Why the Modern Sonic Stories Just Don't Work

[Marco9966]

Hey guys! Feel free to watch this video (or not), the main point is: Modern Stories are bad, and Adventure (and Classic) era stories are better. Because there is no weak stand-up comedy and inconsistent tragedic moments with cringy try-to-be-funny moments just after in the adventure and classic games.

And if there's humor in the Adventure era games, the humor is actually funny and not cringy. Do you agree?

 

[MetalSkulkBane]

For various reaons I can't watch the video right now, but from your desription it really isn't a new observation. Maybe not everyone agrees, but I heard that talk at least since Lost World came out, possibly further (have to check dates on Sonic Dissected).

[Marco9966]

If my first Sonic game ever was Lost World and not SA1, I'd have a very different idea about the franchise and I would think it's horse crap instead of epic.

[Tornado]

15 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

If my first Sonic game ever was Lost World and not SA1, I'd have a very different idea about the franchise and I would think it's horse crap instead of epic.

So why make a thread contending otherwise?

[Marco9966]

4 minutes ago, Tornado said:

So why make a thread contending otherwise?

I don't understand.

[PeterPancake]

The new games have become slapstick cartoons. I miss the story-focused games of Pre-Colors.

[Marco9966]

Just now, PeterPancake said:

The new games have become slapstick cartoons. I miss the story-focused games of Pre-Colors.

At least we got the IDW comics and that's the main thing that keeps me a fan.

[Diogenes]

Modern stories are bad, Adventure stories are bad, Classic stories barely exist. I'm tired of fighting over which bad stories this series should be trying to imitate.

[Marco9966]

44 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

Modern stories are bad, Adventure stories are bad, Classic stories barely exist. I'm tired of fighting over which bad stories this series should be trying to imitate.

So all you want is to run fast through a level over and over without any substance or story? That looks like a casual gamer's motivations at best. Where is your love for Sonic and his universe?

That's your own restrictive opinion, but there are many other opinions.

And I can't say that SA2 has a bad story like Generations.

And classic games in fact have stories, like S3&K, CD.

Again if you'd watch the video, you'd understand why Adventure era stories are miles better than the modern-meta-memes-nostalgia-pandering-crap era.

 

[Skull Leader]

It's because Sonic Team can't, not even for the sake of their lives, tell a decent story.

Even when they do manage to come up with potentially interesting scenarios like Sonic and Eggman being forced to work together (SLW) or Eggman winning and taking over the world (Forces), the always seem to, how should I put it?... Sonic Team'd things by misplacing the focus on the wrong characters or adding more than what the story needs just to reminds us that they exist, trying to do more than what they can chew (especially when they try stuff like 06's dilemma of "is it right to kill someone if it saves the world?") or justifying their latest gameplay gimmicks that they came up with and wrote down on a napkin from a bar where they go either get drunk or high in search of new ideas.

[DabigRG]

Doing more denouncing shit, are we?

Guess I better give it a watch.

[Mega]

I mean, I do think SA2's story holds up pretty well. Mostly 'cause of this video:
 

Granted, it definitely still has plenty of issues. Wonky translation. Cheesy voice acting. But with this dude's analysis in mind, the ideas at least are sound. You can tell there was an effort to tell a story, and honestly, I think it holds up well for what it is.

Even Unleashed, I feel, had a decent plot. Same with Black Knight.

Are they masterpieces? No. But as someone who cares about game stories and sees them as a way to get invested, I'd rather have something that at least tries than something sloppy or nonexistent.

[Tornado]

5 hours ago, Marco9966 said:

I don't understand.

You made a thread with a clickbait title to basically say "watch this video", then a couple posts later you disagree with your own thread premise and chalk up you even liking Adventure-era stories to nostalgia.

[Marco9966]

43 minutes ago, Tornado said:

You made a thread with a clickbait title to basically say "watch this video", then a couple posts later you disagree with your own thread premise and chalk up you even liking Adventure-era stories to nostalgia.

There is a misunderstanding. I think you should also read what I wrote at the beginning of the thread. Adventure era games are in no way the same thing modern games (Modern games are from 2010 till now, with Pontaff stories,

while Adventure ERA games are from 1998 to 2008, different writers)

Modern stories are bad.

But Adventure and Classic are not bad.

Even if it's the same 3D design for Sonic, the Adventure and Modern era (Pontaff) are different.

I was saying that if someone's first exposure ever to Sonic, literally the first time he sees Sonic ever is Sonic Lost World, they'll think it's a silly franchise,

But if someone's first exposure ever to Sonic was Sonic 3&K, or SA1/2, or Riders or Unleashed, they'll think highly of this franchise and see that the writers put some effort to write something more meaningful than daddy jokes.

This is bad:

Spoiler

While this is good:

Spoiler

(https://sanitrance.deviantart.com)

(https://www.pinterest.com/pin/474566879476137367/?lp=true)

(https://www.pinterest.ie/pin/503488433332713891/?lp=true)

(https://siga4bdn.deviantart.com)

(https://aoki6311.deviantart.com)

 

[DabigRG]

1 hour ago, Marco9966 said:

There is a misunderstanding. I think you should also read what I wrote at the beginning of the thread. Adventure era games are in no way the same thing modern games (Modern games are from 2010 till now, with Pontaff stories,

while Adventure ERA games are from 1998 to 2008, different writers)

Modern stories are bad.

But Adventure and Classic are not bad.

Even if it's the same 3D design for Sonic, the Adventure and Modern era (Pontaff) are different.

