Megathread IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog - Megathread

[Endy]

28 minutes ago, CertifiedNobody said:

Two worlds can't even fit into the canon timeline.

SA1 firmly establishes that Angel Island and the Mystic Ruins are on Earth and connected to Station Square. SA2 establishes that South Island/Green Hill Zone are on Earth on the map screen. and considering that Green Hill Zone is a location in Forces, that game must take place on Earth (considering most of the locations are from South Island/Westside island, maybe GUN was the one fighting eggman on the main continent)

While Green Hill could be excused by saying the map screen isn't canon (although there is no reason to assume that), A large portion of the plot in SA1 happens because Station Square is close to Angel Island and the Mystic Ruins. If, somehow Sonic and the others were hopping though dimensions between the mystic ruins and Station Square, there'd be no reason for Eggman to attack the city rather than any other in the world, since it wouldn't be conveniently close to Chaos and his base. On top of that, it'd imply the Egg Carrier has trans-dimensional capabilities.

Angel Island moves. It has a mind of it's own, so to speak. It's not unreasonable to think nor is it difficult to understand that the echidna civilization originated on Earth and the island has just been floating between the two since.

I for one never took GHZ's presence in SA2 as something to be taken very seriously and I don't think it should be used as a basis for judging the geography of anything.

[charmsb]

There's still a lot of plotholes to be had with the two worlds thing, and I'd much rather them cover it all up somehow or just ditch the idea. 

In general I think the off-hand statement from Iizuka in some random interview shouldn't be taken so seriously; its not so deep, he just needed to explain why there's no humans and instead a bunch of animal people instead. That's the direction they want to go in with the series. So I guess the real issue is instead humans vs. animals as backgrounders. And, well, humans kinda make a lot more sense...

That or they could literally just say "Oh, this part of the planet has animal people instead"

Cuz damn it doesn't have to be this complicated lol

[Endy]

as long as they're running with their faux-satam premise they may as well just use Sonic animals. the freedom fight- *ahem* the restoration HQ and stuff like that would probably be super awkward with mostly humans running around

[charmsb]

5 minutes ago, Endy said:

as long as they're running with their faux-satam premise they may as well just use Sonic animals. the freedom fight- *ahem* the restoration HQ and stuff like that would probably be super awkward with mostly humans running around

Good point, it does fit a lot more in Forces. It would be a lot more awkward to have animal people in games like Unleashed or Adventure. Unless they get a lot more creative with the animal people.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

8 minutes ago, charmsb said:

Good point, it does fit a lot more in Forces. It would be a lot more awkward to have animal people in games like Unleashed or Adventure. Unless they get a lot more creative with the animal people.

No, it wouldn’t? If anything, animal people in Unleashed and Adventure would make it more normal.

Like, how in the world would it be awkward there with more animal people instead of just the few we play in the game?

[Endy]

35 minutes ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

No, it wouldn’t? If anything, animal people in Unleashed and Adventure would make it more normal.

Like, how in the world would it be awkward there with more animal people instead of just the few we play in the game?

the settings in most of the 3d games are supposed to be relatively mundane environments so if they were populated with cartoon animals that would just be really stupid
like I guess it would be less "awkward" but it would also take away what's fun about them 

Sonic characters are like anime protagonists where they're the only ones in the world with spiky technicolor hair but instead of just hair they're edgy rubberhose cartoon characters. humans make Sonic and friends stand out, that is the point

what would make it weird for humans to be in this comic however, is that it is obviously ribbing satam's premise of a peaceful nature loving animal world vs evil technology science human so if you featured humans as part of the resistance it would start to look less like woodland creatures doing a cute little rebellion or w/e and more like Terminator

[VO.SUPER]

I'm guessing the Encyclospeddia will be what cements a lot of these details once and for all, if SEGA are finally willing to lay it down on paper. We'll see for sure whether they want to emphasize two worlds or just one again. 

[DabigRG]

1 hour ago, VisionaryofSUPER said:

I'm guessing the Encyclospeddia will be what cements a lot of these details once and for all, if SEGA are finally willing to lay it down on paper. We'll see for sure whether they want to emphasize two worlds or just one again. 

That hasn't come out yet?

[VO.SUPER]

47 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

That hasn't come out yet?

Amazon says not until November. 

[Rabbitearsblog]

Anyone getting the first volume of the IDW Collection?  The collection of the first 12 issues of the series?  I'm planning to get that collection once it comes out at the end of this month!

