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Sonic Forces Reviews Thread

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Just now, SaberX said:

How so?

Well, it seemed safe to assume that if we got more playable characters it 1) wouldn't be in a boost game and/or 2) it'd just be Tails and maybe Knuckles. And when Forces was first announced (as Project '17) and then we got that first gameplay clip, it looked like the trend was going to continue...and then the Avatar was revealed.

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19 minutes ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

 

Well we'll have a long while to see that day come...

Now that that's brought up, I wonder how people and critics alike are receiving the Shadow DLC. Are they critiquing what he brings to the table as far as game play style goes, or are they rounding him up with the other characters and bashing him because he's part of Sonic's friends? I've yet to see any detail on that yet.

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Less than 8 hours in, and I really think the game is very clunky. I really wanted to love this game, but the controls are stiff, unpredictable, and unresponsive at times. I hate how it’s hard to tell what’s going on at times.

The game has too many parts where you think you have to act fast in order to get stuff done, but you basically have to do nothing to get past it. Yet there are parts where you do have to do something, yet die, because you remember what happened the last time you tried using your instincts. For instance, it took me longer than it should have to beat Zavok. I remember how after each attack pattern, he would fly high, and slam into the ground. The game seemed to imply I’d have to wait for him to get low enough to jump at him, yet everytime I jumped, the camera would shake, and Zavok would start his attack patterns over. It turns out I was supposed to stand to the side, and wait for a quick time event to kick in, to attack him. Because I kept jumping, it cancelled the event, and made it look like the game was acting up.

The levels are too short, and the quick time events get real old upon replaying levels. I will say there are a few levels I found decent, and the visuals are impressive, but a lot of them are forgettable, due to the clunky gameplay. This game is easier to enjoy when taking things slow, vs trying to speed through everything. The game’s unpredictable physics makes it harder than it should be to speed through levels. The extra stages are terrible, and have some lousy platforming collision. It looks like the characters are falling through the platforms, despite their feet touching the top of the ledges. The double jump ruins modern Sonic’s gameplay.

Oddly enough, I’ve enjoyed the Avatar’s gameplay the most. It’s not great, but there are some neat stage designs and music in those stages. So far, I like the cube hammer the most.

I’ve spent most of my time replaying levels for S ranks or mission unlockables, instead of rushing to finish the game. I will admit some levels feel better to replay after remembering how they worked, but the game’s wonky controls and physics seem to vary at times. I don’t hate the game, but I am let down by it. The other characters are still on the sidelines, are still unplayable, and barely do anything. I also really hate what they’ve done with Tails. They made him entirely reliant on Sonic, all he does in this game is whine, or suck up to Sonic. Even Amy has more self control over her obsession with Sonic in this game. It gets real annoying to see Tails thinking no one but Sonic can get things done. He lost all hope until Classic Sonic shows up, it feels so out of character for Tails to not believe in himself or others.

 

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2 minutes ago, ShadowSJG said:

Will this lead to the loss of his friends? I rather like them.

Definitely not. Fans are pretty attached to this cast in general to just completely trash them all forever, and as many bad decisions as SEGA makes I can't see that being one. At worst they'll keep doing what they're doing, i.e. not using them except for special occasions and spin-offs.

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1 minute ago, ShadowSJG said:

How are the controls bad? Don;t they play like modern Sonic in colors/generations/unleashed?

It feels more like Lost World, but with the boost mechanic. The physics are all over the place, and change between levels, sections, and characters without warning.

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Looks like I was wrong about how this game would be received. Forces is getting hammered. Good, I hope that impacts sales - Send Sega a message.

And while I certainly am not fond of Forces, I don't think it deserves a 3/10. God damn, did Boom even get that bad of a review?

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1 hour ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

Literally no one is denying they were badly implemented prior to Unleashed--that was half of my point!

The other half was that the critics either didn't know or didn't care whether it was poor implementation and so used these other characters as a convienent scapegoat to blame a lot of the technical problems on them instead of actually calling out the poor implementation of these characters--essentially saying, "these characters suck, so if they were gone and we played only as Sonic, the games would be good." Now the characters aren't playable, and they still have problems, and it's now that they recognize that it's the implementation of the characters as opposed to the characters entirely.

