Sonic Mania: Sequel Speculation (Spoilers)

[BaronGrackle]

8 hours ago, Jango said:

In the light of Sonic Mania, Forces was caught in a Sonic 4 situation, at least one third of it. You have another game to compare that does it way better, to the point of making one basically unnecessary. 

Sonic 4 Episode 1 didn't even try - that's why fans received it poorly.

Forget rolling physics. Do we all remember UNCURLING? Sonic rolls off a ramp and unfolds his body, flailingly awkward and vulnerable. And from here you had to homing attack, so that you could beat the Bubbles badniks that were downgraded into homing attack fodder. Because of this alone, it was stylistically impossible to replicate some of the most iconic scenes from the Genesis.

Sonic Generations tried to feel classic, with some success and some failure. Sonic 4 tried to be a phone game; it's biggest success for SEGA was in lowering fan standards for when Generations came out later.

Generations didn't have to be perfect to please fans. So help us, it just had to have a little effort.

[Jango]

Speaking of the infamous uncurlling, I remember vividly the day when one of the first Classic Sonic gameplays was revealed, and Sonic would uncurl after a ramp, even if he was rolling. People made at least 76 topics about it in various forums I used to be a member of. It was fixed, as well as the jump that in the first gameplays also looked heavy as heck. 

But all in all, yeah, they tried in Generations, they did the homework. A solid 8. While Sonic 4... But, fuck that game, we have the real deal now called Mania. If they made an Episode 2, they can (and should!) make another Mania.

[tailsBOOM!]

They could have character-exclusive bosses:

Sonic: Mecha Sonic, Silver Sonic, Robo Sonic

Tails: Speedy, Witchcart, Tails Doll

Knuckles: Metal Knuckles, Hooligans, Metal Sonic Kai

and so on...

[Multikaris]

5 hours ago, tailsBOOM! said:

They could have character-exclusive bosses:

Sonic: Mecha Sonic, Silver Sonic, Robo Sonic

Tails: Speedy, Witchcart, Tails Doll

Knuckles: Metal Knuckles, Hooligans, Metal Sonic Kai

and so on...

A great idea, but I have my doubts that Witchcart and Speedy will ever return. Even if they could, Speedy apparently died in Tails Adventure. Unless they set it as a prequel or come up with some reason for him to come back to life, he is unlikely tor return even if he could. 

[Zaysho]

46 minutes ago, Miragnarok said:

Even if they could, Speedy apparently died in Tails Adventure.

Didn't stop Shadow.

[tailsBOOM!]

20 hours ago, Miragnarok said:

A great idea, but I have my doubts that Witchcart and Speedy will ever return. Even if they could, Speedy apparently died in Tails Adventure. Unless they set it as a prequel or come up with some reason for him to come back to life, he is unlikely tor return even if he could. 

 

19 hours ago, Zaysho said:

Didn't stop Shadow.

Plus Generations reset the timeline (If you're looking at this from the American perspective of it occurring sometime after Sonic 2.

[Multikaris]

6 hours ago, tailsBOOM! said:

 

Plus Generations reset the timeline (If you're looking at this from the American perspective of it occurring sometime after Sonic 2.

Tails Adventure is allegedly a prequel in the Japanese storyline. So, still likely to be dead, unless Tails Adventure is not canon.

[superman43]

3 hours ago, tailsBOOM! said:

 

Plus Generations reset the timeline (If you're looking at this from the American perspective of it occurring sometime after Sonic 2.

But... it didn´t.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

On 5/18/2018 at 1:16 PM, Miragnarok said:

Tails Adventure is allegedly a prequel in the Japanese storyline. So, still likely to be dead, unless Tails Adventure is not canon.

Or they just simply aren't dead. 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

To be honest, a Classic spinoff with minimal story isn't exactly what I'd consider canon, it can really go either way, it isn't as definitive as a main focal plot point of Shadow dying at the end of SA2 for example.

