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Are multiple playable characters still seen as an issue/

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So with Sonic being the only playable character, I notice there is a significant part of the fanbase who doesn't really like that. I know there were issues with multiple playable characters in the past but could it work now?

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I think the potentiality of multiple playable characters is a good one, and one I would like to see implemented more in the future. I think the issue right now is just that people feel like Sonic himself's gameplay is most important, and Sega has had such a time trying to iron it out and get it down-pat into something that satisfies people (pretty difficult with a fanbase like this one) that they've only really had time to focus on Sonic himself. 

After all, as a game development team, if you still feel like every time you do a solo game with a character that there's a huge vocal crowd of people who say it sucks, you'd probably want to focus more on refining what you're already working on than add more characters to the mix.

TL;DR I don't think it's a bad thing or bad idea, but until people can stop moaning about Sonic play-styles not suiting their specific desires (AKA: Never), we're probably not going to see much of it happening.

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The successful 2D template:

1) The game must be fun in general.

2) The characters must be optional. If you want to play as Sonic from beginning to end, including final story, you should be able to without touching any other character.

 

Out of all the 3D Sonic games with multiple playable characters, NONE of them have made the characters optional. Maybe they should try it out.

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My position is the same: I'm not interested in adding multiple playable characters until they can get one playable character done right. I'm fine with Mania's team adding characters because they're working with a proven formula and they know what they're doing, but I'd rather Sonic Team not until they show that they can make one gameplay style that's actually viable.

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16 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

My position is the same: I'm not interested in adding multiple playable characters until they can get one playable character done right. I'm fine with Mania's team adding characters because they're working with a proven formula and they know what they're doing, but I'd rather Sonic Team not until they show that they can make one gameplay style that's actually viable.

This acually worked in Sonic Heroes.

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1 hour ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

*looks to the side at Sonic Mania Plus* umm, no, not really.

 

1 hour ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

Long story short it's about how they play,

This is the only important part

1 hour ago, MetalSkulkBane said:

 

whenever they optional or not and if writing makes them annoying in any way.

People will always complain whether characters are optional or not, and being annoying is subjective. All that really matters is you make a good and fun game and make them fun to play and be around. The rest will solve itself. 

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I think that yes there can be multiple characters and multiple play styles, Sonic adventure 1 got this mostly right and while not a perfect game it does have its own unique flavor to it.

If the alternate gameplay styles could be refined and well worked on it can be a good game.

 

Of course sonic team would not get it right, we need a mania esque team of developers 

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Indeed, this is why i think the model of multiple characters should be sonic adventure 1.

Again i am not saying it is a perfect game, Sonic adventure 1 does have its deep flaws but the foundation is still there.

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2 hours ago, Marco9966 said:

This acually worked in Sonic Heroes.

The idea that Sonic Team got a singular gameplay style "right" in Sonic Heroes is a veeeeery divisive one.  I sure as hell never want to see that level of boring enemy-combat focused gameplay popping up multiple times to interrupt the platforming in a mainline Sonic game again.

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In the 3-D games, I really don't mind if they stick to Sonic only since those games tend to change game mechanics at the whim of Sonic Team's developers.

In 2-D however, I never seen any issue as they can work fine and without much trouble. However, I'm not very fond of the idea of bloating the cast with clone characters (Tails and Knuckles as enough already) as I feel that those offer the least gameplay/replay incentive. I think the Advance games, particularly the first one, had one of the most playable casts that I found the most appealing. Why did they cut down Amy to return to the trio thing is something that not only puzzles me, but generally see as one of ST's most questionable decisions.

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No, it’s multiple gameplay styles that are seen as the issue—more specifically, styles that almost feel like it’s a whole different genre between them.

Although people have been slow to realize this, but it’s become more obvious given that most of the cast hasn’t been playble since Sonic 06 well over a decade ago. So they can’t blame multiple characters anymore.

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Honestly, this depends on WHAT you mean under "Multiple Playable Characters"

If it's just sprite/model swaps like it was with Shadow in SA2, Tails in Sonic 2, pretty much everyone in SegaSonic, or Blaze in Sonic Rush, It works, because it doesn't go into unfamiliar territory, and actually expands on Sonic's core mechanic of running and jumping, rather than retconning it entirely.

As for BAD examples, that break the pace, there's a lot, actually. There's Classic Knuckles with his VERY slow climbing and generally slow speed, there's Amy from Adventure with, again, less speed and an awful game basis in general, there's Big the Cat, who doesn't belong anywhere, there's Knuckles from SA/SA2, with his tedious treasure hunting, there's Silver with his telekinesis, and so on. 

I mean, the only Sonic game to do more than two multiple playable characters RIGHT is Rivals, because all of the characters were pretty much model swaps with different special moves. Shame that the game itself was a crappy platformer/racer amalgamation.

