem is, in first scenario they never got to Eggman and in latter she was defending "Mr Tinker". Then again, she never tried to kill Eggman in SA2 and she  certainly had opportunities. So we can't be sure, but I say she's against killing and avoids it, but if there was no other way, she would allow it or even do it herself. After all there is biggest problem...

Shadow was willing to kill so many at starts. Then he had amnesia, so in that state he was willing to get his hands dirty. Once he got his memory he wanted to kill Emerl (robot, so maybe doesn't count). And in IDW he's definitely ready to kill if pushed to limits (he never tried to kill Eggman in (canonical) past, but that was BEFORE he conquered the world, almost murdered hundreds and used Shadow's clone to hurt people).  So while none of this is definitive proof, I think there is enough evidence to say Shadow is definitely willing to kill, only question is if  he DID kill someone?
And only mobian/human example that Shadow might killed is Jackal Squad (and that was under Rouge supervision). I'm with Flynn with this one: I suspect Shadow killed as that makes more sense, but Sega very deliberately used wishy-washy phrasing to keep it vague and open to interpretation, so no one can accuse them of dark edgy writing.

With all that said, keep in mind this is Sonic, not Sin City and just because they CAN kill doesn't mean they do that often. Even if Omega got into fight with Fang and his Hooligans, I suspect he might spare their lives. Maybe.

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New solicits with two new connecting Tracy covers!

iowzFl7.jpg

HXcfJN9.jpg

StH #31

(W) Ian Flynn (A) Jack Lawrence (CA) Tracy Yardley

It's all led to this… the thrilling two-part epilogue to the Metal Virus Saga. The world has changed. Heroes and villains plan for the future as reconstruction begins. But one hero remains missing…
In Shops: Jun 10, 2020

StH #32

(W) Ian Flynn (A) Adam Bryce Thomas (CA) Tracy Yardley

The second half of the Metal Virus Saga epilogue. With all the chaos of the recent past still fresh in everyone's minds, Dr. Eggman launches a new assault-determined to take down his enemies once and for all.
In Shops: Jun 24, 2020

Looks like Eggy might be taking advantage of Omega's present handicap.

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Ok, Eggman must have reprogrammed Omega. 

 

And I'm guessing Sonic is the one that's unaccounted for and the epilogue is his return. 

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47 minutes ago, Armored CC14 said:

New solicits with two new connecting Tracy covers!

 

  Hide contents

iowzFl7.jpg

HXcfJN9.jpg

StH #31

(W) Ian Flynn (A) Jack Lawrence (CA) Tracy Yardley

It's all led to this… the thrilling two-part epilogue to the Metal Virus Saga. The world has changed. Heroes and villains plan for the future as reconstruction begins. But one hero remains missing…
In Shops: Jun 10, 2020

StH #32

(W) Ian Flynn (A) Adam Bryce Thomas (CA) Tracy Yardley

The second half of the Metal Virus Saga epilogue. With all the chaos of the recent past still fresh in everyone's minds, Dr. Eggman launches a new assault-determined to take down his enemies once and for all.
In Shops: Jun 24, 2020

Looks like Eggy might be taking advantage of Omega's present handicap.

 

I am confused. Or astounded. Confusastounded.

1 hour ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

Ok, first basic rule: killing Black Arms, Eggman Robots, Dark Gaia Monsters or even attempting to kill Mephiles doesn't count as killing. They are monsters, even if they have mind and Sega writer pretty please ask that you don't think about this too long. Otherwise even Charmy killed in his live.

Eh, Mephiles is honestly something of an exception among that list, but I suppose I can agree otherwise.

Quote

Cool? Let's move on.

In Sonic Heroes Omega wants to kill Eggman and we know from Shadow-Game "What If" scenarios that Omega would finish the job if given opportunity. And if he's okay with killing Eggman, he would probably have little problem with killing other 'bad guys'. I could buy he mellowed down in last few games (even if he doesn't want to admit it) but there is no evidence to think that.