But Sonic fans recognized this before the critics caught up, and were it not for that misinterpretation of the series problems we wouldn't be in this era of Sonic-only. Whether that would lead to better implementation of them is unknown, but let's not try to paint over the blatant bias that was "Sonic's Shitty Friends" & Knuckles that fans have had issues wih for years. Sure the critics didn't complain about Advance or Rush, but you're talking two obscure handheld series over several major main entry ones.

Well, this is definitely not true. Did critics not note how irritating it was spending an obnoxiously long time in SA2 battle treasure hunting with Knuckles, or how boring Tails mech stages were? Or Silver's crappy gameplay? "Sonic shitty friends" arose directly from his friends shitty implementation and everyone knew it. You slog through the boring parts of those games to eventually get to the fun Sonic parts. Its why SEGA went "Overboard" as many modern fans seem to believe and cut the extra playable characters and eventually alternative styles. Like, there's an entire history documenting this, how can anyone not know this by now? No one just randomly starting picking on his friends for no reason, that is complete ignorance. Even Takashi Iizuka commented on this history a few months ago in an interview detailed SEGA's response to people openly stating how polarizing the alternative gameplay styles were to Sonic's core gameplay even back in the adventure days and that they would probably not do that again.

Even with that you still have fans whining about their favorite characters not being included, no matter how much their design would drag the gameplay down. You can't just slap a character like Knuckles into a 3D space without considering how it'll affect the overall gameplay. They tried to do that with Adventure...and it didn't work.

And yet again, we STILL have fans screaming at the top of their lungs about not getting playable characters, regardless of how they affect the quality of the gameplay.

 

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17 minutes ago, SpongicX said:

I also really hate what they’ve done with Tails. They made him entirely reliant on Sonic, all he does in this game is whine, or suck up to Sonic. Even Amy has more self control over her obsession with Sonic in this game. It gets real annoying to see Tails thinking no one but Sonic can get things done. He lost all hope until Classic Sonic shows up, it feels so out of character for Tails to not believe in himself or others.

Oh Christ I never even thought of it like that. He really has become even more clingy than Amy. I mean I honestly liked that about Amy as it's basically the reverse of the damsel/hero trope (At least when they don't take it too far into annoying territory). I vastly prefered that Amy to.....the Amy who is completely inoffensive and not really interesting in any particular way.

But yeah Tails is a Sonic fanboy through and through....but dang it's far more subdue than this normally. I mean by Colors he sorta basically has seen everything and admires Sonic, and is no longer impressed by him as much. Which was an interesting take on their friendship....but this.....ugh....

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5 minutes ago, UpCDownCLeftCRightC said:

Well, this is definitely not true. Did critics not note how irritating it was spending an obnoxiously long time in SA2 battle treasure hunting with Knuckles, or how boring Tails mech stages were? Or Silver's crappy gameplay? "Sonic shitty friends" arose directly from his friends shitty implementation and everyone knew it. You slog through the boring parts of those games to eventually get to the fun Sonic parts. Its why SEGA went "Overboard" as many modern fans seem to believe and cut the extra playable characters and eventually alternative styles. Like, there's an entire history documenting this, how can anyone not know this by now? No one just randomly starting picking on his friends for no reason, that is complete ignorance. Even Takashi Iizuka commented on this history a few months ago in an interview detailed SEGA's response to people openly stating how polarizing the alternative gameplay styles were to Sonic's core gameplay even back in the adventure days and that they would probably not do that again.

Which makes you wonder why they have tried going the Advance/Rush formula with alternate characters given that they seemed to be well-received.

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2 hours ago, RedFox99 said:

Which makes you wonder why they have tried going the Advance/Rush formula with alternate characters given that they seemed to be well-received.

And that they did the same alternate gameplay, but with only Sonic. And they created NPC characters who were even worse than the existing ex-playables.

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Metro.co.uk review: "Sonic is fast and will leave you furious"

Quote

In Short: Whoever this shoddily made platformer is meant to please it won’t be those that like Sonic Mania, or any of the better 3D Sonic games.

Pros: The avatar customisation is very impressive and clearly knows its audience. As flawed as the game is it’s not outright broken, unlike many previous Sonic titles.

