Sonic Forces demo- Green Hill (Modern Sonic gameplay)

[theofficefan99]

Also I'd like to remind everyone that even though SEGA states that the budget price for the game doesn't mean that the budget has been reduced, that's quite obviously a lie.

[pppp]

Also what the fuck did they do to Modern Sonic's controls and physics? His jump is shorter in height and he feels heavier than in Generations. The boost also feels like it has less oomph. I think it's actually more nerfed than in Colors.

[___-_]

@MudHunterWell Generations didn't have a tutorial stage to begin with. It did have Omochao walking you through and teach you things if you wanted the option on, though. 

This game apparently does have a tutorial stage, though, and you'd think something as essential like double jumping, sliding and quick stepping would be taught from the jump in that level, yet they aren't even touched upon. Like, there's gonna have to be another one to explain the rest of his moves, which I feel is needless. And again, why is plot going on in a tutorial level? Unless that's the norm with tutorials these days and I'm missing something?

[Sonicka]

1 hour ago, Mayor D said:

 

So then... Sunset Heights, Tag Stage, Casino Forest, Space Port and... every other level shown that is only 60 seconds long, or artificially inflated due to automated segments

As well as having enemies with no Ai.

Or having no enemies at all....

Or being a flat plane surface.....

And full of QTEs...

 

Are they also tutorials?

...Yes?

Joking aside, these levels are also not the entire game - how do we know the default setting is not on "easy" for this?  - In which case maybe AI is set to non-responsive - when on earth have we ever wanted a Sonic/Boost game with AI set top stop you in your tracks every 5 seconds anyway? What exactly is wrong with QTE's - they can make set pieces flow and gel together in exciting ways. What on earth does flat plane surface even mean? Sorry I just don't get it.   

I'm expecting short and snappy levels levels for the most part - is it disappointing? A little bit yes - but then Colours dealt their cards really well with this design in mind - oh and with the double jump is back in this game so that's another +1 as I enjoyed seeing that little feature return when playing this at EGX - it's a neat mobility failsafe for Sonic in general.

But apart from people literally searching for ways to break through the game to prove there is no God - (I mean, Why... Why do the fanbase waste their life energy with this? Seriously). In my honest opinion there is just no way this game is even comes close to being classifiably terrible from the time I personally put into what I've played. I think people could find it middling and uninteresting, but that depends on what floats your boat for what you're after. I'm after fun, and this has deliver that promise so far (Tag Team prolly my favourite).

It's either that... or I liked playing a really shit game and I'm just contentious enough to put up with Sonic Team's efforts (I can assure you, I'm not, and I have played much worse Sonic titles than the little I have played of Forces - and even then that's not really a matter of fact, it's just an opinion). I agree for the most part that Sonic Team can probably do better, and I still think the Boost Trilogy will largely end up being better than this game - but I won't know that for sure until I've played Forces in full.

But maybe, just maybe it's just that some people like what they've seen so far and some people don't - and it's really as simple as a fanbase being polarised over what they want their Sonic game to be and what it isn't living up to in terms of for them (see also: every Sonic game). In which case, that actually really sucks. So I'm sorry this doesn't cut it for you. 

Anyway... in answer to the quote... I guess they aren't all Tutorials? (although a lot of these are/were for Demo purposes) But at least 4 levels in this game will be tutorials won't they? 4/40 isn't so bad (I'm presuming a ratio of 10 levels per type of stage here - I got no real idea obviously).
 

  

[McGroose]

A Sonic game with a difficulty setting is something that I'm unaware of. If there's an elephant in the room here, please enlighten me. I really doubt for this entire time, the mediocrity displayed as level design and enemy AI was due to a difficulty setting. That's just Sonic team putting their efforts on easy mode when it comes to making their levels.

[The Deleter]

The difficulty setting for the demo is not on "easy", it's "normal". You can collect more than 100 rings, and you lose them all when you get hit; something "easy" mode specifically prevents.

[Badnik Mechanic]

15 minutes ago, Son-icka said:

Joking aside, these levels are also not the entire game - how do we know the default setting is not on "easy" for this?  

  

Dodgy formatting ahead due to mobile...

It's not. Ring counter goes to 0 when you get hit 

 What exactly is wrong with QTE's - they can make set pieces flow and gel together in exciting ways. 

