Amy Rose and Sonic

[Sega DogTagz]

Your taking the meaning of DID and turning it to your own interpretation of the word. There isn't a "more" modern meaning to the term concerning story telling and overall literature. Even Wiki doesn't have a modern meaning to the word. Not all meanings change. Even in modern works, the term Damsel in Distress is usually a term saved for a female who is helpless, meaning she can not help herself in a problem she finds herself in because the hero needs to save her. Like I said Amy has more than once has taken care of herself, without Sonic's help. Her finding herself in a problem or in trouble doesn't make her a DID, no matter how many times it happens. Her being saved by the hero (like Sonic) because of her problem, does. If Amy is repeatedly finds herself in a problem but she repeatedly saves herself, technically she is not a damsel in distress because she didn't need saving from anyone, she wasn't helpless. That goes for any character, not just Amy. (I can't comment on Peach because I'm not into Mario's universe)

Your post to me said she was DID in nearly every game she ever appeared in. If that were true the list of games I put would be a lot shorter, based on the actual meaning of damsel in distress. Even after Sonic 06 she wasn't DID in almost every Sonic game, like you claimed in your previous post.

If Amy was utterly powerless repeatedly, then your implying she can't defend herself because you are claiming she is powerless. That statement is conflicting.

Its not a conflicting statement. I am saying that despite all of her fighting ability, Amy still finds herself in helpless situations. It would be like saying Bob is fast, but Bob lost the race. The two may not really add up, but it is not a contradiction.

That being said, I think we are making our differences on the interpretation of a damsel in distress bigger than it actually is. I believe we really are in the same camp here. I am not bending the interpretation. I am simply allowing it to encompass today’s stories. I think you would agree with my viewpoint of a modern example of a damsel in distress, all we have to do is go back and look.

Take Sonic for example. I think I, you or anyone would agree that at certain times in the series, Sonic himself has been a DiD. Look at when we was stuck in a cell on Prison Island. Sonic was basically sitting in some far off castle, waiting for one of his friends to grant him his freedom. There is no reason to handicap the definition of the term to not include Sonic in this situation. Most people would look at this and say Sonic is a DiD knowing full well that Sonic is

a.) A dude

b.) The farthest thing from helpless.

The point being that Amy’s ability to fend for herself means nothing in her capacity to be a DiD. Any character can be stripped down to helpless status. If God Slayer the Hedgehog can be, than so can anyone.

The only difference is that it occasionally happens to Sonic. Amy seems to fall into the pitfall every single time.

With the very short list of games Amy was actually a damsel in distress in, where she couldn't save herself. I also forgot to add Sonic Rush to the list of non damsel in distress.

Anyways I disagree mainly because I don't agree with your interpretation of damsel in distress. I stand by my previous statement on what a damsel in distress is. I'm not saying Amy has never been a damsel in distress, I know she has. I just don't agree she's been that way in most games she's appeared in.

Sonic Rush was 05 I think.

Still, my list encompasses just about every game post 06. If you want to argue Zero Gravity, I would protest, but it still doesn’t buck the overall trend.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Sega DogTagz

[Genesis]

That being said, I think we are making our differences on the interpretation of a damsel in distress bigger than it actually is. I believe we really are in the same camp here. I am not bending the interpretation. I am simply allowing it to encompass today’s stories. I think you would agree with my viewpoint of a modern example of a damsel in distress, all we have to do is go back and look.

Take Sonic for example. I think I, you or anyone would agree that at certain times in the series, Sonic himself has been a DiD. Look at when we was stuck in a cell on Prison Island. Sonic was basically sitting in some far off castle, waiting for one of his friends to grant him his freedom. There is no reason to handicap the definition of the term to not include Sonic in this situation. Most people would look at this and say Sonic is a DiD knowing full well that Sonic is

a.) A dude

b.) The farthest thing from helpless.

This is just proving to me that this is a personal take on what damsel in distress means and putting your own views into the matter. There is nothing that says your modern view of a damsel in distress whether boy or girl is correct. While Sonic has indeed been rescued by others I wouldn't call him DID either and I have never heard anyone call Sonic a DID simply because he was helpless a few times. Unless you want to say Dude in Distress lol. But that again would be a personal interpretation. I'm going by the actual definition of damsel in distress and how it's repeatedly been played out in different mediums, past and present.

