Sonic Mania Adventures

[Zaysho]

I feel the modern characters have enough broad strokes traits and quirks that would work for this kind of format, to be honest. Sonic Channel did those comic strips a few years back that felt like what I'd actually expect of the characters, and Sonic Unleashed has "Night of the Werehog" and those bonus shorts--all silent by the way--that worked incredibly well. I could easily see stuff that we already have in the games like Knuckles issuing a random/stupid challenge to Sonic and it blowing up in his face or Tails making an invention that needs tweaking only to accomplish a stupid task or whatever. Shadow gets dragged into something with Rouge, etc. These aren't complicated characters.

[Kuzu]

Yea, the modern cast aren't anywhere near as complex as people think they are, and broad enough to fit almost any scenario if people just lightened up a little bit on what's acceptable characterization lol.

[Sgt Nate V]

3 hours ago, Blue Blood said:

It's the Collision Chaos flower;  the place where Amy and Metal first met. Quite fitting, imo.

I mean, I can SEE that, but don't you think a visual pun would've worked too?

[StaticMania]

No, it wouldn't have. It's just a flow-er.

[G-Force]

1 hour ago, Diogenes said:

I feel like all the arguing over the different versions of the characters pretty clearly proves this wrong.

The key word was "should."

Anything you can say about one version of any Sonic character SHOULD apply to any other version of that character, because there SHOULD only ever be one overarching definition of who that character is.  The fact that there is more than one is a problem that SHOULD be fixed.  We SHOULD NOT be embracing the idea that they're separate.

[MadmanRB]

I did like this siort and for once (outside of Boom and Fleetway) i didnt hate Amy Rose

[Ryannumber1gamer]

1 hour ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

I can understand tho how a fan of the Adventure era would take issue with things like how Tails is nowadays, since they make a big deal how he becomes independent but then he clings to Sonic even more nowadays.

But the fact of the matter is, the people who wrote those games are long gone and clearly had far bigger ambitions than the current crew, but expectations were bigger back then since Sonic was way more relevant in 1999 and 2001 than he is in 2018. And no way the current people are gonna abide by writing from almost two decades ago.

I don't really think that's an excuse. It's not the sake of Tails' development being changed due to different writers, it's the fact his character development is being regressed, and not actively being given anything to replace it. Instead of at least being a proactive character, he needs to rely on others to help him and that's while he still remains very cocky and very arrogant and yet does nothing to back it up.

My issue with Tails isn't so much that he isn't just copy and pasted from his adventure characterization, my problem is that he just isn't being given anything of actual worth to replace it and instead gets more annoying. In Lost World, he becomes a lot more whiny and starting fights over nothing, while in Forces, he becomes unable to do much of anything without Sonic being around to save him, and the only thing that gets replaced with is a few bouts of exposition, and a few attempts to snark at Eggman which come off undeserved because Tails has done nothing to deserve it.

But bottom-line is it's also inconsistent. At his worse, Tails has always consistently at least been competent. He was able to take on badniks and enemies alone, he was able to provide help to Sonic and others, with his pre-defined role as inventor, and while Adventure's story involved him being more independent, even beforehand, Tails was living on his own and running tests on the Tornado.

Forces is the first time he's actively portrayed as near-useless and heavily reliant on Sonic. As much as I hate his characterisation in Lost World, at the very least - Tails was capable of inventing and even engineered his own escape from Zavok and co, as well as trying to save Sonic at multiple points at the story. For all of his faults in Lost World, he's at the very least - proactive and still holds a role in the story that allows him to do things independent of Sonic.

Compare his role in Forces to something like Mania Adventures where at the very least, not only is Tails capable, but his animations are pretty adorable to contrast over Sonic's snarkiness and Knuckles' rougher attitude, or even Boom where while he isn't as competent as a fighter, he's full-force as an inventor, and on top of that, has a defined role as a straight man, and bounces off well against Sonic, Amy and Knuckles.

Even in something like Forces, he probably would've fared fifty times better if they at least had the sense to have Tails working in the resistance as opposed to his final role, and it just shows how badly Classic impacts Tails as well. To this day, I don't understand why Tails hadn't been apart of the resistance, especially since it makes the most sense for Tails to have created the Wispons and grappling gear for the rest of the resistance.

If he was in the resistance, if he was the gadget guy who built their tools and even got the wisps to agree with powering the weapons, I very much believe a lot more people wouldn't give him as much shit in Forces because at the very least, he'd be using his unique skills to help fight back against Eggman and whatever else. I legitimately believe Tails' lack of action in Forces is a direct impact from the fact Classic needed something to tie him into the rest of the story since there was so little for him to actually do. 