You are not playing the game during these sequences. Some of these sequences last up to 20 seconds in a level which is only 60-80 seconds long.

What on earth does flat plane surface even mean? Sorry I just don't get it.   

In 3D graphics/geomotry, a flat plane referes to a flat surface.

15 minutes ago, Son-icka said:

 AI set top stop you in your tracks every 5 seconds anyway? What exactly is wrong with QTE's - they can make set pieces flow and gel together in exciting ways. 
 

First of all...

Ai does not mean if an enemy is hard to defeat or if it can do stuff too completely halt you or not.

It referes to how an enemy reacts to the player and/or the environment.

Having Ai means it can make decisions in the world based on the rules and actions it has.

E.g. shoot gun, patrol, physical attack, run away, chase etc...

No Ai means the enemy just stands there being pointless.

But to address your point... Why would we want an enemy that could challenge us and make us think in a game? Yeah why indeed would we want that?

15 minutes ago, Son-icka said:

But at least 4 levels in this game will be tutorials won't they? 4/40 isn't so bad (I'm presuming a ratio of 10 levels per type of stage here - I got no real idea obviously).

40% of the game being tutorial stages is ok to you? In a Sonic game?

[Badnik Mechanic]

3 hours ago, Saber Wisp said:

Uh wut. 

Classic Green Hill, Modern Green Hill, Tag Team.

Sunset Heights, Park Avenue. 

Where are the other four stages? Casino Forest is before Space Port? Or are you counting bosses? 

Missed this.

Green Hill is area 1. At least 4 stages here over the 3 characters

Sunset Heights is area 2. At least 3 stages here over 3 characters.

Casino forest and or space port is area 3. At least 2/3 stages here (based on shown gameplay and cut scenes).

So by the time you reach avatar plant/space port.

You have played around 7-9 possibly 10 levels in total depending if space port comes before casino forest or not.

That means by stage 7-10 the game is still giving you enemies with no Ai.

 

[Detective Kaito]

You could argue that having enemies with AI in certain sections is useless cause they won't be able to hurt you anyways, but I'm willing to wait till the game releases till I can judge stuff like glitches and AI.

[Diogenes]

5 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Missed this.

Green Hill is area 1. At least 4 stages here over the 3 characters

Sunset Heights is area 2. At least 3 stages here over 3 characters.

Casino forest and or space port is area 3. At least 2/3 stages here (based on shown gameplay and cut scenes).

So by the time you reach avatar plant/space port.

You have played around 7-9 possibly 10 levels in total depending if space port comes before casino forest or not.

That means by stage 7-10 the game is still giving you enemies with no Ai.

I would be surprised if you played through every version of every zone in a row before moving on.

1 minute ago, Detective Kaito said:

You could argue that having enemies with AI in certain sections is useless cause they won't be able to hurt you anyways, but I'm willing to wait till the game releases till I can judge stuff like glitches and AI.

But why are the enemies there at all, then?

[StaticMania]

Does it really matter if they can hurt you or not, they should still be programmed to attack the player.

They shouldn't be so easy to destroy in the first place, by which I mean...they shouldn't be lined up in the path with no purpose but to be ran over by Sonic and the Avatar.

[McGroose]

The fact enemies don't attack you feels like an indicator of laziness on Sega's part, almost like they know the only point for enemies in this game is for spectacle.

[Badnik Mechanic]

6 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

I would be surprised if you played through every version of every zone in a row before moving on.

Just going off what I can see in the stages.

Amazingly, it looks like the first GHZ stage is the Avatars.

The Avatars GHZ stage ends with spider/crab bot chase/QTE.

Modern Sonic GHZ ends with Sonic discovering it's remains scattered around.

TAG Stage ends with you entering the pyramid bomb room.

Classic Sonic GHZ shows the pyramid destroyed in the background.

Somewhere in all this is the classic Sonic Boss fight.

[CleverSonicUsername]

51 minutes ago, Son-icka said:

...Yes?

Joking aside, these levels are also not the entire game - how do we know the default setting is not on "easy" for this?  - In which case maybe AI is set to non-responsive

  

What an absolutely shitty way to show off your game for months on end, then.

[Diogenes]

2 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Just going off what I can see in the stages.

Amazingly, it looks like the first GHZ stage is the Avatars.

The Avatars GHZ stage ends with spider/crab bot chase/QTE.