[VO.SUPER]

I want to get it. I just need to find who to give the other volumes to. 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

5 hours ago, Endy said:

the settings in most of the 3d games are supposed to be relatively mundane environments so if they were populated with cartoon animals that would just be really stupid
like I guess it would be less "awkward" but it would also take away what's fun about them 

I find it strange how this wouldn’t be a problem in any other work with cartoon animals, yet its somehow stupid or less fun with Sonic.

Quote

Sonic characters are like anime protagonists where they're the only ones in the world with spiky technicolor hair but instead of just hair they're edgy rubberhose cartoon characters. humans make Sonic and friends stand out, that is the point

I figured it was their abilities and features that made them stand out, what with Sonic’s fame being the fastest thing alive and Tails for his twin tails. Filling the setting with more cartoon animals isn’t going to make them stand out any less so long as they’re still able to be identified by those physical traits—this comic proves that much, as did Archie which did mix humans and anthros into one setting.

Quote

what would make it weird for humans to be in this comic however, is that it is obviously ribbing satam's premise of a peaceful nature loving animal world vs evil technology science human so if you featured humans as part of the resistance it would start to look less like woodland creatures doing a cute little rebellion or w/e and more like Terminator

We already have Metal Gear influences in the comic with Whisper and the late Diamond Cutters she was apart of, so why not? Wouldn’t be the first time humans sided with Sonic to oppose Eggman.

[Celestia]

On 6/17/2021 at 12:09 PM, DabigRG said:

There shouldn't be, considering Eggman is constantly there.

He's kind of an exception, I guess because he's the villain. The, like, handful of people ever who have actually complained about humans existing in Sonic always said so, except that one time I remember someone on here arguing he should be one of the anthros.

Ultimately it's just arbitrary canon nonsense to try and explain art style differences, which is just  silly to me. I've said before that I wouldn't mind as much if it felt like the two worlds thing actually mattered, ie it actually came up, and I stand by that, but personally I'd still rather prefer they simplify it to one world that happens to be kinda weird. Even from the perspective that hardcore fans will care more about the little details, I don't understand how anyone could find that confusing.

Also it's funny to me the argument is now that it would be weird for humans to be on the animal planet (at least in the context of this comic, because it's like SatAM or something. what.). It's like we've gone full circle. Hooray.

[VO.SUPER]

The problem i always had with humans when I was a kid is that they only seemed to exist as some mundane element in Sonic's world and I was wondering where the hell the animal people were who weren't the main cast. 

It took until freaking Sonic Forces to actually get proper animal people npc designs in the game, and they all look blank faced.

It just bugged me. 

[charmsb]

9 hours ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

No, it wouldn’t? If anything, animal people in Unleashed and Adventure would make it more normal.

Like, how in the world would it be awkward there with more animal people instead of just the few we play in the game?

I guess what I mean is you're going around human architecture, human countries, human cultures, but theres just a bunch of random colored animal people. They make Sonic and the rest of the cast look unimportant in comparison. Plus Eggman? Like, atleast when humans are the majority, Sonic isn't alone in being an animalpersonthing. When it's all animal people, Eggman does not mesh. Which isn't a huge problem (see the franchise prior to 1998), but totally is when tackling globe-trotting adventures or stories with deep, realistic histories.

They could remedy some of this by actually making the background characters more diverse instead of sharing the same body plan and lack of clothing. Like if there's a bear character, make him look burly and bigger. If there's a gibbon, make their arms really long. Stuff like that. Currently what they did in Forces makes me pretty bored with the decision. You could also just... have both. Like they could co-exist or be separate. Why not have a Panda character amongst the people of Chun-Nan?

Anyways I'm all done talking about that, it's pretty off-topic.

4 hours ago, Rabbitearsblog said:

Anyone getting the first volume of the IDW Collection?  The collection of the first 12 issues of the series?  I'm planning to get that collection once it comes out at the end of this month!

I feel some shame towards it but I'm just a pirate. Forgive me for not wanting to have a physical Sonic comic. Honestly I would love to own physical releases but I would also love to not be ridiculed by my friends and family lmao.

[Razule]

11 hours ago, Endy said:

Sonic characters are like anime protagonists where they're the only ones in the world with spiky technicolor hair but instead of just hair they're edgy rubberhose cartoon characters. humans make Sonic and friends stand out, that is the point

Would definitely be an interesting direction if Sonic and friends were people and their anthro-looks are actually just the art-style. "The Hedgehog" is a nickname and that human Sonic that Yuji Uekawa drew is his canonical in-universe appearance.

