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54 minutes ago, TideKai said:

Eh, I guess I just like the idea of Shadow being really haughty and sort of narcissistic. I think it'd be a nice kind of parallel to Sonic's own ego and cockiness. And if Shadow's going to constantly remind everyone how he's the ultimate lifeform, might as well roll with it. Like, he knows he's the ultimate lifeform. He knows he's supposed to be the epitome of perfection (well not really, but you know, haha), and he'll make sure you know as well.

But he hasn't said he's the ultimate life form in years? On occasion he gets a bit like don't push me, or get out of my face. But That's him being cocky. I dunno it not to be rude, it just seems like you want Vegeta and shadow has never really been that. And I would argue shadow's parallel to sonic's cockyness is shadow's will and determination. Its a trait described in a lot of bios " He will do anything with in his power to achive his goal " its even built into his moveset. If he can't run faster than you , he will warp time and space so he is faster than you.

54 minutes ago, TideKai said:

As for Shadow in Sonic Boom...eh, he was almost 100% fan service and integrated poorly in my opinion, but I don't mind too much since it was all tongue-in-cheek and was just meant to be, well, fan service.

I hated shadow in that show, and Knuckles too. Not for the reasons you think? Or kind of for the reasons you think, but why those reasons are are different than what you would imagine. To put it simply, they didn't go far enough with either them.

54 minutes ago, TideKai said:

One of the main reasons why I loved (and still love, to be honest) Shadow to this day is that he can be so over the top. I want them to stretch that out a bit. Not too much, but just a little. Like, Shadow going around blowing stuff just because he can. I'd prefer that to Shadow constantly whispering and being sad about his past and his purpose in life and all that. The whole angst-ridden Shadow thing wasn't really something I was a fan of. I'm personally glad that they seemed to be moving away from that with Forces. I'm not saying make Shadow in some wise-cracking jokester like Sonic; still make him have a serious nature but with a bit of flair to it so he's not just a generic sad and grumpy character.

Shadow... don't think ever whispered. And .... hasn't talked about his " purpose " for years. He's a serious guy sure, but you might be exaggerating somethings. I To be fair I don't think they are moving away from that. Shadow just wan't in forces enough to indicate anything, if the comic is any indication he's just as angst ridden as he ever was. Though he came off a bit cocky in one of the later issues. I dunno, shadow isn't the type to just blow shit up. He's just... a focused goal oriented dude. Its why him and sonic clashing works. Sonic's like chill guy who doesn't think about much, and shadow's kind of thinking about everything. Different perspectives. But again, you have a right to your opinion the matter

54 minutes ago, TideKai said:

It reminds me a bit of Eggman in '06. They took away almost all of his cartoonish flair and style and just made him a generic bad guy villain without any of his bombastic personality, and as a consequence he's just...boring and bland.

But I should probably reiterate that this is all my subjective opinion and probably won't be agreeable with a whole lot of people, haha.

Its cool, I disagree but that's cool. Different opinions are fine. There are FAR worse ideas for shadow i've seen. This is something I disagree with, but nothing to get upset or argue to deeply over, its cool. You are cool

54 minutes ago, TideKai said:

Also, I'm afraid I don't know who that dapper man in your posted gif is.

That is Son of Sparda

Vergil From Devil May Cry , Brother of Dante From Devil May Cry also son of sparda

And yes he's a very dapper and clean man and its reflected in his outfit and fighting style

31 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

That could work for Shadow.

An idea: His spines actually are suppose to be down like Sonic's and the only reason they're always pointed upward is specifically because he does them that way....is perfect.

I'm not fond of that, I like that shadow has a distinct features from sonic. And with the black arms it gives you an explanation for why his spines stick up. I think ts cool. He's like a weird mutant super demon-ey looking hedgehog

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28 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 

But he hasn't said he's the ultimate life form in years? On occasion he gets a bit like don't push me, or get out of my face. But That's him being cocky. I dunno it not to be rude, it just seems like you want Vegeta and shadow has never really been that. And I would argue shadow's parallel to sonic's cockyness is shadow's will and determination. Its a trait described in a lot of bios " He will do anything with in his power to achive his goal " its even built into his moveset. If he can't run faster than you , he will warp time and space so he is faster than you.

