Jump to content
Awoo.

Sonic Forces SPOILER Thread


Ellipsis-Ultima

Recommended Posts

7 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Question: Were the illusions/clones/whatever explicitly supposed to be weaker than the real deal? 

iirc I think in the game they were supposed to have the same powers, I don't know if that means equal strength, but they specifically made the distinction 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, The Tenth Doctor said:

 

"I have summoned illusions of your greatest foes! Shadow! Chaos 0! Zavok! Metal Sonic! That's not all! I got some others in on this! Mephiles! Erazor Djinn! Merlina! The other Deadly 6 members! and Wendy Witchcart! What...you don't remember Wendy? That's just... that's just cruel hedgehog."

“The Babylon Rogues! The Biolizard! Rouge! The Mecha Sonics! That jerboa guy! Black Knight! Dark Gaia! And i’ve Been looking into some from your weird-ass comic books and TV shows as well.”

  • Thumbs Up 2
  • Chuckle 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Question: Were the illusions/clones/whatever explicitly supposed to be weaker than the real deal? 

Well considering that clone shadow got taken out with one roundhouse kick and clone chaos was taken out just by classic sonic jumping on his head, I’d say it varies.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, KHCast said:

Depends on what the plot wants.:/ sometimes they put up a challenge like Zavock and Metal Sonic's boss fight, othertimes shadow can dance side to side and take out 30 of them 

Keep in mind that certain projections from the Phantom Ruby are more concentrated energy points, with Infinite being the strongest or most potent of them all. This explains, for example, why Infinite's copies in the Mystic Jungle are easily dispatched with a single homing attack while the real Infinite himself, the epicenter of the Phantom Ruby's energy, can continually take a licking.

  • Thumbs Up 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, hifihedgehog said:

Keep in mind that certain projections from the Phantom Ruby are more concentrated energy points, with Infinite being the strongest or more potent of them all. This explains, for example, why Infinite's copies in the Mystic Jungle are easily dispatched with a single homing attack while the real Infinite himself, the epicenter of the Phantom Ruby's energy, can continually take a licking.

Is this ever confirmed?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Johnny Boy said:

Well considering that clone shadow got taken out with one roundhouse kick and clone chaos was taken out just by classic sonic jumping on his head, I’d say it varies.

As long as they are all much more powerful and capable than Tails, then Sonic Team is pleased.

  • Thumbs Up 3
  • Chuckle 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, UpCDownCLeftCRightC said:

No. I actually think the CaC is a good idea for the franchise...when handled appropriately.

For the main games? No. But I can easily see a successful spin-off series based on that sort of gameplay and storytelling.  

It takes up too many resources. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, KHCast said:

Is this ever confirmed?

It only makes sense that Infinite's auxiliary or secondary illusions are weaker, subordinate latchkeys with a total sum of power no greater than him, their higher origin of power from which they draw their strength. Just look at Jafar in Disney's Aladdin: the minions he created to terrorize and plunder could not draw no more power than their master granted to them. In any case, if power is being divvied up from an originating parent, all children recipients ultimately possess a sum of power no greater than their parent. Considering that the master is typically holding back enough power for his own whim and devices, the slaves' total sum of power is in practice far less than their master's.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, theofficefan99 said:

It takes up too many resources. 

I fee like it could make a lot of money if they did it right though

Link to comment
Share on other sites

43 minutes ago, KHCast said:

No joke, was kinda hoping for mephiles, especially since mephiles himself can create illusions of himself lol

@DabigRG tbf he refrences secret Rings to tails implying tails knows 

"In an interview conducted by Game Informer, Takashi Iizuka stated that they have no plans for Mephiles to appear in any future games, and that he was only useful for the narrative of Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)."

Which is why whenever anyone pulled up with the "Mephiles is Infinite" theory I shot them down, lol

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, KHCast said:

The same guy said classic sonic and the boost would be retired and yet here we are 

Usually when he says things like that it's prefixed by "no plans". As in not at the time. But things change.

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/28/2017 at 5:22 PM, RedFox99 said:

For each individual character, how would you describe how they were portrayed?

Gonna quickly cover this since the game isn't out yet and I just kinda breezed through parts before the cutscenes were posted:

Sonic is Sonic. He has some really good lines here and there.

Tails being Wimpified was something I initially both thought was a bit overblown here and may have been an overcorrection on Sonic Team's part after the way he was received in Lost World. And actually seen the scenes in question, that's mostly accurate. Him being afraid of Chaos Zero suddenly creeping up on him wouldn't bother me...if he literally didn't shout for Sonic there. And yes, the rest of the game doesn't do him much favors since he just kinda tags along with the quiet Classic Sonic and Buddy to explain things and seemingly share some of their good will in lieu of actually doing anything.

Knuckles is one of the main things I was concerned about when we started getting information on this game and my sentiment hasn't changed a bit: Unpopular opinion here, but him being The Leader of the Resistance felt like it was relatively out of theme for him and simply a shorthand for making him feel important after so long. And this was accomplished by giving him a role that Tails or maybe Silver would've/should've had otherwise. Like, maybe it was supposed to be that Tails was the leader before he "lost it" and Knuckles ended up taking over in part because of his ancestry giving him inherent experience or something like that. But on the onset, it feels unearned and, while I admittedly haven't seen much of the later gameplay missions after the Death Egg, he really doesn't seem to add much in the role anyway until the final battle. It's especially weird considering his portrayal in the tie-in comic.

I'm also a bit confused about Shadow's part in things, but at least I know it's likely another Catwoman situation. Omega showing up at the last minute with one line was neat and is clearly linked to Shadow given the tie-in comic. At least Rouge had a nice role that appealed to her actual character skills while also keeping her out of unnecessary focus, so there's a plus. Though the fact that GUN is seemingly completely ashed away is a huge oversight.