Spoiler

 

[Wraith]

It's just a lot of retroframing to make Sonic Team's strange and contradictory mandates to seem like carefully considered artistic decisions when they don't actually hold up under scrutiny. I've seen more and more people fall into this trap over the years and even engaged in some of it myself, but it's time to put it to rest. It's only harmed this comic and the wider franchise in the long run.

Let's be honest about the "world" Sonic team created for a moment:

If the intent was for Sonic and friends to stand out among the normal humans then why did they go out of their way to make important human characters stand out in completely different ways than Sonic and friends? Shahra, Elise, and Maria look far more like traditional central anime characters and don't even really line up with Eggman, let alone Sonic. If the animals are meant to be "key" characters..why aren't these characters animals?

If Sonic and friends are supposed to be foreigners in this human world, why is that never called attention to in universe? When Mario did this, the artstyle disparity was called attention to...and then clearly played off as a joke. Sonic doesn't get this level of consideration. It's played completely straight every time. I could believe that the people of station square are kind and accepting enough to just not care that Amy is an animal, but for it to just not come up at all as the games get more and more grounded is laughable.  Segasonic fans will make the reaches required to label it as an old send up to 80s anime or whatever while everyone normal laughs at the image of Sonic chatting shit with the US president about Eggman's latest terrorist threat or shadow pulling up on the US army with a regular AK47.

Other platforming mascots don't run into this problem because they designed the world with consideration for their central characters. Rayman, Mario etc have a dreamlike "anything goes" vibe while most of the NPC designs in something like Ratchet or Jak spring from the central duo as a source.

With Sonic, it always seemed to be like Sonic Team wanted to shoehorn in more traditional action/RPG mechanics, designs, and tropes without considering whether it fit what they started. Sonic's world was always more grounded than Mario's to an extent, but it's fair to say based on reactions to the second decade of Sonic games compared to the first that they stretched the suspension of disbelief too thin here.

Two worlds seems to be their way of reconciling what they made with a desire for a more consistent direction, but by not drawing attention to it it was functionally pointless to set it up. It cuts off the ambiguity that made discussing fandom interesting but a lot of the confusion and sense that it was poorly thought out remains because..well, it was poorly thought out and conveyed. You still have people occasionally just coming online and asking what the fuck happened and where the humans are in Forces, or why the trees look like that in Lost World, or why they go out of their way to avoid namedropping earth in Colors. Everyone who didn't just start playing Sonic games yesterday is more confused than ever and things seem more disorganized and lacking in cohesiveness than they ever have been. They don't seem to have any long term intent to explain any of it either. The human world is just being avoided for now, but there's chance it'll have to come back up in Sonic Rangers based on what we know about it. What then?

It reminds me of the official Zelda timeline with how corrosive it is on discussion, except this is a lot worse because this is key to how the games work in the present whereas most Zelda stories function the same whether you choose to think about the timeline or not.

And apparently, this is all preferable to the much simpler, much more readable setup of Sonic and friends being animals that represented nature, while Eggman's desire to overrun that nature for power was represented by cold machinery. Or just actually saying fuck it and embracing the absurdity of it all like ASOTH/. Or actually building a fantastic setting evocative of the early classic games with more consideration to functionality like the OVA. Or Sonic just actually being an alien with acknowledgement to this fact in the movies. Or Sonic X taking the same premise and actually leveraging it for it's dramatic potential.  I used to be down on the alternate universes for not adhering more to the games's playbook, but maybe there's reasons Sonic's offshoots retain fans long after they're inevitably pulled out of rotation while the games continue to get disappointment and begrudging followers. They don't make you feel dumb for caring about stuff like this, for starters.

The comic has chosen to just deal with it by presenting a simplified version of SATAM's setup and I think it actually mostly works. Everyone's rendered with a similar level of detail to Sonic and friends and it's lean to some fun designs. The new locales are often bland but I agree with coming up with "hybrids" that function like traditional Sonic zones that have more consideration for civilization like they did with white park. The problems with the worldbuilding are down to how they choose to pace out specific stories and an apparent aversion to original characters...but it's still not worse than the games have been in the last 10 years.  It doesn't 100% line up with the game canon in some ways but I can't hold this comic to a higher standard than the games themselves there. The shit just doesn't add up.
 