The point being that Amy’s ability to fend for herself means nothing in her capacity to be a DiD. Any character can be stripped down to helpless status. If God Slayer the Hedgehog can be, than so can anyone.

Never said it was. I did admit she has been a damsel in distress in a few games.

Point is what essentially makes a damsel in distress is the fact the character has to be rescued (most commonly by the main hero) because she can not help herself. Just because she gets in trouble (whether you think it's often or not) doesn't automatically means she is a DID. If she's being rescued, then yes she is playing the role of DID but if she gets out her troubles herself, she is not a DID. Amy doesn't always need rescuing in every game, making her not damsel in distress in every game she appears in.

The only difference is that it occasionally happens to Sonic. Amy seems to fall into the pitfall every single time.

Again I disagree. Amy does not fall into the pitiful of DID everytime. Why? because she is not always saved by Sonic or some other character every single game, whether it was before or after Sonic 06. There are some games nothing threatening happens to her and then there are other games where she saves herself. To say every single time is not true.

Sonic Rush was 05 I think.

Still, my list encompasses just about every game post 06. If you want to argue Zero Gravity, I would protest, but it still doesn’t buck the overall trend.

I do count Zero Gravity because she didn't need to be saved at any point in the game. By the time Sonic got there she already took care of herself and put Storm in his place. Not at all DID.

Sonic Chronicles: Amy didn't need rescuing. Taking her to the Voxai for the final battle of the stage again is optional. Optional doesn't equal as fact that she went, it's totally the players choice.

Sonic and the Secret Rings : nothing happened to her, even thought she wasn't in the story. The only reason I brought it up in the first place was because you said every single game Amy appears post Sonic 06 she's a DID. I took you literally because she did make an appearance in the game.

Sonic and the Black Knight I already mentioned

The only games she was a damsel in distress was in two games post 06, Sonic Rivals and Sonic Unleashed.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Genesis

[Badnik Zero]

I think you guys would agree if you change "damsel in distress" to "girl in a lot of trouble". Amy attracts trouble in the series, and yes I believe it's due to her role as a girl. She can smash a few heads, but she's usually the prime target for kidnappings, hostage scenarios, being chased by a pervert robot and so on.

[Genesis]

I think you guys would agree if you change "damsel in distress" to "girl in a lot of trouble". Amy attracts trouble in the series, and yes I believe it's due to her role as a girl. She can smash a few heads, but she's usually the prime target for kidnappings, hostage scenarios, being chased by a pervert robot and so on.

This I can agree with, somewhat.

Anyways I'm not going to derail the topic any longer. I said what I wanted to say already about the main topic on this thread. Moving on......

Edited April 22, 2010 by Genesis

[Sega DogTagz]

She can smash a few heads, but she's usually the prime target for kidnappings, hostage scenarios, being chased by a pervert robot and so on.

All Zero wanted was a hug. Why are the killbots always so misunderstood.

Anyways I'm not going to derail the topic any longer. I said what I wanted to say already about the main topic on this thread. Moving on......

Fine. I'll leave it alone too. I don’t see how an analysis of Amy is counterproductive to an analysis of Amy and Sonic though.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Sega DogTagz

[Blazey Firekitty]

You know, even though that was technically an alternate universe version of her, I think that Nimue was a great portrayal of Amy and that she should be more like that in future appearances. I mean, not that she should keep talking in an overly formal matter like in Camelot, but Nimue!Amy didn't always talk like that. She could be just as casual as regular Amy, and because of that she basically just seemed like what normal Amy would be like if she weren't so prone to the occasional romance related burst of anger. She kind of seemed like a "big sister" to Sonic, during that game, kind of like what Sally was in the old SatAM cartoon, without losing the cuteness and emotional passion that I usually think of when I think of Amy.

And, well, I kind of like that. I don't mind the thought Sonic x Amy, but at the same time, it seems like it might be a little more fitting for the series to have Amy as more of a nurturing sort of platonic figure, one who can fight alongside her "little brother" at times.

...I hope that all made sense.^^;;

[Flyboy Fox]

Sonic as Amy's little brother? That kind of boggles my brain. She's, what, at least four years younger than him, isn't she? And emotionally, she's really quite immature. Not that she's not got great redeeming qualities such as compassion and loyalty and strength of will... because she does have all of those things. But I really can't see Sonic ever seeing her as a nurturing older sister type. She's more like the cute and clingy yet fiery little sister who consistently gets herself into scrapes as she tries to prove herself. Except of course that she's in love with Sonic, which kind of kills the whole sibling analogy because I don't think that's ever going to change ^^;

[Sean]

Even if Amy was Sonic's sibling, she doesn't obsess over him in the PROPER ANIME INCEST WAY.