I was saying that if someone's first exposure ever to Sonic, literally the first time he sees Sonic ever is Sonic Lost World, they'll think it's a silly franchise,

But if someone's first exposure ever to Sonic was Sonic 3&K, or SA1/2, or Riders or Unleashed, they'll think highly of this franchise and see that the writers put some effort to write something more meaningful than daddy jokes.

This is bad:

  Hide contents

While this is good:

  Hide contents

(https://sanitrance.deviantart.com)

(https://www.pinterest.com/pin/474566879476137367/?lp=true)

(https://www.pinterest.ie/pin/503488433332713891/?lp=true)

(https://siga4bdn.deviantart.com)

(https://aoki6311.deviantart.com)

 

I love how all but one of those "pre-Modern" pics are pretty-ified fanart.

[Marco9966]

5 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

I love how all but one of those "pre-Modern" pics are pretty-ified fanart.

Can you find that with Lost World?

Pre-modern games (like SA1, S3&K or Unleashed) have more meat, thus give more inspiration to artists.

[DabigRG]

24 minutes ago, Marco9966 said:

Can you find that with Lost World?

Pre-modern games (like SA1, S3&K or Unleashed) have more meat, thus give more inspiration to artists.

Oh, there's fanart. Maybe not like Amy playing with Flickies(because of course not; isn't that basically something that happens in the game, though), but there's stuff out there.

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/491666484298218014/

seiga.nicovideo.jp/seiga/im3550711

 

[dbzfan7]

I definitely agree with the video. I don't exactly think we've had a perfect story persay, but at least there was reasons to care before. Not to mention the memorable moments that are iconic. I don't think I've ever heard of anyone really take with them anything from the meta era beyond some laughs. I don't hear how cool this was or how sad and uplifting this other part was. How memorable this scene was, etc. If I hear someone mention memorable, it's for the wrong reasons usually as they point out.

It's pretty much become a great divide with the games to the point where the moto is "Play Sonic games for the gameplay and nothing else, read the comics if you want to care about their universe since the games don't care."

 

[Marco9966]

10 minutes ago, dbzfan7 said:

 I don't think I've ever heard of anyone really take with them anything from the meta era beyond some laughs.

It's pretty much become a great divide with the games to the point where the moto is "Play Sonic games for the gameplay and nothing else, read the comics if you want to care about their universe since the games don't care."

 

100%.

Everybody still loves Shadows and Tikal and Blaze.

But there are no fanboys for the Deadly Six or Wisps or Classic Sonic being in the same room as Modern Sonic.

[Razule]

This is bad:

Spoiler

While this is good:

Spoiler

 

It's not hard.

[Marco9966]

2 minutes ago, Razule said:

This is bad:

  Reveal hidden contents

While this is good:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

It's not hard.

Okay then, let's do it with complete story/vibe/writing analyses instead of screenshots and fanarts.

(Also, Chip is actually funny and not cringy, Sonic asking Knuckles what's up with him is not bad, and the faker line works well within the context of the whole story).

[DabigRG]

1 hour ago, Razule said:

This is bad:

  Hide contents

While this is good:

  Hide contents

 

It's not hard.

Oh hey, it's Brainscratch!

I can somewhat agree with half of this, though.

 

[Multikaris]

On 6/23/2018 at 9:30 AM, Marco9966 said:

There is a misunderstanding. I think you should also read what I wrote at the beginning of the thread. Adventure era games are in no way the same thing modern games (Modern games are from 2010 till now, with Pontaff stories,

while Adventure ERA games are from 1998 to 2008, different writers)

Modern stories are bad.

But Adventure and Classic are not bad.

Even if it's the same 3D design for Sonic, the Adventure and Modern era (Pontaff) are different.

I was saying that if someone's first exposure ever to Sonic, literally the first time he sees Sonic ever is Sonic Lost World, they'll think it's a silly franchise,

But if someone's first exposure ever to Sonic was Sonic 3&K, or SA1/2, or Riders or Unleashed, they'll think highly of this franchise and see that the writers put some effort to write something more meaningful than daddy jokes.

This is bad:

  Reveal hidden contents

While this is good:

  Reveal hidden contents

(https://sanitrance.deviantart.com)

(https://www.pinterest.com/pin/474566879476137367/?lp=true)

(https://www.pinterest.ie/pin/503488433332713891/?lp=true)

(https://siga4bdn.deviantart.com)

(https://aoki6311.deviantart.com)

 

What about Forces? While bad, it is bad in a different way from the other modern games. Same with Mania.

[Marco9966]

Just now, Miragnarok said:

What about Forces? While bad, it is bad in a different way from the other modern games. Same with Mania.

At least it tried to have a more serious story and world, it's a step in the right direction.

All they needed to make this game better is:

-No Classic Sonic

-No cringey jokes

[Strickerx5]

After watching the video (which honestly man, your initial description of it did originally turn me away a bit), I have to say that I agree with a fair amount of it.

I was going to spend this post going on my usual ride on how Colors started this downward trend of cheesy, lifeless messes of plot elements with the only noteworthy points coming attached with a multitude of asterisks. With lengthy pieces going into how a game is the sum of all its parts and completely skipping on story because "gameplay is the only thing that matters" is a lazy excuse that doesn't solve the main issue most fans have with these games. How this attempt to follow the "classic" style was sorely mismanaged and why Pontaff need to go but then... I stopped myself. At around the 400 word mark (and I probably wasn't even half-way done at that point) I realized that I just didn't have it in me today. Anyone who even remotely knows me already know where my head is here.

I'll leave it at this. Sega needs to look at the IDW comics for the next game. No matter what tone, style, perspective, genre, rating, or fucking shoe size it may take. These comics understand what a Sonic story could be when put in the right hands which is something games from the past 9 years haven't even come close to doing imo.