[Meta77]

If I remember correctly Sega basically pulled the "two worlds" thing out of their bum because they could not keep up with their own lore from game to game. It was years ago but in one instance was such when a fan asked why the moon was not destroyed in other games or something and they said it was cause it was on the wrong side. Besides in the adventure games and 06 no one ever seem bothered by sonic and gang in the games so that tells us they either are around enough or live close enough to them that they are used to them.

[Celestia]

2 hours ago, Wraith said:

I used to be down on the alternate universes for not adhering more to the games's playbook, but maybe there's reasons Sonic's offshoots retain fans long after they're inevitably pulled out of rotation while the games continue to get disappointment and begrudging followers. They don't make you feel dumb for caring about stuff like this, for starters.

Yeah. I honestly never felt dumb for caring about the series or the world, but then it turns out there's this big thing that's supposed to explain...honestly, probably the last thing I ever would have questioned? Whenever people would talk about realistic vs unrealistic stuff in Sonic I'd just think about those loops in those human roads and shrug it off.

I think it's actually good the alternate continuities had some lore regarding any humans that happened to be around or even the setting as a whole, ranging from simple enough (SatAM's series bible, STC and X) to some good old comic book nonsense (Archie), but my sense of disbelief was always pretty strong so I just fully took the games at face value. As funny as Sonic talking to the not-U.S.'s President undeniably is.

I'm not against this in itself, it's just been a weird time that's not helped at all by how they've handled it. As others have said, including me in the past, it's clearly not important to the games because it's never come up at all. And yet...side stuff now has to adhere to it even when the people working on it would really rather not. It probably is gonna come up in the next game at this rate, huh

It's sometimes taken as a given that the reason they came up with two worlds was to write out the humans, but the interesting thing is, if we take them at their word (as relayed by Ian), they had it in mind since long before "the human world" was phased out of the games. So it's more like they're finally employing it now as an excuse, while still not saying it, probably because it'd be a pretty huge bomb to drop after 20 years of the more talky Sonics. Even some casual players would be confused imo, though I'm sure many would just shrug and go "oh yeah, like Sonic X / the movie," understandably.

 

There's something else I want to bring up for some context, particularly for newer members / fans of the series. I mentioned discussions about the whole "real vs surreal" thing, and of course there's also been plenty of talk about if the humans fit or not. As far as I saw, these discussions came up more often in the 2010s than before. However, even then it wasn't really humoured that much...

...this, of course, was just in time for us to find out SEGA had thought about it after all. I think that's why a lot of us were blindsided, and then assumed for another few years that it was a retcon.

This ended up longer than I meant it to be. Sorry for this stuff that's mostly only tangentially related to IDW. Sonic comics are cool.

[Endy]

7 hours ago, Wraith said:

If the intent was for Sonic and friends to stand out among the normal humans then why did they go out of their way to make important human characters stand out in completely different ways than Sonic and friends? Shahra, Elise, and Maria look far more like traditional central anime characters and don't even really line up with Eggman, let alone Sonic. If the animals are meant to be "key" characters..why aren't these characters animals?

Its something that depends on the game. I think anybody reasonable would acknowledge that you can;t boil down each Sonic game to the same decisions. Inevitably these games are going to contradict themselves at one point or another, even Adventure contradicted the classics games style. But generally speaking, and it's very obvious in Sonic Adventure with the humans who have very purposefully muted designs, it is a way of making them stand out from the world at large. All the games with humans in them take place in relatively mundane environments and apart of the fun is having Sonic and friends run around in them. That's not to say you can't criticize them for seemingly contradictory choices, but the intent behind the ones regarding humans in Sonic Adventure is there. Sonic and friends aren't supposed to be treated as foreigners to this world either, they're just the main characters. The same principle really does apply to the rest of the games with humans, just with a few minor caveats. I think it's a really valid direction to take.

[DabigRG]

With regards to IDW's worldbuilding, it's worth recalling the handful of reasons why it is so restricted and haphazard: it's down to a combination of being a new publisher, Sega's tighter control, the vaguery of the game it chose to model itself on, basic conservation of detail, and finally, possible apathy on the writers' part.