"oh onii-chan we should take baths together since we're not related by blood ^____^;;"

[Blazey Firekitty]

Sonic as Amy's little brother? That kind of boggles my brain. She's, what, at least four years younger than him, isn't she? And emotionally, she's really quite immature. Not that she's not got great redeeming qualities such as compassion and loyalty and strength of will... because she does have all of those things. But I really can't see Sonic ever seeing her as a nurturing older sister type. She's more like the cute and clingy yet fiery little sister who consistently gets herself into scrapes as she tries to prove herself. Except of course that she's in love with Sonic, which kind of kills the whole sibling analogy because I don't think that's ever going to change ^^;

In retrospect, I went overboard with trying to make Amy like Sally, partly because of the Fleetway comics I'd read, where Amy is portrayed as a more tomboyish, leader-like figure.

I am glad that you recognize the same redeeming qualities in Amy(Compassion, loyalty, strength of will), that I do, though. I personally think that the reason that Amy makes Sonic so uncomfortable(Aside from the whole clown mallet thing) is that she expresses those qualities to the same extremes that Sonic does. While someone like Tails compliments Sonic's personality by sharing his interests, but being his polar opposite in sense(Tails being calm and logical vs. Sonic being passionate and emotion), Amy is basically a female Sonic in a sense. By which I mean that, like Sonic, she has a big ego and is very impulsive, yet channels those traits in such a way that she can help other people while making herself happy. I guess the basic problem is that Amy wants Sonic just as much as Sonic wants adventure.

Even if Amy was Sonic's sibling, she doesn't obsess over him in the PROPER ANIME INCEST WAY.

"oh onii-chan we should take baths together since we're not related by blood ^____^;;"

Heh, harem anime step-sibling romance, I almost wouldn't be surprised since the Sonic games already has a couple references to Dragon Ball.XD

Edited April 24, 2010 by BlazeyBakeneko

[NiGHTS]

In retrospect, I went overboard with trying to make Amy like Sally, partly because of the Fleetway comics I'd read, where Amy is portrayed as a more tomboyish, leader-like figure.

I am glad that you recognize the same redeeming qualities in Amy(Compassion, loyalty, strength of will), that I do, though. I personally think that the reason that Amy makes Sonic so uncomfortable(Aside from the whole clown mallet thing) is that she expresses those qualities to the same extremes that Sonic does. While someone like Tails compliments Sonic's personality by sharing his interests, but being his polar opposite in sense(Tails being calm and logical vs. Sonic being passionate and emotion), Amy is basically a female Sonic in a sense. By which I mean that, like Sonic, she has a big ego and is very impulsive, yet channels those traits in such a way that she can help other people while making herself happy. I guess the basic problem is that Amy wants Sonic just as much as Sonic wants adventure.

Heh, harem anime step-sibling romance, I almost wouldn't be surprised since the Sonic games already has a couple references to Dragon Ball.XD

You know Blaze, I agree with you here 100 percent. Amy is pretty much a female version of Sonic. Also one of the reasons I like Amy as a character (one of my fav female characters actually) is that yes, she might have a crush on Sonic, but besides that. She is a tough cookie, and always looking for adventure and would help in any battle she can be in. (Mostly in the archie comics) Shes been involving herself in more battles, and im really liking the idea of Amy turning into a warrior now.

[Unionhack]

I don't mind the couple as a whole, in fact I support it, but I think SEGA should wait until he very last games of the series, to maybe give it a sense of completion. i doubt they'll be finishing it anytime soon, however. Making too much money most likely.

[Unionhack]

But why would falling in love nessicarily mean "settling down". It's not as if he'd suddenly have to buy a house in the suburbs and get a 9-5 job. XD

Adventurous, free-spirited, always on the move people exist in real life and have partners -- usually partners who are the exact same way. And what do they do? They explore, adventure, and travel the world together. Some never "settle down". There are couples who do nothing but roam the world, hoping from place to place.

There's nothing to suggest that Sonic would detest having someone to come along, as long as they could keep up to some capacity (naturally, they'd always arrive a bit late, but hey, love can be a little patient, right? XD)

Doesn't mean I support Sonic/Amy in any way.