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2 hours ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

No, it’s multiple gameplay styles that are seen as the issue—more specifically, styles that almost feel like it’s a whole different genre between them.

Adding emphasis to this: this is a problem that persisted long after other playable characters were cut entirely.

You could already see this in effect as early as Unleashed, right when the "shitty friends" talk first started to get to a head. Sega forced a generic beat-em-up in what was otherwise the fastest Sonic game to date against the advice of practically every other branch of Sega, and somehow seemed surprised when nobody liked it. Almost everything we've had since then is a shiny new gimmick of the month seemingly designed only to distract players from the fact that they're not actually improving or polishing the core gameplay they've set up for themselves. Nobody has ever asked for that.

Alas, "shitty friends" rolls off the tongue better, so this is what we're stuck with. Typical.

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32 minutes ago, A person, that exists said:

 

As for BAD examples, that break the pace, there's a lot, actually. There's Classic Knuckles with his VERY slow climbing and generally slow speed,

Eh, I really wouldn't count that with the others. Even if he is slightly slower and jumps somewhat lower than the Unbreakable, Knuckles in the 2d games is still just the standard Sonic playstyle with the optional ability to climb walls.

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35 minutes ago, A person, that exists said:

There's Classic Knuckles with his VERY slow climbing and generally slow speed,

Knuckles is exactly as fast as Sonic and Tails are. Exact same acceleration, exact same top speed, exact same slope physics. The only differences are his gliding, his climbing, and his jump height (and he's taller than Tails, as is Sonic).

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1 minute ago, Diogenes said:

Knuckles is exactly as fast as Sonic and Tails are. Exact same acceleration, exact same top speed, exact same slope physics. The only differences are his gliding, his climbing, and his jump height (and he's taller than Tails, as is Sonic).

But, the aforementioned gliding, jumping and climbing really do make a difference. Knuckles feels tedious to play as, bosses that you could defeat in less than 30 seconds as Sonic drag on, because of Knuckles' jump ability, the climbing is slow as fuck, same with the gliding.

My point is, Knuckles doesn't PLAY like a Sonic character. He plays like a character from a completely different, more vertical platformer, which Sonic ISN'T.

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1 minute ago, A person, that exists said:

But, the aforementioned gliding, jumping and climbing really do make a difference. Knuckles feels tedious to play as, bosses that you could defeat in less than 30 seconds as Sonic drag on, because of Knuckles' jump ability, the climbing is slow as fuck, same with the gliding.

Obviously those differences contribute to the overall feel and pace of playing as Knuckles, but he is not "generally slow". You spend the vast majority of the game running around with the same stats as every other character.

1 minute ago, A person, that exists said:

My point is, Knuckles doesn't PLAY like a Sonic character. He plays like a character from a completely different, more vertical platformer, which Sonic ISN'T.

Shit man and people think I have an unreasonably narrow definition of playing like a Sonic character.

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1 minute ago, Diogenes said:

Shit man and people think I have an unreasonably narrow definition of playing like a Sonic character.

I mean, what even IS a Sonic playable character?

It's a character, who has more emphasis on horizontal movement, and who goes fast. Knuckles has more emphasis on verticality (Heck, Chaotix was mainly a vertical platformer) and has abilities that slow him down. 

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Are extra playable characters in the series still a problem? Not at all in the 2D games at least. The 3D games however refuse to stick to a single play-style long enough to really know for sure. I'm normally not super picky with how characters play, so if nothing else I know I wouldn't have a problem with extra characters being included even in the 3D games far more often... Just no more multiple versions of Sonics in the same game OK?

Anyways my opinion is the only real thing that matters is if a character is fun to play as. Not much else really matters to me. I don't follow the belief that all characters HAVE to be perfect Sonic clones with added powers on top in order to be enjoyable.

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It depends on how its added if it changes the gameplay to much it might do more harm then good there will be people who want there favorite character in the gameplay they prefer or making to much work for the developers to handle. Best to change the character to fit the game and not other way around.

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33 minutes ago, A person, that exists said:

But, the aforementioned gliding, jumping and climbing really do make a difference. Knuckles feels tedious to play as, bosses that you could defeat in less than 30 seconds as Sonic drag on, because of Knuckles' jump ability, the climbing is slow as fuck, same with the gliding.

My point is, Knuckles doesn't PLAY like a Sonic character. He plays like a character from a completely different, more vertical platformer, which Sonic ISN'T.

I disagree with you completely, but you know what?

This: We have the ability to play S3&K as Sonic Alone through his full story, including his final zone and true ending, without having to play as Knuckles or Tails. Same thing in Sonic Mania.

None of the 3D games have tried this. The 3D games don't know the meaning of "optional".

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