Vector and Charmy got some nice lines in here and there, with Vector in particular seemingly acting as in the field Mission Control from what I've seen. Meanwhile, Espio is just kinda there and Amy isn't that much better despite seemingly being the main Mission Control.

And I'll say it again: Cream's absence is really odd considering literally every other major cast member plus Silver and Omega is present, not to mention the various rabbit soldiers visibly hopping high in the ending. 

 

As for the villains, well, I think that's been well established so far:

Eggman being on top of things was vaguely neat, since it led to moments like him calling out Infinite for letting Sonic live at this stage and more or less phoning in a boss fight against Classic Sonic. However, considering he's pretty much won this time, the game treated him in a somewhat undersold manner. Like, I get that he had to get serious and the intro nicely establishes this, but much of his trademark motifs and what not are extremely minimal.

Gonna have to stew on Infinite for a while to really have any deep opinion. I'll say this though: his characterization was fine for what he is and he had some good lines(even some comically serious ones), but it really is obvious that whatever they were setting up with him ended up getting unanswered after he ripped off Metal's boss. The DLC was presumably  a factor in that, but it's still pretty bad form after the buildup.

Chaos is really weird in that him being there is fine enough given he's more of a force of nature than a full out character, but the lack of a bossfight or another major scenes with him feels weird. I honestly find myself wondering if they shouldn't have bothered at all.

Speaking of which, Metal Sonic did not need to be in this game. Like, I know that should be specified as the way he was implemented, but really he could've been left out entirely. He adds nothing but a pointless boss fight to the game from what I've seen that only serves to further lessen the impact of Infinite's final scenes.

And finally Zavok. Zavok is another really weird one since, unlike most of the other villains, I was actually mildly interested in what they would do with him so soon after Lost World and to an extent, they did do some things with him. It just so happens that those things are simultaneous more coherent and weirder than Chaos. Like, the fact that they're all illusions obviously screws things up, so there's that. However, in another simultaneous comparison with Tails and Knuckles, it ultimately feels like they both tried to do him justice and overcorrected at the same time. On one hand, he's the only illusion to actually have lines and a clear role as the Death Egg's warden, complete with the implication that he was torturing Sonic("I'll savor your every scream and feast upon your fear.") and having a boss fight --probably the best in the game. But on the other, Sonic completely no sells his actions(which also lead to the confusion as to why Zavok opened the cell the first time) and he & Knuckles make quick work of him in head on fights despite his size and previously notable strength/durability, with the former even knocking him down in the intro.

 

  • Thumbs Up 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, KHCast said:

The same guy said classic sonic and the boost would be retired and yet here we are 

When was it said the boost was being retired? As for Classic they said that years ago and tbh, it was kinda silly. At the end of the day it's just a design, use it for games where it fits (like Mania) and people'll be happy or not care either way.

  • Thumbs Up 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I fee like it could make a lot of money if they did it right though

You could say the same thing about this whole damn franchise.

Unfortunately, there is no "did it right" with Sonic Team. They either take a neat concept and execute it "good enough" and people just learn to settle for that, or they embarrass themselves again and proceed with starting completely over, throwing all potential improvements and learned lessons away in the process.

I'll be generous and say the Avatar managed to land in the "good enough" bin, as in it's not completely broken by any means, but it also doesn't function any better than a third-rate platformer whose shallow mechanics are covered up by a bunch of cinematics and automation. Kinda like the boost gameplay! And since it's considered "good enough", we're likely to never see any real improvements whatsoever. No interesting mechanics that involve the grappling hook. No major improvements regarding the character creator's level of flexibility. Nothing. Just small quality of life improvements from time to time that would have already been implemented in the first place if the concept was being handled by a competent developer, and that's if the Avatar even shows up again.

----------

If you can't tell, I think Forces looks like a big, mediocre poopy pile.

But it's all whatever, honestly. As long as we keep getting games like Mania, games developed by people who seem to have a decent understanding of what made the franchise so charming and fun to play in the first place, then Sonic Team can keep flailing around for as long as they want. It'll be entertaining, at least.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Uhh...not that I disagree that people should be more critical, but where are the people who consider the Avatar gameplay "good enough?"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Celestia said:

When was it said the boost was being retired? As for Classic they said that years ago and tbh, it was kinda silly. At the end of the day it's just a design, use it for games where it fits (like Mania) and people'll be happy or not care either way.

During Gens they were going on about how they wanted to move on from the current modern formula.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Celestia said:

Uhh...not that I disagree that people should be more critical, but where are the people who consider the Avatar gameplay "good enough?"

Look other places than here and you'll find plenty that think it's fantastic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, Celestia said:

Uhh...not that I disagree that people should be more critical, but where are the people who consider the Avatar gameplay "good enough?"

I meant in a general sense regarding mechanics or concepts that have been introduced over the years, not the Avatar specifically. They're "good enough" in the sense that they're not lambasted by critics, but aren't particularly impressive on their own by any means either. I feel like the Avatar will probably fall into that area, since it's just watered down modern Sonic gameplay. Nothing too different.

Most of my post was my own personal thoughts, not an attempt in calling anyone out. Guess it wasn't clear enough.

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, KHCast said:

During Gens they were going on about how they wanted to move on from the current modern formula.

Well yeah... they did. Didn't work out, so they backpedaled.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Has there been any music rip leak so far? 

Because I'm in love with Avatar's Metropolis theme from what I can hear.

Does anyone have a list of how the stages are called? You know, Aqua Road and Sunset Heights and stuff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

You must read and accept our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy to continue using this website. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.