[Kuzu]

7 minutes ago, Ryannumber1Santa said:

I don't really think that's an excuse. It's not the sake of Tails' development being changed due to different writers, it's the fact his character development is being regressed, and not actively being given anything to replace it. Instead of at least being a proactive character, he needs to rely on others to help him and that's while he still remains very cocky and very arrogant and yet does nothing to back it up.

My issue with Tails isn't so much that he isn't just copy and pasted from his adventure characterization, my problem is that he just isn't being given anything of actual worth to replace it and instead gets more annoying. In Lost World, he becomes a lot more whiny and starting fights over nothing, while in Forces, he becomes unable to do much of anything without Sonic being around to save him, and the only thing that gets replaced with is a few bouts of exposition, and a few attempts to snark at Eggman which come off undeserved because Tails has done nothing to deserve it.

But bottom-line is it's also inconsistent. At his worse, Tails has always consistently at least been competent. He was able to take on badniks and enemies alone, he was able to provide help to Sonic and others, with his pre-defined role as inventor, and while Adventure's story involved him being more independent, even beforehand, Tails was living on his own and running tests on the Tornado.

Forces is the first time he's actively portrayed as near-useless and heavily reliant on Sonic. As much as I hate his characterisation in Lost World, at the very least - Tails was capable of inventing and even engineered his own escape from Zavok and co, as well as trying to save Sonic at multiple points at the story. For all of his faults in Lost World, he's at the very least - proactive and still holds a role in the story that allows him to do things independent of Sonic.

Compare his role in Forces to something like Mania Adventures where at the very least, not only is Tails capable, but his animations are pretty adorable to contrast over Sonic's snarkiness and Knuckles' rougher attitude, or even Boom where while he isn't as competent as a fighter, he's full-force as an inventor, and on top of that, has a defined role as a straight man, and bounces off well against Sonic, Amy and Knuckles.

Even in something like Forces, he probably would've fared fifty times better if they at least had the sense to have Tails working in the resistance as opposed to his final role, and it just shows how badly Classic impacts Tails as well. To this day, I don't understand why Tails hadn't been apart of the resistance, especially since it makes the most sense for Tails to have created the Wispons and grappling gear for the rest of the resistance.

If he was in the resistance, if he was the gadget guy who built their tools and even got the wisps to agree with powering the weapons, I very much believe a lot more people wouldn't give him as much shit in Forces because at the very least, he'd be using his unique skills to help fight back against Eggman and whatever else. I legitimately believe Tails' lack of action in Forces is a direct impact from the fact Classic needed something to tie him into the rest of the story since there was so little for him to actually do. 

This is a good point actually and really explains why I've hated how Tails has been written recently. 

It's not so much he's regressed as a character, but he's an outright liability. He does nothing to move the plot along or help Sonic out, which would be fine if he had a charming personality to make up for it, but he's written about as smug as Sonic but unlike him, he's done f nothing to justify being so smug, so it REALLY makes him irritating to watch.

[CleverSonicUsername]

21 hours ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

I just hope it leads into a reveal of a free Ice Cap Zone DLC for Mania.

I can dream, can't I?

Ok, well, look... They still showed Ice Cap in it, so I'm happy.

Also I think this is my favorite part of Mania Adventures.

[Diogenes]

Honestly if Tails was just the gadget guy of the resistance...he'd be as boring as everyone else in it.

What they did with him in Forces isn't great, but having him break down after Sonic's "death" and transfer his feelings to Classic Sonic as he's trying to work through things is at least an interesting start. It's actually probably the ballsiest idea in Forces, problem is that is just goes nowhere, Tails is basically "cured" as soon as Classic shows up.

I'm bored of blandly competent Tails, so even "kinda fucked up but actually has feelings and shit" Tails is more interesting to me.

[Wraith]

That's not even mentioning how Tails is still playing the role of the gadget guy anyway as he did in the last two games. He's just pointing Classic Sonic where to go instead of normal Sonic. Aside from his moment of weakness which isn't really that big of a deal to me he's not actually that different than he was in the last 10 Sonic games. I don't find that take on Tails very interesting but it essentially is the character now and has been for a very long time.

[Kuzu]

8 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

Honestly if Tails was just the gadget guy of the resistance...he'd be as boring as everyone else in it.

What they did with him in Forces isn't great, but having him break down after Sonic's "death" and transfer his feelings to Classic Sonic as he's trying to work through things is at least an interesting start. It's actually probably the ballsiest idea in Forces, problem is that is just goes nowhere, Tails is basically "cured" as soon as Classic shows up.

I'm bored of blandly competent Tails, so even "kinda fucked up but actually has feelings and shit" Tails is more interesting to me.

But like you said, it goes nowhere so its ultimately pointless lol.

It's not like I want Tails to be the bland gadget guy either. I want to like him, especially since he's the most prominent character after Sonic and Eggman, but the games don't know how to do that lol.

