Sonic Forces: New Tag Team level confirmed

[Sonikko]

I would like to specify that I didn't draw that picture myself, Mr. Lange sent it to me, but it gets the point across very well.

[KHCast]

9 hours ago, Celestia said:

I know people are throwing around the narrative that they're just quietly releasing this game cuz they want to get it over with, and y'know what, maybe it's true to an extent.

Considering I was literally the only one remotely saying anything like this in this topic, you could have just quoted me vs act like you weren't referring just to me yknow.:/

[Celestia]

...You're far from the only person who's been saying that.

I also hadn't noticed you had said it in this topic anyway, I was referring to the forum in general??

[KHCast]

I said this in the other topic whoops, but still here's what I said

"I feel like Sonic team simply don't care about intricate level design and just want this fucker released so they can move on"

And really? Haven't seen anyone else say that stuff on here. Huh 

[Celestia]

Either way I can see why someone would feel that way so it's not like I'm disparaging anyone. ? As much as I like the games, that only makes me sympathetic of the devs, not the company as a whole.

[Celestia]

So if you fail the button masher thing before the Double Boost, it seems the duo enter the stumbling animation from previous boost games for a few seconds before finally blasting off.

As hilarious as that is I...kinda wish it just forced you to go through that section normally, or have the gauge start draining earlier, or...any sort of real punishment, really?

[sonicdudeatdawn]

4 minutes ago, Celestia said:

So if you fail the "press boost button a bunch" thing before the Double Boost, it seems the duo enter the stumbling animation from previous boost games for a few seconds before finally blasting off.

As hilarious as that is I...kinda wish it just forced you to go through that section normally, or have the gauge start draining earlier, or...any sort of real punishment, really?

i wish if it ran out during the climb, the two just tumbled down like drunken fools

something like this:

Spoiler

I hope that guy is okay

 

[Bobnik]

44 minutes ago, Celestia said:

So if you fail the button masher thing before the Double Boost, it seems the duo enter the stumbling animation from previous boost games for a few seconds before finally blasting off.

As hilarious as that is I...kinda wish it just forced you to go through that section normally, or have the gauge start draining earlier, or...any sort of real punishment, really?

Yeah, this sucks, but I wouldn't really make the player go through this long-ass hallway with a slower boost. That'd just prolong that section even more IMO.

Their synchronous stumbling is pretty funny tho, I must say.

[Blue Blood]

You can fail the excessive button button mashing. What's the point of this mechanic?

[Dannymax440]

For your avatar to look cool boosting with Sonic.

[sonicdudeatdawn]

1 minute ago, Dannymax440 said:

For your avatar to look cool boosting with Sonic.

all the more reasons to call them op.

didn't they say the avatar was just a normal dude? How is he keeping up with sonic? i'll tell ya why: because its you! 

Avatar runs up wall: You did that! You!

Avatar keeps up with sonic: You're doing that! You

Avatar destroys mooks easily: you did that! You

Avatar gets killed: That's you in ____ Years!

[Dr. Mechano]

3 minutes ago, Dannymax440 said:

For your avatar to look cool boosting with Sonic.

And that's one of my big problems with this game.

It's prioritizing spectacle over gameplay and solid design. Mechanics that have little function but to "look cool," I can do without.

[Blue Blood]

3 minutes ago, Dannymax440 said:

For your avatar to look cool boosting with Sonic.

But it really doesn't look cool. And for that matter, it doesn't sound cool either work the off-key main theme blaring or Sonic congratulating you for being his new BFF.

[Dannymax440]

I hope for a future tag team boost, it'll be like Unleashed's chase sequences.

[Meta77]

47 minutes ago, Dannymax440 said:

For your avatar to look cool boosting with Sonic.

I agree I think it looks super cool seeing our ocs boost alongside sonic. I was at work when i saw the trailer and was like wow this is cool.

[speedfreak]

1 hour ago, Blue Blood said:

But it really doesn't look cool. And for that matter, it doesn't sound cool either work the off-key main theme blaring or Sonic congratulating you for being his new BFF.

Oh good, I'm not the only one who hates how Sonic gushes over the OC. It's so annoying, and completely uncool imo.

The whole "Team work, we can do anything if we work together!" theme is nauseating to me. It's shoved down our throats and in no way subtle. 

[Sonikko]

2 hours ago, Celestia said:

So if you fail the button masher thing before the Double Boost, it seems the duo enter the stumbling animation from previous boost games for a few seconds before finally blasting off.

As hilarious as that is I...kinda wish it just forced you to go through that section normally, or have the gauge start draining earlier, or...any sort of real punishment, really?

This game literally Forces you to play in the exact way the developers intended you to. I wasn't expecting anything different, honestly, since what they had previously shown had clear indicators of things like this happening.

Also yeah, I think people at Sonic Team have to face a lot of meddling from the higher ups, this game really shows no love or care put into it... It's kinda sad, really.

[MegasonicZX]

You know I was really excited about the double boost being a thing leading into the video but finding out that its just a scripted event instead of something that requires skill to pull off right in knowing where to use it in the level just makes me really sad. Like its hard to say this but it honestly feels like the david cage equivalent of trying to make the player feel emotional while doing something without making anything happening on screen all that meaningful and ultimately pointless as you can't botch it anyway. Heck, even if you were speed running this I doubt it'd be much trouble since they probably don't even require you to mash that fast for people that can't do it well at all (which isn't a bad thing mind, but for someone like me who mashes buttons like a madman on speed mashes potatos, it'll just feel like a waste of time).