Cons: Barely interactive level design that has learnt nothing from the franchise’s better entries. Clumsy, frictionless controls and weird storytelling tone.

Score: 4/10

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6 hours ago, UpCDownCLeftCRightC said:

Knuckles was not a throw away in mania. In particular he had one of the best levels in the game and many unique routes in many others accessible with his abilities only. You may not be overly impressed with Mania but don't overly reduce what was cleanly executed.

Also, the entire point of Mania was to reintroduce a precise, unique style that had been absent for 20 years. Nostalgia and "copy paste" were the main selling point because many had forgotten what the original gameplay was like. It was even part of the advertising for the game. Remembering what made Sonic great. 

You're also severely underselling Christian Whitehead''s retro engine. He didn't just port the game's physics over; he and the Team literally recreated everything from scratch and added a crapton of new content. It's why it's sitting at 86% on metacritic right now...as opposed to this.

EDIT:Sorry for the late response. Bad connection.

I messed up on the editing in my post and accidentally sent something I didn't mean to(bad internet=less likely to edit sooner before the damage is done). Definitely my fault entirely on Mario's post...No excuse there.

But since I opened up these cans of worms...

Quote

 Knuckles was not a throw away in mania. In particular he had one of the best levels in the game and many unique routes in many others accessible with his abilities only. You may not be overly impressed with Mania but don't overly reduce what was cleanly executed.

I'm not giving Taxman a pass because of his efforts. I think Unleashed is one of the best, if not the highest quality Sonic games. Even more work was put into that game(not to demystify Taxman's work). Yet because of my analytical nature I do have to make my criticisms, even harsh ones all due to it bringing some of the flaws from past games.  It happened with Sonic 3k, another personal favorite I loved dearly growing up and stil do. I've praised the immense much of the work in all of these games in the past..I cannot praise Taxman, Yuji Naka and Hashimoto enough.

There must come a point where I express my dislike. Can't romanticize something forever. It won't typically break my enjoyment of the product once I quit my love affairs with it:P

I admit, "Throwaway" wasn't the best way in putting it. I was brutal sounding and wasn't descriptive on what I meant.

The correct word would be "Conservative". The innovation to characters like Knuckles, compared to his debut was lacking in giving him interesting abilities to traverse the stages.

I understand wanting to keep it within the spirit while peaking outside the box a little. But with he level of skill he and his team inhabits, I was not amused with the level of reused concepts already done before.  Knuckles having his own journey throughout the game is an appreciated thought and well in execution!

...Just that Knuckles himself isn't particularly an interesting character to play as. He still is ineffective with using the shield abilities(come on guys) a very slow glide and a slow climb. I don't understand this specific appeal to this dull character(other than his glide cancel to spin dash but that got messed up by adding more animation frames. He can't do it as well as before). He literally can't do any sort of action that further encapsulate my interest. The Advance series at least go it right by giving him something that compliments him(spin dash on walls is very cool, I admit). Tails also suffers form this the same way as knuckles but benefits more all due to his flying being much faster than Knuckles. If Sonic can get a completely new move

Quote

Nostalgia and "copy paste" were the main selling point because many had forgotten what the original gameplay was like.

So we heavily criticize other games in the series for doing this, like forces, but we cannot look at Mania with a critical eye either? Why should this game get a special treatment just because it has "Classic" written all over it?

Quote

It was even part of the advertising for the game. Remembering what made Sonic great. 

Sonic was great for breaking the technological boundaries of the genesis and providing a new era of video games we've never seen before. Taxman actually did this somewhat with his new and innovative engine. Can't deny what he did and his team was an incredible that should not be overlooked.

Quote

You're also severely underselling Christian Whitehead''s retro engine. He didn't just port the game's physics over; he and the Team literally recreated everything from scratch and added a crapton of new content. It's why it's sitting at 86% on metacritic right now...as opposed to this.

I'm judging the content in which I have obtained. Read above.

6 hours ago, Super Mechanio said:

Furthermore, I believe this is the ideal blueprint for how to offer variety of gameplay in a 3D space as well. Instead of the old "genre roulette" approach, why not just have selectable (and optional) characters that you can choose between for the same levels as Sonic? The stages would be the same, but how you approached those stages would be greatly affected by who you were playing as.