I hated shadow in that show, and Knuckles too. Not for the reasons you think? Or kind of for the reasons you think, but why those reasons are are different than what you would imagine. To put it simply, they didn't go far enough with either them.

Shadow... don't think ever whispered. And .... hasn't talked about his " purpose " for years. He's a serious guy sure, but you might be exaggerating somethings. I To be fair I don't think they are moving away from that. Shadow just wan't in forces enough to indicate anything, if the comic is any indication he's just as angst ridden as he ever was. Though he came off a bit cocky in one of the later issues. I dunno, shadow isn't the type to just blow shit up. He's just... a focused goal oriented dude. Its why him and sonic clashing works. Sonic's like chill guy who doesn't think about much, and shadow's kind of thinking about everything. Different perspectives. But again, you have a right to your opinion the matter

I've never watched Dragon Ball, so I can't comment about the Vegeta comparison.

I was also joking with the whispering comment. Probably should have made that more obvious. Oops.

I don't know, I just think when Shadow's written to be really super serious like that, he's just...kind of dull to me. I like Shadow when he's a cocky and smug jackass. It gives him more personality and it makes him more entertaining to me. I like when characters have personality and flair. And I know he hasn't talked about his purpose and past for a while. I'm happy about that fact and that it's something he's finally seemed to move on from. I'm pretty sure I said that in my post. I also haven't really read the IDW comics aside from a few previews, so I can't comment on that comparison either. 

That's why I kind of like Shadow in Forces. His line of "Should've hired a Defense Squad for the Defense Squad, eh Doctor?" got a laugh out of me, and I absolutely love how when Infinite shows up, he goes completely ham on him and beats the ever-living shit out of him and then calls him pathetic right to his (probably cracked and bleeding) face, and then warps off like he couldn't care less. I love that. I'd take that over boring serious rival Shadow or uber edgelord angst Shadow from the early 2000's. 

To me, the whole idea of the parallel between Sonic and Shadow is that they have the same core traits: they're both willful, determined, and egocentric. But they manifest in different ways between the two. In Sonic, he's a bit more light-hearted and benevolent when it comes to these traits. In Shadow, they're more negative and destructive. That's what makes their rivalry interesting to me. Part of the reason Shadow appealed to me in the first place and why he still does is that he's so...over the top. He's a secret military experiment who's immortal and can warp time and space. Granted, I may not entirely like that backstory, but it was so crazy to me as a kid that I loved it. He just does whatever he wants and doesn't give two shits about what anyone else thinks. I think that's great, and something they should roll with a bit more.

Also, Shadow's "I'm the coolest!" from SA2 still makes me go into hysterics every time I hear it. 

I think in the end, it just boils down to a difference in personal preference. We both want different things out of Shadow and he appeals to us in different ways. But hey, that's not a bad thing, yeah? I'd say that's a good thing!

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48 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

His spines look like Super Sonic...the thing he was based on, I don't know what the Black Arms have to do with that...

He's not based on super sonic. Shadow the hedgehog retcons any possiblity of the speculation that shadow might be based on the mural by strait up saying all the relics on the arc are ancient black arms stuff. And he's black and red like they , and his spins pointing up, are like demonic horns like the ones they have

Quote

I thought it'd just be an interesting character thing.

I feel like that brings him way to close to sonic in a way i'm not fond of. But like what you like man, i'm not the god of sonic thought.

13 minutes ago, TideKai said:

I've never watched Dragon Ball, so I can't comment about the Vegeta comparison.

I was also joking with the whispering comment. Probably should have made that more obvious. Oops.

I don't know, I just think when Shadow's written to be really super serious like that, he's just...kind of dull to me. I like Shadow when he's a cocky and smug jackass. It gives him more personality and it makes him more entertaining to me. I like when characters have personality and flair. And I know he hasn't talked about his purpose and past for a while. I'm happy about that fact and that it's something he's finally seemed to move on from. I'm pretty sure I said that in my post. I also haven't really read the IDW comics aside from a few previews, so I can't comment on that comparison either. 

