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Bayonetta 3! (Coming Exclusive to Switch)

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1 hour ago, Sean said:

Does he really? He did DMC3 which was great but he also did DMC4 which was trash. The DMCV leak, assuming it's true, sounds like it's taking a lot of cues from 4, too. At this point I don't even know what to expect out of DMC's future.

At least with Kamiya it's outright guaranteed that anything he directs will be solid fucking gold. If he's the lead dev for Bayo3 this time then DMCV won't have shit on it.

I don't think you'll find many people who agree with you about DMC4 being trash. If anything, public opinion of that game has only gotten better and better over time  DMC3 certainly has it beat in terms of alternate weapons, boss fights, and stage progression;  it's a more cohesive package and it's totally understandable why someone might prefer 3 over 4. But DMC4 controls smoother, looks a hell of a lot better, has more interesting art direction, and the two (or five, depending on version) playable characters with their own unique game play styles elevate the game far above 3 for me. I find myself returning to 4 at least once a year whereas DMC3 will only get my fourth complete playthrough when the PS4 collection comes out.

There are so many leaks surrounding DMCV right now that I'm not sure which you are referring to, but what I've heard makes it sound like the game is taking mores ques from the Bayonetta series rather than doubling down on the more dated aspects of DMC3 and 4. The addition of a dedicated dodge button that doesn't require a Style, if true, is a real game changer, and more open level design akin to Bayo would go a long way towards making the game feel less like a combat hall simulator. The original DMC was the only game in the mainline series to 100% nail atmosphere and level geography, and while I don't want DMCV to go back to the 90% castle level design, I'd love to see some actual world building that gives the DMC world at large a concrete identity. Despite all its other flaws, that was the one thing DmC succeeded at.

Unfortunately, its pretty unlikely that Kamiya will be directing Bayonetta 3, as he has a poor track record of directing sequels. Bayonetta 2 still turned out fantastic without him, but his touch really could have helped elevate the game to something more (non-stop) climactic. My main wish for Bayonetta 3 is that it makes regularly occurring enemies a threat again like they were in Bayonetta 1, and to have the ratio of mooks to bosses be closer to that first game as well. At this point, though, I already have faith that Bayo 3 is gonna knock it out of the park, so I'm a bit more interested in seeing how DMCV shapes up as a direct opponent. These are two series that should exist at the same time, competing to outdo each other in combat and spectacle, so that neither franchise rests on its laurels. I haven't been this excited since DmC and Revengeance went up against each other in 2013.

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The gameplay in DMC4 is fucking solid as hell. Nero is really fun to play and Dante has never played better in the entire series. Everything else about the game I hate though. Dante's great but the forced switcharoo halfway through killed my enthusiasm for it so hardcore that I never bothered finishing it.

My main issue with the leak on ResetEra is that several of its plot points are stupid as hell, reaching heights of fanfic-ish stupidity that even DMC4 couldn't dream of attaining, and the idea of switching between characters at certain points of the story. If DMCV is real, I hope that leak ends up being fake.

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16 minutes ago, Marcello said:

So, a while back Platinum teased Bayonetta for Switch. And now we've got the first two and a new third game.

But, if you also remember they also teased this:

I've only played the demo, but here's a comparison to the jacket from the first game:

SPmoztV.jpg

So this could definitely also be hinting at a sequel.

I'd be grateful for a sequel to 101, even if it was Platinum's most disappointing game. A sequel on more powerful hardware could go a long way towards making the gameplay more engaging, as constant debilitating slowdown wouldn't be a factor. Even then, I think a sequel would need to fundamentally overhaul the way combat works. Playing Wonderful 101 is like playing a game of Simon Says mixed with Rock, Paper, Scissor: you're always switching to certain forms to counter certain enemy types, and most of those forms work the same and share the same moveset, so there is actually very little need or incentive for experimentation. Everyone complained (and rightfully so) about the color coded enemies in DmC, but W101 made an entire game out of that concept and somehow gets a free pass. Once you know each enemy's weakness, you've essentially solved the game, and there just isn't enough combat variety to make it a fun game to replay.

