Mario Bros. Animated Movie Coming from Illumination

[StaticMania]

14 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Movies are supposed to tell an enthralling story and if you fail at that, your missing the point of the medium.

This kind of ignores the fact that not every movie tries to do that anyway.

Some are just looking to entertain purely on spectacle and/or comedy.

---

Literally any medium can tell stories and every one of them has a variety of ways to tell them.

It's only because this is a video game movie that this even matters that much. It didn't fall into a unique pitfall of storytelling, it's the same problem it could've had even if this was telling an original story.

[JezMM]

I don't think there's that much to worry about with copycats.  Mario is in a pretty unique position to be a franchise with as much stuff to reference as it does while also being so incredibly well-known across generations.  It's no surprise that, regarding referencing modern Mario games, there's a focus on New Super Mario Bros. and Super Mario 3D World elements - y'know, the multiplayer ones that all generations have played together.

Like, if you did what Mario did here with Sonic, all the parents would be scared and confused the moment they were done referencing Green Hill Zone and the rest of the film would be for kids and Sonic nerds only.  Fortunately it weaves into the plot nicely, but nobody except us knew that there was anything to be excited about when Guardian Unit of Nations popped up in Sonic 2.  But everyone and their dad (literally, that's the point) knows what Mario Kart is, probably even stuff like Cat Mario too.

[batson]

It's honestly a real shame that it just so happaned that the live action Sonic movie came out before the animated Mario movie. If the Mario movie had come out first, like before the live action Sonic movie was even in production, then it's very likely that Sega would have had the bravery to actually attempt an animated Sonic movie instead of a live action one. That would just have been so infinitely preferable to the Sonic movies we've noe ended up with. There is litterally no reason at all to present the Sonic universe in live action. The only reason Sega did it was because at the time the movie started production, the safest bet in terms of box office seemed to be the "well known cartoon character in a real life setting where we can make both silly jokes for the kids and jokes that relate to actual adult life that the parents can enjoy"-genre. I bet a fully animated Sonic movie would have  seemed like too much of a gamble since they were probably afraid of losing the parental crowd if they went with that. If only the Mario movie, bland in terms of actual content or not, would have come out first and showed that making a video game movie that actually looks and feels like the games can pay off.

And I mean yeah, sure, the Sonic series isn't nearly as well known or beloved as the Mario series, but I still think an animated Sonic movie with faithfullness to it's source material could have made money.

[Dr. Mechano]

It still can make money. I don't think these live-action Sonics are the last time the series will make movies.

We just have to wait until Sega and Paramount's partnership expires, but I'm almost certain that their next movie project will be more akin to this.

[Sonicka]

Actually, I might disagree on that point. I think it made a lot more sense for SEGA to go down the Live Action Sonic Movie route.

Unlike Mario, Sonic is already inundated with lots of animated adaptions over the last 25 years, as such there isn’t really anything that they could have done (like the Mario Movie) to make Sonic stand out from the crowd of SatAM, AoSTH, Sonic Underground, Sonic The Movie, Sonic X, Sonic Boom & Sonic Prime etc… in a cartoon Movieverse. 

The Mario Movie plays it safe with a threadbare plot but nostalgia riddled Easter eggs because it can. And good for it.

Arguably I’d say Sonic doesn’t quite have the same luxury of benefits. So (for me at least) this is why I enjoy those live action films a lot more - it did it’s own thing, in its own way AND had the sprinkling of Easter Eggs for the more Hardcore of followers to enjoy (but not at the detriment of the regular movie goer).

[Rabbitearsblog]

5 hours ago, Sonicka said:

Actually, I might disagree on that point. I think it made a lot more sense for SEGA to go down the Live Action Sonic Movie route.

Unlike Mario, Sonic is already inundated with lots of animated adaptions over the last 25 years, as such there isn’t really anything that they could have done (like the Mario Movie) to make Sonic stand out from the crowd of SatAM, AoSTH, Sonic Underground, Sonic The Movie, Sonic X, Sonic Boom & Sonic Prime etc… in a cartoon Movieverse. 

The Mario Movie plays it safe with a threadbare plot but nostalgia riddled Easter eggs because it can. And good for it.