Advance 3. Which is what I've been saying for the longest time if you want more than 3 characters in a Sonic game.

Ocean Base can be skipped by over a minute if you use Knuckles and Amy for his Wall Spin Dashing ability.

Or how about Advance 1 like with Amy? She's complex enough to make the game entirely different.

Quote

You may not be overly impressed with Mania but don't overly reduce what was cleanly executed.

I am impressed. Highly impressed. Blew me away when I found out that the Megamix guy did this but my honeymoon phase, alas, is over and it's time for this game to get pushed in.

"Cleanly Executed" you say..

I don't think the story of the game constitutes as "clean" nor it's other flaws.

6 hours ago, Super Mechanio said:

Tails' flight and Knuckles' climbing/shorter jump/gliding/wall breaking abilities are a master class of how different characters make a difference in how the game is played. This opens up options for not only general play, but branching and intertwining paths and shortcuts, mostly exclusive especially in Knuckles' case; if you removed these guys from the game Mania would fundamentally be a lesser game because of it. There'd be less replay value, less level to explore, and overall less game to play. 

Quote

I admit, "Throwaway" wasn't the best way in putting it. I was brutal sounding and wasn't descriptive on what I meant.

The correct word would be "Conservative". The innovation to characters like Knuckles, compared to his debut was lacking in giving him interesting abilities to traverse the stages.

The exploration is a little meaningless to me. I don't care for searching for the chaos emeralds for 7 more times after doing it 14 times in 3K(It was bad there too but I love those new bonus stages so I sorta now have to now). Further more; Mania acts like a sequel to Sonic CD. I have a lot of qualms with CD and it's why the level design seems more confusing 

PQauaRv.jpg

I think this is a fun stage but like all of the CD inspired stages(many of them) they just throw you all around till you find a running path and throw you around some more. Too big for a simple stage from the original that had perfect flow.

6 hours ago, SonicLegends said:

t's at times like these with mentioning other characters I really wish that Heroes would have been the style that they would have done going forward and improving upon it like with the controls because learning curve for those is high. I actually hated the game as a kid because I couldn't get a handle of the controls, but after revisiting and as a more experienced gamer I actually like it more than the Adventure games, especially since it has aged better (that isn't to say the game doesn't have its problems like Egg Emperor's bs charge when in the middle of launching threw the air to move on making for a cheap death).

Heroes had some surprising depth. 

That game holds up the best of of Adventure 1 and 2. Though SA2 wasn't bad either since it aged decently.

I prefer the why of physics and control of the adventure games compared to Heroes but Heroes managed to be fleshed out more(and had a mix of Adventure/Adventure 2 level design. It was great).

 

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7 hours ago, Jar Jar Analysis 1138 said:

EDIT:Sorry for the late response. Bad connection.

I messed up on the editing in my post and accidentally sent something I didn't mean to(bad internet=less likely to edit sooner before the damage is done). Definitely my fault entirely on Mario's post...No excuse there.

But since I opened up these cans of worms...

I'm not giving Taxman a pass because of his efforts. I think Unleashed is one of the best, if not the highest quality Sonic games. Even more work was put into that game(not to demystify Taxman's work). Yet because of my analytical nature I do have to make my criticisms, even harsh ones all due to it bringing some of the flaws from past games.  It happened with Sonic 3k, another personal favorite I loved dearly growing up and stil do. I've praised the immense much of the work in all of these games in the past..I cannot praise Taxman, Yuji Naka and Hashimoto enough.

There must come a point where I express my dislike. Can't romanticize something forever. It won't typically break my enjoyment of the product once I quit my love affairs with it:P

I admit, "Throwaway" wasn't the best way in putting it. I was brutal sounding and wasn't descriptive on what I meant.

The correct word would be "Conservative". The innovation to characters like Knuckles, compared to his debut was lacking in giving him interesting abilities to traverse the stages.

I understand wanting to keep it within the spirit while peaking outside the box a little. But with he level of skill he and his team inhabits, I was not amused with the level of reused concepts already done before.  Knuckles having his own journey throughout the game is an appreciated thought and well in execution!