Let's start with that last one for clarity: Mr. Flynn was coming off of a second exodus of the book he grew up with and worked hard on, which he has admitted didn't hit as hard because he had already seen it forced to scrap two decades worth of material and he was more concerned about whether his friends & coworkers would be alright going forward. When IDW got the license after Archie was slowly killed behind the scenes, it was actually fan demand and long earned goodwill with Sonic Team itself that got him involved again rather than any motion on his part, especially since he already had connections to them alongside Droguun and other comics to keep him occupied. But he accepted the part with thay flattery and so was game to work alongside the IDW editor, coworkers old & new, and the much more involved Sega to construct an even more game loyal identity to distinguish it from Archie, especially once he realized/learned that the SATAM/original characters were tied to Archie's contracts/copyrights and thus wouldn't be used out the gate. So he made concepts for characters like Tangle, Whisper, the Starline Trio, and the Skunk Bros to fill in roles that the existing game cast(besides Marine and Deadly Six evidently) didn't and just set out to tell the first years story with Neo Metal Sonic as the Big Bad and would build from there once it was done.

I semi-vividly remember when we got to the Blaze Issue"Tangle's Big Debut," I think someone happened to mention that the issue took place in Tangle's Hometown and I was like, "...was it?" Now I don't think it went exactly like that and it may have actually started beforehand, but that was the point where the "No Name" criticism started and for good reason: we were four to six issues in and now had an awkward time describing the somewhat formulaic context of each issue. The first two or three issues didn't really have to matter in that regard because they were just basic towns plus a Resistance base that our core four heroes plus Rough and Tumble were just passing through, with the story even being firmly about establishing them and how they're dealing with the fallout for Forces. Hell, Issues 2, 3 and 5 were notable for how the artists just had fun either filling out a town of nameless Mobians with some of their fan characters or taking advantage of the fact that the script called for Sonic & Amy to interact with a particular citizen that went unnamed and even undescribed in the script.

Hence how we ended up with Scruffy(who might be a tip of the hat to a longtime fan/friend of Flynn) in Issue 5, [that dog](sorry Jen, I forgot your boy's name) in Issue 3, and of course Lanolin in Issue 2; the latter is the most memorable due to her skittish personality, recurring appearances afterwards, and a cute design so fantastic that when Ms. Stanley officially pitched her recently after she notably had to be removed from another issue's cover, she was approved with only the new presumably already planned outfit due either how popular she was or she already fit their vision enough that they said "Go for itbuuutifyoupullthatstuntagain,Iamgoingtospinyouandyourwife!" It was was the former situation that the arguable nitpick of careless oversight became a genuine issue since we were now expected to remember and care about the world itself as a necessity of the plot and appropriately, that was also due to the characters involved: Tangle was seriously pushed as the hot new character bordering on mascot leading up to the comic's debut yet the fact that the admittedly cool but unnamed locale had personal relevance to her could be missed entirely, but okay fine--maybe she was originally intended to become a globetrotter since she was already made out to be a kindred spirit to Sonic himself, idk.  But the matter got worse yet in how Dr. Eggman, the previously missing main villain of the entire franchise since day one, was now an antithetical amnesiac in a quaint little Hamlet that we also never learned the name of; and when the elder of said village, who unlike [dog] and Lanolin spends the bulk of part 1 regaling how he checked out Mr. Tinker and convincing Sonic that he is no longer a threat to the world, didn't bother to introduce himself, people couldn't help but notice because he was a critical player in that plot.

Now as an ambiguous result of either people complaining about the matter or simply actually having necessity to do so, that issue got addressed and resolved in Year 2, but there is still a level of reasonable ambivalence among the other issues that remain. To talk about the improvements, we preluded the Metal Virus Saga with  returns to previous locales with tacked on names because the plot and possibly symbolism of the stories called for that--Tinker had to be retrieve from the [3rd] Windmill Village for Dr. Starline to restore Eggman, Barricade Town was name-dropped as the place where Sonic first fought Rough & Tumble, and unnamed City from Forces got some world building as a former jewel trading hub to emphasize the devastation Eggman had wrought on it twice over, plus the unspoken "Remember when Phantom Shadow tore up these streets? Me neither, apparently" Another interesting point is that the Rabbit Family's cottage is once again located within a town that I honestly don't remember the name of because I don't really need to--the only important thing about it is the major character that lives there and the reason it's probably not on the prairie like in canon/Sonic X because they wanted other denizens around for Cream, General, and Sonic to talk to, save, or fight in that issue. And this hit the level that stared this conversation with the other four locations the Deadly Six personally attack in having names and general climates, but little else to remember because they were just specific areas for the Heroes & Eggman to target when retrieving the Chaos Emeralds; by contrast, the game inspired White Park retained it's name, aesthetic, and possible location with the addition of a resort with a Chao Racing hub and Black Market as key parts of it's overall plot and action setpieces, making it more memorable in contrast because the location has purposes beyond "this character is found [blank] here" or "characters fought XYZ there."