Arguably I’d say Sonic doesn’t quite have the same luxury of benefits. So (for me at least) this is why I enjoy those live action films a lot more - it did it’s own thing, in its own way AND had the sprinkling of Easter Eggs for the more Hardcore of followers to enjoy (but not at the detriment of the regular movie goer).

I agree with this too.  We've had so many animated adaptations of Sonic over the years that making a live action version of the character was actually new grounds for the franchise at the time.  

[StaticMania]

It's not like we were gonna get a live action tv series at any point...

A fully animated movie...feature length is still new ground for the series that has yet to be done.

[batson]

As much as I still dislike the fact that the Sonic movies are live action, I will say that I'm willing to look past that aspect of the movies if the series could actually evolve into being good. The first Sonic movie was just an absolute lowest-common-denominator comedy family movie and the second movie, while I did appreciate that it steered the series into more action-adventure territory, felt really unfocused and shallow. I hope that the adition of Shadow and his backstory in the third movie will push the series into being a little bit more ambitious.

Same with the Mario movie series (I mean don't we all already know that there is gonna be more?). As much as I dislike how much they've screwed up Mario as a character and made him a bland normie instead of a lovable hyper positive manchild, I'll probably be willing to look past that if the following movies at least tell good stories.

But still... man, as both a Mario fan and a Sonic fan it stings how Hollywood bastardized the main characters of both franchises, turning Mario into what I just described him as, and turning Sonic into some love-starved insecure clown. Modern Hollywood just can't concieve of the idea of having a main characters that aren't "relatable", a stand in for the audience that makes them say "yeah, that's pretty much me!". Sidecharacters can be as eccentric as possible, but the main character always have to be a to some extant a "normal" guy/girl. Hollywood should take notice from anime, where characters like Goku and Luffy are the polar opposites of regular people, and where part of the appeal of watching the series is because our main focus is an impossible fantasy of a person who stands out from everyone else in their universe.

[SticksSuperFan14]

I feel like the filmmakers taking notes from the Mario RPGs could've helped make the plot better, and I don't just mean cameos or references, but like giving a the film a similar scale to those games. I imagine DreamWorks maybe could've pushed for this sort of thing, but even then something tells me Nintendo would push back on it as they don't seem to like telling complex stories with Mario anymore.

[Rabbitearsblog]

2 minutes ago, SticksSuperFan14 said:

I feel like the filmmakers taking notes from the Mario RPGs could've helped make the plot better, and I don't just mean cameos or references, but like giving a the film a similar scale to those games. I imagine DreamWorks maybe could've pushed for this sort of thing, but even then something tells me Nintendo would push back on it as they don't seem to like telling complex stories with Mario anymore.

I think that could be Nintendo's undoing in regard to the Mario movies in the near future.  The thing about films is that yes, you don't necessarily have to have a deep plot to make a film enjoyable to watch.  But, movies rely on storytelling to keep the audience invested and if Nintendo up and decided that none of the upcoming Mario movies will have any kind of plot or nothing in the plot that will make the audience clutch onto the characters, then the Mario movies could easily go downhill from this point forward.

[The Deleter]

https://deadline.com/2023/04/box-office-super-mario-bros-movie-air-amazon-ben-affleck-1235318951/

Quote

SATURDAY PM: "It's still growing tonight" says one rival studio source tonight who happens to be watching the swelling late night ticket sales for Illumination/Universal's Super Mario Bros Movie which clocked a $56M Saturday (+2% over Friday), for what is now a $146M 3-day, a massive $33,1K theater average, and a record 5-day of –wow– $204.2M according to industry figures tonight. That kicks Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen's $200M Wednesday-Sunday opening to second place. Among Easter weekend openings, Super Mario Bros ranks as third behind 2016's Batman vs. Superman ($181M) and 2015's Furious 7's $161M.
If overseas is still at $173M, then the new global opening record for an animated movie set by Super Mario Bros is $377.2M.

And it's still going...

[batson]

2 hours ago, The Deleter said:

https://deadline.com/2023/04/box-office-super-mario-bros-movie-air-amazon-ben-affleck-1235318951/

And it's still going...