That's why I kind of like Shadow in Forces. His line of "Should've hired a Defense Squad for the Defense Squad, eh Doctor?" got a laugh out of me, and I absolutely love how when Infinite shows up, he goes completely ham on him and beats the ever-living shit out of him and then calls him pathetic right to his (probably cracked and bleeding) face, and then warps off like he couldn't care less. I love that. I'd take that over boring serious rival Shadow or uber edgelord angst Shadow from the early 2000's. 

To me, the whole idea of the parallel between Sonic and Shadow is that they have the same core traits: they're both willful, determined, and egocentric. But they manifest in different ways between the two. In Sonic, he's a bit more light-hearted and benevolent when it comes to these traits. In Shadow, they're more negative and destructive. That's what makes their rivalry interesting to me. Part of the reason Shadow appealed to me in the first place and why he still does is that he's so...over the top. He's a secret military experiment who's immortal and can warp time and space. Granted, I may not entirely like that backstory, but it was so crazy to me as a kid that I loved it. He just does whatever he wants and doesn't give two shits about what anyone else thinks. I think that's great, and something they should roll with a bit more.

Also, Shadow's "I'm the coolest!" from SA2 still makes me go into hysterics every time I hear it. 

I think in the end, it just boils down to a difference in personal preference. We both want different things out of Shadow and he appeals to us in different ways. But hey, that's not a bad thing, yeah? I'd say that's a good thing!

I dunno that kinda seems dull to me? But like you said its preference. I like shadow being a dude who's introspective and kind of soft spoken, he got problems and he's dealing with em and life the best he can. And I can relate to that. But I'm glad you can derive an entire different version of the character and get entertainment from it, its speaks to the versatility of his character and how he's lasted so long.

An extra edit to show how differently we view the character. In an earlier comment you speak about how he claims he's  the ultimate life form and not. The reason I like soft spoken shadow is because he doesn't claim that and he is. He talks softly and walks with a gigantic stick that can stop time. Like in sonic 06 where like the devil tells him that everyone will betray him and he's just like " nah" and then beats his ass. Or like in the archie comics, where he fights with knuckles, chokes him out, saves him whilst fighting him , and then fights someone else. And knuckles is the one to admit " Oh yeah if we could have kept fighting I wouldn't have been able to keep up " . And even before that point in the comic where like he's having a talk with a character and how he feels his a monster.

I dunno I don't really interpret forces as what you saying? Shadow no matter what version he is, is known for the occasional joke. He can be snarky if he wants to, even in sonic 06 he's like " Better keep up " to sonic. And in the recent comic he likes bodies neo metal sonic and sonic is like " Oh its gonna make him stronger " and shadow's like " What are you scared " .  Shadow's always had a sort a snark about him. And to go into infnite, I don't really think he beat the shit out of him, he kicks him a few times, nothing major. Tells him to not show his face, and leaves. Dunno reads like edgy angsty shadow to me.

But I think that speaks to how wildly different we interpreted that series of events.

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13 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

I don't recall Sonic being that interested in his own looks...

Also, that doesn't make sense...retroactive continuity makes plot hole. Unsurprising.

I think it makes sense, or as much sense as it being echidna ruins. He found some old ruins, found a hedgehog did experiments.

They explain why shadow looks....relatively weird compared to a lot o the cast, in a way that's unique and I think that's cool

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I guess that change is why Super Sonic's spines all point up now...the spines in the middle don't stay down anymore.

Shadow's red accents remind me of Cream, he doesn't look too out there.

Who needs just a little bit more oomph, less passive...

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7 hours ago, TideKai said:

I'd prefer that to Shadow constantly whispering and being sad about his past and his purpose in life and all that. The whole angst-ridden Shadow thing wasn't really something I was a fan of. I'm personally glad that they seemed to be moving away from that with Forces. I'm not saying make Shadow in some wise-cracking jokester like Sonic; still make him have a serious nature but with a bit of flair to it so he's not just a generic sad and grumpy character.

 

He's been like that since 06.