And lastly, there's the absence of human influence beyond Eggman himself in IDW thus far. This has a number of reasonings that can all be allocated towards Forces itself, which had Mobian citizens and soldiers among the resistance with zero involvement or reference to the likes of GUN beyond maybe Rouge's involvement as a spy. And that in itself has some basis on the idea of there being Two Worlds, which has reportedly been a thing since the late 90s that only became relevant because Unleashed was all about traveling the world that lacked most of the recurring cast & core iconography, thus they needed a workaround before prior to and while developing Forces itself. Now to be entirely fair to the complaints, it is weird that there are zero humans besides Eggman thus far since the games seemingly lack the fantastic racism Archie & the LeBron film had, but then the same was true during most of the Adventure & Dark Age eras, so fair is fair there as well.

Long story short, what's necessary doesn't always equal what's satisfying and what's satisfying can cause confusion.

[charmsb]

49 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Long story short, what's necessary doesn't always equal what's satisfying and what's satisfying can cause confusion.

mucho texto but i think i agree

anyways to get more back on topic...

What do you guys think is going to happen with the Deadly Six after this arc? I guess I'm thinking a bit too far into the future, but are they gonna get their shit kicked in and just retreat to the wilds again? Or will they go back to the Lost Hex? Personally I would love for them to go back. As brilliantly written as they are in this series, I dont want them to just keep bouncing around and being core villains. 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Got through reading Issue 40, and to be honest, I didn’t dig it that much. To be honest, I’m kind of shocked by the set up. I thought it’d be something like Zavok having been hunting for the Zeti for awhile, or the Restoration having been hunting for them and/or protecting encaptured ones but like…no?

Zavok legit just randomly decides it’s now time to find the other Zeti and he just…does, with no issues whatsoever. Like shockingly easily. Literally just finds Zazz chilling and fishing, and he apparently knew where they all were to begin with, so he just didn’t do this for some reason, and suddenly Zik pops up with the other three who are no worse for wear, even though Zik was just with Sonic and Eggman moments prior. Did he seriously have time to go to three different villages to regroup everyone?

And even funnier is that this whole big built up plan of Zavok deciding to screw with Sonic psychologically and this being a whole huge arc, it’s legit just “oh hey Zavok, instead of destroying a village, we INSTEAD make it look like we are, and then we attack the HQ instead?”. 

Most disappointing is just the character work for the Zeti, Ian usually has a better grasp on them, but we’re at the point where the Zeti legit can’t understand not destroying things, or even teamwork, despite the fact that they’re a pack that literally feels the need to find each other and work together to destroy things, they’re literally just “let’s destroy for the hell of it because it’s our way”, even though the Lost Hex wasn’t destroyed, and the reason they wanted to destroy Sonic’s world in Lost World was both Eggman wronging them and enslaving them, and a thirst for power. Now just causing chaos and destruction is apparently just the Zeti way now. Pretty disappointing all around.

[Wraith]

The Zeti are a vindictive bunch and it was established earlier in the book that they still wanted revenge on Sonic pretty much for the hell of it anyway. I still don't like them as characters but they've largely been consistent in just getting involved in shit because they don't like Sonic.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

7 minutes ago, Wraith said:

The Zeti are a vindictive bunch and it was established earlier in the book that they still wanted revenge on Sonic pretty much for the hell of it anyway. I still don't like them as characters but they've largely been consistent in just getting involved in shit because they don't like Sonic.

I get doing it for the general idea of revenge, even if I find it slightly weak. What I take issue with is that apparently the Zeti can’t even understand the general ideas of teamwork, building things, and even their idea for revenge has gotten less interesting. It’s changed from “We’ll use our abilities to rule Sonic’s world” to “We’ll burn it to the ground”, an idea that wouldn’t be that bad if it wasn’t being so ridiculously portrayed, like the Zeti are some straight up force of nature that cannot understand how not to destroy. From the portrayal here, you’d think the Lost Hex would be some destroyed husk instead of the relatively colourful place it is in-game.

Plus again, pretty funny to have a story built up as psychological warfare on Sonic shift to pulling a pretty tame attack plan, and decide to just destroy things.