5 minutes ago, Sean said:

The gameplay in DMC4 is fucking solid as hell. Nero is really fun to play and Dante has never played better in the entire series. Everything else about the game I hate though. Dante's great but the forced switcharoo halfway through killed my enthusiasm for it so hardcore that I never bothered finishing it.

My main issue with the leak on ResetEra is that several of its plot points are stupid as hell, reaching heights of fanfic-ish stupidity that even DMC4 couldn't dream of attaining, and the idea of switching between characters at certain points of the story. If DMCV is real, I hope that leak ends up being fake.

That's totally fair. Nero is probably my favorite character to play as in the entire franchise, and the switch to Dante along with the jump in difficulty was a big hurdle on my first playthrough. It's a game that really does get better on subsequent playthroughs, like all games in its genre. If you get the chance, I'd still recommend picking up the Special Edition on sale some day; if nothing else, you can just play through Vergil's campaign, which has only one cutscene and doesn't switch your character at the halfway point (you still have to do the backwards trek through the whole game, unfortunately, but at least the game is throwing new enemy types at you).

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2 hours ago, Sean said:

Does he really? He did DMC3 which was great but he also did DMC4 which was trash. The DMCV leak, assuming it's true, sounds like it's taking a lot of cues from 4, too. At this point I don't even know what to expect out of DMC's future.

At least with Kamiya it's outright guaranteed that anything he directs will be solid fucking gold. If he's the lead dev for Bayo3 this time then DMCV won't have shit on it.

DMC3 is the best game in the series and as much as I love DMC1 and think in many ways it was a genre revolution, DMC3's combat is so much more sophisticated it's not even comparable. DMC4 is further improved upon 3 as far as combat is concerned, every other area was weaker granted and the story was really off base for the franchise but gameplay is the absolute most important part of DMC (though I do overall prefer DMC3 I admit).

Kamiya spoke in interviews about playing DMC4 before he began work on Bayonetta to see how the genre had grown since DMC1 and Bayonetta definitely plays way closer to DMC4 than it does DMC1, Itsuno definitely left a pretty significant impact on the genre.

Also we don't know what Kamiya is doing since Scalebound got cancelled so it might be Bayonetta 3, but given he wasn't really involved in Bayonetta 2 much beyond picking who to direct I wouldn't take it as a certainty he's directing 3.

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Gameplay is huge in Devil May Cry, I agree. It's just that all the bad stuff in DMC4 was so bad that I just couldn't ignore it and find it in my heart to call it a game I enjoy playing. Two excellent playstyles gone to fucking waste under a heap of bad game design, middling content, and atrocious storytelling. Once I was forced to play as Dante, I lost complete and total interest in anything else the game had to offer despite playing Dante's first two or three missions to death.

I'd take DMC1, a game with dated gameplay but superior environments and flow, over 4.

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Definitely think we’ll see another teaser for this at E3. Just like with Bayonetta 2.

Hwoever, I don’t believe this game will be out until 2019. Like Metroid Prime 4. Looks like they have not long started development.

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4 had flow. It was just a much cockier dantae lord his banter with that one scientist towards the end was perfect as the music slowly starts to cut in before their fight

Though I encourage for a opportunity to battle a creature of such grand delusion  such as you is a sweet fortune!

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DMC4's problem was that it lacked flow. Having Dante's levels be backtracking the entire game without giving him unique levels and boss encounters was a waste. It's a game that was blatantly unfinished and is all the more frustrating for it's wear in the Special Edition where now there's even more characters to play. It's become an overstuffed turkey of a game, which is a shame because it has by far the best combat mechanics in the series.

Anynway, Bayonetta 3.