Believe it nor not, but even as someone who dislikes the movie, I actually do still appreciate seeing the success of it, since what it truly signals is just how much the world loves Mario. Mario, as a character and a series, just needs to show up and people line up. Video games are such an unerapreciated medium compared to for instance movies and TV since not everybpdy plays video games (at least other than simple mobile games like, I dunno, Candy Crush). But nearly everyone has some kind of relation to Mario. Whether it be that they played the games as a child, or that they play Mario Kart as a start up activity to a house party, or even just that they watch their own children play the games, everybody knows what Mario is about and that it signals innocent childlike joy.

I often marvel at just how unique a position the Mario series hold within the field of video games. Mario is both the most beloved franchise, the most famous franchise (only rivaled by Pokémon), is often considered the best franchise (only rivaled by The Legend of Zelda) and also by far the most revolutionary franchise in terms of how many times it has revolutionized gaming while inventing entire genres through it's spin-off's in the process. The original Donkey Kong invented the platform genre and introduced the idea of video games having a story, Super Mario Bros defined the platform genre and in the process other side-scrolling games and also defined how jumping physics work in video games, Super Mario 64 utterly defined how not just 3D platform games but just plain 3D games in general should work, including it's revolutionary controls and camera. And in his spare time away from platforming the pesky plumber introduced the world to combatative, weapons-based kart racing and later to whatever you want to call the Mario Party genre.

And as for the quality of the games, I think it's almost unreal to think that the game series whose new main installments always ended up on lists of "best games of the year" in the 1980's still ends up on similar lists whenever a new main series installment are released today. Zelda regularly manages that feat as well, but other than that Mario is in a league of his own.

The actual praise for all this of course goes to Shigeru Miyamoto and his colleagues. I know this might sound hyperbolic but I say Miyamoto is a genius within his artform in the exact same way that Bach was in his. This leaves video games as an artform in a very unique place among artforms; it's foremost genius is still alove and active today. It's as if Bach was still around to write and release new music.

All in all, Mario as a video game franchise truly deserves the love it gets from the global population, and the fact that this loves radiates so strongly that even a bland Illumination movie becames a huge success by doing basically nothing more than reminding people of the video games is actually kinda beautiful.

 

[MetalSkulkBane]

Much worse Illumination movies made much more money. It's a safe bet that Mario will be at least 500M,

[DaBigJ]

To nobody's surprise, Mario is doing quite good

Even passed Frozen 2 for the highest box office opening for animated movies! Very impressive stuff!

[Rabbitearsblog]

Eh, not really surprised it's doing well. It's Mario and Illumination after all.

[Chili Dawg]

Was a ton of fun. Not gonna convert nonbelievers, but Mario is Mario- most of the audience is already somewhat pious. I get why critics aren't keen on it, but I also don't really care about any of that. Start to finish was just pure fun and at the end of the day that is what Mario is about.

[Red Hot Jack]

15 hours ago, DaBigJ said:

To nobody's surprise, Mario is doing quite good

Even passed Frozen 2 for the highest box office opening for animated movies! Very impressive stuff!

Fans are glad the Mario movie is better than both Sonic movies.

Meanwhile I'm just here to say Mario dethroning Frozen 2 at the box office records is deserved. 

I don't like Mario vs Sonic arguments, even though comparisons are kind of a given at this point, but personally speaking Frozen 2 was really dull and empty, it made all that money because the first Frozen was better and was liked a lot.

That said, I haven't watched Mario yet (this wednesday I will), but the Sonic movie stories were pretty good to be honest. Of course I would prefer an animated movie with the game cast instead of half of the cast made up by humans, if they can get it right like the live action ones... okay it will be even better.

[Rabbitearsblog]

11 hours ago, Red Hot Jack said:

Fans are glad the Mario movie is better than both Sonic movies.

Meanwhile I'm just here to say Mario dethroning Frozen 2 at the box office records is deserved. 

I don't like Mario vs Sonic arguments, even though comparisons are kind of a given at this point, but personally speaking Frozen 2 was really dull and empty, it made all that money because the first Frozen was better and was liked a lot.

That said, I haven't watched Mario yet (this wednesday I will), but the Sonic movie stories were pretty good to be honest. Of course I would prefer an animated movie with the game cast instead of half of the cast made up by humans, if they can get it right like the live action ones... okay it will be even better.

I don't care much for the Mario vs Sonic arguments either.  They both have really good movies, so why drive a wedge between these two properties again?  After seeing the Mario movie, I'm looking forward to Sonic 3 now more than ever and I hope that it's a really good film. It doesn't have to make big money like the Mario movie is doing now. It just needs to be a good movie.