Like, why did sonic team's design philosophy change so much with this game? Like yeah we had some pretty heavy handed usage of style for style's sake before, but it was never to the point where i'd honestly wonder if this was supposed to be a GAME or not though.

[Scar]

Yet more control is taken away from the player.

I gotta ask at this point, why is this game being made? Sonic Team really don't look like they're even trying. Its all mechanical. As shallow as the boost games are touted to be, there was (at one time) a nuance to how there were designed to reward quick reflexes and an intimate understanding of the level design and mechanics to navigate a level. All that's gone now. Automation and pointless gimmicks all the way.

This really makes me sad, as a boost game (as tired as I think the formula is) which was properly designed wouldn't be bad. But nope, gotta pad it out with random garbage.

[Bowbowis]

I'll admit, I kind of smiled when I heard Sonic's dialog in this level. Now don't get me wrong, it's still nowhere near Black Knight's level and RCS's performance still rubs me wrong for some reason. Still, after seven straight years of boredom and snide commentary it's refreshing to hear some actual positivity from him again. I'm just glad to not have to want to punch him in the face is all.

[Blue Blood]

I was just rewatching this, and some of the laziness in the design just became more obvious to me.

• When Your Name uses the grapple in mid air, Sonic just magically swings along side them. He goes into his ball form and swings as though he's using the grapple. It looks like nobody tried. It's even worse when they're using the Burst Wisp and Sonic is supposedly holding their hand even though he's nowhere near.
• There's absolutely no AI going on ala Sonic and Tails gameplay. The partner character will just follow the main one 1:1 except a little bit to the side. It's two characters being controlled by a single controller. Whatever other Sonic game you compared it to, be Heroes, ShTH or even S2, Forces does it worse.
• Your Name's drift is automatic. 
• When the first gameplay footage was released at SXSW, people noted how stuff Sonic's walking and running animations were compared to Gens and Lost World. I think that's to accommodate the custom hero, who is probably sharing some of Modern Sonic's animations and they've been design to be transferable from one model to another without any clipping. Looks bad.

[Meta77]

24 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

I was just rewatching this, and some of the laziness in the design just became more obvious to me.

• When Your Name uses the grapple in mid air, Sonic just magically swings along side them. He goes into his ball form and swings as though he's using the grapple. It looks like nobody tried. It's even worse when they're using the Burst Wisp and Sonic is supposedly holding their hand even though he's nowhere near.
• There's absolutely no AI going on ala Sonic and Tails gameplay. The partner character will just follow the main one 1:1 except a little bit to the side. It's two characters being controlled by a single controller. Whatever other Sonic game you compared it to, be Heroes, ShTH or even S2, Forces does it worse.
• Your Name's drift is automatic. 
• When the first gameplay footage was released at SXSW, people noted how stuff Sonic's walking and running animations were compared to Gens and Lost World. I think that's to accommodate the custom hero, who is probably sharing some of Modern Sonic's animations and they've been design to be transferable from one model to another without any clipping. Looks bad.

Your upset sonic can swing in midair without holding on to something?

[Blue Blood]

Just now, Meta77 said:

Your upset sonic can swing in midair without holding on to something?

Nope. Just remarking on something else in the game that looks sloppily implemented. 

[Diogenes]

23 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

There's absolutely no AI going on ala Sonic and Tails gameplay. The partner character will just follow the main one 1:1 except a little bit to the side. It's two characters being controlled by a single controller. Whatever other Sonic game you compared it to, be Heroes, ShTH or even S2, Forces does it worse.

This I'm not particularly bothered by, considering how much flopping around the characters did in Heroes and how that ended up causing some problems when switching between them. With something like Tails in Sonic 2/3&K I think it's fine for them to be AI-controlled, but when the player's meant to be controlling both characters I think it's probably better if they control more like one unit.

[Sonikko]

39 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

I was just rewatching this, and some of the laziness in the design just became more obvious to me.

• When Your Name uses the grapple in mid air, Sonic just magically swings along side them. He goes into his ball form and swings as though he's using the grapple. It looks like nobody tried. It's even worse when they're using the Burst Wisp and Sonic is supposedly holding their hand even though he's nowhere near.
• There's absolutely no AI going on ala Sonic and Tails gameplay. The partner character will just follow the main one 1:1 except a little bit to the side. It's two characters being controlled by a single controller. Whatever other Sonic game you compared it to, be Heroes, ShTH or even S2, Forces does it worse.
• Your Name's drift is automatic. 
• When the first gameplay footage was released at SXSW, people noted how stuff Sonic's walking and running animations were compared to Gens and Lost World. I think that's to accommodate the custom hero, who is probably sharing some of Modern Sonic's animations and they've been design to be transferable from one model to another without any clipping. Looks bad.

Yeah, I've noticed all those things.

The animations are bad, Lost World tier bad, they're very stiff and lifeless. Compare the animations in the diving section, Generations had the character tilt around and react to input directions, Forces and Lost World are stiff, no reactions whatsoever.

Also I'm pissed that they took out the drift from Sonic to justify the OC's existence. He has been able to drift for 3 games now, but in Forces no, the OC drifts with the grappling hook, Sonic can't anymore for some reason?

And they made it worse, now the drift is either part of a setpiece like at the beginning of the stage, or exclusive to auto-run sections. It's not completely automatic but it's less skill-dependant than in the previous games.

EDIT: The AI missing isn't a big turndown for me. It does look pretty jarring though, they could've put more effort into masking it. It looks like one of those mods where Sonic is followed by Wisps in Generations and SADX. 

The whole game screams amateurish to me. 

"My first game.exe"