5 hours ago, TideKai said:

I love that. I'd take that over boring serious rival Shadow or uber edgelord angst Shadow from the early 2000's. 

 

Shadow WAS the early 2000s.

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5 hours ago, StaticMania said:

I guess that change is why Super Sonic's spines all point up now...the spines in the middle don't stay down anymore.

Shadow's red accents remind me of Cream, he doesn't look too out there.

Who needs just a little bit more oomph, less passive...

No he does, his color pallet is very specific and weird, he has stripes going all over his body. The only 3 characters that look like that not named shadow , and all of those characters are aping shadow hard. Silver, Mephilies, and Infinite. The first two have explanations and possible explanations for why they do.  Infnite they just kind of gave up, they just wanted a character that looked like shadow who was new and shiny with little explanation

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4 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

No he does, his color pallet is very specific and weird, he has stripes going all over his body. The only 3 characters that look like that not named shadow , and all of those characters are aping shadow hard. Silver, Mephilies, and Infinite. The first two have explanations and possible explanations for why they do.  Infnite they just kind of gave up, they just wanted a character that looked like shadow who was new and shiny with little explanation

Eh, I doubt it.

Infinite was a variety of animals with varying mask designs before they settled on one-eyed  monochrome Jackal with a red lightning bolt.

 

Also, Red and Black are a common palette choice, but that's not really here.

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Just now, DabigRG said:

Eh, I doubt it.

Infinite was a variety of animals with varying mask designs before they settled on one-eyed  monochrome Jackal with a red lightning bolt.

 

Also, Red and Black are a common palette choice, but that's not really here.

Just because they went through a bunch of designs doesn't mean the design they came up with at the end doesn't have a purpose. He is supposed to envoke a specific character. Unless i'm mistaken, and please tell me if I am, up until that point shadow was the only black animal character made by sega. It was this weird thing that was specific to him in a sea of bright colored animals. Infnite comes along and is black and another solid color, not only they position him beside the shadow in all of the marketing materials and have him scream out " I"m the ultimate mercenary " in game.

They wanted you to associate the new shiny character with the old cool character that you like, they even put him beside him, they made him look like him. This is a pretty common tactic in marketing, it just didn't work this time

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They're just dark because they're evil/grumpy. Sonic is a cool blue, Knuckles is a hotheaded red, Amy is a passionate and feminine pink, Shadow is a dark and edgy black, and Infinite is also black because he is also an edgelord. Infinite isn't aping Shadow, they're both just drawing from the same basic color associations.

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20 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Just because they went through a bunch of designs doesn't mean the design they came up with at the end doesn't have a purpose. He is supposed to envoke a specific character. Unless i'm mistaken, and please tell me if I am, up until that point shadow was the only black animal character made by sega.

vAgR13D.png?fb

Eh, depends on what you wanna count, but Mighty, Bearanger*, Geoffrey St. John, Hershey, Uma Arachnis*, Beta, Bokkun(?), Gemerl,  Ahklut, and TW Barker.

So, just a few.

Though to be honest, I earnestly forgot Infinite is legit black with white hair without the mask.

20 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 It was this weird thing that was specific to him in a sea of bright colored animals. Infnite comes along and is black and another solid color, not only they position him beside the shadow in all of the marketing materials and have him scream out " I"m the ultimate mercenary " in game.

They wanted you to associate the new shiny character with the old cool character that you like, they even put him beside him, they made him look like him. This is a pretty common tactic in marketing, it just didn't work this time

That's mostly an episode Shadow thing, though.

They wanted to give Shadow a distinct role in the game to further the Darkier and Edgier epic adventure feeling of the Dreamcast & early Modern era(many of which involved him anyway) and so giving him a DLC that ties him in with the new villain's origins(again) was the obvious/laziest way to do that.

20 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

 

They wanted you to associate the new shiny character with the old cool character that you like, they even put him beside him, they made him look like him. This is a pretty common tactic in marketing, it just didn't work this time

Uuuh, you sure about that?