[Shiny Gems]

Did anyone post this yet? If not, anyone want some Peaches?

 

[Soniman]

Honestly going into this movie you get exactly what you expect. This movie is a Mario movie, probably the most accurate 1:1 conversion from console to movie I’ve ever seen. It’s literally a movie version of the games you played, and like the game they’re narratively simple but a lot of fun, I think it did exactly what it needed to do. 
 

it’s not perfect, pacing is to fast and the listened music usage is inappropriate, specifically take on me (mostly because we were robbed of DKC music) but I really do t have any major hang ups. Characters were on point though Peach could’ve used tweaking I’ll admit, voices range from decent to pretty good across the board, it looks really good and extremely accurate.

Yeah idk I was never bored or not entertained watching the movie, it’s just fun. Very safe but in a less bland way than something like the first Sonic Movie. I think Sonic Movie 2 has lower lows but higher highs than this which was a consistently above average experience from beginning to end. But I enjoy all these movies at the end of the day so it’s not a big deal.

Good movie, I get why critics didn’t get much out of it but if you like Mario it’s a pretty easy sell 

 

 

[batson]

On 4/11/2023 at 4:02 AM, ShinyGems said:

Did anyone post this yet? If not, anyone want some Peaches?

Bowser's love ballad to Peach winning an oscar is something I could actually get behind. The song is pretty good. And it would be kinda funny if the movie, despite its negative critical reviews, would end up having to be refered to as an academy award winning film.

[DaBigJ]

Mario has become THE Video Game movie

[Rabbitearsblog]

1 hour ago, DaBigJ said:

Mario has become THE Video Game movie

I thought that Warcraft is still the highest grossing video game movie.

[StaticMania]

I don't usually propose "fixes" for things, but after a bit of time away from the movie and not really expressing positive feelings by talking about it...I want to address my problems with the movie in the form of "fixes" but still working 'mostly' with what the movie gives us.

Removals:

Spoiler

Remove Mario wanting his dad's approval, what is normally a fairly standard motivation has a pretty average setup and a weak payoff.

Remove the concept of Mario bringing down Luigi, this point never really goes anywhere and only has a single flash back to its name, which of course could easily be reframed to fit a different context.

Remove Brooklyn going through a flood, this pretty much just served as the inciting incident that leads to Mario & Luigi getting sucked into the Mushroom Kingdom, but...it never comes back at all, which wouldn't be a problem if we never actually went back to Brooklyn and it wasn't framed as a serious conflict.

Remove Donkey Kong's daddy issues as well, this one has almost no setup and an even weaker payoff.

Remove Mario's aversion to mushrooms, this is less of a fix really and a personal pet peeve of mine in adaptations like this. It's one of those meta jokes where an iconic element of the series is disliked/made fun of by the main character despite being so associated with said element. Outside of one joke, it's not really clever.

Oh and how could I forget, remove all of the licensed music after the first one. Due to brand familiarity it's not even that they didn't fit the scenes they were in (they didn't), but they don't fit with 'Super Mario' and the use of them is just generally a sign of laziness that you don't want to see.

 

Expansion 1 (Mario's Insecurity + The Obstacle Course + The Travel Montage):

Spoiler

I see the movie want to go with the idea that Mario's an insecure guy who wants to prove himself. He's got the chops to do what he sets out to do, but the world won't really give him the chance to do it.

To be honest, all the movie really needed to do is have people just put Mario down a bit more. You've got Spike's jabs in the beginning, some disappointment from the dad, Donkey Kong doesn't take him seriously, and it all tops off with Bowser's speech at the end of the movie.

Well, the only change I would make to that is instead of the Dad's disappointment, it'd be less blunt and more...both the parents patronizing reassurance that the Bros. can always rely on them if needed. Not intentionally meaning any ill-will, but still stinging.

I feel like that despite Peach trying to soften the blow from his failure at the obstacle course she actually denies his request to come along with her and Mario (like he does in the movie already) renews his confidences and states firmly that he's coming along, which then allows him to prove himself during the travel montage.