Edit: Also, the above doesn't mean I can see ANY of that happening in game or ever being canon. I don't WANT anything of the sort to happen in canon. I'm simply arguing in terms of fanfic/art and pure speculation only, Sonic falling in love with someone is not something I think is impossible.

I should have though of it like that. Nice point.

[jutgf]

I think Segs should kill that twerp off? She is absolutely pointless in an action game about action dudes with super speed and attitude. Shonen manga even have action babes even though their second to the men, but seriously her weak ass has been in the damsel in distress spot for far to long, even Peach can defend herself nowadays.

[Badnik Mechanic]

I think Segs should kill that twerp off? She is absolutely pointless in an action game about action dudes with super speed and attitude. Shonen manga even have action babes even though their second to the men, but seriously her weak ass has been in the damsel in distress spot for far to long, even Peach can defend herself nowadays.

You've not played many Sonic games have you? I'll just do the sort version instead of bumping up my old have you met miss rose argument.

Sonic Heroes: She takes it upon herself to lead and launch a rescue mission with Big and Cream. She's sassy and confident when she puts Vector in his place too.

Sonic Adventure: Sonic adventure she spends most of the game defending a small helpless bird. Whilst her missions involve her running from Zero. One would be utterly foolish to claim that she's weak or a coward in this game. Just before the final boss fight, Zero attacks the bird. Amy has a responce along the following lines

Ok so the lines are not quite that.

But for the whole game Amy has been running, from one of Robotniks Hunter badniks, a machine thats far more powerful than Amy. Amy knows she's no match for Zero hence why your gameplay with her is running as apposed to fighting. But when the thing she's been looking after is hurt by this machine. It's payback time. Thats the moment she shows what shes capable of. She turns on Zero and defeats him.

Sonic Adventure 2: Whilst you do not play as her, she's able to break into a maximum security prison and rescue Sonic... Cowardly? Weak? Hardly.

Sonic Battle: She kicks fucking ass in this game! Not only that but she acts as a motherly figure to that pumpkin head robot thing that appears in chronicles too.

Sonic Chronicles: In what way is she cowardly or weak in this game? Pick the wrong type of responce to her and she'll put Sonic in his place.... heck she'll put Sonic in his place regardless.

[Saint Nathan]

A great example of the fact that Amy can kick some ass is right there. Notice how she turns around quick as lighting, then hits Zero so hard he's knocked several feet back, and into the air.

She's about as weak as, I'd say Tails. Not the strongest, but she will kick ass if she wants too.

[Blazey Firekitty]

You know Blaze, I agree with you here 100 percent. Amy is pretty much a female version of Sonic. Also one of the reasons I like Amy as a character (one of my fav female characters actually) is that yes, she might have a crush on Sonic, but besides that. She is a tough cookie, and always looking for adventure and would help in any battle she can be in. (Mostly in the archie comics) Shes been involving herself in more battles, and im really liking the idea of Amy turning into a warrior now.

Yeah, she seems to have the heart of warrior, she just seems to need more experience/training.^^

[Indigo Rush]

Yeah, she seems to have the heart of warrior, she just seems to need more experience/training.^^

Who else is fitting enough to bear the Warrior's Feather? :)

[Blazey Firekitty]

Who else is fitting enough to bear the Warrior's Feather? :)

A hairpin that can make you do a powerful spin technique with a blunt object is pretty badass. It's literally a killer fashion statement.

[The Kid]

A hairpin that can make you do a powerful spin technique with a blunt object is pretty badass. It's literally a killer fashion statement.

I remember using that to no end with Amy, good times. In the Archie comics at least Amy seems exactly like a girl version of Sonic. Especially in the Iron Dominion arc. Now if only she was able to kick some butt like that in the games, maybe then there wouldn't be as many anti Amy fans.

Of course not being whiny and clingy would help...

[Dejablue]

I remember using that to no end with Amy, good times. In the Archie comics at least Amy seems exactly like a girl version of Sonic. Especially in the Iron Dominion arc. Now if only she was able to kick some butt like that in the games, maybe then there wouldn't be as many anti Amy fans.

Of course not being whiny and clingy would help...

I kind of like the whiny and clingy aspects when partnered with instances showing her growing out of it. Sonic Team is probably being a lot looser with Sonic and Amy's relationship because key people who influence their personalities aren't there anymore.