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I've said it 900,000 times but Sonic could stand to be a lot more rude here and then. He's supposed to be this cocky wiseguy but he's about as safe a character as you can get with this type. Let him cause more trouble, be more stubborn, put him in the wrong more, be a little more insensitive, all that. He's a guy who lives by nothing but his own motives and can go pretty much anywhere he wants by just acrobatics and a bi-plane, he shouldn't be 100% sympathetic to a normal person's troubles. 

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17 minutes ago, Osmium said:

I've said it 900,000 times but Sonic could stand to be a lot more rude here and then. He's supposed to be this cocky wiseguy but he's about as safe a character as you can get with this type. Let him cause more trouble, be more stubborn, put him in the wrong more, be a little more insensitive, all that. He's a guy who lives by nothing but his own motives and can go pretty much anywhere he wants by just acrobatics and a bi-plane, he shouldn't be 100% sympathetic to a normal person's troubles. 

Lost World.

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48 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

 

Uuuh, you sure about that?

Yeah i'll be blunt, its what they did with shadow. Made him kinda look like sonic had him fight him had a mystery. Sonic team does this all the time, its just that they haven't been able to do it successfully after shadow. And i'm not saying its impossible because shadows perfect or something, nah Ian flynn did it with eclipse on a smaller scale, but sega themselves kind of lost the narrative on why people like shadow when translating that to new characters and it never works out.

 

Side note: I"m watching Young Justice Season 3, Super Boys personality and living situation is a pretty good template for shadow if they wanted to change him up

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26 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

Yeah i'll be blunt, its what they did with shadow. Made him kinda look like sonic had him fight him had a mystery. Sonic team does this all the time, its just that they haven't been able to do it successfully after shadow. And i'm not saying its impossible because shadows perfect or something, nah Ian flynn did it with eclipse on a smaller scale, but sega themselves kind of lost the narrative on why people like shadow when translating that to new characters and it never works out.

 

Side note: I"m watching Young Justice Season 3, Super Boys personality and living situation is a pretty good template for shadow if they wanted to change him up

I talking more about Infinite there, but this is an interesting observation too, I guess.

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2 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

I talking more about Infinite there, but this is an interesting observation too, I guess.

I think infnite's color pallet is supposed to evoke a very simular feeling to shadow. If the leaked script is correct, and i think it is because there's lines in the game that indicate this , infinite was strait up supposed to be an experiment eggman made, similar to shadow and Gerald. They backed off a bit, but I think its very clear what they wanted to do with that character.

He says " I"m the ultimate mercenary " for crying out loud, to shadow.

DLC or not, that is a very specific declaration of authorial intent of who you are supposed to associate him with thematically

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3 minutes ago, Shadowlax said:

I think infnite's color pallet is supposed to evoke a very simular feeling to shadow. If the leaked script is correct, and i think it is because there's lines in the game that indicate this , infinite was strait up supposed to be an experiment eggman made, similar to shadow and Gerald. They backed off a bit, but I think its very clear what they wanted to do with that character.

He says " I"m the ultimate mercenary " for crying out loud, to shadow.

DLC or not, that is a very specific declaration of authorial intent of who you are supposed to associate him with thematically

Huh.

I remember skimming through the script once, but didn't really pay much attention to Infinite himself. Remember things being mostly the same barring some tweaked and/or additional lines that aren't in the final game.

Anyway, to be specific, there are apparently people who still like Infinite.

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1 minute ago, DabigRG said:

I remember skimming through the script once, but didn't really pay much attention to Infinite himself. Remember things being mostly the same barring some tweaked and/or additional lines that aren't in the final game.

I don't blame you for not wanting to pay attention to infinite.

 

 

1 minute ago, DabigRG said:

Anyway, to be specific, there are apparently people who still like Infinite.

That's cool. I mean I don't think he's gonna come back, but I dunno maybe he does and they change his character. If so to wrap this back around to being ontopic

I would like an effective soft reboot?

I like the concept of infnite's jackal squad more than him being some weirdo in a mask, the idea of animal mercs is cool. Do something with that, ignore forces.

