So..its no longer "classic" sonic. Smart??

[antyep]

maybe classic caused a alternate future back in gen like Trunks

[Razule]

1 hour ago, antyep said:

maybe classic caused a alternate future back in gen like Trunks

No, Modern was never Classic now

On 12/11/2017 at 9:03 AM, DoubleXXCross said:

 

In any case I think it's pretty obvious that Classic was supposed to 'grow' into Modern simply because the game is about time-travelling through the history of the Sonic franchise. It was never meant to be visually literal, and Classic Sonic is not meant to be a child version of Modern (any more than Modern Sonic is himself a child); but Classic being Modern's actual past self in Generations is not just logical but the only conclusion one can draw from:

• Sonic: Is it me, or is that place we were just in awfully familiar?
• Tails: This Chemical Plant feels familiar. I'd never forget a smell like this! And that pink water makes me really nervous for some reason.
  Sonic: You're right Tails, this place is giving me deja vu all over again!
• Amy: Thank you, Sonic. Wow, you look younger every day! What's your secret?
• Modern Tails: Places and enemies from our past...
  Both Tails: We're travelling through time and space!
• Classic Tails: When that thing goes through time—
• Modern Tails: When the Sonics accelerate through time—
• Classic Eggman: If you would be so kind as to explain, gentleman genius Dr. Eggman From The Future.
• Classic Eggman: Oh, you are too kind, my dear future self!
• Modern Sonic: Hey Sonic! Enjoy your future. It's gonna be great!

Oh, right, and the enemy is called the Time Eater and appears during an event (Sonic's birthday/Sonic's anniversary) that explicitly marks the passage of time. Let's not forget that.

Well.. yeah, Generations says Classic Sonic is past Sonic, no arguing that.

Actually.. maybe SEGA wanted both designs to be in their own timeless bubbles. Classic growing into Modern implies Classic Sonic is ephemeral. And he kinda was considering he only lasted seven years

[King Scoopa Koopa]

I thought it interesting that there were a lot of familiar yet different things in Forces. Stuff like Chemical Plant, and even Badniks (plus maybe the Death Egg interior) were sort of like the Classic stuff, but not to the degree it was in Generations. Metropolis was there, too, but looked nothing like in Sonic 2. 

So "the same but different histories" seems like what we might be dealing with now?

As noted above, both Tails mention time AND space being altered; maybe (even as a retcon) Modern Sonic's versions of past levels reflect his version of history (previously unseen to us), and Classic Sonic's post-Genesis stuff -- even funky stuff like the skateboard in City Escape -- are from a future in his world yet to be (and maybe never to again be) seen.

The past/future thing could hold as well; Classic Sonic (and associates) being plucked from the era of the earlier games, while Modern Sonic had been through everything up to that point.

It's bending and stretching what we've seen to a point that no one would ever think it was originally intended as such, but still kind of workable. 

[Almar]

Sonic Adventure referenced the Classic games repeatedly. Just call it a retcon and carry on.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

Come to think of it, the different worlds thing would explain the vastly different Master Emerald shrines.

[Almar]

Again, Adventure  has references to Classic Sonic's games (see Amy's flashback, Knuckles being tricked again, Classic Eggman in Hedgehog Hammer). And there were Adventure models for Sonic and Tails that were more like their Classic versions.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

Oh, I didn't realize that was a direct response to my statement.

I don't see the problem? Particularly if the argument is that Modern Sonic has been through a lot of what Classic Sonic has, but in different ways, then it makes sense there could and would be such a flashback.

Frankly, I'd think Episode Metal from Sonic 4 would provide more of a sticking point, what with the scene from Sonic CD, but even then...

I mean, it's like the comic reboot. We saw some things were the same, but different slightly:

In this case, instead of time being rewritten, it's a different universe.