[Multikaris]

I think that the sequel should have an Encore Mode again for more replay value. And if the old mania team doesn’t get hired for this again, I think Prope and Artoon would be the best choices. Heck, even if they do return, those developers could also work  alongside them. After all, they were founded by members of Sonic Team, and it would be a great reunion. 

[Fire-N-Space]

With all this positive support for Amy Rose on twitter and youtube for her to be in Mania hopefully she will be in the sequel and not be left out again.

[Sonic Fan J]

Is there really that much support? Last time I checked up on it there was almost as much hatred and attacks against her fans as there were fans coming out to support her. It was kind of an ugly to be honest 

[Red Hot Jack]

On ‎5‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 6:04 AM, Sonic Fan J said:

Is there really that much support? Last time I checked up on it there was almost as much hatred and attacks against her fans as there were fans coming out to support her. It was kind of an ugly to be honest 

I haven't checked but I think they are trying to defend Mania? And hopefully not hate on Amy... that hate has been over for a decade now.

[Sonic Fan J]

7 hours ago, Jack the Maniac said:

I haven't checked but I think they are trying to defend Mania? And hopefully not hate on Amy... that hate has been over for a decade now.

Unfortunately when I last checked there was some rather blatant hate not just against Amy but also her fans as well. The way they those people talked you'd think it was a crime to even like Amy in any capacity. Hopefully some of that has died down though since then.

[Skull Leader]

On May 20, 2018 at 11:04 PM, Sonic Fan J said:

Is there really that much support? Last time I checked up on it there was almost as much hatred and attacks against her fans as there were fans coming out to support her. It was kind of an ugly to be honest 

And should Amy and her fans be thrown under a bus for those people? 

I'd say fuck'em and just give Amy her long, very looong overdue chance to be put on the spotlight, both story and playable wise. Her fans have just as much right to enjoy the character too, and should not be denied because of her detractors.

Really don't know what is Sega/ST afraid off, and the excuses like "but how would she play like?", "she wasn't even on the Genesis games" or "she wasn't a hero yet" can go f themselves when a) there is already a basis in her Advance gameplay to draw ideas from, b) Mighty and Ray were never in those games either yet they got picked up despite being most likely some of the least requested compared to the more logical Amy choice, or the Chaotix, who are much more relevant than that couple characters that should had stayed retired by all rights and c) who cares? Why is this even a thing when they have no trouble featuring other characters in games they originally did not appear in? Plus, isn't the  Classic era being treated like a different dimension?

[Tracker_TD]

On 5/22/2018 at 11:18 PM, Skull Leader said:

Really don't know what is Sega/ST afraid off, and the excuses like "but how would she play like?", "she wasn't even on the Genesis games" or "she wasn't a hero yet" can go f themselves when a) there is already a basis in her Advance gameplay to draw ideas from, b) Mighty and Ray were never in those games either yet they got picked up despite being most likely some of the least requested compared to the more logical Amy choice, or the Chaotix, who are much more relevant than that couple characters that should had stayed retired by all rights and c) who cares? Why is this even a thing when they have no trouble featuring other characters in games they originally did not appear in? Plus, isn't the  Classic era being treated like a different dimension?

See, but some of those matters are pretty important. Just dropping Amy with her Advance moveset into Mania wouldn't necessarily work - Mighty and Ray meanwhile take from Sonic as the main basis like Tails and Knuckles, making them actually more logical choices. That's not to say Amy can't ever show up, but it makes more sense for a sequel where they can build level design that can better suit her as well as the other characters without stripping away what makes her unique, whereas in Mania she's more liable to break stuff due to the unique nature of her Advance playstyle. 