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8 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

He's not based on super sonic. Shadow the hedgehog retcons any possiblity of the speculation that shadow might be based on the mural by strait up saying all the relics on the arc are ancient black arms stuff. And he's black and red like they , and his spins pointing up, are like demonic horns like the ones they have

I feel like that brings him way to close to sonic in a way i'm not fond of. But like what you like man, i'm not the god of sonic thought.

I dunno that kinda seems dull to me? But like you said its preference. I like shadow being a dude who's introspective and kind of soft spoken, he got problems and he's dealing with em and life the best he can. And I can relate to that. But I'm glad you can derive an entire different version of the character and get entertainment from it, its speaks to the versatility of his character and how he's lasted so long.

An extra edit to show how differently we view the character. In an earlier comment you speak about how he claims he's  the ultimate life form and not. The reason I like soft spoken shadow is because he doesn't claim that and he is. He talks softly and walks with a gigantic stick that can stop time. Like in sonic 06 where like the devil tells him that everyone will betray him and he's just like " nah" and then beats his ass. Or like in the archie comics, where he fights with knuckles, chokes him out, saves him whilst fighting him , and then fights someone else. And knuckles is the one to admit " Oh yeah if we could have kept fighting I wouldn't have been able to keep up " . And even before that point in the comic where like he's having a talk with a character and how he feels his a monster.

I dunno I don't really interpret forces as what you saying? Shadow no matter what version he is, is known for the occasional joke. He can be snarky if he wants to, even in sonic 06 he's like " Better keep up " to sonic. And in the recent comic he likes bodies neo metal sonic and sonic is like " Oh its gonna make him stronger " and shadow's like " What are you scared " .  Shadow's always had a sort a snark about him. And to go into infnite, I don't really think he beat the shit out of him, he kicks him a few times, nothing major. Tells him to not show his face, and leaves. Dunno reads like edgy angsty shadow to me.

But I think that speaks to how wildly different we interpreted that series of events.

Yeah, I think this is just a case of us interpreting parts of the character differently and wanting different things from him. I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

I'm sorry if that sounds like a really cheap and cop-out answer, I promise I'm not throwing away any of what you said. It's just my entire counter-argument is pretty much just me saying "This what I personally feel and would like", and it's all subjective. And I don't think it's something that you can really argue with, you know what I mean? All of the events from the games you listed I see them in a different light, but that's probably because I have my own sort of personal definitions and measurements of some character traits, like "edgy" and "angst." 

So, yeah. I'm afraid this is one we're going to have to agree to disagree on, haha. But I like that, there's different parts of Shadow that appeal to us and that we like! In the end, we can both agree that he's one cool dude.

Image result for shadow gif

10 hours ago, StaticMania said:

That could work for Shadow.

An idea: His spines actually are suppose to be down like Sonic's and the only reason they're always pointed upward is specifically because he does them that way....is perfect.

I'm sorry, I swear I didn't mean to completely gloss over your post. Please forgive me!

There's just something I love about the idea of Shadow being really meticulous about his appearance. I can totally see him spending an hour in front of the mirror every morning and patting back his quills and brushing his chest fur, hahaha.

3 hours ago, DabigRG said:

He's been like that since 06.

Shadow WAS the early 2000s.

I'm very sorry, I'm not really sure what you're say or mean here? I got like 3 hours of sleep last night, so my mind is probably just a little fuzzy, haha.

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3 minutes ago, TideKai said:

Yeah, I think this is just a case of us interpreting parts of the character differently and wanting different things from him. I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

I'm sorry if that sounds like a really cheap and cop-out answer, I promise I'm not throwing away any of what you said. It's just my entire counter-argument is pretty much just me saying "This what I personally feel and would like", and it's all subjective. And I don't think it's something that you can really argue with, you know what I mean? All of the events from the games you listed I see them in a different light, but that's probably because I have my own sort of personal definitions and measurements of some character traits, like "edgy" and "angst." 

So, yeah. I'm afraid this is one we're going to have to agree to disagree on, haha. But I like that, there's different parts of Shadow that appeal to us and that we like! In the end, we can both agree that he's one cool dude.