I mean, the Ghostbusters and Real Ghostbusters both fought Gozer, but their worlds are pretty different. Transformers have had their war and fought Unicron in different ways and styles across multiple universes. Or heck, the same things that have happened in different ways between the Sonic comics and games, or comics and cartoons, or comics and comics, or games and cartoons. Sonic X isn't the game universe, but Sonic Adventure (and 2) still happened.

This would just be another instance of that.

[castell-neath]

Maybe Sega are going all Star Trek Discovery on us.....

The USs Discovery looks like it can jump between alternate universes AND time at the same time using the spore drive.

 

Maybe this phantom rugby does the same...forces is the future for classic sonic...just not his universe's future.

This would also explain boom!!

[Diogenes]

7 hours ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

Come to think of it, the different worlds thing would explain the vastly different Master Emerald shrines.

We don't need two different continuities to explain that. There's the ancient shrine we see in SA and the less ancient shrine we see in 3&K. At some point after Chaos wiped out the echidnas the less ancient shrine was made and the Master Emerald was moved there, and between 3&K and SA Knuckles moved it back.

e: well I guess Knuckles moved it after Mania, now. Or would have if not for this multidimensional bullshit.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

24 minutes ago, castell-neath said:

phantom rugby

This may be my new favorite typo of all time, and I only wish now that there was some sort of visual representation of it.

8 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

We don't need two different continuities to explain that. There's the ancient shrine we see in SA and the less ancient shrine we see in 3&K. At some point after Chaos wiped out the echidnas the less ancient shrine was made and the Master Emerald was moved there, and between 3&K and SA Knuckles moved it back.

We don't need it, no; we've managed fine to this point without it. But it's still a pretty simple explanation now that lends a nice distinction between the two worlds.

[Razule]

Pretty sure Hidden Palace was just retconned out of existence in Adventure, like a bunch of other things 

[King Scoopa Koopa]

Didn't Mania bring it back, though?

[Darth InVaders]

Possibility: They altered the timeline in Sonic Generations. Classic Sonic used to be the past version of Modern Sonic, but after Generations when Classic returned to the past, they started doing things differently creating a tangent timeline - a different dimension. So Modern Sonic still has a version of Classic Sonic in his past, but the current Classic Sonic split from that version. When Modern Sonic was still Classic Sonic, he did not experience what the current Classic Sonic experienced in Generations or Forces, and Modern Sonic never experienced the events in Mania at all.

[Salamander]

Then how did Tails and Eggman instantly recognise Classic Sonic as being from another dimension, when on their previous meeting they recognised Classic as a past Sonic?  The sticking point for any timeline-branching theory is that Generations itself has also been retconned.

[Razule]

2 hours ago, FFWF said:

Then how did Tails and Eggman instantly recognise Classic Sonic as being from another dimension, when on their previous meeting they recognised Classic as a past Sonic?  The sticking point for any timeline-branching theory is that Generations itself has also been retconned.

Generations is canon, there was no timeline splitting. Sonic was the past then, he's from another dimension now. Gotta change a few lines to make Generations make sense

[Salamander]

Or, better yet, change a few lines to make Forces make sense...

[Razule]

6 minutes ago, FFWF said:

Or, better yet, change a few lines to make Forces make sense...

Next anniversary. Or better yet..

"Hey! You're Sonic's twin brother!" Then he can appear in every game~

19 hours ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

Didn't Mania bring it back, though?

Classic dimension (Hidden Palace)

Modern dimension (Altar Emerald)

[King Scoopa Koopa]

...but that's what I said in the first place. You said Hidden Palace was retconned out:

23 hours ago, Razule said:

Pretty sure Hidden Palace was just retconned out of existence in Adventure, like a bunch of other things 

 

 

[Razule]

19 hours ago, KingScoopaKoopa said:

...but that's what I said in the first place. You said Hidden Palace was retconned out:

 

 

Well, yeah, but back in Adventure, there was only one canon. It just stopped existing instead of existing somewhere else.