 

Quote

Rouge never killed and there was no indication in that territory (other that assumption "Well government black ops have to kill, right"? No, this is Sonic, where missile to the face means large headache. Rules are slightly different.)
With that said, she was okay with Omega killing Eggman in Heroes, but tried to stop Shadow in IDW. Problem is, in first scenario they never got to Eggman and in latter she was defending "Mr Tinker". Then again, she never tried to kill Eggman in SA2 and she  certainly had opportunities. So we can't be sure, but I say she's against killing and avoids it, but if there was no other way, she would allow it or even do it herself. After all there is biggest problem...

Honestly, Rouge is generally the using type. Not much of a killer herself, but she'd let certain parties be compromised in order to get what she's really after. I mean hell, she ultimately let Eggman blow up Prison Island and half the moon because she wanted the Emeralds for herself bin addition to biding time for a chance at getting into the ARK's computer.

Quote

Shadow was willing to kill so many at starts. Then he had amnesia, so in that state he was willing to get his hands dirty. Once he got his memory he wanted to kill Emerl (robot, so maybe doesn't count). And in IDW he's definitely ready to kill if pushed to limits (he never tried to kill Eggman in (canonical) past, but that was BEFORE he conquered the world, almost murdered hundreds and used Shadow's clone to hurt people).  So while none of this is definitive proof, I think there is enough evidence to say Shadow is definitely willing to kill, only question is if  he DID kill someone?
And only mobian/human example that Shadow might killed is Jackal Squad (and that was under Rouge supervision). I'm with Flynn with this one: I suspect Shadow killed as that makes more sense, but Sega very deliberately used wishy-washy phrasing to keep it vague and open to interpretation, so no one can accuse them of dark edgy writing.

Shadow himself is more of a kill as necessary type, but he is definitely more prone to it than anyone besides hypothetically Omega. Dark Antihero and all that.

Quote

With all that said, keep in mind this is Sonic, not Sin City and just because they CAN kill doesn't mean they do that often. Even if Omega got into fight with Fang and his Hooligans, I suspect he might spare their lives. Maybe.

It's still kinda amazing that we had a battle Royale with both Team Dark and Blaze present.

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1 hour ago, Armored CC14 said:

New solicits with two new connecting Tracy covers!

 

  Hide contents

iowzFl7.jpg

HXcfJN9.jpg

StH #31

(W) Ian Flynn (A) Jack Lawrence (CA) Tracy Yardley

It's all led to this… the thrilling two-part epilogue to the Metal Virus Saga. The world has changed. Heroes and villains plan for the future as reconstruction begins. But one hero remains missing…
In Shops: Jun 10, 2020

StH #32

(W) Ian Flynn (A) Adam Bryce Thomas (CA) Tracy Yardley

The second half of the Metal Virus Saga epilogue. With all the chaos of the recent past still fresh in everyone's minds, Dr. Eggman launches a new assault-determined to take down his enemies once and for all.
In Shops: Jun 24, 2020

Looks like Eggy might be taking advantage of Omega's present handicap.

 

Can anyone explain why every issue seems to have a different artist? Like in this two parter, Lawrence and ABT have two very different styles. Its going to be very jarring to go from Lawrence's cartoonish style to ABTs manga style next issue.

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Those covers are badass! Also I guess they're just going the Transformers (2019) approach now of publishing 2 issues a month. I almost wonder if this is to set up for 2 Sonic books a month.

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21 minutes ago, SBR2 said:

Those covers are badass! Also I guess they're just going the Transformers (2019) approach now of publishing 2 issues a month. I almost wonder if this is to set up for 2 Sonic books a month.

Pretty sure it's supposed to be a catch up for the delays.

Anyway, I'm so surprised Sega gave the pass for that Omega twist, they give tons of freedom in some cases, and tons of restrictions in others like Shadow and even a minor character like Gemerl. What the hell, Sega.

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16 minutes ago, Jack at the Cinema said:

Pretty sure it's supposed to be a catch up for the delays.

Anyway, I'm so surprised Sega gave the pass for that Omega twist, they give tons of freedom in some cases, and tons of restrictions in others like Shadow and even a minor character like Gemerl. What the hell, Sega.

I mean it's not like Sega is a particularly consistent company.

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