Sonic Forces: The War Of Wasted Opportunities.

[DabigRG]

12 hours ago, StaticMania said:

Jeez, dey could've given him a different boss fight, problem solved.

Guest, Metal Sonic doesn't hurt nothing by being in dis game.

Exactly!

Unlike all the other villains, Metal Sonic is just a silent robot doppleganger created by Eggman and irregularly appears as his weapon specifically to combat Sonic. There's no real significance or novelty to having him be one of the Eggy Six. The fact that he's on the box art alongside Eggman and Infinite doesn't exactly help.

His only appearance in the game is showing up at Red Gate Bridge for the boss fight. They could've just had the Death Egg Robot(s) be the boss of that level.

Now, if it was Neo Metal Sonic, it could probably be a different story.

In fact, they should've just brought back a different, more individual villain.

Also, Guest?

[Swing]

On 17.1.2018 at 6:59 AM, DabigRG said:

Metal Sonic did not need to be in this game. Like, I know that should be specified as the way he was implemented, but really he could've been left out entirely. He adds nothing but a pointless boss fight to the game from what I've seen that only serves to further lessen the impact of Infinite's final scenes.

I think everyone besides Sonic, Eggman, Avatar and Infinite was pointless. 

[DabigRG]

18 minutes ago, Swing said:

I think everyone besides Sonic, Eggman, Avatar and Infinite was pointless. 

Well, I suppose if you wanna boil the basic gameplay/story down to the absolute basest form possible, then maybe.

 

But speaking from any broader POV, the only thing Metal contributes by being in the game is a boss fight that Infinite would also use for the most part. Just about all of the other characters had some sort of special design, ability, personality, or other novelty that people generally wish would've been tapped into more. Metal Sonic has very little of any of that.

[Almar]

They were really serious about making this game Generations 2. Hell, if it wasn't for Zavok and Infinite I'm sure they would have put in Mephiles and Black Doom too.

[DabigRG]

2 hours ago, Almar said:

They were really serious about making this game Generations 2. Hell, if it wasn't for Zavok and Infinite I'm sure they would have put in Mephiles and Black Doom too.

So, the original setup for Shadow Fall?

 

 

[ClassicKnuckles]

I adore Forces, but wouldn't be awesome if Chaos turned into Perfect Chaos using Mega Mack, and then was cloned by the Phantom Ruby? What if they brought back Ibilis, Mephiles, Metal Madness, Shadow Androids, Time Eater, the Death Egg Robot, Hard Boiled Heavies, and the Biolizard as one epic crossover battle using the Phantom Ruby? Maybe they'll do this in further games if they have the Phantom Ruby.

[GuyWithThePie]

Not sure if it's already been posted elsewhere, but somebody found an earlier version of Mortar Canyon.

This actually looks fun and challenging. What happened?

[mayday2592]

On 1/21/2018 at 9:25 PM, ClassicKnuckles said:

I adore Forces, but wouldn't be awesome if Chaos turned into Perfect Chaos using Mega Mack, and then was cloned by the Phantom Ruby? What if they brought back Ibilis, Mephiles, Metal Madness, Shadow Androids, Time Eater, the Death Egg Robot, Hard Boiled Heavies, and the Biolizard as one epic crossover battle using the Phantom Ruby? Maybe they'll do this in further games if they have the Phantom Ruby.

I really doubt that would be well recieved by most of the fanbase, seeing as most of the characters you mentioned are widely disliked and a boss with that many characters would be a huge mess.

[Bobnik]

16 hours ago, GuyWithThePie said:

Not sure if it's already been posted elsewhere, but somebody found an earlier version of Mortar Canyon.

This actually looks fun and challenging. What happened?

I understand this is an earlier version, but my god these dash panel rows give me aneurism.

Also I had suspicions that the middle part was supposed to have actual challenge instead of a ramp that gets you through that section and to the red ring, making other "paths" in that section completely useless. That said tho, I'm not sure if this is much better than just putting a ramp through there, cuz man this is Marble Zone level of tedious waiting. And with controls like in this game, it'd be even more frustrating to get through the section.

It does look a bit more challenging tho, so...

[DabigRG]

8 hours ago, Bobnik said:

I understand this is an earlier version, but my god these dash panel rows give me aneurism.

 That said tho, I'm not sure if this is much better than just putting a ramp through there, cuz man this is Marble Zone level of tedious waiting. And with controls like in this game, it'd be even more frustrating to get through the section.

It does look a bit more challenging tho, so...

Agreed. That one part where you have to precisely double jump and/or boost off the lone square at the end of a waiting section in particular looks like flimsy design.

[Nicky Nicardo]

I know it would never happen, but I wonder what would happen if Sega released a sorta 'extended cut' for Sonic Forces. Like, a MASSIVE download that contained longer levels, more cutscenes that explained the plot better, and fixes for all of the control issues. Kinda similar to what was done with Mass Effect 3 after everyone complained about the ending.

[DabigRG]

So, this isn't really a wasted opportunity so much as a inquiry-based musing inspired by Brainscratchcomms, but I thought it  was best to bring it up here first: Would the game's story make more sense if it was Dr. NEGA rather than Eggman himself behind everyhing?

 

[Salamander]

There was a certain amount of early speculation to that effect, but now that we know the full story then I don't think it would make things enormously clearer.

[NegaMix]

1 hour ago, DabigRG said:

So, this isn't really a wasted opportunity so much as a inquiry-based musing inspired by Brainscratchcomms, but I thought it  was best to bring it up here first: Would the game's story make more sense if it was Dr. NEGA rather than Eggman himself behind everyhing?