The guns she has in the trailer are called the Whittingham Fair. What's interesting about that is unlike Love Is Blue, the namesake it draws from isn't an entirely different song reference, rather it is a variation of the original Scarborough Fair ballad, which is what Bayonetta's original guns were named after.

To not only regress to Bayonetta's original design but giving her guns with a naming convention that's blatantly derivative is already a telling implication in and of itself - which is emboldened by the fact that, when slowing down the trailer, you can notice that Bayonetta lacks her iconic beauty mark. It might be considered a goof on the modeler's part but Kamiya has gone on record in the past saying that an Umbran Witch gains their beauty mark once they've gone through a life-affecting experience.

So there's a few possibilities - one is that this isn't the "real" Bayonetta. The derivative naming convention of her weapons in the trailer could very well imply that it's a Bayonetta from an alternate dimension, one where she instead received Whittingham Fair as her guns of choice, highlighting her essentially being a facsimile of the real thing. The games have gone deep into time travel, so having Bayonetta 3 include alternate dimensions isn't a hard thing to swallow.

That said it's equally likely, or perhaps more likely, that what we're looking at is an alternate timeline. With the lack of a beauty mark on Bayonetta, this looks like it had to have taken place some time between her reawakening at the lake and the beginning of the first game, possibly Rodin had made the Whittingham Fair at that point as a prototype.

Nonetheless the teaser sets the stage and I don't think this Bayonetta is the one we're going to play as. For one thing the developers have mentioned in the past that Bayonetta is the kind of character that changes styles and they'd miss a huge opportunity by going back to an older (and more inferior than Bayo 2 anyway) design rather than conjuring up a new one. But there's also the fact that the antagonist clearly looks like some omnipresent time wielder. He doesn't counter the bullets, he stops their momentum entirely and disassembles them. What I speculate is going on here is that this guy is like a combination of the Terminator and those Time Wraiths from season 2 of The Flash - the guy is out to kill Bayonetta, likely for having fucked with the timeline on too many occasions. If it's more of an alternate dimension thing then I'm expecting it to lean more on the Terminator side of things with the guy basically killing every Bayonetta across multiple dimensions to completely wipe her out of existence itself. 

What I'm guessing then is that the story of this game will be some Back to the Future shit where Bayo has to race across time and space to save her own existence.

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Recent news update!

Essentially, it's about the devs progressing well with Bayo 3 and really enjoying it. Not much, but it's always nice to be reminded and reassured that the game is coming. Also great to hear that the team is "in sync" and well attuned during the development. Good conditions make for more promising games in the long run.

https://www.dualshockers.com/bayonetta-3-development-going-well/

Quote

Bayonetta 3’s Development “Going Very Well” PlatinumGames “Very Excited About What They’re Doing”

While PlatinumGames is keeping Bayonetta 3 under wraps, the studio is very excited about what they're doing with the upcoming game for Switch,

 

Today, during a stage event at the Bitsummit Roadshow: Tokyo hosted at the Daikanyama Unit venue in the Japanese capital (which DualShockers attended), PlatinumGames’ own Hideki Kamiya and Atsushi Inaba shared a tease about the upcoming Bayonetta 3.

We hear that the game is “on course” and everybody in the development team is “in sync.” While they can’t say more at the moment, we hear that development is proceeding smoothly.

“It’s nice to be able to tell you that everything is going very, very well. We’re all very excited about what we’re doing on that game.”

Interestingly we also hear about a small anecdote about the inception of the first Bayonetta. Kamiya-san had the idea of having guns and using them both to shoot and hit enemies. When he presented the idea to the animator, it was the animator himself who suggested that since Bayonetta could hit enemies with her guns, why not letting her kick them too? And that’s when the iconic gun heels were born.

Bayonetta 3 has been announced last year at The Game Awards, and we haven’t heard much more since, or seen any gameplay. What we do know is that it’ll come exclusively for Nintendo Switch.

 

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