Sonic Forces devs to teach what good level design is about

[PKGaming]

7 hours ago, Yeow said:

If you're referring to Green Hill from Generations, it's worth noting Generations was designed and directed by by a different group of Sonic Team staff. Forces has the same director/lead game designer of the Nintendo-exclusive Sonic games (Storybook series, Colors, Lost World) helming the project.

Oh my god, that explains EVERYTHING!!! 

Honestly, seeing Sonic Team's philosophy on good level design would be legitimately intriguing. We may finally understand where they're coming from, and even better, able to know exactly how to counter their views. "So you think THIS, eh Sonic Team? Well let me tell you why that's NOT good."

[memoryman3]

Oh boy oh boy! We all know that the Lost World team are the pioneers of EXCELLENT level design!

[StaticMania]

Lost World is good game.

Is not regarded negatively.

Mediocre.

 

In conclusion, they could learn a thing or 2 from Lost World.

[Mark1]

Is there any way to see the level design approach from the Mania team too? Even for comparisons sake with Sonic Team at least?

To this day no game in the franchise has done it better than Mania - they should really be doing this. 

Nonetheless I'm keen to see Sonic Team teaching good level design for 2D and 3D Sonic. I do want to see more classic levels for Forces to really see if they justify a full presentation...

[Sonikko]

4 hours ago, StaticMania said:

Lost World is good game.

Is not regarded negatively.

Mediocre.

 

In conclusion, they could learn a thing or 2 from Lost World.

Yeah, how not to design a stage

EDIT:

Also

>Lost World

>Good game

>Mediocre

Which one is it then?

[StaticMania]

I don't know what you mean by that...I find LW positive.

Others regard it mediocre...not negative.

[Blue Blood]

Oh the whole, Lost world is an experiment that didn't work. 3D design is very flat and linear with obstacles you can just walk around, 2D design is... well, better than Colours and Forces but still nothing to write home about. I don't think they quite knew what they were doing with it. Desert Ruins 1 really fun though.

[Plasme]

The amount of snark in this thread is utterly pathetic! The Forces' devs are true professionals, they know what makes Sonic great.

[Indigo Rush]

I disagree. They really don't seem to know what makes Sonic great. You've spent a lot of your time baiting us and I think that's the real pathetic thing. 

I like your Metal avatar though. It has Bright Eyes.

[Plasme]

Thanks, I guess. But that doesn't have much to do with the Forces devs

[Korke]

11 hours ago, StaticMania said:

In conclusion, they could learn a thing or 2 from Lost World.

I'm curious, what do you think they could even learn from SLW at all?

[Plasme]

Lost World is a great game. It has lots of platforming, a great art style, brilliant music and is totally open and non automated.

[The Deleter]

Has anyone recorded this? It was supposed to happen today, but I don't think there's been any live streams for it...

[TargetWatch]

I'm done, fuck the current Sonic Team. Either get new talent that understands the series or shutdown in shame. They've truly hit rock bottom if they think this shit is competent level design, let alone great.

[Plasme]

Sonic Team has loads of talent, don't get jealous. Just look at how great Forces is, the Boost is fast and fun. Look at the amazing graphics.

I can't wait to hear their words of wisdom!

[TargetWatch]

4 minutes ago, Plasme said:

Sonic Team has loads of talent, don't get jealous. Just look at how great Forces is, the Boost is fast and fun. Look at the amazing graphics.

I can't wait to hear their words of wisdom!

Compared to those working with the Mario series? No they don't. Actual talent like Yuji Naka left ages ago. In addition, look at how shallow you've described the game you're hyped for. It's that crap you can barely find anything actually substantial about it in regards to level design, game-play and mechanics. Believe me there's a shitload to be said about the A.I. alone. Never have I seen a game where enemies were that useless.

[Plasme]

The Mario devs are amazing though, Sonic's never been as good as Mario.

Anyway, Forces doesn't have shallow gameplay, Boost is a really complex system.

[Detective Kaito]

If the Sonic Colors/Lost World team is working on Sonic Forces, then what has the Generations team been doing all this time?

[Plasme]

I don't think thee's much truth to the whole seperate team thing. They put people on projects on a flexible basis. There is no concrete Colors or Gens team.

[TargetWatch]

4 minutes ago, Plasme said:

The Mario devs are amazing though, Sonic's never been as good as Mario.

Anyway, Forces doesn't have shallow gameplay, Boost is a really complex system.

Your only point of interaction is dodging obstacles whilst pressing one button to get instant speed... How is that more in depth than a momentum based system that's varied at all times via player control and player skill? The answer? It's not... Why? Cause that would not make any sense. 

[Celestia]

At the end of the day this is just them talking about some really basic level design stuff and using like, one screenshot from a game that's coming out soon as an example. Maybe I'm missing something, but the screenshot in the OP is really harmless. Some spikes and an enemy, and not in a particularly bad layout either. I know why people instantly leaped the jokes they did over this but...eh.

5 minutes ago, Plasme said:

Anyway, Forces doesn't have shallow gameplay, Boost is a really complex system.

You should at least try to back up statements like this with something. C'mon.

33 minutes ago, Indigo Rush said:

It has Bright Eyes.

For the record when people act like this we immediately check for evidence for ban dodging. If there is any, insta-ban.

Edit: ban dodging. Not "band" dodging. Though I don't condone dodging band practice either.

[Wraith]

3 minutes ago, Detective Kaito said:

If the Sonic Colors/Lost World team is working on Sonic Forces, then what has the Generations team been doing all this time?

There aren't two teams.

http://segaretro.org/Hiroshi_Miyamoto

Gen's director, however, is frequently put on spinoffs while Colors's director gets the main games.(???)

[Plasme]

It's far more complex because it creates better pacing and complements the speedruning nature of the game. Do I jump here, boost here, drift here, all to maximise your speed and get a top time. All tied in to core player mechanics.

It's the true essence of Sonic but without the boring pitfalls, slow platforming and waiting.

It's the true glory of Sonic.

[Celestia]

1 minute ago, Plasme said:

It's the true essence of Sonic but without the boring pitfalls, slow platforming and waiting.

These pop up in the boost games (mostly the later ones) all the time tho'.

[TargetWatch]

6 minutes ago, Plasme said:

It's far more complex because it creates better pacing and complements the speedruning nature of the game. Do I jump here, boost here, drift here, all to maximise your speed and get a top time. All tied in to core player mechanics.

It's the true essence of Sonic but without the boring pitfalls, slow platforming and waiting.

It's the true glory of Sonic.

By significantly reducing actual player input and streamlining it to a one button action? That's more complex is it? Got ya. It may have the speed-running aspect down, but when it comes to everything else it's a failure of a gameplay system that goes against the core game-play of the originals.