Eh, I highly doubt it. Aside from giving more of a reason for Silver to be there (or an excuse for Blaze to appear, I guess), I don't really see any benefit of having Nega be the main villain in Forces. Heck, if anything I'd say it would've made things worse by robbing the story of its main premise (Eggman finally taking over the world).

[DabigRG]

1 minute ago, NegaMetallix said:

(or an excuse for Blaze to appear, I guess),  

Eh, while he was introduced and is occasionally still linked with Blaze, he's really more along Silver's territory now.

2 minutes ago, NegaMetallix said:

Heck, if anything I'd say it would've made things worse by robbing the story of its main premise (Eggman finally taking over the world).

You mean the main premise that had a FOQ ton of LOT to live up to and people complain was wasted anyway?

[NegaMix]

6 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Eh, while he was introduced and is occasionally still linked with Blaze, he's really more along Silver's territory now.

True, but considering how Sonic Team like to flip-flop on particular details every now-and-then (see: Classic Sonic) I wouldn't put it past them to use Nega as an excuse for Blaze to pop up in Sonic's world. Even Nega's 25th anniversary comic strip had him interacting with Blaze, despite his "canon" future origins.

10 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

You mean the main premise that had a FOQ ton of LOT to live up to and people complain was wasted anyway?

...Yeah. I mean sure, the plot of Eggman finally succeeding was ultimately wasted anyway. But I can't imagine things would've been any better, if they revealed near the end that neither Eggman, nor Infinite, were ever the main villain, and that it was Eggman's crazy descendant from the future the whole time.

[DabigRG]

1 hour ago, NegaMetallix said:

True, but considering how Sonic Team like to flip-flop on particular details every now-and-then (see: Classic Sonic) I wouldn't put it past them to use Nega as an excuse for Blaze to pop up in Sonic's world. Even Nega's 25th anniversary comic strip had him interacting with Blaze, despite his "canon" future origins.

I suppose. Though now that you mention it, I can't help but think using her there--or more specifically, with that dialogue exchange--was kinda off.

1 hour ago, NegaMetallix said:

...Yeah. I mean sure, the plot of Eggman finally succeeding was ultimately wasted anyway. But I can't imagine things would've been any better, if they revealed near the end that neither Eggman, nor Infinite, were ever the main villain, and that it was Eggman's crazy descendant from the future the whole time.

I was just thinking that given that more standardized robot designs, Infinite's aesthetic, the Phantom Ruby's bizarre warping powers, the concept of trapping Sonic in another dimension, the whole "Burn the Resistance to a crisp" endgame, and just overall lack of what Eggman conquering the world should be like, it would've been a perfect chance to use his doppleganger in a 3d game.

[BaronGrackle]

So my understanding is, to get the most out of villain boss battles for this game, you need to

1. Save and turn the game off when Shadow or Chaos is about to be disposed of.

2. Start up Sonic Generations and play the Shadow and Perfect Chaos boss battles.

3) Continue Sonic Forces from where you left off.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

On 1/25/2018 at 7:46 PM, GuyWithThePie said:

Not sure if it's already been posted elsewhere, but somebody found an earlier version of Mortar Canyon.

This actually looks fun and challenging. What happened?

At this point, I'm half tempted to say "Hard Mode DLC" incoming.

[DabigRG]

They must've intended to use Infinite's "hospital room" and the Death Egg's Prison Block again at one point.

 

2 hours ago, BaronGrackle said:

So my understanding is, to get the most out of villain boss battles for this game, you need to

1. Save and turn the game off when Shadow or Chaos is about to be disposed of.

2. Start up Sonic Generations and play the Shadow and Perfect Chaos boss battles.

3) Continue Sonic Forces from where you left off.

Honestly, I feel like that's the inherent reason they didn't have much screentime compared to Newcomer Zavok and Advertised Extra Metal Sonic.

Chaos still should've gotten something else, though.

[DabigRG]

What other villain(s) could've been reasonably included?

[Salamander]

For what values of "reasonable"?  Narratively, speaking of illusions, anything Eggman knows about is presumably fair game.

[DabigRG]

On 3/15/2018 at 7:18 AM, FFWF said:

For what values of "reasonable"?  Narratively, speaking of illusions, anything Eggman knows about is presumably fair game.

Reasonable as in they can stand out as a noteworthy member of the Eggy Six without being too overpowered or to an extent convoluted.

[TearForFear]

What disappointed THE MOSTabout the game is that, graphically and technically speaking, it looks exactly like the previous games.

The models of the characters are the same, old, stiff, rigid figures as always, while other games from other franchises constantly improve and evolve.

Look at Super Mario Odyssey. Mario and co. are flexible, jiggling, alive, almost reaching Pixar-CGI levels.

What is Sonic Forces excuse to not being like that? It's because the Avatar, which is a customable character, can't be included in high quality cutscenes so the only way is to use the in game-graphic for every cutscenes?

 

Also, maybe I'm just nitpicking at this point, but this is the best they could come up when animating the hug between Sonic and Tails:

I see that it's hard to make the two getting closer considering their big heads and their lack of shoulders but come on, they didn't even try.

[JD!]

I just finished the story portion of the game the other night and I have to say the only thing I was really disappointed by was the story. So much more could have been made of Sonic and friends struggle in the war. As for gameplay etc I really enjoyed it.

The only thing that really upset me, as much as a game can, is the retcon of Classic Sonic.