---

The obstacle course is a weird thing, it's just something the Princess already has and according to her flashback it existed even back when she was a teenager. Since they already showed the Mushroom Kingdom town as a Mario Maker-esque environment (complete with construction Toads), I think...what they should've done is imply that Peach recently requested this to be built. The movie already has Peach aware of the fact that Bowser is coming to invade her Kingdom, but it also implies that he hasn't actually tried to do so before.

So this obstacle course is built to give her some idea of Bowser's forces and the movie could show that she also has Toads train on this course to recruit the ones that will come with her to the Kong Kingdom.

The fact that the Toads fail at the course would then lead to the scene of Mario running into her in the castle and requesting her help to find his brother. Mario tells the princess that Luigi is in Bowser's territory, the princess bluntly states Luigi is mostly likely in Bowser's captivity...but tries to assure that she's currently on a quest to stop him. Mario asks that he come along too and Peach tries to warn him away, but Mario declares "I'll do anything for my brother" which causes Peach to change her mind. Mario being another human also helps.

The entire obstacle course scene can play out exactly the same until the point where Mario's final failing causes Peach to reconsider Mario joining her. She does try to give him his dues, but the fact that he failed causes another blow to his confidence and the idea that he may not be able to save his brother is what strengthens his resolve for going even more.

(I wanted to say that Toad could try the obstacle course too, because it would justify Peach allowing him to come as well, but I figure that would be pretty redundant)

So in order to justify Peach allowing Toad to join their quest, first Mario would vouch for Toad being the one who brought him there and that would actually impress Peach along with his "I fear nothing" bravado.

---

The travel montage is kind of pointless in the way it's handled, like the only reason it exists is to show off Mario iconography...and it doesn't even really use them at all.

This doesn't even need to be that much longer, but they could've actually used it in order to show how Mario's beginning to get used to the new world he's in.

Starting with him bumbling through the environment, dealing with the weird creatures, but then as we go a long he gets better about traversing the environment...in a way that's similar to how he was moving through Brooklyn at the beginning of the movie. Plus a bit of Peach saving Mario from danger, then Mario saving Peach from danger while Toad's just having a grand ol' time. Ending off with the scene of Mario being amazed at the beauty of this new world would've had more impact.

In regards to the landmarks they actually used, I think they picked the most logical Mario locations to use in a travel montage...there really aren't that many that could be contextualized into a real, lived in environment. I just wish they could've shown off more of the ones they did use.

Expansion 2 (How Mario & Luigi find the Pipe + Peach's Backstory + Luigi's Role):

Spoiler

What I mean is, the actual inciting incident for Mario & Luigi finding the pipe to the Mushroom Kingdom.

As I said before, I think the whole situation with Brooklyn flooding should be removed because it serves no purpose other than to lead the bros. into the sewer system, but it feels like it's a bit too significant of a conflict to just be left hanging and forgotten like that.

So an idea I've seen tossed around once or twice is that Foreman Spike actually hire Mario & Luigi to set up the plumbing system in a newly constructed building and that would essentially lead to the same situation we had in the movie. Now Spike's characterization would have to be changed a bit in order for this to make sense, but it could simply be that he does think they're competent and only makes fun of them because they quit on him.

This just sounds like a more fun concept and we would also spend more time with Spike and...to keep Pauline in the movie from removing the original scene, all you have to do is make the building one that's more important to the city, something built at the mayor's request.

Conceptually it's not a major conflict and it's one that could be left behind without people questioning it.

---

Peach's backstory could be expanded on a little bit more.

I don't need to know how she got to the Mushroom Kingdom, but just longer scenes she adapted to the place growing up and how her presence affected the Toads at all. Something like that.

For a more plot relevant expansion, they could show us that Bowser actually met Peach when they were both young and why Bowser even likes Peach in the first place.

---

Luigi really got the short end of the stick, they put him in a situation where he could do literally nothing for most of the movie. He doesn't even really go through an arc.

A simple prison escape sequence would've done wonders for allowing him to do more.

Let's start from the beginning though: Luigi already looks to be the optimistic one in comparison to Mario, but what if he only ever feels that way because Mario's always around? When Luigi lands in Bowser's kingdom and finds himself captured and put in a dungeon, he realizes how much he's always relied on Mario and feels completely helpless without him.