Modern Sonic GHZ ends with Sonic discovering it's remains scattered around.

I'm pretty sure those are Death Egg Robot parts, not giant crab-bot parts.

The way I see it, going by NPC chatter, Avatar GHZ has to come after Modern city stage; Avatar GHZ is all about creating a distraction while the rest of the heroes head to Chemical Plant, so they can get a rocket to reach Sonic or something, after he got his ass kicked by Infinite. Modern GHZ is Sonic working his way to the city (where Infinite kicks his ass), as it starts with Tails calling him there for help.

[The Deleter]

9 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Just going off what I can see in the stages.

Amazingly, it looks like the first GHZ stage is the Avatars.

The Avatars GHZ stage ends with spider/crab bot chase/QTE.

Modern Sonic GHZ ends with Sonic discovering it's remains scattered around.

TAG Stage ends with you entering the pyramid bomb room.

Classic Sonic GHZ shows the pyramid destroyed in the background.

Somewhere in all this is the classic Sonic Boss fight.

What? No he doesn't. Those are Death Egg Robots.

The Avatar level is the one that shows the destroyed pyramid, as well. Not classic, as far as I can recall at least.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

6 minutes ago, The Deleter said:

15 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Just going off what I can see in the stages.

Amazingly, it looks like the first GHZ stage is the Avatars.

The Avatars GHZ stage ends with spider/crab bot chase/QTE.

Modern Sonic GHZ ends with Sonic discovering it's remains scattered around.

TAG Stage ends with you entering the pyramid bomb room.

Classic Sonic GHZ shows the pyramid destroyed in the background.

Somewhere in all this is the classic Sonic Boss fight.

What? No he doesn't. Those are Death Egg Robots.

The Avatar level is the one that shows the destroyed pyramid, as well. Not classic, as far as I can recall at least.

 

 Excellent observation and catch there Deleter. It makes more sense now. 

[CheatsterX]

6 minutes ago, The Deleter said:

What? No he doesn't. Those are Death Egg Robots.

The Avatar level is the one that shows the destroyed pyramid, as well. Not classic, as far as I can recall at least.

I'd say it goes Modern GHZ, then they go to the city and meet the Avatar. Tails parts ways with Modern to do Classic GHZ and the Boss. Tag Team GHZ happens, and they potentially meet Infinite, who beats Sonic and kidnaps him, the fight destroys the pyramid. Avatar GHZ happens as the resistance chase infinite to Space Port.

[Detective Kaito]

22 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

But why are the enemies there at all, then?

Cause they don't know what else to put in those empty hallways.

[StaticMania]

6 minutes ago, Detective Kaito said:

Cause they don't know what else to put in those empty hallways.

Perhaps those corridors could just not be there, they don't even transition very well.

[Kuzu]

I have played the demo...or at least as much of it as I could at least.

 

....So uh....yea...it exists...that's all I can really say lol. The environments at least look nice.

[Sr101]

Seeing the glitches from Generations still exist really makes my programmer blood boil. Debugging is the dirty work of programmers, and to see they didn't even put in the effort to scan through their shit and make some changes really makes me question if this is even a full on project or someones little reskin. 

[GuyWithThePie]

35 minutes ago, Sr101 said:

Seeing the glitches from Generations still exist really makes my programmer blood boil. Debugging is the dirty work of programmers, and to see they didn't even put in the effort to scan through their shit and make some changes really makes me question if this is even a full on project or someones little reskin. 

Actually, a Generations mod would probably have less bugs and glitches than this.

[Razule]

2 hours ago, The Deleter said:

What? No he doesn't. Those are Death Egg Robots.

Oh, hey, that reminds me..

On 25/10/2017 at 2:55 PM, Razule said:

Those "wide open spaces" in Green Hill are just going to be like this, huh (referring to Sonic Forces you to the center, and invisible walls)

Called it.

[BlueFlare]

5 hours ago, Mayor D said:

 

So then... Sunset Heights, Tag Stage, Casino Forest, Space Port and... every other level shown that is only 60 seconds long, or artificially inflated due to automated segments

As well as having enemies with no Ai.

Or having no enemies at all....

Or being a flat plane surface.....

And full of QTEs...

 

Are they also tutorials?

The whole game is a tutorial. Tutorial of how a Sonic game should NOT be put together.