Image result for shadow gif

 

I mean, its not really a cop out. We like different stuff. I'm glad you are being cool about it, and while I don't agree with your interpretation , I buy shadow kind of guy who's kinda  bit messy actually. I see shadow instead of getting prepared in the mirror, a guy who just kind of works on bikes and cars in his spare time deep into thight and sometimes sleeps in his garage. A guy who gets lost in what's he's doing much like himself on his missions and a bit messy because of it  its a genuinely interesting take. That said, your's is a genuinely interesting take, especially compared to what i see normally.

I see people recommending " shadow should literally be a clone of sonic " or " Sonic grandfather brought from the future " as ways to " fix " his story and character.

I'll take shadow being a bit pomp over that any day of the week

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Shadow needs to be a guy that represents Sonic's ironic side in his cool and carefree ways. A true self awareness parody of Sonic. He also needs to stand out, being mean and edgy is a pre requiste for almost all the cool sonic character types already. He needs to really stand on his own with his "darkness" without it being taken lightly or played for laughs. The Punisher is a good template for this. His commitment to the mission and obsession with the results would give him more a valuable unique constrast to everyone who is more content in saving the day and prolonging the fight for good. Shadow wants instant victory and total accomplishment over evil and his goals at all costs even if he'll kill the wrong people to do it.

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1 hour ago, Shadowlax said:

 

I don't blame you for not wanting to pay attention to infinite.

 

 

Hmph.

1 hour ago, Shadowlax said:

 

That's cool. I mean I don't think he's gonna come back, 

Oh, me neither dude. Again, I'd be shocked if they did that.

1 hour ago, Shadowlax said:

but I dunno maybe he does and they change his character. If so to wrap this back around to being ontopic

I would like an effective soft reboot?

 

Eh, I guess.

Then it becomes of whether he'd work or less importantly, be accepted without some of the big stuff that made him to begin with.

1 hour ago, Shadowlax said:

 

I like the concept of infnite's jackal squad more than him being some weirdo in a mask, the idea of animal mercs is cool. Do something with that, ignore forces.

Yeah, that is generally a big take away people get from him..

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Totally left field, here but about the only character I can really say I would like to have seen receive any change that wouldn't take me a month or longer to right up the type of changes I'd like to see is Elise. Sure she's a one off character that most people dislike, but I actually enjoyed, her carrot colored tights and all. Well except for the one thing I'd like to change about her personality; her romantic interests in Sonic.

Now, crazy as it sounds I actually liked 06 even with everything wrong with the game (bar the glitches as outside of Wave Ocean at the start I pretty much never encountered any playing on the Xbox), but even with having the view point of liking the game unlike pretty much everyone I've ever seen talk about it I never saw the SonElise romance as a two way thing even with a mission trying to shove it down my throat (it just felt unnatural and unearned to me). Where most people saw Sonic reciprocating Elise's feelings I never did. Sonic just appeared like he was going off of his character trait of not liking tears. Sure Elise didn't actually cry till she saw Sonic take a cheap shot to through the back, but it was implied clearly enough to me that if not for releasing Iblis if she did her situation would have left her crying quite a bit and Sonic supposedly can't stand that type of thing and would naturally try to cheer someone up by doing what he could. In the case of Elise it was offering her some friendship and advise that works for him; smile and just run. So what then would I change about Elise's personality before I get to off topic? Well at this point obviously her having romantic feelings for Sonic would be the thing that I would change. I'd firmly put her feelings squarely in the friend zone as too me I think that would have made her less obnoxiously used in the story, as well as playing to Sonic's long time theme of befriending most people that he meets. Then of course I feel that what Elise truly needed was a friend outside of everything that she knows and not a romantic partner. Honestly, as someone who's had to deal with depression and unreasonably high expectations to where you just feel as physical crushed as you do mentally and emotionally having a friend from outside of what you know would have gone a long way to helping me cope better without the entanglement of romantic interests creating more unhealthy expectations to where I could have easily seen myself trying to entrap the other person with my emotions. It's a horrible way to do things and just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Sure one can probably justify Elise's romantic feelings, but I just feel being lost in the friendship Sonic provided without any romantic feelings would have made her a better character and make it easier for me to want to see her again in the franchise.

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