[Fire-N-Space]

Just now, Tracker_TD said:

See, but some of those matters are pretty important. Just dropping Amy with her Advance moveset into Mania wouldn't necessarily work - Mighty and Ray meanwhile take from Sonic as the main basis like Tails and Knuckles, making them actually more logical choices. That's not to say Amy can't ever show up, but it makes more sense for a sequel where they can build level design that can better suit her as well as the other characters without stripping away what makes her unique, whereas in Mania she's more liable to break stuff due to the unique nature of her Advance playstyle. 

I don't see how this would stop Amy from getting in to Mania when the characters are made from the ground up with a lot of them having the hover ability something Amy can do. Old Amy still has a running animation in Sonic CD that they could have copy pasted in to the game like with the others characters and to add to all of this is that she isn't even a part of the story for when she was a main character in those classic games.

[Diogenes]

I'd agree that you couldn't just drop Advance Amy's moveset into the game and have it work, but then they could just...not do that? Come up with some new way to represent her abilities that's more in line with the other characters in the game, like they're already doing with Mighty and Ray.

[Tracker_TD]

32 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

I'd agree that you couldn't just drop Advance Amy's moveset into the game and have it work, but then they could just...not do that? Come up with some new way to represent her abilities that's more in line with the other characters in the game, like they're already doing with Mighty and Ray.

Aye, but I was more responding to the point that you could just drag the Advance abilities to Mania. That, and from what I’ve seen that’s honestly what a lot of folks would expect to happen. 

[HywelAtTheMoon]

They would have to rework Amy's moveset no matter what. All characters there had moves that were mapped to two buttons. Mania only used the one button. 

If Mania 2's controls used two action buttons, then OK.

If Amy was in there, maybe use her SAd1 attacks and no spin attack, but up her speed. 

[kergo]

There's an idea I came up with long ago. Can a classic Sonic game have pixel 2D foregrounds, but low-poly 3D backgrounds? I loved what the Metal Sonic fight looked like with the Eggman statue spinning at the back, and wondered why not have an entire game with shenanigans like that? What about exploit the Sonic Time Twisted idea of background bosses and have a giant 3D robot shooting at Sonic?

[Sonic Fan J]

12 hours ago, HywelAtTheMoon said:

They would have to rework Amy's moveset no matter what. All characters there had moves that were mapped to two buttons. Mania only used the one button. 

If Mania 2's controls used two action buttons, then OK.

If Amy was in there, maybe use her SAd1 attacks and no spin attack, but up her speed. 

Well, Mania did add the transformation button didn't it? So it's not like the current version of the game doesn't already have two buttons that can be mapped to. Though, would that mean that Amy wouldn't be able to have a super form or would they have to map a third button then just to continue to avoid unwanted super transformations?

[Multikaris]

3 hours ago, kergo said:

There's an idea I came up with long ago. Can a classic Sonic game have pixel 2D foregrounds, but low-poly 3D backgrounds? I loved what the Metal Sonic fight looked like with the Eggman statue spinning at the back, and wondered why not have an entire game with shenanigans like that? What about exploit the Sonic Time Twisted idea of background bosses and have a giant 3D robot shooting at Sonic?

I’d especially be interested by a boss with a “wireframe” effect, like in the Megaman X series. 

[Salamander]

I wouldn't want any potential Amy gameplay to stray too far from the mould of other characters, and in particular I would say that the spin dash is essential, not just for a Sonic the Hedgehog character but for a hedgehog character; derived as it is from the real hedgehog's ability to curl into a ball, it would make no sense for Amy to lack the ability to roll while the likes of Tails and Ray possess it.  Similarly, I'm not fond of the extra (and frequently extraneous) technical aspect of the Advance movesets; adding a few streamlining moves overall is fine by me, but broadly speaking I think complexity should come from the way movesets interact with the environment.  For example, a one-button hammer spin jump for Amy could still retain the hammer's spring-boosting properties from the Advance games, or do other things like bounce off walls for extra height.

So far as Super transformations go, I'm sure there must be some simple button-press or combination which can be found to save on button economy; the up button, perhaps?