But what if seeing that the depressing Luma who makes all the other prisoners depressed inspires Luigi to build up everyone else' confidence that they rally together and bust out of the dungeon and they make it so far...only to get stopped by Bowser's overwhelming troops. This leads to everyone being placed in the cages that are in the actual movie, being stuck in here then leads to Luigi's flashback of Mario defending him as babies.

The payoff to this would obviously come in the climax where Luigi sees that Mario needs him just as much and he protects Mario from Bowser's fire.

Expansion 3 (Mario & Donkey Kong's rivalry + The Blue Shell Koopa + Mario, Peach, & Toad Bonding):

Spoiler

This isn't as much of an expansion as much as it is a general reworking of a concept I already like quite a bit.

Another thing I've said before is that they should get rid of both Mario & DK's daddy issues, in the actual movie it briefly seemed like they were gonna connect over this and I'm glad they didn't, but I also wish the scenario didn't really come up at all.

Making Mario and Donkey Kong rivals was a good decision. I just feel like a teeny-tiny explanation was needed as to why other than the simple fact that DK lost. It doesn't need to be outright stated, but expressed via characterization.

Donkey Kong appears to be the Kongs' champion and also liked making fun of Mario a lot for using power-ups (specifically the animal ones).

Well it seems pretty obvious that Donkey Kong's beef would only come up because of his ego, right? As cool as Fire Kong was, I'd like it if DK had a childish grudge against power-ups in general only because Mario used them to win.

Also the scene with them stuck inside the Eel needs a lot less heat, because the resolution to that part is extremely abrupt. It's fine if they're arguing there, but they should've already been working together in the first place.

---

When watching this purely as a film from start to finish it's pretty weird how the Blue Shell Koopa just becomes crazy and Kamikaze's himself out of nowhere, right?

There was no build up to this, it just randomly happens.

I feel like all that was really needed  to set this up was a brief scene where we see that Bowser's troops are prepared to ambush all the heroes and right before they drive off, Kamek specifically casts a spell on the leader Koopa that gives him the power to deal with Mario.

---

Much like Luigi, Toad definitely feels like he doesn't really get to do much. He's not even in the movie that much as comic relief.

They have him claim to be Mario's best friend...and all we get from that bit of nothing is a little fist bump at the end.

They have him state that he's going to protect Peach, but he's really only used to force her hand in marrying Bowser.

He does come through for her plan to escape from Bowser, but that's really the only thing does that's important.

I feel like for both of these things to have had any impact, there should've been any scenes of them bonding. The traveling montage is an obvious place for small vignettes of visual interactions to take place and the scene in the field of fire flowers would've be the most blatantly obvious place for any genuine and/or emotional interactions that allowed the characters to be closer.

Of course for Mario and Toad specifically, for one thing: you could expand on their trek to and inside the Toad Town. From a first meeting you don't really get a lot of dialogue between the 2 as Toad is simply leading Mario through the town. They could easily establish more of a dynamic in this time.

For Peach and Toad, he just needs to actually try to protect her. Despite believing she can do anything, he would never actually back down off his promise. Naturally this would happen during the travel montage.

Expansion 4 (The Locations + Peach's Characterization):

Spoiler

We only visit 2 civilizations in the movie and we're barely in either of them for any significant period of time.

We could stood to stay in Toad Town for a little bit longer. Have Mario interact with some Toads, help out more than just the one guy, establish some sort of presence so that when Peach tells them all that they've lost Mario...it makes sense that they would care.

Would also just like to see more of the place in general.

On the flipside to that, we also could've stayed in Kong Country longer as well. Meeting some Kongs, seeing how they're civilization in greater detail, maybe introducing/establishing some (familiar) characters would've allowed the audience to care when all the Kongs got captured due to Peach's plan.

---

Peach has pretty much no real characterization in this movie, she's actually pretty boring. I have no real problem with her being super competent or not having any notable flaws, this isn't her movie and she's not the one meant to be going through an arc.

It's just a shame she doesn't display much "character"...she's not really sassy, she's not super spirited, she's not ditzy, she's not stoic, she's not sweet, or anything.

She's just kind of nice, which is boring.

If she displayed any of these traits along with...any of these traits affecting her dynamic with Mario, she would've been 100 times better.

The movie is a: Yes

[SupahBerry]

Edit- Welpeth, that was fast, leaked art thread gone now

Edited April 23, 2023 by Supah Berrio
Leaked Concept Art taken down