...Just that Knuckles himself isn't particularly an interesting character to play as. He still is ineffective with using the shield abilities(come on guys) a very slow glide and a slow climb. I don't understand this specific appeal to this dull character(other than his glide cancel to spin dash but that got messed up by adding more animation frames. He can't do it as well as before). He literally can't do any sort of action that further encapsulate my interest. The Advance series at least go it right by giving him something that compliments him(spin dash on walls is very cool, I admit). Tails also suffers form this the same way as knuckles but benefits more all due to his flying being much faster than Knuckles. If Sonic can get a completely new move

So we heavily criticize other games in the series for doing this, like forces, but we cannot look at Mania with a critical eye either? Why should this game get a special treatment just because it has "Classic" written all over it?

Sonic was great for breaking the technological boundaries of the genesis and providing a new era of video games we've never seen before. Taxman actually did this somewhat with his new and innovative engine. Can't deny what he did and his team was an incredible that should not be overlooked.

I'm judging the content in which I have obtained. Read above.

Advance 3. Which is what I've been saying for the longest time if you want more than 3 characters in a Sonic game.

Ocean Base can be skipped by over a minute if you use Knuckles and Amy for his Wall Spin Dashing ability.

Or how about Advance 1 like with Amy? She's complex enough to make the game entirely different.

I am impressed. Highly impressed. Blew me away when I found out that the Megamix guy did this but my honeymoon phase, alas, is over and it's time for this game to get pushed in.

"Cleanly Executed" you say..

I don't think the story of the game constitutes as "clean" nor it's other flaws.

The exploration is a little meaningless to me. I don't care for searching for the chaos emeralds for 7 more times after doing it 14 times in 3K(It was bad there too but I love those new bonus stages so I sorta now have to now). Further more; Mania acts like a sequel to Sonic CD. I have a lot of qualms with CD and it's why the level design seems more confusing 

PQauaRv.jpg

I think this is a fun stage but like all of the CD inspired stages(many of them) they just throw you all around till you find a running path and throw you around some more. Too big for a simple stage from the original that had perfect flow.

Heroes had some surprising depth. 

That game holds up the best of of Adventure 1 and 2. Though SA2 wasn't bad either since it aged decently.

I prefer the why of physics and control of the adventure games compared to Heroes but Heroes managed to be fleshed out more(and had a mix of Adventure/Adventure 2 level design. It was great).

 

This was honestly a good read and most walls if text make me just scroll to the last line

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I'm surprised how wrong I was about how this game would be received. It's so good to see this game get such low reviews. Even if Sega prioritizes sales over reviews, hopefully these reviews influence sales significantly enough for Sega to take notice and change the direction of the series.

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3 hours ago, Mayor D said:

That's the IGN Italy review, here's the Spain review: http://es.ign.com/sonic-forces-ps4/125380/review/sonic-forces-analisis-multiplataforma

Raging Gazebo review: "New allies, same old tricks"

Quote

Sonic Forces doesn’t add any game changing mechanics or carve a new path for the series, but rather contributes enhanced next-gen visuals, an extra playable character and a cliché, yet dark take on the Hedgehog’s franchise storyline. While the same formula of 2D and 3D camera perspectives mixes for the same results as its precursor, Sonic Forces still provides thrilling ride for the short duration of its linear story.

In a year where classic platforming stars are making their impeccably timed comeback (looking at you Crash BandicootBubsy and that Mario guy), Sonic already experienced his days of glory once this year in Sonic Mania; twice seems to be just too far out of reach for the modernized blue hedgehog to keep up.

Score: C+

GamesRadar review: "A short game of short levels, yet desperately short of real ideas"

Quote

Sonic Forces has one defence; that it’s a great-looking, fan-serving, accessible Sonic for the hedgehog’s younger audience. With Sonic Mania pitched as the Sonic for real gamers, that’s all it needs to be. Well, that’s not good enough. Sonic’s younger fans deserve a game with more imagination and more chance to discover, learn and build their Sonic skills, and the Mario series shows it’s possible to do this in a game that appeals to fans both young and old. Sonic Forces does not.

Sonic Forces is a spectacular but empty sugar rush that’s over in a blur. Once again, Sonic’s return to form falls flat.

Score: 2.5/5

----

Current aggregate metascores:

OpenCritic: 54 "Weak" (10 reviews)

Metacritic: 55 (Switch, 6 reviews), 53 (PS4, 7 reviews)

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