 

As said, he's fine in Boom; he's still the gadget guy of the group but he's kind of awkward and his inventions don't always work out, which helps contrast him with the more action oriented characters like Sonic and Knuckles. 

That makes him endearing, because while he's not as charismatic as Sonic or as gung ho as Knuckles, he still tries his best despite not always succeeding. It makes you wanna root for the little guy.

[DabigRG]

Interestingly, it was Boom that made me realize Tails is kinda boring.

5 hours ago, JosepHenry said:

As he said, you are a fucking monster if you are not friends with Cream the Rabbit.

With that said, wouldn't it be kinda fun if that got subverted once?

[Scape]

well now Amy has to be in a sonic mania 2, so she'll be forced to confront metal sonic again and learn to regret this decision

[Dr. Detective]

6 hours ago, Zaysho said:

I feel the modern characters have enough broad strokes traits and quirks that would work for this kind of format, to be honest. Sonic Channel did those comic strips a few years back that felt like what I'd actually expect of the characters, and Sonic Unleashed has "Night of the Werehog" and those bonus shorts--all silent by the way--that worked incredibly well. I could easily see stuff that we already have in the games like Knuckles issuing a random/stupid challenge to Sonic and it blowing up in his face or Tails making an invention that needs tweaking only to accomplish a stupid task or whatever. Shadow gets dragged into something with Rouge, etc. These aren't complicated characters.

No joke, when I imagined a Modern version of these little cartoons, I envisioned them just being animated versions of those Sonic Channel comics.

Tails is a-scared of ghosts, Amy almost burns her house down baking cookies, Knuckles gets hit on the head with a fruit, punches over a tree, and than feels bad about it, Rouge teases Omega for being thanked by some Chao when they put a flower crown over his head, Vector puts his pudding in the freezer like an idiot, Espio gets hit and run over by everyone while he's trying to train while invisible, Charmy sets up a prank for Vector and Espio using bait that HE would want and then falls for it himself, Silver makes dango out of the rocks from Pumpkin Hill... 

It's all silly stuff except with the Modern cast. The only one that was serious was the one with Shadow and that still mostly relied on being cute and genuinely heart-felt. 

[SBR2]

14 minutes ago, Scape said:

well now Amy has to be in a sonic mania 2, so she'll be forced to confront metal sonic again and learn to regret this decision

It's not that deep.

[Rowl]

16 hours ago, G-Force said:

The idea that these variations of the characters are separate, or somehow should be separate is stupid. 

Technically no... at least not anymore. According to Forces the Classic Characters are now from another dimension. So they are no longer the younger version of the Modern Cast. 

[Sonictrainer]

51 minutes ago, Rowl said:

Technically non... at least not anymore. According to Forces the Classic characters are now from another dimension. So they are no longer the younger version of modern cast. 

It was confirmed by Takashi Iizuka that Classic Sonic from Generations is the same one from Mania and Forces.

[Your Vest Friend]

1 hour ago, Sonictrainer said:

It was confirmed by Takashi Iizuka that Classic Sonic from Generations is the same one from Mania and Forces.

Yep. Still not younger versions since what Generations said was retconned. 

[G-Force]

3 hours ago, Rowl said:

Technically non... at least not anymore. According to Forces the Classic characters are now from another dimension. So they are no longer the younger version of modern cast. 

Yes.  I know.  And I'm saying that it's fucking stupid.  The fact that Sonic Team is actually doing this doesn't stop it from being stupid, it just makes them stupid for thinking it's a good idea.

[Lord-Dreamerz]

I still like and prefer the change to Classic Sonic becoming it's own separate universe myself. It means new classic games and media can be made without the baggage of the modern universe and can evolve into it's own direction if needed. I never liked the idea fans had of Classic Sonic being a kid version of Modern Sonic when they have the same bloody character age. I actually enjoy stuff like alternate dimensions in certain stories like Spider-Verse, and they do it in DC too... so it doesn't bother me.

[DaddlerTheDalek]

20 hours ago, Tracker_TD said:

Well I didn't see that coming! 

Really really really adorable episode. Amy is so precious in this!

[Rowl]

8 hours ago, Sonictrainer said:

It was confirmed by Takashi Iizuka that Classic Sonic from Generations is the same one from Mania and Forces.

Than why the whole dimension mumbo Jumbo? 

[Red Hot Jack]

I personally think classic characters have less traits so more simple personality and it's easier to handle compared to modern characters. Not that those are too deep.

[DabigRG]

4 hours ago, Rowl said:

Than why the whole dimension mumbo Jumbo? 

Because the Time Eater cause a considerable split by having the two Sonic's meet and then the Phantom Ruby threw things further out of whack.